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LMS 5400 - Curved Cabinet Build

post #1 of 49
12/20/11 at 10:02am
Thread Starter 
Trying to work out the final design details on my curved cabinets for my two LMS 5400s and I had some questions. The cabinets will be similiar in size and shape to Warp's Funky Waves Build:
http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...400-build.html

I have never built a curved cabinet before, but I did have a couple of ideas on how to build this.

1) Frame structure very similiar to Warp's and then wrap with 6 or more layers of 1/8'' hardboard/masonite around the frame. Final side thickness would be greater than .75

2) Layers. I don't know the official name for this, but just cut out lots and lots of layers of MDF to stack together and create the box this way.

Just curious which way you guys might suggest and also is it possible to stick the LMS into too small of a box? As long as it fits am I good to go?
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post #2 of 49
12/20/11 at 7:04pm
Warps' build would be far less time-consuming compared to the lam-ply build. I don't believe you'd need the curved walls too be over 3/4" since a curved surface such as that creates a much stronger surface compared to something flat. 2 layers at the most is all you need, or one if you can pull off the bend.

The Laminated Ply build is esthetically superior to most people and also rare because of the complexity of the build.

If I were you I'd build a curved cab like Warp's first. Down the road you can always take on the lam-ply project if you have the time/patience/skills for it.
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post #3 of 49
12/20/11 at 7:12pm
I would copy Warp's approach. The laminated ply style looks cool, but IMO offers no benefit while using extra material and time. I guess it would be easy if you had a CNC cut it.
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post #4 of 49
12/20/11 at 7:21pm
I don't know if this can help you... maybe get some ideas... check it out!
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post #5 of 49
12/20/11 at 8:07pm
Thread Starter 
I've been talking with some local guys who will be able to CNC parts for me, but I agree that the layered option probably isn't going to be the best option for now. I will try the other method.

The kerf cutting was interesting, but seems like it would require a bit of trial and error to get the cuts correct so you can bend it. I may get some scraps and give it a try as well.

thanks for the input.
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post #6 of 49
12/20/11 at 8:11pm
The kerfs were done every 3/4"... you draw a black line on your sawblade insert.. you make the first cut and then move the mdf 3/4" over ..so the second cut aligns with the black mark and that will be your guide.
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post #7 of 49
12/21/11 at 6:23am
Thread Starter 
those cuts look pretty wide. was that with only a single pass? How deep did you cut?

I think the biggest problem I still might have with this is since it will be a sealed cab for the LMS that such high pressure might build up and blow out one of the sides since so much material is removed by the kerfs.
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post #8 of 49
12/21/11 at 6:35am
He could fill the gaps after bending with something that would cure like water putty or fiberlass resin etc.
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post #9 of 49
12/21/11 at 7:31am
You can use a pre-kerfed mdf product like BendyMDF. There is a similar product called KerfCore but I had bad luck with this and the kerfed parts delaminating from the main panel.

On my sealed Maelstrom-X curved cabinet I did have one small spot where the curved panels pulled loose from the internal bracing when I really cranked it up. I don't know if I had a dry glue joint at that spot or what but now when I do a curved cabinet I always use pocket hole screws to give additional strength where the sides glue to the internal bracing.

Here is the skeleton of that sub without sides or veneer.

Regards,

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post #10 of 49
12/21/11 at 8:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by NateTTU View Post

those cuts look pretty wide. was that with only a single pass? How deep did you cut?

I think the biggest problem I still might have with this is since it will be a sealed cab for the LMS that such high pressure might build up and blow out one of the sides since so much material is removed by the kerfs.


Don't forget when you make the bend most of the kerfs end up joining again... the mdf was 3/4" and the cuts were 5/8" deep...You can do this to plywood too.
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post #11 of 49
12/21/11 at 12:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanaris View Post

I don't know if this can help you... maybe get some ideas... check it out!

