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Official Sony VPL-VW95ES Owners Thread - Page 8

post #211 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

I thought the same thing when I read that comment (as well as a few other remarks). If Joerods JVC truly sounded like an "electric razor", he had a defective unit. The Sony might be more quiet, but hell I cant even hear my RS40 in low lamp mode unless I shut off my preamp and listen for it. I remember how pleasantly surprised I was by how quiet it was in my VERY low noise floor dedicated HT. In high mode, it is a bit louder but I would say subjectively on par with my RS1 which was certainly not bad IMO.

I enjoyed reading your thoughts otherwise Joerod and thanks I have predicted all along that the 95 would be the overall unit to beat which certainly seems to be the case so far. Sounds like one nice projector!

Actually Electric Razor refers to when it is first turning on. When the doors open not during normal performance. I guess I should go back in and clarify that.
post #212 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by damelon View Post

Can someone just post the direct link to Joerod's review? I've tired multiple browsers, and still can't see the 95 on the home page or the link on page 5.

Send me an email: joerod55@msn.com
post #213 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

Actually Electric Razor refers to when it is first turning on. When the doors open not during normal performance. I guess I should go back in and clarify that.

Well that I would agree with! You really do need to clarify that though since right now it reads that it sounds like an electric razor during operation which is obviously not the case. That 3-4 second lens cover opening does resemble the sound of an electric razor though so thank god it only lasts that long!
post #214 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

I liked Joe's review, shows some spirit at least, and reviews are a pain to make.

I've learned a few hard lessons about writing reviews, the first thing you need to do is to temporarily hate all projectors for at least one reason, that is the first step in leveling the BIAS that exists in everyone's own mind. It's sort of like acting in a way, you literally have to act your way out of the BIAS to yourself. If you cannot find at least one reason to hate a projector you are reviewing, then you need to step back (I know this sounds extreme but it really does work).

I promise when I get the RS-45 in and do a review, it will be as non-bias as any single person could make it. Only problem is I've never had a RECENT MODEL higher-end Sony, maybe Sony will send me a reviewer unit once I get more of my sites completed so I can compare to the JVC (too busy with the calculator atm).

I use that mind game technique on myself and it works. I will be hating every projector as I'm writing a review
Much like some movie critiques can find something wrong with almost every movie.

Great points!
And let's not forget this is only my own opionion. Anyone here can do their own site and type whatever they like as well. That is part of the fun.
post #215 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

Well that I would agree with! You really do need to clarify that though since right now it reads that it sounds like an electric razor during operation which is obviously not the case. That 3-4 second lens cover opening does resemble the sound of an electric razor though so thank god it only lasts that long!

Fixing it now. Wowser, I am taking a hit over that one.
post #216 of 3559
I agree anyone can say anything, but reviewers gain credibility by stating their own BIAS and working around it. Art @ pjreviews.com is good at this technique, he will often point out that although a projector beat X and X for whatever reason, his decision making was based on the bias of him preferring black levels. Comments like that are helpful and give a review more weight because it provides a basis of reasoning for every opinion given.

However, I am not one to fault anyone elses opinions or methods of review writing. For all I know the Sony does really kill the JVC, it does after all cost a lot more than an RS-45 at least, but I'd like to see both units in a shootout before I were to make any hard-core conclusions.

I for one am not concerned about how the projector sounds when you first turn it on, as long as my ears are not bleeding before the movie starts.
post #217 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

@mark...

thanks for posting that... i had been looking forward to this "review", and unfortunately, it reads like a fanboy screed...

glad joe takes the time to do stuff, so i'm not directly knocking him... just wish it was a "real review", as it likely would have been helpful to many of us...

Not sure what else you would like me to say about the 95? I am not posting numbers since units they can vary quite a bit. And so far I have received 178 thank you messages from my site. I guess I can't please everybody. Truth be told I am still having a hard time finding something to not like about the 95. It has the image in 2D and 3D, features and more importantly the PRICE to make it the complete package.

I could send one to you and you can "review" it for us...
post #218 of 3559
It's no problem. I think all the attacks are one reason pro reviewers kind of keep a low profile on this forum
No matter what you say, someone will attack it, even if you are 100% accurate, or if you are 50% accurate, some people will still attack you 100% of the time.

Part of a forum I suppose.
post #219 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by kabrumbs View Post

We all want a JVC with improved montion, but i think the quote above is just misleading. The 95 didn't improved on black level from the 90 and is a tid bit dimmer. The 30 didn't improved on black level from the 20. It is expected that RS45 has the same black level of RS40 but improved brightness. It is expected that RS55 will improve on black level and on brightness. So, for me, its not like Sony is closing the gap, at least not in this year.

I really wanted a Sony with greater native contrast!!!

And my doubts are : VW95 or RS45 + HC7800.

[]s Humberto

I'd have to disagree. At least with the two 95s I have here. Not to mention 90 and 30 as well. The blacks are a little deeper and shadow detail looks even better. Again the 95 is also the sharpest. Add that with their already superior Motion and yes the JVC gap is closing each gen.
post #220 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geof View Post

But some folks bitched when they found out the automatic lens cover is omitted from the RS45. Some folks rejoiced. Others, like you, make fun of the sound. Who cares, it lasts like 5 seconds and it's gone. Making reference to an electric razor sound that only happens during start up shows prejudice in my mind. In the end though I guess it really doesn't matter.

