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The Official Acer H9500BD Thread - Page 87

post #2581 of 4667
4/27/12 at 7:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by joepaiii View Post

I would like to see some video or blu ray compares between hdmi and vga to see how much difference there is. I have seen the single pixels and one pixel line tests but never an image from a movie showing the difference. It seems to me the only people to pick this up saw it looking at pc graphics and noticing a softness with the text and other lines.

I put up a bunch of test patterns through my 9500 and it is much sharper than the 8350 I had before and in another league compared to my hd70. I guess my point is that I dont see how this is making a big impact in video.

I read the link

http://www.projectorcentral.com/acer...tor_review.htm

and it would seem to explain why movies (including Ghost Protocol) look good to me. Could they be better if Acer made some firmware changes? Probably. I believe what Zombie 10K says about the BenQ being noticieably sharper after the fix because he doesn't appear to have any axe to grind and I can at least understand what he's saying on his posts (by the aforementioned I mean he doesn't rant, criticize, or make obscure references with no explanation of what he's talking about).

While I don't have a "firmware updated Acer" (because none exist that I know of) to compare to mine, I find my picture more than acceptable and am quite happy with it. Would I like an improvement in sharpness? Sure, as long as other aspects of the picture quality don't suffer. From the perspective of watching movies and TV via blu ray and cable (which is all I do), I think the picture is great....noticeably better than my Sanyo (which, as I've said, I like).

I'm all for improvements any time I can get them and am willing to do some legwork to accomplish that.

Earlier I suggested that BenQ might be more forthcoming about what the problem was and what they did to fix it. After listening to Zombie, it occurs to me that they might not want to drop a fix in their competitors lap. As was also pointed out, the willingness on the part of BenQ to provide a fix for the blurring may be a result of the fact that projection systems constitute a larger part of their business than it does for Acer. It may also be that Acer doesn't WANT to fix the problem and will address it in their upcoming model. We shall see....

See what happens when rational people (like Zombie 10K) post? Others listen, think about what they are saying, and formulate opinions.
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Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #2582 of 4667
4/27/12 at 7:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by joepaiii View Post

I would like to see some video or blu ray compares between hdmi and vga to see how much difference there is. I have seen the single pixels and one pixel line tests but never an image from a movie showing the difference. It seems to me the only people to pick this up saw it looking at pc graphics and noticing a softness with the text and other lines.

I put up a bunch of test patterns through my 9500 and it is much sharper than the 8350 I had before and in another league compared to my hd70. I guess my point is that I dont see how this is making a big impact in video.

joe - I can't speak for the 9500 but we are assuming the issue is the same since the results are the same for the tests Mike and I have done with the PC single pixel HDMI vs. VGA.

I guess it's all relative. I have a number of other projectors at my disposal to compare it to and my 142" screen is unforgiving with any flaws such as this one. There were ways to manipulate the image with the 'sharpness' and 'detail' settings on the W7000 to the point where I could fool my eyes into thinking everything was better in HDMI mode, but I do have the capabilities of watching full 1080P video via VGA and this is where the difference was obvious - switching back and forth between HDMI and VGA.

I believe I took some closeup photos, I will look through them this weekend and see if I have any good examples to post. I can't do it now since the W7000 has been fixed.
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post #2583 of 4667
4/27/12 at 8:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

joe - I can't speak for the 9500 but we are assuming the issue is the same since the results are the same for the tests Mike and I have done with the PC single pixel HDMI vs. VGA.

I guess it's all relative. I have a number of other projectors at my disposal to compare it to and my 142" screen is unforgiving with any flaws such as this one. There were ways to manipulate the image with the 'sharpness' and 'detail' settings on the W7000 to the point where I could fool my eyes into thinking everything was better in HDMI mode, but I do have the capabilities of watching full 1080P video via VGA and this is where the difference was obvious - switching back and forth between HDMI and VGA.

I believe I took some closeup photos, I will look through them this weekend and see if I have any good examples to post. I can't do it now since the W7000 has been fixed.

