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Official Power Sound Audio Thread - Page 273

post #8161 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by GusGus748s View Post

I'm not really sure why people think that an amp is going to provide better sound. The amp. only provides adequate power to drive the speaker.

To this point, folks don't seem to have gotten this point yet as they seem to be living with the bias' of the 80s and the 90s. There's Home Theater and there's music. When the action sequence ramps up, if the Amp is not up to the task, you can hear the life being "SUCKED" out of the speakers as the subwoofers "LEAVE" the speakers behind. You bet amplification makes a difference.

Maybe sound quality wise the amplifier doesn't make a difference........when not being stressed. But the ability of the amplifier, to handle the load, if watching action based, Home Theater sequences, makes a "WORLD" of difference when listening close to reference.

We just upgraded our AVR to a flagship AVR and "Holy $h#&" Batman, at reference level, kr@p, you bet it makes....."ALL" the difference in the world.

(and if we're agreeing, we're agreeing)

...biggrin.gif

-
Edited by BeeMan458 - 1/14/14 at 11:10am
post #8162 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

fully balanced and less crosstalk was my thinking...but in the end..it was in fact all a myth...debunked by me..and i got paid 400$ to do so wink.gif

Yeah, I realized that the amp doesn't provide better sound when I was comparing my monoblock Outlaw amps vs a QSC-GX3. The mono's were 200 watt at 8ohm and the QSC-GX3 was 300 wpc at 8 ohm. The sound from the speakers was the same. However, once I started cranking up the volume, I could get the QSC to clip, but not the Outlaws. So, I'm guessing the Outlaw has better parts than the QSC. I ended up selling the QSC because I couldn't stand the loud fan. biggrin.gif
post #8163 of 10080
gotcha...well mine was comapring the xpa-5 (250 wpc) vs the xpa-1's (500wpc) so power wasnt the problem smile.gif
post #8164 of 10080
I apologize for going out of topic. Now, I fully love my PSA-XV15. I am hoping to add a second one soon.
post #8165 of 10080
How many people actually can stand listening to movies at reference? I doubt most people do. One reason I hate going to movie theaters,there sound is ear piercing. It really doesn't make the experience better in my opinion. Don't get me going on projectors either..
post #8166 of 10080
Have any of you guys considered using height speakers?
post #8167 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

gotcha...well mine was comapring the xpa-5 (250 wpc) vs the xpa-1's (500wpc) so power wasnt the problem smile.gif

I think the XPA-5 is 200 wpc at 8 ohm. If I had the money to buy an XPA-5 I would. I had the chance to buy one at an excellent price, but I've got 3 mono block amps. It will be a little bit cheaper to go with 2 more monoblocks.
post #8168 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by LowTech1 View Post

How many people actually can stand listening to movies at reference? I doubt most people do. One reason I hate going to movie theaters,there sound is ear piercing. It really doesn't make the experience better in my opinion. Don't get me going on projectors either..

I agree with you. I had to go and complain about the sound being too loud when we went to watch Transformers. Apparently, someone increased the volume thinking that would sound better. I don't listen to music at reference levels unless I am by myself. The same goes with movies. However, I prefer having the power and not needing it, than needing more power and not having it wink.gif
post #8169 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

To this point, folks don't seem to have gotten this point yet as they seem to be living with the bias' of the 80s and the 90s. There's Home Theater and there's music. When the action sequence ramps up, if the Amp is not up to the task, you can hear the life being "SUCKED" out of the speakers as the subwoofers "LEAVE" the speakers behind. You bet amplification makes a difference.

Maybe sound quality wise the amplifier doesn't make a difference........when not being stressed. But the ability of the amplifier, to handle the load, if watching action based, Home Theater sequences, makes a "WORLD" of difference when listening close to reference.

We just upgraded our AVR to a flagship AVR and "Holy $h#&" Batman, at reference level, kr@p, you bet it makes....."ALL" the difference in the world.

(and if we're agreeing, we're agreeing)

...biggrin.gif

-

You're right. Having enough power on hand to meet the demand does make a difference.

This is why I've always prefered having a beefy power amp to handle whatever speakers or content I wish at whatever level I wish. smile.gif
post #8170 of 10080
I agree with what you just said. I would rather have the power also,but I've never had an issue with my 818. But now I do have an Emo UPA2 and an XPA3. The UPA is for my height speakers,which add considerably for tv and movies.. I never listen to anything at reference. I go down to maybe - 15. When you get to around -20 the sound is really nice..
post #8171 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by GusGus748s View Post

I think the XPA-5 is 200 wpc at 8 ohm. If I had the money to buy an XPA-5 I would. I had the chance to buy one at an excellent price, but I've got 3 mono block amps. It will be a little bit cheaper to go with 2 more monoblocks.

Yes and it's 300 watts at 4ohm. My speakers are 6ohm so the xpa5 would be putting out about 250wpc in my application
post #8172 of 10080
I watch most movies at -8 to -12. I like things pretty loud, but reference level is almost painful.
post #8173 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvolle View Post

I watch most movies at -8 to -12. I like things pretty loud, but reference level is almost painful.

