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Buffalo, NY - HDTV - Page 242

post #7231 of 7283
If i was you i would use rabbit ears until winter is over. After all of the snow & ice on your roof has melted you can put an outdoors antenna up there if you wanted to. Even though i don't live on Grand Island you should get good reception of the buffalo locals without an amplifier.
post #7232 of 7283
This is probably the best news for WKBW 7. They're are getting a new owner.

And it's Scripps. Scripps will buy WKBW and Detroit's WMYD for $110M.
post #7233 of 7283

Thanks for the input.  I stopped and purchased an RCA Rabbit Ears at Family Dollar - price is now $12.95 (I could have gotten at Walmart for 10.95 but once a decision is made I wanted to get started).  I also bought a Mohu Leaf ultimate from Sam's club for $49.95 and will do an experiment.  I can return the Leaf before 90 days.  My daughter and son-in-law live at the south end of Grand Island and I live in the Sandy Beach neighborhood at the north end.  We will set these two antennas to do a comparison.  Son-in-law reported he is now getting 12 channels with the RCA rabbit ears on first try. He says the system reports he should get 13.  I will have to find out which stations.  I will collect data and report back. Let me know your questions and I will add to my record sheet for exploration.  

post #7234 of 7283
Might be picking up but not showing WNED's music channel.
post #7235 of 7283

Results from Mohu Leaf Ultimate on North end of Grand Island Ny.  Placed on LR Wall near ceiling.  I am pulling in 15 TV broadcasts and one music station.  2.1 WGRZ (NBC), 2.2 WGRZ, 2.3 ANTEN, 4.1 WIVB (CBS), 7.1 WKBW (ABC), 23.1 WNLO (CW), 23.2 ENLO (Bounce), 3 TNT stations 26.1 WNYB, 26.2, 26.3, 29.1 & 29.2 Fox, 43.3 (PBS) and 43.4 (THINK), 49.1 WNYO My TV  and 43.1 Radio Music.  

 

I found printing off TVGuide OTA listings helped me figure out what was what.  

 

The quality of every station is very good.  I like that there are no adjustments needed between stations like with the rabbit ears. 

 

I will have to get back to you with Rabbit ears results as son-in-law took it with him so I did not get a chance to do the same documenting as above.  I have asked him to bring it back and we can swap so he can try this out at the south end of the Island.  

 

I am hoping to do better than this so will test drive a few others, but this will be the only UHF limited antenna I will try.  Anyone had experience with Antennas Direct ClearStream 2V which is available at Walmart? Says it is somewhat directional but if I put it in the attic facing Toronto maybe it would not have to be rotated.  


Edited by Frugal1SBM - 2/12/14 at 6:18pm
post #7236 of 7283
OMG eek.gif Comcast just purchased Time Warner Cable & i heard their internet is CAPPED so anybody with Road Runner is SCREWED. To read all of the details go to this link. http://stopthecap.com/2014/02/13/comcast-reaches-surprise-agreement-to-acquire-all-of-time-warner-cable-for-44-billion/
post #7237 of 7283

Update on Antennas on Grand Island, NY

I have now compared the Mohu Leaf Ultimate to an RCA Rabbit Ears ANT119 from Family Dollar.  

15 TV broadcasts and one music station. 
2.1 WGRZ (NBC), 2.2 WGRZ, 2.3 ANTEN, 
4.1 WIVB (CBS), 
7.1 WKBW (ABC), 
23.1 WNLO (CW), 23.2 ENLO (Bounce), 
3 TNT stations 26.1 WNYB, 26.2, 26.3, 
29.1 & 29.2 Fox, 
43.3 (PBS) and 43.4 (THINK), 
49.1 WNYO My TV and 
43.1 Radio Music. 

 

However, the TCT stations are not coming in well and some of the other stations are better on the Leaf. If cost is an issue the rabbit ears will do the trick for Buffalo Network stations. You can get similar from Walmart or Radio Shack. I understand some are just $5. I prefer the Leaf with no tweaking rabbit ears. I am hoping to do better so need to find something that brings in the Canadian stations. My son-in-law at the south end of the island had the same experience we preferred the Leaf.  The next Antenna I am trying is Antennas Direct's Clearstream 2V from Walmart for $89.00.  It comes with a J-Mounting pole but no coax so I was able to get white cable to blend in with the wall where I will run it up to the attic.  This is not an antenna to mount in the Living room like the Leaf.

post #7238 of 7283
Quote:
We will set these two antennas to do a comparison.
The only way you can do a comparison between two antennas is to have them placed in the exact same place withing a very short period of time. Indoors is worse, reflections with give you huge variances in reception. Just walking around the room will make a difference.
An attic is better, but outdoors is preferred by far. There will always be some reflections, you want to eliminate as many as possible. wink.gif
.
Quote:
I prefer the Leaf with no tweaking rabbit ears.
"Rabbit Ears" is a "dipole" antenna designed for VHF. Except for CFTO & WBBZ, all stations in this market and Canada are UHF. Have you been to the "HDTV Technical" sub-forum??;
http://www.avsforum.com/f/25/hdtv-technical

