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JVC RS 45 / Sony HW30 / BenQ W7000 / Epson 5010 mini-shootout - Page 47

post #1381 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

So, got some 3D viewing in on my 5010.
...
For kicks I put it to 3D Dynamic mode. Someone turned a vacuum cleaner on so I went to complain and realized it was my Epson. Holy smokes it is loud in that mode.

Actually, I was thinking of stealing the muffler off our built-in vacuum and attaching it to the exhaust port on the 5010.
post #1382 of 3271
Some ghosting that isn't really visible to the eye can also add a very slight but still apparent blur to the image. It'd be hard to notice unless another projector without ghosting was running split screen.
post #1383 of 3271
I don't know if this has been mentioned but I hear about how well the 5010 does 3D and wanted to know how the 3010 compares with 3D also.
post #1384 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

Elkhunter - it's good that the projector worked for you. I thought you'd like the brightness with the torch mode on the HP screen.

it sounds like the MV3D's are your only choice. These are pretty big compared to all the other glasses including the Epson's. They have come down in price and I recently tested them to work fine with the 5010.

The MV3D's are in the upper right.


regarding 3d glasses, are the MV3D glasses the same as the optoma glasses used with the HD33 and HD83 (8300 in states) if so will they work with the HW30 and W95 from Sony? with regards to the PS3 glasses can't seem to find them on best buy for $50, cheapest at $69.99.
post #1385 of 3271
So is the consensus still that the best glasses for the 5010 are Epson's own glasses, or has that changed over the course of discussion?

While I am waiting for my Himedia 900A to get here, do I need anything more than either PowerDVD 11 and/or TMT5 (along with an Nvidia card, of course) to play back 3D? Or do I need some other software to make this all work on a PC? I already have DVDFab Passkey installed, along with Slysoft's virtual drive software (I forgot what it is called) for reading ISOs, so I think I am good to go, but I just want to check to be sure...
post #1386 of 3271
Mod's edit: Redundant post...
post #1387 of 3271
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DisTreSs View Post

I'll be demoing the Epson vs the 45 next weekend, so I'll try to pause some of the clips this time, but really, if it doesn't catch my attention while the pic is moving, I frankly don't care it's there. The only reason why it would be bothersome without pausing, is the fact that even though you can't see it, it does cause fatigue on the eyes. Since I had no fatigue while demoing the RS45 for 2+ hours, that to me suggests there wasn't too much there to begin with. With my samsung plasma I had head & eye-aches within 10 minutes!

it's not really the ghosting, when comparing JA3 3D on the JVC vs the 5010 - On my 142" screen, I think it looks softer than it does on the 5010.

please add your feedback when you see them side by side and let us know what demo material you were using. thanks!
post #1388 of 3271
I have an Epson 6010 on order and have some questions…

The Epson 6010 includes a spare lamp. How does the warranty work for the spare lamp for the 6010? For example if 5010/6010 lamps have say a 90-day warranty what does this mean for the spare lamp included with the 6010 since there would be no reason to install it right away. Or does the 6010 not ship with a spare lamp but ships with a certificate redeemable for a spare lamp whenever one is needed?

I was reading the owners manual (online PDF) last night and see that there is a 3D Depth setting (what are people’s opinions of owners who have played with it? What is the default?) and a 3D Brightness setting for the glasses that says it isn’t available if the 3D Format is set to Auto re: what format 3D is sent to projector from source device (e.g., 3D Bluray, .mpo file). So what format is 3D BluRay? What format is a 3D .mpo file? I’m trying to figure out if it will be possible to switch 3D format from Auto to one of the other values so the 3D Brightness setting isn’t disabled. BTW I have an Oppo BDP-93 player.
post #1389 of 3271
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by abs View Post

regarding 3d glasses, are the MV3D glasses the same as the optoma glasses used with the HD33 and HD83 (8300 in states) if so will they work with the HW30 and W95 from Sony? with regards to the PS3 glasses can't seem to find them on best buy for $50, cheapest at $69.99.

Hi, it's been confirmed that the Optoma glasses and the MV3D's are the same glasses by the manufacturer 'Bit Cauldron'. You should have no problems with them on the HW30 or VW95.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Sorel View Post

So is the consensus still that the best glasses for the 5010 are Epson's own glasses, or has that changed over the course of discussion?

While I am waiting for my Himedia 900A to get here, do I need anything more than either PowerDVD 11 and/or TMT5 (along with an Nvidia card, of course) to play back 3D? Or do I need some other software to make this all work on a PC? I already have DVDFab Passkey installed, along with Slysoft's virtual drive software (I forgot what it is called) for reading ISOs, so I think I am good to go, but I just want to check to be sure...