Hey - i can't see any pics in that thread. Is it just me or did you take them down or something? Interested in seeing some curved-build action
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post #12 of 49
12/21/11 at 12:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowpolyjoe View Post

Hey - i can't see any pics in that thread. Is it just me or did you take them down or something? Interested in seeing some curved-build action


They are there... it's a paid photobucket account..
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post #13 of 49
12/21/11 at 12:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanaris View Post

They are there... it's a paid photobucket account..

crap - i wonder why i can't see them. i'll have to try a different browser later today.
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post #14 of 49
12/21/11 at 1:00pm
If you haven't seen it, check out this thread. I'm just finishing up a similar project and it is pretty well documented here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1371181

I can send you the AutoCAD file for use as a model for CNC cuts.

Brad
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post #15 of 49
12/21/11 at 1:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesSailor View Post

If you haven't seen it, check out this thread. I'm just finishing up a similar project and it is pretty well documented here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1371181

I can send you the AutoCAD file for use as a model for CNC cuts.

Brad

Great build - thanks for the link Brad. I can see your pics. I don't think i'll be attempting a curve build just now, but thanks for the offer of the AutoCAD plans.

Just installed Firefox (in addition to IE 8) but i still can't see any pics in the Kanaris thread... weird.



Ahhh... my job's VPN was silently blocking the photobucket content. disconnected from the VPN and now i can see the pics. Good stuff Mike.
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post #16 of 49
12/29/11 at 7:44am
Thread Starter 
I can't remember where the thread is so I'm hoping someone can point me in the right direction. Someone here built a custom trigger for their pro amp so that it turned on whenever they powered up the receiver.

Also, what is the little box I should get to make an LT and also make a custom high pass filter? couldn't remember if it was the bassis or minidsp or something else.

Thanks
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post #17 of 49
12/29/11 at 8:57am
Its in nots sub build
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post #18 of 49
1/2/12 at 3:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NateTTU View Post

I think the biggest problem I still might have with this is since it will be a sealed cab for the LMS that such high pressure might build up and blow out one of the sides since so much material is removed by the kerfs.

Not a problem; max pressure is only a fraction of a psi.
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post #19 of 49
1/3/12 at 3:30pm
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the advice. Looks like I should be ok then.

I will be shooting for a 1.5'' front, top, bottom, back, and then a hardboard layer for around 1'' thickness. I think this should make a very nice box. I'm going to shoot for a 21.5 x 21.5 x 21.5 cube. Anyone got any recommendations on what measurements to use to create the curved sides?

I'm trying to figure out how to mimic the solid roundover corners on the box and was curious if anyone had some suggestions on how to do this. BTW, what do you think the front corner radii is? The radius around the top and bottom is .75''. I'm guessing the sides and rear would be close to 1.5''.

(large pic)
http://www.funkywaves.net/catalog/in...y18_large2.png

I can get a large roundover this size for around $50 shipped which isn't too bad.
http://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shops...ound_over.html
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post #20 of 49
1/24/12 at 6:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NateTTU View Post

Trying to work out the final design details on my curved cabinets for my two LMS 5400s and I had some questions. The cabinets will be similiar in size and shape to Warp's Funky Waves Build:
http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...400-build.html

I have never built a curved cabinet before, but I did have a couple of ideas on how to build this.

1) Frame structure very similiar to Warp's and then wrap with 6 or more layers of 1/8'' hardboard/masonite around the frame. Final side thickness would be greater than .75

2) Layers. I don't know the official name for this, but just cut out lots and lots of layers of MDF to stack together and create the box this way.

Just curious which way you guys might suggest and also is it possible to stick the LMS into too small of a box? As long as it fits am I good to go?

I used 4 layers of 1/4" ply for the side, and a bunch of tow straps to keep the sides in place while the glue is drying. Then I used a router to trim off the excess. I think the boxes turned out OK
LL
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post #21 of 49
1/26/12 at 8:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by macming View Post

I used 4 layers of 1/4" ply for the side, and a bunch of tow straps to keep the sides in place while the glue is drying. Then I used a router to trim off the excess. I think the boxes turned out OK

Looks great! Can I ask where you got those feet for the enclosure?
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post #22 of 49
1/26/12 at 10:21am
Thread Starter 
You do excellent work macming. I hope my boxes come looking out as nice.

