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Official Power Sound Audio Thread - Page 63

post #1861 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

... does a sub really need to be tweaked with this ?

It's a terrible fact of life. Subwoofer systems need to be tweaked and if they're not tweaked, nobody will "EVER" be able to get the best out them.
post #1862 of 10096
Dstew,

You might have missed my earlier post but it was the audyssey. I hard rest the receiver to factory and mid bass came back. In fact, the whole bass come back. My subs are move air. Woofer is moving as it should. Before, it barely buzzed. I hope it's the mic. I should a getting a new one soon. One good thing out of all this is that I decided to spend time on REW
post #1863 of 10096
Here are my xv 15s. This is PWS forum after all. [IMG]
post #1864 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

It's a terrible fact of life. Subwoofer systems need to be tweaked and if they're not tweaked, nobody will "EVER" be able to get the best out them.

how do i tweak mine if YPAO dsnt do it ..!? can it be tweak manualy ?
post #1865 of 10096
post #1866 of 10096
post #1867 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by mp5475 View Post


Quote:
Originally Posted by mp5475 View Post



Very Nice, mp5475, it's good you got your problem or the source of it figured out. biggrin.gif
post #1868 of 10096
I will let you guys know what happens with the new mic. Thanks for all the suggestions!

Dstew, when I get my REW going, I will post the graph.
post #1869 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

how do i tweak mine if YPAO dsnt do it ..!? can it be tweak manualy ?

I'm not familiar with YPAO but it is an automatic system that will EQ your subwoofer system. I'm sure there's a YPAO thread in AVS that will explain YPAO and how to use it to your best interest.

First things first, to get the best out of your subwoofer system, it helps to have a sound level meter so the levels of the subwoofer's output can be gain matched so at the main listening position, when running a test tone through the subwoofer system, you're measuring 73dB - 75dB with aid of the sound level meter.

Once you have properly set the gain level of the subwoofers, run YPAO and let it measure your room and it will advise the AVR what the internal settings should be.

Now the rub. To be able to get the best out of one's subwoofer system, they need a room measuring program like REW so as to measure the room's acoustic response to the subwoofer's output. The reason, sound waves interact with each other in a positive and negative way, much like throwing pebbles into a glass smooth lake as you watch the ripples interact with each other. When subwoofer waves interact in a room in a bad way, they take away the strength of the subwoofer output. Without room measuring capability, one can't see what's happening in their room and they won't know what needs to be done to make things right.

In the simple, the easiest way to fix things is to asymmetrically place three or four subs in a room and the overlapping sound waves that are produced will smooth things out and make everything sonically even.
post #1870 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by manonfire View Post

If you don't mind me asking, what was the reason for the switch?

I honestly couldn't give you a rational answer because it was purely emotional. I probably would have always wondered "what if". Also not really in the habit of upgrading gear often, the sub I have was a matched set with my main speakers but was inadequate in the new room. Now I have subs that I will not get rid of for another 10 years along with angry neighbors.

My wife told me today that I could not judge on how she shopped for the next 6 months and damn if she wasn't right frown.gif
post #1871 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

this is quite retarded , ive read on other forum , the rx-a1xxx serie do not EQ subs .. only the rx-a2xxx/3xxx .. this is pretty retarded considerning rx-a1010 is adventage serie and a 1200$ amp..

how can i EQ my subs once ill buy it if my YPAO dsnt do it ... does a sub really need to be tweaked with this ?

Please don't use that word, it's quite offensive to some folks and just bad taste anymore.
post #1872 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by mp5475 View Post

Dstew,

You might have missed my earlier post but it was the audyssey. I hard rest the receiver to factory and mid bass came back. In fact, the whole bass come back. My subs are move air. Woofer is moving as it should. Before, it barely buzzed. I hope it's the mic. I should a getting a new one soon. One good thing out of all this is that I decided to spend time on REW

WoooHooo, glad to hear it's back to life. Long day, couldn't stay up to speed. Enjoy
post #1873 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by mp5475 View Post

Dstew,

You might have missed my earlier post but it was the audyssey. I hard rest the receiver to factory and mid bass came back. In fact, the whole bass come back. My subs are move air. Woofer is moving as it should. Before, it barely buzzed. I hope it's the mic. I should a getting a new one soon. One good thing out of all this is that I decided to spend time on REW

Glad you got the issue fixed! I had just signed on to check if it got resolved. Love your setup also!
post #1874 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post

Please don't use that word, it's quite offensive to some folks and just bad taste anymore.

what? retarded ! ?
post #1875 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by mp5475 View Post


really really nice setup !!! i wish i could have that ! maybe later after alot of overtime done !!!
post #1876 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

how do i tweak mine if YPAO dsnt do it ..!? can it be tweak manualy ?