It was more of a humerous comment. I can youtube a video of both my electric razor and turning on the RS40 if everyone wants. They would be right on. Seriously, if you can't poke fun then what is the point? JVC loyalists must be bored if that comment offends them.

Again, I am just calling it like I see (HEAR) it...
post #221 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

It's no problem. I think all the attacks are one reason pro reviewers kind of keep a low profile on this forum
No matter what you say, someone will attack it, even if you are 100% accurate, or if you are 50% accurate, some people will still attack you 100% of the time.

Part of a forum I suppose.

I completely agree. If the 95 was not improved and had issues I would definitely be reporting them. I have been very complimentary to JVC the past couple gens. Heck I even ended up with them for longer periods (RS35 and 60). I am looking forward to putting up a 55 next to the 95. I am planning a detailed comparison this December.
post #222 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I knew you would call me out on the SDI thing again. Face it, SDI is about extinct. This is the only way to carry it on.

As for "attacking" the competition I am just setting the bar JVC needs to get to this year to have a chance. The Sony 95 is priced super competitive and JVC needs to realize they can't make it on name recognition alone this time. Not after last year's fiasco. I plan to look at the 55 and if it is in order I will definitely state that. I am not happy JVC never answered any questions about the Lamp -Sudden Dimming Issue- which ended up occurring to each model I reviewed after I sold them of course.

some folks want to love JVC and everything JVC does. hear no evil speak no evil. I was one of those people too until I had the RS40 and RS50. These are decent projectors in some regards, but there is a lot more to a projector than a specific contrast ratio, it's the sum of the parts. IMO, JVC has to make serious ammends this year on the 2012 models (fix the buggy CMS, Gamma controls, no warm up time for 3D, no 400 hours on the lamp and 3D is done for, no early lamp failures, etc)

I can see why folks are flocking to the VW95 given how positive my experience is with the cheaper HW30. There is a reason I use the HW30 80%+ of the time vs the JVC. It has great colors and brightness out of the box (no lumen robbing severe grayscale adjustments just to get D65) and very good 3D due to the FI. I can watch 3D as soon as I turn the projector on and the 1/2 price lamps (compared to the JVC) means I can let it burn as much as I want.

when properly calibrated, the HW30 contrast and black levels look great on my 142" 2.8 HP screen. the perceived black level / contrast is better imo than the #'s would indicate. I watched 'Blade' on bluray the other night, quite a dark movie. I didn't find myself wishing I was watching the RS50 at any time during the movie.
post #223 of 3559
Joe has put the electric razor thing in context and is fixing it. It is clear we weren't reading it as he intended but I agree that is his fault not ours. Anyhow a miscommunication is being fixed.
post #224 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 4 View Post

Joe has put the electric razor thing in context and is fixing it. It is clear we weren't reading it as he intended but I agree that is his fault not ours. Anyhow a miscommunication is being fixed.

It was late when I was doing my last walkthough.
post #225 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geof View Post

But some folks bitched when they found out the automatic lens cover is omitted from the RS45. Some folks rejoiced. Others, like you, make fun of the sound. Who cares, it lasts like 5 seconds and it's gone. Making reference to an electric razor sound that only happens during start up shows prejudice in my mind tho. In the end though I guess it really doesn't matter what I think.

I don't know about you guys, but when I hit the macro to start up my theater and hear the RS20 lens cover open I get a thrill knowing the entertainment is about to begin. Obviously, I have a low excitement threshold
post #226 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlanzy View Post

I don't know about you guys, but when I hit the macro to start up my theater and hear the RS20 lens cover open I get a thrill knowing the entertainment is about to begin. Obviously, I have a low excitement threshold

That's a good way to look at it. Though when I had guests over they would always look up towards the ceiling with a worried look. Then they would pick straws to see who had to sit under it. Just kidding...
post #227 of 3559
lens opening discussion aside, Joe has pointed out the major concerns with the 2011 model JVC's that all conscience buyers should be aware of, and should keep a sharp eye open for real fixes in the 2012 models once they are in users hands.

I don't recall any 'professional' review discussing warm up time for 3D, early dimming lamps, severe ghosting after a few hundred hours, etc. I prefer the 'man on the street' reporting which comes from many of the members here who can get past the honeymoon phase and can call it like it in.

in the end, it can benefit folks such as Sony listening to customer complaints about the VW90 and fixing them in the VW95. time will tell if JVC listened too.
post #228 of 3559
I of course knew that Joe was talking about the lens opening noise of the JVC's. This is a 'feature' (on my RS20) that I actually like: when I turn it on or off, I immediately get the 'electric razor' telling me that it is indeed turning on or off, without having to look back at the lens to confirm.