Did the fix to the 7000 affect brightness as has been suggested it might?
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post #2584 of 4667
4/27/12 at 10:41am
I don't think the Optoma ML500 comments apply here. We know the Acer is capable of 1:1 pixel mapping (via VGA). In close-up photos of the projected image you can clearly see the individual mirrors/pixels, which are square shaped and well-defined. So we know the Acer (and BenQ) are using true 1920x1080 mirror arrays in a square-shaped grid pattern. If I read between the lines, the Optoma appears to be using a wobulated DMD chip, which uses a 960x1080 mirror array in a diamond-shaped grid pattern. This increases brightness by increasing fill factor, and reduces cost and size, but sacrifices 1:1 pixel resolution (since you have to move one axis of the DMD chip back and forth rapidly to fake 1920 pixels out of 960 mirrors, a process called wobulation, which overlaps and blurs neighboring pixels).

At any rate, we know the Acer is perfectly capable of 1:1 pixel mapping without dimming, as evidence by VGA. Using HDMI should produce identical results.
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post #2585 of 4667
4/27/12 at 11:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by InCali View Post

Did the fix to the 7000 affect brightness as has been suggested it might?

negative, it's no different after the fix. My original W7000 measured ~900 lumens in 3D mode with a D65 calibration and the new one is about 1000 lumens, also with a near D65 calibration. This is more likely due to sample variance, lamp age, etc. You can get more light out of it, but at the expense of color accuracy. Most projectors with torch modes are cranking the green levels.

Brian - After the fix, HDMI and VGA are indistinguishable from one another on the W7000. It seems likely that Acer could also fix this with a firmware update.
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post #2586 of 4667
4/27/12 at 1:04pm
I have contacted the french acer support and they told me that the hdmi bug has been reported by several users and is currently under investigation.
Let's wait and see...
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post #2587 of 4667
4/27/12 at 3:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Miller View Post

I don't think the Optoma ML500 comments apply here. We know the Acer is capable of 1:1 pixel mapping (via VGA)...

I disagree. When digital data is converted to analog, 1:1 pixel mapping is lost. Many types noise and distortions are added. Analog is continuous signal.
Then the analog signal needs to be resampled, a process in which new distortion and noise are also always added. Likewise a 50' VGA cable takes it toll with limited bandwidth, propagation delays and resulting phase shifts and imperfect grounds.

Given the proper design, the whole cycle is unnecessary.
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post #2588 of 4667
4/27/12 at 4:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by magicone_fr View Post

I have contacted the french acer support and they told me that the hdmi bug has been reported by several users and is currently under investigation.
Let's wait and see...

Thanks for your assistance and that is encouraging news from your side of the pond. Has anyone stateside gotten such a response yet? The first step is acknowledgement. If they fix this I will be doing backflips. Yes I like my projector, I just want it to be the best it can.
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post #2589 of 4667
4/27/12 at 5:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by HiFiFun View Post

I disagree. When digital data is converted to analog, 1:1 pixel mapping is lost.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I'm not implying that VGA is a good solution here. I was just pointing out that the Acer is not behaving like the Optoma ML500 which is incapable of full resolution, since the Acer shows evidence of full resolution over VGA. Since we know the Acer can achieve full resolution, there is no technical reason it cannot do so over HDMI as well. Indeed, I agree with everything you said, and HDMI ought to be superior to VGA (but is currently inferior).
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post #2590 of 4667
4/27/12 at 6:51pm
Although this has been said before, I want to reiterate that the 9500 video through HDMI is still sharp - just not as sharp as it could be. I had both the 9500 and the Epson 3010 side by side, and the 9500 was probably sharper. I kept the 3010 because I liked the color and the brightness better, but that 9500 sure had pop. I appreciate the effort to get the Acer up to its full potential, but prospective buyers need not avoid this on account of HDMI blur, as this is a minor flaw in a very good projector. Frustration is that a firmware fix is almost surely possible, but not currently available, and Acer seems oblivious.
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post #2591 of 4667
4/27/12 at 7:39pm
The Optoma ML500 has absolutely nothing to do with the Acer H9500BD. They are totally different sized chips, with different resolutions serving totally different purposes. Acer makes a FP similar to the ML500 (K330?). I'm pretty sure both those projectors also use wobulation, something that has nothing to do with the Acer H9500BD projector (as the use of the VGA inputs clearly demonstrates)
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post #2592 of 4667
4/28/12 at 4:53am
I believe the blur issue is different with each projector. My replacement seems to blur more than my original and is very sensitive to resolution and refresh changes. 1080p60 may look like crap after quiting a game being played at the same resolution (looking at pc desktop). Icon text is so blurry that i cant read it. Changing refresh to 59 and then back to 60 clears up some of the blur. Changing refresh to 48 actually creates a much sharper looking image. Very sporadic behavior for an investment like this. Vsync seems to be a big problem with this unit when you toss in the SBS 3d problems.
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post #2593 of 4667
4/28/12 at 8:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by pixel67 View Post