Does anyone by chance have any type of file I can use on a CNC machine? I'm going to a CNC meet here in North Texas on Saturday and hope to meet a few people who can cut the parts for me, but it would be nice if I have a file ready to go or at least to start with.
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post #23 of 49
1/26/12 at 11:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by wth718 View Post

Looks great! Can I ask where you got those feet for the enclosure?

I bought them directly from Paradigm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NateTTU View Post

You do excellent work macming. I hope my boxes come looking out as nice.

Does anyone by chance have any type of file I can use on a CNC machine? I'm going to a CNC meet here in North Texas on Saturday and hope to meet a few people who can cut the parts for me, but it would be nice if I have a file ready to go or at least to start with.

Thanks for the complement! Just ask if you need help with any part of the construction!

I made a template using a piece of card board, and hand cut all the curves using a router. Having a CNC will definitely make things a lot easier!


I think my box will look a lot better with a LMS driver inside
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post #24 of 49
1/26/12 at 1:51pm
"I think the boxes turned out OK"

i'll say. :-)

"Does anyone by chance have any type of file I can use on a CNC machine?"

this might help: http://www.probotix.com/cnc_software/

i'm not sure what shopbot uses, but it is a hugely popular machine and probably has a big support group if you need help.

edit: http://www.shopbottools.com/mProducts/softwaretable.htm
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post #25 of 49
1/26/12 at 3:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by macming View Post


I bought them directly from Paradigm.

Thanks for the info. I imagine it wasn't that cheap?
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post #26 of 49
1/27/12 at 6:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by wth718 View Post

Thanks for the info. I imagine it wasn't that cheap?

I can't remember the specifics, but I don't remember them being ridiculous

The feet really add to the finish of the boxes, so to me, it was well worth it!
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post #27 of 49
1/30/12 at 4:03pm
Thread Starter 
Can someone tell me which material would be best for the inner supports of the curved cabinets? They will be similiar in design to Warp's Funky Waves cabinet.

MDF $30/sheet
Arauco Plywood $25/sheet
Birch Plywood $42/sheet

Since the support thins out around the front edges it would be best to go with a material that won't split so I think the plywoods would be better, but how much better is the birch over the much cheaper arauco?
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post #28 of 49
1/31/12 at 4:07pm
Thread Starter 
For those of you who have flush mounted this driver before. Do you remember what dimensions you used? I was going to use 18.60 x .70 deep and a 16.90 thru hole. I'm hoping this will keep things tight, but not too tight.

I'm creating some sketches for a CNC machine and don't really want to have to pull those drivers from their current boxes as it would be a huge pain. I'm basically going off the spec sheet which lists the outer diameter as 18.52 and the frame to be 16.83.
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post #29 of 49
1/31/12 at 4:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NateTTU View Post

Can someone tell me which material would be best for the inner supports of the curved cabinets? They will be similiar in design to Warp's Funky Waves cabinet.

MDF $30/sheet
Arauco Plywood $25/sheet
Birch Plywood $42/sheet

Since the support thins out around the front edges it would be best to go with a material that won't split so I think the plywoods would be better, but how much better is the birch over the much cheaper arauco?

I used birch plywood for my own build, and doubled up all the non-curved layers. The wood I bought were all void free, and were fantastic to work with. Oh, they are very screw friendly.

For the sides, you are stuck with 1/4" plywood. I'd do at least 4 layers and just glue them together.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NateTTU View Post

For those of you who have flush mounted this driver before. Do you remember what dimensions you used? I was going to use 18.60 x .70 deep and a 16.90 thru hole. I'm hoping this will keep things tight, but not too tight.

I'm creating some sketches for a CNC machine and don't really want to have to pull those drivers from their current boxes as it would be a huge pain. I'm basically going off the spec sheet which lists the outer diameter as 18.52 and the frame to be 16.83.

I made my inside hole 17", which might be too big for your liking. I didn't flush mount my driver, so I can't help you with the outer dimension.
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post #30 of 49
1/31/12 at 4:19pm
I don't recall off hand the exact dimensions but I do know it depends on if you use the supplied rubber gasket or not. If I remember correctly the thru hole will be a little sloppy if you use the gasket and tight if you don't.

I had to mount mine without the gasket since the flush mounting was just too tight. I used something like this to ensure a tight seal: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=260-542
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