Re Joe's 'review', if you have read many of his before, you are not surprised--very little hard info. Why no #'s? We all know there are variations, but at this stage one needs to hear from various sources. So far the max we have heard for the 95 is something like 770 lumens (high lamp, min throw), and cine4homes's report of 930 lumens for the RS55/65 in same conditions. Sure, it would be good to have these under more controlled conditions, but it's all out there at present. Joe's would have been useful. Also, nowhere yet have I seen any report of the native CR of the 95; have I missed it?
post #229 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by conan48 View Post

The JVC RS45 actually competes and beats the Sony 95 in native contrast (...) One last thing, people should stop bad mouthing the JVC for motion. I'm really sensitive to motion issues and the JVC does very well. The FI is not as smooth as the Sony, but the JVC uses a more aggressive approach which gives more of the SOE but at the cost of some artifacting.

1. The native contrast of the VW95 is on par with the RS45.
2. If you like how JVC handles motion, you are certainly not "sensitive to motion issues". The JVCs have only one "acceptable" FI mode (3) which manages to, as you acknowledge, introduce a soap effect and other artifacts - and motion *still* looks blurry. Very weird.

I really wanted to like the X30/VW45 as it has a great price and of course very nice contrast, but the motion handling is just too bad. The head of JVC Germany, whom I spoke to at a HT fair, admitted that he wished the new models had improved motion (FI) but that JVC headquarters in Japan didn't think it was a problem they needed to tackle. And as long as their PJs sell well and JVC buyers live in denial that motion is fine/good enough, I guess there'll be no pressure to do something about it, which would be a shame.
post #230 of 3559
Ah, screw it - I ordered one...will be here Friday AM..
post #231 of 3559
I am surprised folks are still comparing the Cine4home and Kraine #'s, especially regarding lumens. There are too many variables to consider even a reasonable comparison until the 95/55 are both evaluated in the same testing environment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Ah, screw it - I ordered one...will be here Friday AM..

good news, I'd like to hear how you think it compares to the RS50.
post #232 of 3559
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Ah, screw it - I ordered one...will be here Friday AM..

post #233 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I am surprised folks are still comparing the Cine4home and Kraine #'s, especially regarding lumens. There are too many variables to consider even a reasonable comparison until the 95/55 are both evaluated in the same testing environment.

Agree that it's not ideal or definitive; that's why another report would have been (marginally) useful.
post #234 of 3559
Are the Optoma 3d Glasses interchangeable with the Monstervision 3D glasses? - they look identical.

I can order the Monstervision with emitter from Amazon, but cannot find the add on stand alone glasses. Amazon does have the Optoma stand alone glasses, but want to know if they will sync with the Monster-branded emitter...

http://www.amazon.com/Optoma-Technol...0338884&sr=8-2

Sorry if this was covered before..


Thanks
post #235 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

The blacks are a little deeper and shadow detail looks even better.

Well Sony thinks that it didnt improve on contrast!!!

From Sony website:
VW90ES contrast: 150000:1 w/iris
VW95ES contrast: 150000:1 w/iris

And JVC thinks that it did improve!!!

From JVC website:
RS 50 native contrast 70000:1.
RS55 native contrast 80000:1 .

We all know that numbers are just part of story, but manufactors will always brag about their improvements. And so, just on black levels/contrast, I think in this year Sony was almost static and JVC continued improving. If the effort was on the right target, that is another story. I really think that the path that each company choose with LCos somehow restrained them to improve the picture in every aspect. JVC just cant handle motion like Sony in the same way Sony cant get the native contrast of JVC...

And Joe, thanks to take your time to write the review. Specially when your last day of freedom is so close

[]s Humberto
post #236 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Ah, screw it - I ordered one...will be here Friday AM..



That's so good news.

If Rick and you keep the 95, I think that is the best compliment this projector can get

[]s Humberto
post #237 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Ah, screw it - I ordered one...will be here Friday AM..

Awesomeness!
post #238 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by kabrumbs View Post



That's so good news.

If Rick and you keep the 95, I think that is the best compliment this projector can get

[]s Humberto

Last time I checked I have had about 12 projectors in the last 15 months or so!
post #239 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by kabrumbs View Post

Well Sony thinks that it didnt improve on contrast!!!

From Sony website:
VW90ES contrast: 150000:1 w/iris
VW95ES contrast: 150000:1 w/iris

And JVC thinks that it did improve!!!

From JVC website:
RS 50 native contrast 70000:1.
RS55 native contrast 80000:1 .

We all know that numbers are just part of story, but manufactors will always brag about their improvements. And so, just on black levels/contrast, I think in this year Sony was almost static and JVC continued improving. If the effort was on the right target, that is another story. I really think that the path that each company choose with LCos somehow restrained them to improve the picture in every aspect. JVC just cant handle motion like Sony in the same way Sony cant get the native contrast of JVC...

And Joe, thanks to take your time to write the review. Specially when your last day of freedom is so close

[]s Humberto

Which is why I am squeezing out one more in the Combo- Integra 80.3 and Halo A5 1 review!
post #240 of 3559
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

JVC loyalists must be bored if that comment offends them.

Certainly not offended by it, but lets make clear what you are talking about (which it sounds like you have) since it was misleading (I dont think this was intentional) the way it was written. If someone did not know better, they could easily take that comment as how the unit sounds when watching a film which is incorrect.
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