I believe the blur issue is different with each projector. My replacement seems to blur more than my original and is very sensitive to resolution and refresh changes. 1080p60 may look like crap after quiting a game being played at the same resolution (looking at pc desktop). Icon text is so blurry that i cant read it. Changing refresh to 59 and then back to 60 clears up some of the blur. Changing refresh to 48 actually creates a much sharper looking image. Very sporadic behavior for an investment like this. Vsync seems to be a big problem with this unit when you toss in the SBS 3d problems.

I've written extensively on what I think are out of the box quality issues for this device. The first one I got didn't do 2D to 3D; the second had faulty HDMI inputs; the third one works great. I wasn't overly concerned about this because I knew there were good units out there; I just needed to get one. I also heard from others who had a similar experience.

My suggestion is to call Acer, get a case number, and return it to whomever sold it to you (hopefully it's within the return time frame). If you have to send it in, I STRONGLY suggest you have them check the hi res ports and tell them about the HDMI blurring. Reference Mike's case number (posted earlier). They told him he had to send in his unit for evaluation even though everyone else has the same problem. If you have to send your unit in, we might as well try to kill two birds with one stone.....may not help, but at least we can say "Hey, fine....here's a unit with the problem. Fix it. You might even ask if someone will call you BEFORE they process it for shipping back to you in case they give you the old "we didn't find anything".

One other thing you might try first.....unplug EVERYTHING and hold down the start button for 30 seconds. It will cause a reset and you'll have to adjust everything again (a bit of a pain.....believe me, I know....), but it might clear up the problem.

Good luck and let us know what happens.
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post #2594 of 4667
4/28/12 at 8:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by pixel67 View Post

I believe the blur issue is different with each projector. My replacement seems to blur more than my original and is very sensitive to resolution and refresh changes. 1080p60 may look like crap after quiting a game being played at the same resolution (looking at pc desktop). Icon text is so blurry that i cant read it. Changing refresh to 59 and then back to 60 clears up some of the blur. Changing refresh to 48 actually creates a much sharper looking image. Very sporadic behavior for an investment like this. Vsync seems to be a big problem with this unit when you toss in the SBS 3d problems.

You should NOT have to do that crap to get a clear picture.....
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post #2595 of 4667
4/28/12 at 9:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by pixel67 View Post

I believe the blur issue is different with each projector. My replacement seems to blur more than my original and is very sensitive to resolution and refresh changes. 1080p60 may look like crap after quiting a game being played at the same resolution (looking at pc desktop). Icon text is so blurry that i cant read it. Changing refresh to 59 and then back to 60 clears up some of the blur. Changing refresh to 48 actually creates a much sharper looking image. Very sporadic behavior for an investment like this. Vsync seems to be a big problem with this unit when you toss in the SBS 3d problems.

A couple more thoughts.....I wonder if the fact that 48 seems to work better than 60 is a result of pulldown? Could this be the issue Acer is dealing with? I seem to recall others testing at different settings, but don't remember. Also, if you have to send your PJ in, can you take pictures and send them in with it? You might also want to include Mike's or someone else's pics showing the HDMI blurring. You can tell them that's what your PJ looked like before the issue you are describing occurred....or something. I think Acer is trying to pass the buck and I want to do anything I can (short of sending my PJ in of course ) to force them to deal with this.
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post #2596 of 4667
4/28/12 at 10:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by InCali View Post

A couple more thoughts.....I wonder if the fact that 48 seems to work better than 60 is a result of pulldown? Could this be the issue Acer is dealing with?