Yup that's loud...in my book. I'd be lucky to hit reference peaks at my LP when I watch a movie....some bass heads like reference levels with their sub running +12-15 dbs hot....insane, certainly not for me...biggrin.gif
post #8174 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy p View Post

Yup that's loud...in my book. I'd be lucky to hit reference peaks at my LP when I watch a movie....some bass heads like reference levels with their sub running +12-15 dbs hot....insane, certainly not for me...biggrin.gif

Yeah, I've made my two XV30f's +10 db hot for a buddy who apparently needed to kick-start his heart, but I like 'em about +4 db hot. Even at +4, there is plenty of tactile "feedback". wink.gif

I have a dedicated, sound-proofed room, and that certainly makes a huge difference.
post #8175 of 10080
A few days ago I invited friends over and sent my GF and kids away, for the specific purpose of enjoying my setup at reference level for once.

It's indeed extremely loud. We only watched snippets of movies (demo scenes); the loudest I ever watched a whole movie was -6 dB and I was alone. My ears were ringing a bit afterwards. But that night we did listen to classics (WotW's Pod Emergence, U:A's Super Lycan, etc.) at reference level. What is striking is how well, for once, dialogs can be heard tongue.gif But also, it seems to me that the problem is mostly ear-splitting highs such as car crashes, glass being shattered, etc. Mid bass hits hard but is sustainable. Very low bass is impressive, but not painful at all.

So running the subs hot (or even very hot) during movies is not much of a problem, "pain"-wise, and if crossed low enough, it doesn't even unbalance the sound track, as you're just adding tactile feelings to rumbles and such. You can achieve the same crossing the subs higher, but EQing them (e.g. using a MiniDSP) with a house-curve with a low-cutoff. We did exactly that with a gentle house curve with a 40 Hz cut-off, which brought about +6 dB at 20 Hz (and probably close to +7-8 dB at 15 Hz). The effect during the Super Lycan scene was greatly appreciated, enhancing even more the Lycan's steps, but else not changing the soundtrack that much. In Pulse's Server Room scene though, at reference level, the house curve was a bit too much and port noise could be heard (yet it was way quieter than my house's main door rattling in its frame).

In conclusion, I blame highs, not bass, for making movies hard to watch at reference levels.
post #8176 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

In conclusion, I blame highs, not bass, for making movies hard to watch at reference levels.

Totally agreed! I love the lows and the ultra-lows. It's the higher ranges that can make the ears bleed. My previous comment about keep the subs just "kinda hot" was to save the structural integrity of my house. biggrin.gif
post #8177 of 10080
I agree with that also,its the highs that kill your ears.. I wonder how my Martin Logan Electromotion ESL's would handle reference wink.gif
post #8178 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

To this point, folks don't seem to have gotten this point yet as they seem to be living with the bias' of the 80s and the 90s. There's Home Theater and there's music. When the action sequence ramps up, if the Amp is not up to the task, you can hear the life being "SUCKED" out of the speakers as the subwoofers "LEAVE" the speakers behind. You bet amplification makes a difference.

Maybe sound quality wise the amplifier doesn't make a difference........when not being stressed. But the ability of the amplifier, to handle the load, if watching action based, Home Theater sequences, makes a "WORLD" of difference when listening close to reference.

We just upgraded our AVR to a flagship AVR and "Holy $h#&" Batman, at reference level, kr@p, you bet it makes....."ALL" the difference in the world.

(and if we're agreeing, we're agreeing)

...biggrin.gif

-

So do you like the receiver Beeman???? howd it go????
post #8179 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by LowTech1 View Post

How many people actually can stand listening to movies at reference? I doubt most people do. One reason I hate going to movie theaters,there sound is ear piercing. It really doesn't make the experience better in my opinion. Don't get me going on projectors either..

I agree, reference isn't high enough lol biggrin.gif
post #8180 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackmambakila View Post

So do you like the receiver Beeman???? howd it go????

I had to rassle it a bit but it's installed, XT32 has been run, used a sound meter to set final levels and the sucker "ROCKS!" biggrin.gif

(at reference playback, I'm very surprised, it runs hand touching cool)

Has clean highs and easily understood dialogue. And when the action cranks up, the amplifier section can keep up with the subwoofers. Very nice.

I'm fighting allergies and allergy pills, so I'm going slow. In the next few days, I'll get REW up and see how the room measures. Everything is set up and ready to measure, I just don't have any brain power with all the anti-histamines in me. The short version, I love how the amplifier handles the speakers during reference level playback.

Holy Kr@p Batman!!!

...eek.gif...eek.gif...eek.gif

-
Edited by BeeMan458 - 1/14/14 at 6:14pm
post #8181 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

I had to rassle it a bit but it's installed, XT32 has been run, used a sound meter to set final levels and the sucker "ROCKS!" biggrin.gif

(at reference playback, I'm very surprised, it runs hand touching cool)

Has clean highs and easily understood dialogue. And when the action cranks up, the amplifier section can keep up with the subwoofers. Very nice.