Yes.
Like the other post says, a sound meter will help immensely. For phase issues, you can play with the distance settings in your receiver. Sometimes the phase button on the sub is not enough. If you want to spend money, there are sub equalizers that can help with dialing in the sub (SMS-1, anti mode, svs as eq-1). Afaik ypao will set the level and distance, it's just not always accurate especially the distance.
post #1877 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

what? retarded ! ?

Yes that word. I personally don't take offence to it but at the same time don't use it mostly because its in poor taste to do so. It's probably just best to avoid using it in your posts.
post #1878 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

Yes that word. I personally don't take offence to it but at the same time don't use it mostly because its in poor taste to do so. It's probably just best to avoid using it in your posts.

absolutely sry about it , my first language is french and we use it commonly when something just dsnt make sense ...especialy when its not used againt someone in particular ... maybe different in english i guess ...

sry if it sounded rude it idk .
post #1879 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

absolutely sry about it , my first language is french and we use it commonly when something just dsnt make sense ...especialy when its not used againt someone in particular ... maybe different in english i guess ...

sry if it sounded rude it idk .

We use it in that manner as well amongst family and friends but not so much in a more public setting.
post #1880 of 10096
I've used it in the past in the same manner, but have recently realized how offensive it could be to the mentally handicapped so have tried to stop using it altogether in my personal life. I still catch myself now and then.
post #1881 of 10096
FWIW, language is used to communicate ideas.

I have a mental handicap because of a couple of concussions when a child. Yes, I'm a cliche, I was dropped on my head as a child. tongue.gif The top of my brain (corpus callosum) was damaged. Due to this, I'm emotionally handicapped and my social abilities are retarded but my intellectual capacity has not been harmed in the least. What has happened, the two hemispheres are not able to process emotional energy at the same rate as a normal individual so my social development has been stunted or retarded accordingly.

The point, being handicapped or retarded is a fact of life that we all have to deal with and it's okay to have these unavoidable handicaps or retardations. It's when one derides a person for their handicap or retarded abilities that the act becomes a social crime against humanity. To openly do so only goes to show the mean spirited nature of the person affecting the derision. But at the same time, there's no harm using language to communicate an idea as in that's stupid or that's retarded. In the same vein, there is something wrong with socially controlling others (PC police) because they've decided for others how one should be allowed to communicate to the controlling individual's satisfaction; a sign of insecurity with their own personal philosophies.

Just saying, from one nerd to a room full of nerds, I'm a nerd and proud. biggrin.gif

-
Edited by BeeMan458 - 3/29/13 at 10:12am
post #1882 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

I'm not familiar with YPAO but it is an automatic system that will EQ your subwoofer system. I'm sure there's a YPAO thread in AVS that will explain YPAO and how to use it to your best interest.

First things first, to get the best out of your subwoofer system, it helps to have a sound level meter so the levels of the subwoofer's output can be gain matched so at the main listening position, when running a test tone through the subwoofer system, you're measuring 73dB - 75dB with aid of the sound level meter.

Once you have properly set the gain level of the subwoofers, run YPAO and let it measure your room and it will advise the AVR what the internal settings should be.

Now the rub. To be able to get the best out of one's subwoofer system, they need a room measuring program like REW so as to measure the room's acoustic response to the subwoofer's output. The reason, sound waves interact with each other in a positive and negative way, much like throwing pebbles into a glass smooth lake as you watch the ripples interact with each other. When subwoofer waves interact in a room in a bad way, they take away the strength of the subwoofer output. Without room measuring capability, one can't see what's happening in their room and they won't know what needs to be done to make things right.

In the simple, the easiest way to fix things is to asymmetrically place three or four subs in a room and the overlapping sound waves that are produced will smooth things out and make everything sonically even.

Unfortunately, YPAO does not EQ the subwoofer (one of the downsides compared to Audyssey).

I am looking at the MiniDSP at the moment. I was considering the BFD, but it does not work below 20hz. And with the PSAs, I will need that...
post #1883 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thermoform View Post

I was considering the BFD, but it does not work below 20hz. And with the PSAs, I will need that...

Are you looking to boost below 20hz? Below 20hz, I rely on room gain, as eq'ing it higher could damage your driver in that range. As for peaks, in my opinion it isn't as crucial for sq for higher db's below 20hz, but may add to the tactile fun.

Other thoughts?
post #1884 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thermoform View Post

Unfortunately, YPAO does not EQ the subwoofer (one of the downsides compared to Audyssey).

I am looking at the MiniDSP at the moment. I was considering the BFD, but it does not work below 20hz. And with the PSAs, I will need that...

yea i have the rx-a1010 and i was wondering how i will EQ my sub since the amp dsnt do it ...

my question is , if the amp dsnt EQ the sub ... even if we use a tool to EQ it , the amp stills end the same info to the sub , so nothing change ... dunno if u understand what i mean .
post #1885 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by ndskurfer View Post

Are you looking to boost below 20hz? Below 20hz, I rely on room gain, as eq'ing it higher could damage your driver in that range. As for peaks, in my opinion it isn't as crucial for sq for higher db's below 20hz, but may add to the tactile fun.