.
Quote:
Might be picking up but not showing WNED's music channel.
That sub-channel is audio only, no video.
post #7239 of 7283
Quote:
i heard their internet is CAPPED so anybody with Road Runner is SCREWED.
"Capped"??? confused.gif
post #7240 of 7283
You forgot to mention CHEX which is on ch-12, some people receive it a little to the east
post #7241 of 7283
Yes I did, but it's highly doubtful that would be receivable in these cases. wink.gif
post #7242 of 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

"Capped"??? confused.gif

Comcast puts data usage caps on all of their internet plans. Remember when TW tried doing the same thing a few years ago & all of their customers started an angry protest against the company. If comcast takes over here they'll force all their internet subscribers to use the data usage caps if we like it or not.
post #7243 of 7283
I didn't know that. I was with Verizon DSL at that time.
That will be a problem. I find it hard to believe they would try that here given that fact TWC is struggling with what FiOS service is available.
post #7244 of 7283
In the rochester area the only alternatives to Road Runner is DSL from Frontier or Verizon in the Batavia area so Comcast can easily force their customers to use Data Usage Caps. Where Verizon Fios is available i would be shocked if comcast internet stayed unlimited.(After they merge with TW) I was thinking about getting TW's $14.99 internet plan since it's the same price i currently pay for Verizon DSL & double the speed but now i'm thinking i'll stay with Verizon DSL so i don't have to deal with any stupid data usage caps.
post #7245 of 7283

Unfortunate for me, only TWC provides Internet services on Grand Island.  Verizon has yet to decide whether it is worth the investment to bridge the river.  Perhaps if TWC had been successful in charging for band usage then they would not be shopping a buyer.  I don't like paying so much for the bundled package, but once we trim to just Internet then we are captive.  Hard to go any lower.  

 

VideoBruce thanks for the suggestion to post in http://www.avsforum.com/f/25/hdtv-technical.  Is there a forum for getting advice about HuluPlus, Amazon Prime, Netflix, etc?  

post #7246 of 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frugal1SBM View Post

Unfortunate for me, only TWC provides Internet services on Grand Island.

If you have a clear view of the southern sky you can get satellite internet. The two providers i know of are WildBlue & HughesNet. I'll put a link to their sites below & you can check them out if you want.

http://www.hughesnet.com/
http://www.wildblue.com/
post #7247 of 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPNASCAR24 View Post


Comcast puts data usage caps on all of their internet plans. Remember when TW tried doing the same thing a few years ago & all of their customers started an angry protest against the company. If comcast takes over here they'll force all their internet subscribers to use the data usage caps if we like it or not.

I'm not sure that's still the case -- certainly not according to GigaOm's November update. http://gigaom.com/2013/11/15/data-cap-2013/
Also the caps in the US are, for the most part, not as odious as the ones in Canada.
post #7248 of 7283
I just looked at all the internet plans on comcast.com & it doesn't say anything about data usage caps anywhere. Maybe their not using them anymore because they finally realized nobody likes having a cap on their internet. I also read in a forum on comcast.com they don't require a contract like Satellite TV which is the opposite of what i read on other sites.
post #7249 of 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPNASCAR24 View Post

I just looked at all the internet plans on comcast.com & it doesn't say anything about data usage caps anywhere. Maybe their not using them anymore because they finally realized nobody likes having a cap on their internet. I also read in a forum on comcast.com they don't require a contract like Satellite TV which is the opposite of what i read on other sites.

I guess that's what 'quietly' means... http://gigaom.com/2013/11/08/looks-like-comcast-is-quietly-pushing-a-300-gb-cap-and-overage-charges/
post #7250 of 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPNASCAR24 View Post

If you have a clear view of the southern sky you can get satellite internet. The two providers i know of are WildBlue & HughesNet. I'll put a link to their sites below & you can check them out if you want.

http://www.hughesnet.com/
http://www.wildblue.com/

No one in their right mind should consider satellite if they have access to other broadband options. HughesNet maxes out 15/2 (and good luck getting that), with a 40 GB/month cap, with a lovey 2 year contract, insane latency for the ultra-low price of $130/month. I wouldn't wish satellite internet on my worst enemy. Not sure if they still do it, but a there used to have a daily limit of 169Mb data transfer and you would be FAP'd to dial up speed. I would imagine Wild Blue sucks just as bad. I used to frequent areas in the Southern Tier, where it was either satellite or dialup. Hughes was the poison of choice, almost no one as Wild Blue in this general area. I know many people who went back to dial up, and others who went with cellular 3G/4G. With my smartphone I’d get lower latency on Verizon or Sprint with a bar or two of 1X then these people get with satellite.
post #7251 of 7283
Isn't deregulation great? Anything big business wants to do they can. rolleyes.gif
Thanks for all these that continue to support them.
post #7252 of 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frugal1SBM View Post

Verizon has yet to decide
Verizon is done with non-wireles in upstate NY. They're not expanding* their various land-line services and are probably still hoping to find a sucker to buy the copper business.