How do you set 48 vs 60? (I guess it's possible only via PC/HTPC)
If I force PS3 to output 1080P/24, would that make the PJ go to 48 and not 60?
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post #2597 of 4667
4/28/12 at 10:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by InCali View Post


A couple more thoughts.....I wonder if the fact that 48 seems to work better than 60 is a result of pulldown? Could this be the issue Acer is dealing with? I seem to recall others testing at different settings, but don't remember. Also, if you have to send your PJ in, can you take pictures and send them in with it? You might also want to include Mike's or someone else's pics showing the HDMI blurring. You can tell them that's what your PJ looked like before the issue you are describing occurred....or something. I think Acer is trying to pass the buck and I want to do anything I can (short of sending my PJ in of course ) to force them to deal with this.

I posted a video on youtube of the SBS tearing issue prior to sending in my old unit and the new one exhibits the same problem only worse. On the "new" one, if i leave the projector in 3d mode and watch 2d content it tears. This is why i think it has some serious sync issues. I keep waiting to hear someone else got theirs fixed as i dont want to be without a projector for another month.
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post #2598 of 4667
4/28/12 at 10:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post


How do you set 48 vs 60? (I guess it's possible only via PC/HTPC)
If I force PS3 to output 1080P/24, would that make the PJ go to 48 and not 60?

I created a custom res on my pc based on another post in this forum.
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post #2599 of 4667
4/28/12 at 5:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pixel67 View Post

I posted a video on youtube of the SBS tearing issue prior to sending in my old unit and the new one exhibits the same problem only worse. On the "new" one, if i leave the projector in 3d mode and watch 2d content it tears. This is why i think it has some serious sync issues. I keep waiting to hear someone else got theirs fixed as i dont want to be without a projector for another month.

I guess I was one of the lucky ones. I sent my PJ in for repair and got is back in a little less than 2 weeks. I didn't like being without it either, but I had my Sanyo as a back up.

I take it you're past the exchange date for your PJ.
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post #2600 of 4667
4/28/12 at 5:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Miller View Post

I don't think the Optoma ML500 comments apply here. We know the Acer is capable of 1:1 pixel mapping (via VGA). In close-up photos of the projected image you can clearly see the individual mirrors/pixels, which are square shaped and well-defined. So we know the Acer (and BenQ) are using true 1920x1080 mirror arrays in a square-shaped grid pattern. If I read between the lines, the Optoma appears to be using a wobulated DMD chip, which uses a 960x1080 mirror array in a diamond-shaped grid pattern. This increases brightness by increasing fill factor, and reduces cost and size, but sacrifices 1:1 pixel resolution (since you have to move one axis of the DMD chip back and forth rapidly to fake 1920 pixels out of 960 mirrors, a process called wobulation, which overlaps and blurs neighboring pixels).

At any rate, we know the Acer is perfectly capable of 1:1 pixel mapping without dimming, as evidence by VGA. Using HDMI should produce identical results.

the chips(1140x912) in those leds are pico chips ,with the mirrors set to where there was a side there is now a corner(turned a 1/8 ),there is no wobble ,that uses a secondary mirror any ways(takes a lot of space is only used in rear pj tv,s )
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post #2601 of 4667
4/28/12 at 11:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by InCali View Post

After last night, I'm getting damn tired of these 9th innings.....maybe Bug Selig (not a typo) would consider making it an 8 inning game????

Hi PrimeTime....finally a 9th inning I can live with and the 10th was better (and shorter). Still think Bug can do away with the 9th. Can't send a PM.

The Pollyanna in me says we're getting closer to solving what appears to be a firmware issue with the Acer. Glad to hear others around our big globe are pushing also. My hat would be off to you all except for the fact that I don't wear one.

At this point, I'm considering sending my PJ in just to find out "what de mudder fuggin hale" is happening. I have the box and packing material from Acer and am thinking this might be a way to get some answers (though the answer might be "nuthin's wrong").