Other thoughts?

No, just cut.
I have huge room gain below 40hz that makes any dips look like the Grand Canyon...
The large humps force the gain down to mach the mains when using pink noise.
post #1886 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

yea i have the rx-a1010 and i was wondering how i will EQ my sub since the amp dsnt do it ...

my question is , if the amp dsnt EQ the sub ... even if we use a tool to EQ it , the amp stills end the same info to the sub , so nothing change ... dunno if u understand what i mean .

Your new EQ hardware would be between the Yamaha Sub Output and the sub. (MiniDSP, Behringer Feedback Destroyer (BFD), etc)...
post #1887 of 10096
Just watched dark zero 30. I adjusted my receiver manually since my audyssey is mess up. The helicopter scene sounded amazing. Felt it in my chest. Didn't get too much from gun shots but likely gun shots are higher frequency.
post #1888 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

yea i have the rx-a1010 and i was wondering how i will EQ my sub since the amp dsnt do it ...

my question is , if the amp dsnt EQ the sub ... even if we use a tool to EQ it , the amp stills end the same info to the sub , so nothing change ... dunno if u understand what i mean .

You could always adjust the level until you get it to where you like it manually.
post #1889 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoogerBomb View Post

You could always adjust the level until you get it to where you like it manually.
`

ive bought this rx-a1010 8 month ago being told by the local store guy its a really really good amp for HT/Music ... is it something i should consider changing ? because of the Ypao no EQing my subwoofer ?

or is this something i can easily fix using external EQ device like MiniDsp !? ... the problem is i dont understand nothing at all when i go see minidsp on youtube or w/e i dont even know how to plug it and make it EQ the sub ..

thats why im wondering , should i just get an avr that do everything by itself !?

sucks cause i have to admit , i am using rx-a1010 since 8 month with my monitor 11 v7 system ( without subwoofer) and i love the sound...
post #1890 of 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemoreborn View Post

`

ive bought this rx-a1010 8 month ago being told by the local store guy its a really really good amp for HT/Music ... is it something i should consider changing ? because of the Ypao no EQing my subwoofer ?

or is this something i can easily fix using external EQ device like MiniDsp !? ... the problem is i dont understand nothing at all when i go see minidsp on youtube or w/e i dont even know how to plug it and make it EQ the sub ..

thats why im wondering , should i just get an avr that do everything by itself !?

sucks cause i have to admit , i am using rx-a1010 since 8 month with my monitor 11 v7 system ( without subwoofer) and i love the sound...

DON"T WORRY, you have a great receiver!!!

Are you having a problem with your bass? If you come to the these forums you have to know that alot of us are trying to squeeze as much performance out of our gear in our imperfect rooms as possible. Even before we EQ we add absorbtion, diffusion, buy microphones, test/tweak/test/tweak/test/tweak, buy more gear, then repeat over and over again.

BUT......

The first thing I did years ago was to buy a Radio Shack sound meter to be able to check that all of my speaker levels (including the subwoofer) matched using the Sound & Vision, and Avia setup DVDs.

Even before that...

We both have Yamaha receivers, so I can help you with setup. (You may need to double check the menu structure with your manual, but we both have Aventages, so I think it's very similar). I'll try to show you with of without a subwoofer. Sorry for any confusion, I'm typing this out pretty fast...
1. Turn the crossover knob on your sub all the way to the highest frequency (probably 150-200hz)
2. Set the gain knob on your sub to the 1 oclock postion. And set the Phase knob to 0
3. Run the YPAO. Make sure the microphone is in your primary listening position at ear level. If you have a couch for two people, put the mike in between the two seating positions. Don't bother with running multiple seating positions with YPAO at this point.

THEN...

4. Go into the onscreen display of the Yamaha, got to the Manual Setup, then Configuration page. Set all of your speakers to "Small". (LARGE without Subwoofer)
5. Still in the Configuration page, Check the Subwoofer crossover, it should be set at 80.
6. Return to the page before "Configuration", and go to "Level". Check the Subwoofer level. Sometimes YPAO really knocks down the volume. I would not let it go below -5
7. Play alot of music you are familiar with to tweak your subwoofer gain (the actual knob on the subwoofer)
8. Play action scenes from movies you are familiar with, and play with the subwoofer gain.
9. In the Manual Setup, try out the different Parametric EQ settings.
9. Go back and forth between movies and music until you find a happy compromise.

Now, after you do that...If you want to start down the road of tweaking...

Go buy a Radio Shack sound meter to verify that all of the speaker levels (including the subwoofer) match using the Sound & Vision, or Avia setup DVDs, etc.

Once you do that...And if you still desire more...

You will be going from watching movies and enjoying music to entering into a new hobby...
Edited by Thermoform - 3/30/13 at 9:23am
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