Power Sound Audio Discussion Thread! - Page 32

That doesn't matter. The test tone is running through your receiver/processor so that both the left front speaker and sub are playing.

You commented about swapping the leads when you posted:


I thought what you posted regarded subwoofers and if using an RCA plug, how can one swap the leads? ???

He meant swapping the positive and negative leads on the left speaker, not the sub. By adjusting the phase on the sub your essentially doing the same thing, when you go from 0 to 180.

Thanks for the clarification. I got that the leads were being swapped. I misunderstood him to be saying that he was suggesting the swapping of the leads on the subwoofer. One would have to remove the subwoofer driver to make a lead swap. In that sense, it confused me. I'm the dizzy one walking down the hallway.

I was contemplating getting 2 XV15s, but for some reason I'm attracted to the XS30 for the ULF capabilities, or maybe 2 of those. It will be 90% HT in a 4600Ft^3 room. For some reason I'm drawn to the ability to dig deepest since I'm not aiming for the absolute most output.

Any advice on this delima?

Two VX15s roughly have the same output as one XS30. I have dual XS30s in a 2100cubic/ft room. I would say go with the XS30 if you don't mind paying a little more, you'll love them!

I went with dual XS 30's for my room which is roughly the same size as yours. They should be shipping in the next few days and I will post my impressions when I get them. I emailed Tom numerous times and that's what he suggested. I was leaning towards those anyway. If you're unsure, email Tom, and he will definitely help you. He's a great guy to deal with.

Oh...my...god!

I've had my subs in basically the same location for almost 20 years. I determined long ago that the two corners behind my MLP was the optimum placement. Sooo...when I got my new XS15s, I assumed they would also sound best there. Boy, was I wrong!

Last night I moved the subs from behind the MLP to in-between the FL/R speakers and my TV...the difference was night-and-day. With this new placement the XSs really came to life! They now dig just as deep as the old F15s (maybe even a bit deeper), BUT with much more authority, speed and overall "smoothness". Mid-bass is sooo much better than my old subs, kicking me in the chest on a regular basis - AND this was after my wife had went to bed, so I didn't dare turn it up much more than -20.

When I first set up the XSs, I was a bit disappointed because I was not "blown away" by the XS15s (my wife even asked "what's wrong" when she got home that day)....well, that has all changed with the new placement...color me blown-away!

My old Velos in the front positions did not sound good at all. I have no idea why there would be such different response from 2 sets of 15" subs in this location, but I'm very happy about it none-the-less.

Now, to try and integrate my old Velos back into the equation.

Good to hear Alan. I have come to realize that my XV-15 was and my XS-30 is not in the proper location. If I move a few feet from left or right I can feel and hear a major improvement in all around sound quality. I am definitely in a null right now. May try the sub crawl and will have to purchase a SPL meter. Amazing what even a few feet will do!

Yeah, IMO a SPL meter is an essential tool for any home theater. I've had mine for over 20 years.

Try turning it 90 degrees and see if that makes any difference.

Just placed an order with Tom last night for a XV15. He made the decision to buy extremely easy for me.
Now the wait.....

Thanks Tom. Good talking to you last night.

Rick

Jim,

I asked that in another thread and was told it made no difference. I will try it though. I had both drivers shooting into the walls instead if one in the corner and one facing the living room because of the broken grills and curious kids. Now I have the grills replaced and will try that again. I was told the null is purely the consequence of subwoofer placement.

More then likely it won't, but it's something quick and easy if nothing else.

Rotating the xs 30 probably not going to alter much as its dual opposed. I don't think rotating a downfiring sub will have much difference either as you are not really moving the acoustic source on the bottom. Rotating a front firing sub will change its orientation with the acoustic source and boundaries which can alter frequency response around the crossover and I have found it an easy way for improvement acoustically but sometimes not visually (can't see drivers, subwoofer sideways or firing into corner...). My take away is if you aren't measuring you are just guessing.

http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=content&id=77

Agreed on the downfiring - rotation is not going to alter much there. My take on the XS30 was changing the orientation of the drivers might slightly affect were the null was, potentially minimizing it if nothing else. Long shot, but figured it was painless to try. You're oh so right about the measuring; ears can only go so far...