If I do send it in, I want to be fully armed. All suggestions appreciated.
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post #2602 of 4667
4/29/12 at 8:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by eat meat View Post

the chips(1140x912) in those leds are pico chips ,with the mirrors set to where there was a side there is now a corner(turned a 1/8 ),there is no wobble ,that uses a secondary mirror any ways(takes a lot of space is only used in rear pj tv,s )

This is a wide ranging complicated subject with hard-to-find information.

The key requirement is that brighter, more efficient DLP was needed for both pico projectors AND 3D.

This has occurred! Wikipedia calls this "advancements" for pico projectors:
"In 2011, Texas Instruments DLP announced improved chipsets that enable brighter images. The chipsets are designed to enhance image brightness without increasing power usage for both WVGA (native DVD resolution) devices, such as mobile phones, and VGA devices, such as digital cameras and camcorders. The chipsets have the ability to project an image up to 50” on any surface in optimum lighting conditions, the tiny projection chip requires very little space and is virtually undetected in a device’s overall form factor. With advancements in size and performance, the TI DLP Pico chipset supplies big picture experiences with contemporary handsets[citation needed]."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handheld_projector

I did a IXQuick search and found only AVS a source for the non-standard 1140 resolution in an LG projector:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post20956125

Notice that we only learn of this stuff through inadvertent leaks - through press or support engineers. Only about 25% of the professional reviewers catch the lack of 1:1 mapping (this was the major finding of my and Cine4home 9500 reviews).

To its credit all three display forums here at AVS have caught the lack of 1:1 mapping in DLP based displays: rear projection, pico/mobile projection and under $3K and over $3K front projector forums.
Here is the rear projector forum thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1397654

Note: AVS pico/mobile needs its own forum

The initial evidence indicates there is a trade-off between 1:1 mapping and brightness. That is, allow the DLP to generate a brighter image, but quietly loose the sharp 1:1 pixel mapping.

TI sure has been busy increasing projector brightness for 3D and pico projectors. We should realize that. For myself I would never purchase any DLP projector which doesn't have sharp text or video as its been the signature trademark of the technology!

I'm going to re-read the Amazon projector reviews and see how many consumers indirectly describe the loss of 1:1 pixel mapping. Actually it manifests itself in the lack of comments on the text being sharp!
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post #2603 of 4667
4/29/12 at 12:22pm
Hi guys ! I just got my projector back from repair and that was the 3rd time ! Now guess what ... The 3D doesn't work anymore, no one of the mode! Even 2D to 3D conversion doesn't work anymore. It just splits the screen on half and swap the two parts/left to right/ The glasses are synchronizing , the 3D depth is working, but the image is spitted and swapped. I called Acer immediately, and spent an hour to explain everything including the history of my issues. Also how the repair depot
tossed away my retail box , and the plastic bag which wrapped the unit inside the carrying bag. I managed to reach Acer second level/technical support/ and I insisted to speak with their supervisor.At the end I was on the phone with the
the Corporate of Acer America/WOW/The guy was polite and I explained everything again. I took a photo of the current issue with the 3D and sent it to his email. Then I got back with the tech support again for more details.
Shortly after, their conclusion was that there is some problem with the projector processor. I refused to send the unit back to the same repair depot in TX , but at the end I had to do it again! I also mentioned the issue with the blurry image via HDMI/DVI ports
and advised them to take a look of the latest reviews at Amazon,Newegg and Tigerdirect. I also left a note inside the box of the projector for the repair depot so they can compare the VGA and HDMI/DVI image quality. I think I made some noise and hope that you'll make some too , and hopefully Acer will cooperate and solve this issue.
LL
LL
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post #2604 of 4667
4/29/12 at 2:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kfor View Post