*More expensive FiOS TV offerings being the exception.
post #7253 of 7283
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Mehs View Post

No one in their right mind should consider satellite if they have access to other broadband options.
Depends on what broadband means. If you mean >= 1Mb then most people have maybe four choices:
  1. Cable internet.
  2. Telco internet if you can get DSL.
  3. Wireless
  4. Satellite (just the two providers).
The first two are typically monopolies. While the latter two are quite pricey mobile broadband is insanely expensive which is what might steer someone that doesn't care about latency to a sat service. My in-laws have Exede which is reasonably fast ( 6-18Mb) and provides enough capacity for retired country folks. I looked into it as a backup but they have extremely limited markets unlike their WildBlue legacy service. Now according to my LTE modem they can get an acceptable signal from Verizon but Verizon isn't interested* in selling them Home Fusion and even if they were it's triple the price of Exede.

*Yes you could go with a third party but those services exist at the whim of the wireless carriers.
post #7254 of 7283

Continuing my reporting of antenna tests in north Grand Island, NY.  I now have a Clearstream 2V installed in the attic. The results with a 25 ft cable run straight up to the attic from my 1 TV.  I am now getting most of the stations I was hoping to pull in except for ION.  We experimented with location and this pulled the most in with pretty good results.  When I scanned it said 30 channels but some are not broadcasting.  Here are the ones with broadcasts I could receive.  This gets the Canadian stations I was hoping to pull in. - 26 stations.  The picture is good for all except that they may from time to time exhibit interference by blip-ping in and out.  I am wondering if a amp will reduce the blipping and bring in ION.  Below is a picture of the installation.  Much easier to adjust in the attic rather than roof and will not be subject to the Buffalo weather.  

WGRZ 2,1 (NBC), 2.2

ANTEN 2.3

WIVB 4.1 (CBS)

CBLT 5.1 (CBC English)

WKBW 7.1 (ABC)

CTV 9.1 

TNT  15.3, 15.4, 15.5

TVO 19.1

WNLO  23.1 (CW)

ENLO 23.2

IRCH 25.1  (CBC French)

WUTV 29.1 (Fox), 29.2 ZUUS

GLBD 41.1, 41.2

PBS 43.3, 43.4, 43.10 (music)

WNYO 49.1 (MyTV)

WBBZ 67.1

THIS 67.2

MeTV 67.3

WBBZ 67.4

 

post #7255 of 7283
You haven't been reading the thread.
Forget using any amp, especially a preamp. It would be severely overloaded.
post #7256 of 7283

Reading is not necessarily understanding.  Why do amps work with some antennas but not others?  I confirmed with Antennas Direct I am getting as good as I can expect from this antenna, as the maximum range for the antenna is 50 miles.  It is installed facing Toronto with the Buffalo stations coming in through the back.  

 

Is there any antenna which would fit in the attic not requiring a rotary controller that would provide just a bit more reach.  If I can't get more stations that is fine I just would like a steadier signal from all the stations I am now getting.  Am I expecting too much from these antennas?  If I am I will settle for this set up.   

 

nkreed, You thought I could get 17 but I have not pulled it in on any of the 3 antennas tested.  At the price of the CM2016 you are using I could return the Clearstream and get two to point opposite directions, NW for Canada and SW for Buffalo.  Online the CM2016 is only rated from 35 miles.  Dimensions would work.

 

  • SCHNEEDOO, I am not interested in building my own antenna.

I also received the suggestion of the Antennacraft HBU-22 from Radio Shack which is rated for 50 miles and at a price point I could buy two for joined install.  Although 70 inch length is not quite what I was expecting to put in my attic.  

 

 


Edited by Frugal1SBM - 2/17/14 at 7:21pm
post #7257 of 7283
I have 100+ feet of coax between my Clearstream and my tuners. A preamp is a must or I don't pick up squat.
post #7258 of 7283
If you're seeing 43.3 and 43.4, that is WNED, just without PSIP (the data that tells your tuner to display it on 17.1 and 17.2).

- Trip
post #7259 of 7283
Quote:
Why do amps work with some antennas but not others?
It's not the antenna, it's where you are. You have 2 1/2 TV stations in your backyard (literally). with the 1/2 being that duplication of that station in the Southtowns. Amps will get overloaded with high RF levels present. Preamps are worse.
.
Quote:
I confirmed with Antennas Direct I am getting as good as I can expect from this antenna, as the maximum range for the antenna is 50 miles.
There is no way they or anyone else can state that you are "getting as good as can expected" without knowing the area and the situation. Nor is stating that or any antenna will not receive further than 50 miles or worse yet will receive xx miles like it was a guarantee of sorts. That's mostly all marketing (what else).
Terrain, as in water, hills, elevation (or lack of) etc. all reflect reception.
Be satisfied what what you have. Being north of those xmitters with the antenna facing north is the best scenario for where you live though I would move it outdoors when the weather breaks, even if it is a eve mounted install to get it out of the attic.

1HD_addict;
Where are you in relation to the 'big three' and where is the antenna aimed??
post #7260 of 7283
Quote:
If you're seeing 43.3 and 43.4, that is WNED, just without PSIP
Or the inability of the tuner to recognize that data properly. There seems to be a problem with some receivers and WNED. I have had it ID'ed improperly at times and I have read the same with others.
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