Bob - I think it's a matter of comfort and fit. The MV3D's are larger than the Epson's and might be more comfortable for those with prescription glasses. They both have similar performance.

regarding the software, there is a good chance you are going to need this:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/3dtv-play-overview.html

I don't need this because I have the Nvidia 3D vision IR emitter and the drivers automatically enable the 3D bluray playback, but I think they did something sneaky and are charging for this feature now if you don't have the 3D vision setup.

other than this last bit of software, you should be ready to go. send me a PM if you get stuck anywhere along the line setting it up.
post #1390 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

I was reading the owners manual (online PDF) last night and see that there is a 3D Depth setting (what are people’s opinions of owners who have played with it? What is the default?) and a 3D Brightness setting for the glasses that says it isn’t available if the 3D Format is set to Auto re: what format 3D is sent to projector from source device (e.g., 3D Bluray, .mpo file). So what format is 3D BluRay? What format is a 3D .mpo file? I’m trying to figure out if it will be possible to switch 3D format from Auto to one of the other values so the 3D Brightness setting isn’t disabled. BTW I have an Oppo BDP-93 player.

Don't worry about it. You don't have to switch anything from defaults when feeding 3D from Oppo BDP-93 playing a Blu-ray 3D disc. The projector recognizes incoming frame-packed format and switches over to 3D mode automatically. Glasses brightness setting is definitely available when playing Blu-ray 3Ds. 3D Depth is available when 2D-to-3D conversion feature is enabled. MPO files are created by digital 3D still cameras. Viewing them in 3D on the projector requires either a direct HDMI 1.4 connection from the camera to the projector or viewing them on a 3D-compatible PC connected to the projector.
post #1391 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Sorel View Post

So is the consensus still that the best glasses for the 5010 are Epson's own glasses, or has that changed over the course of discussion?

While I am waiting for my Himedia 900A to get here, do I need anything more than either PowerDVD 11 and/or TMT5 (along with an Nvidia card, of course) to play back 3D? Or do I need some other software to make this all work on a PC? I already have DVDFab Passkey installed, along with Slysoft's virtual drive software (I forgot what it is called) for reading ISOs, so I think I am good to go, but I just want to check to be sure...

I tried the Sony PS3 glasses this weekend, and they work just fine with the Epson 6010, but they're darker. I didn't do exhaustive testing, but I much prefer the Epson glasses. They're super bright, and ghosting is not an issue at all (IMO, of course, but I'm probably a lot more sensitive to ghosting than the vast majority of people). The Sony glasses are on sale this week at Best Buy for $40, down from $70. Check their ad. The Sony glasses are universal 3D glasses, and they sync very easily to IR signals. Of course, they won't work with Bluetooth or RF emitters, so "universal" is a relative term.
post #1392 of 3271
Congrats Wyne, you are going to love the Epson (crossing fingers.)

For whomever asked about Nvidia setup for 3D, you will need 3dplay TV as mentioned by zombie and Nvidia's official supported list that has the .inf files built into the drivers for easy setup: http://www.nvidia.com/object/3dtv-pl...uirements.html

You also can buy the dongle kit and use it to bypass 3dplay TV but it would be just as expensive vs. just buying the connector software and then you have to be worried about having another dongle to mess with.
post #1393 of 3271
I never bought an nVidia kit to get 3D to work with my RS40 - just the regular nVidia video drivers. Try it with PDVD11 or TMT5 alone before you spend anything extra.
post #1394 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

it's not really the ghosting, when comparing JA3 3D on the JVC vs the 5010 - On my 142" screen, I think it looks softer than it does on the 5010.

please add your feedback when you see them side by side and let us know what demo material you were using. thanks!

I know they should have Tangled and Avatar so definitely not good material to go ghostbusting with. I don't really have any 3D material anymore (sold it together with the Samsung) so I'll probably go rent some Blu-rays the day I go to their shop. I saw Sammy 3D in our videostore the other day (this should be a good test if memory serves) but I wasn't able to find Despicable me in 3D... Definitely going to try to get my hands on that one before I go. If there's someone in Belgium that can lend it to me, I'd be grateful

I can understand what you and coder are saying with regard to softness and blurriness. I can already confirm from memory that this was worse on the RS45 than the HW30 I demoed, but I attributed this to the FI on the Sony. That's what I meant when I previously stated that I found the image on the HW30 to be smoother, more steady in 3D.