Hi guys ! I just got my projector back from repair and that was the 3rd time ! Now guess what ... The 3D doesn't work anymore, no one of the mode! Even 2D to 3D conversion doesn't work anymore. It just splits the screen on half and swap the two parts/left to right/ The glasses are synchronizing , the 3D depth is working, but the image is spitted and swapped. I called Acer immediately, and spent an hour to explain everything including the history of my issues. Also how the repair depot
tossed away my retail box , and the plastic bag which wrapped the unit inside the carrying bag. I managed to reach Acer second level/technical support/ and I insisted to speak with their supervisor.At the end I was on the phone with the
the Corporate of Acer America/WOW/The guy was polite and I explained everything again. I took a photo of the current issue with the 3D and sent it to his email. Then I got back with the tech support again for more details.
Shortly after, their conclusion was that there is some problem with the projector processor. I refused to send the unit back to the same repair depot in TX , but at the end I had to do it again! I also mentioned the issue with the blurry image via HDMI/DVI ports
and advised them to take a look of the latest reviews at Amazon,Newegg and Tigerdirect. I also left a note inside the box of the projector for the repair depot so they can compare the VGA and HDMI/DVI image quality. I think I made some noise and hope that you'll make some too , and hopefully Acer will cooperate and solve this issue.

Way to go! Publish his email address and we will pummel him with replacement requests, or at least make him aware of all of the issues just in case he hasnt read this thread and counted on one hand the number of customers that dont have issues (or at least arent complaining). Too many of us have adopted an "its good enough" attitude (including me at times) even though the units continue to fail to conform to their own published specifications. I haven't returned mine for the second time because i have no confidence that they can fix it. Every unit out there seems to have the SBS tearing issue and i sold my old optoma based on this units published specs (1080sbs 3d, 2d to 3d, lens shift, accumotion, etc). Sucks...
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post #2605 of 4667
4/29/12 at 6:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pixel67 View Post

Way to go! Publish his email address and we will pummel him with replacement requests, or at least make him aware of all of the issues just in case he hasnt read this thread and counted on one hand the number of customers that dont have issues (or at least arent complaining). Too many of us have adopted an "its good enough" attitude (including me at times) even though the units continue to fail to conform to their own published specifications. I haven't returned mine for the second time because i have no confidence that they can fix it. Every unit out there seems to have the SBS tearing issue and i sold my old optoma based on this units published specs (1080sbs 3d, 2d to 3d, lens shift, accumotion, etc). Sucks...

Hi Folks,

I'm all for contacting anyone who can effectively deal with these problems. I am suggesting that Acer executives will respond more favorably if they think we will continue to purchase Acer products as long as they address our issues. If I were to say "Screw you and the Acer horse you rode in on. I'm never buying any POS from Acer as long as I live", it would probably get someone's attention, but doesn't provide much of an incentive to fix the problem. As a matter of fact, I'm watching the Acer now. It really does look good and it only cost me fifteen benji's. I want it to look as good as possible, but, honestly, the only reason I'm not satisfied is because I think it could still be better.

On another note, I got my old Sanyo hooked up in my son's bedroom today with an 80 inch screen and it looks really good when he's playing WoW. I was surprised at how much brighter an 80 as opposed to a 120 inch screen appeared. Even with a fair amount of ambient light, the picture is clear and (relatively) bright. The kid is stoked.....
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post #2606 of 4667
4/29/12 at 6:35pm
Hey guys, I am trying to be patient here and see what happens. Ten days ago I went as far as Acer would let me via their support channel. Here is what really bothers me about that experience:
1. Failure to listen to what the customer is telling you. By that I mean they refused to acknowledge that every 9500 has the issue. They do not need me to send my unit in to test this. Surely there is one at their repair facility they can test.
2. Failure to allow me to speak with the appropriate people in order to properly address the HDMI issue. Nobody I spoke with had a clue what I was talking about despite the pictures I sent them. I pleaded with them to forward my observations to their engineers but do not believe they did.
3. Failure to respond back from their highest level of customer care that I could reach except to say that it would be reviewed internally. I do need to and will follow up on this soon, just hoping there would be a lot of other complaints referring to my case #.

Enough failure talk because I could go on. The bottom line is that I am not sending my unit in because it is a very sharp projector for most of the viewing I do. Yet the fact remains that I can expose it's 1:1 mapping problem at will now. Kind of like the RBE thing. Do not go looking for trouble. Problem is that I was set to buy the BenQ W7000 yet passed on that due to price and some issues. Alas BenQ has owned it and appears to have fixed their problem. Acer has not yet even acknowledged the issue. Yes I know these things do not happen over night but all I asked them to do was look into it and get back to me. That is it.