I'm fighting allergies and allergy pills, so I'm going slow. In the next few days, I'll get REW up and see how the room measures. Everything is set up and ready to measure, I just don't have any brain power with all the anti-histamines in me. The short version, I love how the amplifier handles the speakers during reference level playback.

Holy Kr@p Batman!!!

...eek.gif...eek.gif...eek.gif

Sounds like th same improvements I saw, awesome!

-
post #8182 of 10080
How do you like the cm8's?
post #8183 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goat1 View Post

How do you like the cm8's?

I love 2 things about them and dont like 1 thing lol hehe.

First thing I love is the looks, they are so beautifully finished and crafted, sleek and sexy!!!
Second thing is when you crank them they still sound so smooth and silky, clear and elegant, not harsh on your ears at all. At reference level they sound very comfortable and amazing.

What I dont like is that Bowers and Wilkins arent the highest on their speaker sensitivity so for someone like me that likes a more extreme soundstage they lack a little on their power
Handling and output capabilities.

For someone that likes reference or below they sound amazing for music, movie and game playback. Personally because of my tastes, id be happier with Klipsch or JTR's. Other than that it just one of those things that comes down to an individuals tastes. At the time I got them it was my first setup so I didnt know id be going extreme until I got a taste of the HT frenzy! smile.gif
post #8184 of 10080

Don't listen too loud too long or too often, or it will take more and more power to get things as loud as you want it as you slowly lose your hearing.  And it will never come back.

post #8185 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post

Don't listen too loud too long or too often, or it will take more and more power to get things as loud as you want it as you slowly lose your hearing.  And it will never come back.

Not sure what you mean, I couldnt hear you bear lol! Im lucky to turn on my setup once a week, sometimes once every 2 weeks and its in my bedroom. Usually im just to tired from work or doing stuff around the house. I sure wish id use it more but atleast I have it there for whenever I do score some off time hehe. Not too worried about being to loud, im happy to make it home everyday from work. So far after finishing my first year in the oilf field, ive been sent to the hospital 3 times for things that should of killed me. Then offcourse theres been dozens of close calls eek.gif after starring death in the face on a daily basis in a billion dolllar industry, the last thing that worrys me is speakers being too loud lol. Not to sound dumb but I love watching a movie or what not at an intense level, thats why I spent the money Ive spent, to be able to experience the sound that I crave. Honestly I think since I hardly actually fire it up, id probably be fine. Man I still have so many movies I havent watched and still havent played any xbox one games, I wish I was young again
post #8186 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackmambakila View Post


Not sure what you mean, I couldnt hear you bear lol! Im lucky to turn on my setup once a week, sometimes once every 2 weeks and its in my bedroom. Usually im just to tired from work or doing stuff around the house. I sure wish id use it more but atleast I have it there for whenever I do score some off time hehe. Not too worried about being to loud, im happy to make it home everyday from work. So far after finishing my first year in the oilf field, ive been sent to the hospital 3 times for things that should of killed me. Then offcourse theres been dozens of close calls eek.gif after starring death in the face on a daily basis in a billion dolllar industry, the last thing that worrys me is speakers being too loud lol. Not to sound dumb but I love watching a movie or what not at an intense level, thats why I spent the money Ive spent, to be able to experience the sound that I crave. Honestly I think since I hardly actually fire it up, id probably be fine. Man I still have so many movies I havent watched and still havent played any xbox one games, I wish I was young again


Any cold weather out there in the oil field?  We hit -10 in PA the other week.  I work a lot of hours as well.  I know what you mean by not having time to enjoy our hobby often enough.

post #8187 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post


Any cold weather out there in the oil field?  We hit -10 in PA the other week.  I work a lot of hours as well.  I know what you mean by not having time to enjoy our hobby often enough.

Where in pa are you?
post #8188 of 10080

I agree on the separates.  I used to have NAD receiver and then ran NAD separates and there is no comparison to me.  Dynamics are much better, clearer dialogue, more slam...of course when you have double the power going into it, that could be expected.  My speakers are not the most sensitive either (Von Schweikert towers), so perhaps that has something to do with it also.  But I would not go back to a "top of the line" receiver with built in amp...YMMV

post #8189 of 10080
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post


Any cold weather out there in the oil field?  We hit -10 in PA the other week.  I work a lot of hours as well.  I know what you mean by not having time to enjoy our hobby often enough.

It hasnt been that bad but just 20's mostly. About 5 weeks ago it was -15 to -50 for ten days straight, that sucked!!!!!
post #8190 of 10080
I listened to the CM8's and 9's among others before I bought the Martin Logan Electromotion ESL's.. I actually liked how the CM8's sounded over the CM9's.. My gf agreed.. Don't know why. We both thought the tweeter was too bright tho.
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