Still, the 3D on the RS45 was miles and leagues better than what I saw on the Samsung.
For instance:
- The shower scene in SBS format from resident evil: I was unable to focus on the image with the samsung, but had no problem whatsoever with the JVC. Not to say that it was 100% non-blurred (that would be impossible in a scene like that: even with perfect DLP 3D I would probably still go cross-eyed from the 3D water droplets ) but it was more than sharp enough that I could enjoy that scene without having to go look for ghosts or being distracted by anything.
- Another scene I had problems with on the Samsung was in the Roadrunner clip I already mentioned: at a certain point the coyote is flying through a canyon with a helicopter helmet strapped to his head (you go Wile E.!) and it was impossible to keep track of him. On the RS45 I could actually sit back and easily track the coyote.

Anyway, I'll do my best to give my objective feedback when I get to see them next to each other. I can still change my order to the Epson if I want to, so I'm going in with an open mind. I just hope we don't run into the syncing problems we did when we put the HW30 next to the RS45: made it harder to switch back and forward between the 2 PJ's...
post #1395 of 3271
Do the Sony 3D glasses work with JVCs?
post #1396 of 3271
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark View Post

I never bought an nVidia kit to get 3D to work with my RS40 - just the regular nVidia video drivers. Try it with PDVD11 or TMT5 alone before you spend anything extra.

Joseph - are you running the latest drivers? it was my understanding that at a certain driver revision, if you didn't have the transmitter, you needed the $40 software for 3D playback.

otherwise, what are they selling it for?
post #1397 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

Hi, it's been confirmed that the Optoma glasses and the MV3D's are the same glasses by the manufacturer 'Bit Cauldron'. You should have no problems with them on the HW30 or VW95

Thanks zombie, can the optoma glasses be used at the same time as the Sony glasses that come with the pj?

Do I need the separate rf transmitter with the optoma glasses or will they work with the Sony transmitter?
post #1398 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by abs View Post

Do I need the separate rf transmitter with the optoma glasses or will they work with the Sony transmitter?

MonsterVision kit ships with an IR receiver/converter needed to convert Sony's sync pulses to MV RF sync signals. Optoma kit in Europe does not have such a receiver/converter. Optoma kit works only with projectors that have the same 3-pin VESA3D connector for external emitter as Optoma's 3D projectors have. Sony and Epson use RJ45, not VESA3D connector. In the official Sony HW30 Owner's thread there is a schematic for a DIY Sony-to-MonsterVision adapter.
post #1399 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by pteittinen View Post

Don't worry about it. You don't have to switch anything from defaults when feeding 3D from Oppo BDP-93 playing a Blu-ray 3D disc. The projector recognizes incoming frame-packed format and switches over to 3D mode automatically. Glasses brightness setting is definitely available when playing Blu-ray 3Ds. 3D Depth is available when 2D-to-3D conversion feature is enabled. MPO files are created by digital 3D still cameras. Viewing them in 3D on the projector requires either a direct HDMI 1.4 connection from the camera to the projector or viewing them on a 3D-compatible PC connected to the projector.

The way I read the manual is the 3D Brightness setting is disabled if 3D Format menu item set to Auto so I'm trying to figure out if I can set it to a value other than auto (primary 3D source will be 3D BluRay from Oppo) so I can get at the 3D Brightness setting. From your post it sounds like the Epson manual is incorrect in stating the 3D Brightness setting is disabled if 3D Format is set to Auto.

I didn't realize the 3D Depth menu item only applies to the 2D to 3D Conversion, I didn't see that mentioned in the manual.

I thought the Oppo BDP-93 handles .mpo files but perhaps I'm wrong. My Sony point and shoot camera takes 3D pics and puts them in .mpo files. I don't keep them in the camera, I have them on my PC which is nowhere near the projector/Oppo. If the Oppo can't play them I need to see if my Popcorn Hour media player can else I'll have to figure out another game plan such as putting them back on a SD card and put them in my camera... When people come over would prefer to have them on a CD or in the hard drive attached to the Popcorn Hour, more convenient than dealing with the actual camera.
post #1400 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

The way I read the manual is the 3D Brightness setting is disabled if 3D Format menu item set to Auto so I'm trying to figure out if I can set it to a value other than auto (primary 3D source will be 3D BluRay from Oppo) so I can get at the 3D Brightness setting.

I've been running Epson 9000/5010 for several days in Auto mode: it works fine with BD3D and does not disable glasses brightness setting. I'm assuming the brightness setting in 6010 is the same as in 5010, of course.

Quote:


I didn't realize the 3D Depth menu item only applies to the 2D to 3D Conversion, I didn't see that mentioned in the manual.