Do you guys recommend a spl meter or are you more inclined to recommend the use of REW with a microphone or omnimic? I see there are many price levels for spl meters? Not sure if any old meter will do...

Both. One needs a sound meter to aid in the setting the gain settings on the sub and final AVR gain settings after the room analyzer has been run to set SPL levels at the main listening position. And one needs a real time analyzer (RTA) kit to be able to see what's what with a room's acoustics. Hence the both answer.

As to the price of a sound meter, they range online from some twenty bucks to under a hundred dollars. Like any other appliance, whether a microwave or a remote control, it all depends on how much you want to invest in this type of gear.

Well my two XS30s shipped today.

My room is 1700 ft^3 (11 X 17 X 9) so I should have some fun!!!
Edited by colleycol - 1/11/13 at 4:24pm

Is it a sealed room? Man dual XS30s sound awesome in my room and mines only 2100ft^3. 1700ft^3 will be crazy.

Does anybody have a recommendation as to what SPL meter to buy? I did a search on Amazon and 20 pages worth came up
Id like to have one just for S&G's. :-)

I got mine from Radio Shack about 4 years ago. Don't use it too often, but it's good to have.

I dont really need a "Pro" meter, just something that isnt going to die after 2 uses like the cheap network cable tester I bought did.

The radio shack spl meter is fairly cheap. I think $30-40.

S&G's.............. Love it.

Pretty much, anything will work. How anal are you about your readings?

As an example, my hangup are thermometers. Who calibrates these things? What standard is being used for calibration purposes? On the day the thermometer was calibrated, how happy was the employee and how much did they care about their professional calibration efforts. Does the manufacture really care about this stuff? It's been said, the best manufactured vehicles are autos manufactured on Tue, Wed and Thur due to being between hangover Mondays and I want out of here Fridays.

Continuing, how accurate are cheap thermometers vs lab grade thermometers and who calibrates and oversees the calibration of lab grade thermometers? And does a few degrees in error have any consequences in the grand scheme of life? If the thermometer reading is off, will water still boil at the assigned temperature and for correction purposes in answering the question, at what temperature does water boil, what's my elevation and who checked the accuracy of the contour lines on the topo map? With that in mind, enters sound meters, their accuracy, what are their calibration standards and what are the variables in calibration standards between a $20.00 meter vs $40.00, $80.00, or $120.00 meters? And did the tech really check the barometric pressure and make sure what the humidity was on that day or did they use yesterday's readings and gun-deck their log?

Enters my original question, how anal are you about these sorts of things? The point, if you care, you'll have to find out about sound meter calibration standards and find reviews to see what the differences are between a $20.00, $40.00, $80.00 amd $120.00 sound meter as you compare these against the price/quality levels of lab grade sound meters. Now we need to know, how do lab grade meters compare to each other? And what are the calibration standards for lab grade sound meters and how do these standards compare to those of the less expensive models? Did Sally do the calibration today or Pete, as everybody in shipping knows that Mike consistently provides the best calibration efforts because he doesn't party. In the end, how does anybody know who or what equipment manufacture they can trust to be telling the truth about the accuracy of their wares?

Me to self; Tom, it's a stupid thermometer.

"Jay Rant in Dogma" (Warning, lots of "F" language)

Good luck............

And to directly respond to your question, in the case of sound meters, I like to buy the $40.00 - $60.00 meters and if froggy, I'll go for the $129.00 meter, just because expensive measuring gear gives me that much needed false sense of security. The good stuff runs in the $250 - $350 range and gives a +/- 1.5dB accuracy. Calibration devices are extra.

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Edited by BeeMan458 - 1/12/13 at 7:18am

As much as I could seal it. Used 2 layers of drywall with green glue, exterior door with sealing. I guess we will see. :-)

And this seriously meets the definition of a "Basshead."

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Edited by BeeMan458 - 1/12/13 at 8:44am

What did I just read?

beeman...has to much time on his hands. i guess that's what happens when you retire.

Humor.

If this form of humor upsets you, I'll remove it.

(it was a compliment to the individual's dedication to the hobby)