So for now I cannot recommend the unit to anyone shopping. Yes all projectors have a problem or two it seems. What matters is how the manufacturer handles these things. So far I am not happy in this area. For now my 9500 is still mounted to the ceiling and will remain there. If Acer comes out and says that the HDMI circuit is functioning the way we designed it and we are not going to change anything despite your pictures, then so be it. Then I can change my review to point out this design issue and review it based on it's strengths and weaknesses that will never change. That would be unfortunate since a very good picture can be just that much better. I believe I am more frustrated with my support on this product than the product itself.
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post #2607 of 4667
4/30/12 at 1:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikes2cents View Post

Hey guys, I am trying to be patient here and see what happens. Ten days ago I went as far as Acer would let me via their support channel. Here is what really bothers me about that experience:
1. Failure to listen to what the customer is telling you. By that I mean they refused to acknowledge that every 9500 has the issue. They do not need me to send my unit in to test this. Surely there is one at their repair facility they can test.
2. Failure to allow me to speak with the appropriate people in order to properly address the HDMI issue. Nobody I spoke with had a clue what I was talking about despite the pictures I sent them. I pleaded with them to forward my observations to their engineers but do not believe they did.
3. Failure to respond back from their highest level of customer care that I could reach except to say that it would be reviewed internally. I do need to and will follow up on this soon, just hoping there would be a lot of other complaints referring to my case #.

Enough failure talk because I could go on. The bottom line is that I am not sending my unit in because it is a very sharp projector for most of the viewing I do. Yet the fact remains that I can expose it's 1:1 mapping problem at will now. Kind of like the RBE thing. Do not go looking for trouble. Problem is that I was set to buy the BenQ W7000 yet passed on that due to price and some issues. Alas BenQ has owned it and appears to have fixed their problem. Acer has not yet even acknowledged the issue. Yes I know these things do not happen over night but all I asked them to do was look into it and get back to me. That is it.

So for now I cannot recommend the unit to anyone shopping. Yes all projectors have a problem or two it seems. What matters is how the manufacturer handles these things. So far I am not happy in this area. For now my 9500 is still mounted to the ceiling and will remain there. If Acer comes out and says that the HDMI circuit is functioning the way we designed it and we are not going to change anything despite your pictures, then so be it. Then I can change my review to point out this design issue and review it based on it's strengths and weaknesses that will never change. That would be unfortunate since a very good picture can be just that much better. I believe I am more frustrated with my support on this product than the product itself.

I am just curious, you mentioned your Mitsubishi DLP does the same thing have you inquired Mitsubishi on the issue with the tv? And if so what they attributed it to? What did Ben Q attribute the issue with W7000 to or did they just fix it?
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post #2608 of 4667
4/30/12 at 5:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by man4mopar View Post

What did Ben Q attribute the issue with W7000 to or did they just fix it?

unfortunately they didn't disclose that information. The firmware fix came from their HQ and they sent it to the US group to install on customers projectors. I've been testing it for about 3 weeks now, they definitely resolved the problem and HDMI is now as sharp/clear as the VGA connection.
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post #2609 of 4667
4/30/12 at 6:01am
Think Ill hold off on the Acer upgrade for now and see what happens.
My current H5360BD has software which could be better anyway and i never heard of a firmware fix for that! lets see if they fix the issues reported here first before I go and hand down €1,700 on a new unit.
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post #2610 of 4667
4/30/12 at 7:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zt-octavian View Post

Think Ill hold off on the Acer upgrade for now and see what happens.
My current H5360BD has software which could be better anyway and i never heard of a firmware fix for that! lets see if they fix the issues reported here first before I go and hand down 1,700 on a new unit.

I don't blame you. The new model could be out in a few months and maybe the problem will get resolved. One thing we should do is make sure the reviewers are aware of this issue and test for it. We should also let Acer (as high up as possible) know their new unit will be put under a microscope.

The picture on the 9500 is really clear and the only thing I don't like about it is that I know it could be better. I could see why someone would think I'm nuts, but just knowing that there's room for improvement and nothing is being done about it is annoying.
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