Hmm. Perhaps it doesn't work the same way in 6010 and 5010? Where did you download the manual?

Quote:


I thought the Oppo BDP-93 handles .mpo files but perhaps I'm wrong.

BDP-93 wiki says it does not.

Quote:


My Sony point and shoot camera takes 3D pics and puts them in .mpo files.

Does it have an HDMI output you could use to connect to the projector? You'd have to copy/move the images you wish to view in 3D to camera for viewing in that case.
post #1401 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

I have an Epson 6010 on order and have some questions

The Epson 6010 includes a spare lamp. How does the warranty work for the spare lamp for the 6010? For example if 5010/6010 lamps have say a 90-day warranty what does this mean for the spare lamp included with the 6010 since there would be no reason to install it right away. Or does the 6010 not ship with a spare lamp but ships with a certificate redeemable for a spare lamp whenever one is needed?

It is my experience that if any lamp fails in the first year or so (maybe even 2 years) under about 1000 hours, you can push Epson on the phone to replace it. Epson is often replacing lamps for the full warranty life of the projector according to some. I cannot confirm that they always do, but I can say that Epson is probably #1 in customer service out of all the manufacturers when it comes to stuff like this.

Their warranty and replacement programs can get backlogged at times, because I think some people take advantage of it.
post #1402 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by pteittinen View Post

I've been running Epson 9000/5010 for several days in Auto mode: it works fine with BD3D and does not disable glasses brightness setting. I'm assuming the brightness setting in 6010 is the same as in 5010, of course.


Hmm. Perhaps it doesn't work the same way in 6010 and 5010? Where did you download the manual?


BDP-93 wiki says it does not.


Does it have an HDMI output you could use to connect to the projector? You'd have to copy/move the images you wish to view in 3D to camera for viewing in that case.

Yes, I could do it via my camera's HDMI out which sounds like may be my most realistic option.

So the 3D Depth setting only applies to 2D to 3D conversion, not used when watching a 3D BluRay?

Epson 6010 manual: http://files.support.epson.com/pdf/p...plpc6010ug.pdf
post #1403 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

Some ghosting that isn't really visible to the eye can also add a very slight but still apparent blur to the image. It'd be hard to notice unless another projector without ghosting was running split screen.

I wonder if the additional depth I'm seeing with the Epson over the RS40/45 is due to subtle ghosting on the JVCs. That thought had occurred to me. Objects have greater 3-dimensionality on the 6010. I see it in all the 3D I've watched.
post #1404 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

So the 3D Depth setting only applies to 2D to 3D conversion, not used when watching a 3D BluRay?

That's how it is in the TW9000, the equivalent of 5010 according to various folks here on AVS. I can't vouch for 6010 as an equivalent model is not on sale in Europe... but I would be surprised if 3D Depth was available for 3D Blu-ray viewing.

Joseph C. got a 6010 not too long ago, perhaps he could check for you?
post #1405 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

The way I read the manual is the 3D Brightness setting is disabled if 3D Format menu item set to Auto so I'm trying to figure out if I can set it to a value other than auto (primary 3D source will be 3D BluRay from Oppo) so I can get at the 3D Brightness setting. From your post it sounds like the Epson manual is incorrect in stating the 3D Brightness setting is disabled if 3D Format is set to Auto.

I didn't realize the 3D Depth menu item only applies to the 2D to 3D Conversion, I didn't see that mentioned in the manual.

I thought the Oppo BDP-93 handles .mpo files but perhaps I'm wrong. My Sony point and shoot camera takes 3D pics and puts them in .mpo files. I don't keep them in the camera, I have them on my PC which is nowhere near the projector/Oppo. If the Oppo can't play them I need to see if my Popcorn Hour media player can else I'll have to figure out another game plan such as putting them back on a SD card and put them in my camera... When people come over would prefer to have them on a CD or in the hard drive attached to the Popcorn Hour, more convenient than dealing with the actual camera.

As Petri says, the 3D brightness setting is not disabled when in auto detect mode. 3D depth is determined in any pre-recorded content by the cameras used to shoot the material. The only way to change that significantly would be to shift the images left or right and then scale the 2 images. You can't set it for the 6010, either.

For mpo files, you might want to consider a program like Cyberlink PowerDirector 10 for your PC (if you have one). You can drag mpo files onto the timeline, add some background music, and burn them to AVCHD discs. They play in 3D on your 3D Blu-ray player. It's quick and easy. I use it for stills from my Fuji W3 camera.
post #1406 of 3271
BTW, the Fuji W3 camera allows you to change the parallax after you've shot your 3D still. You can then save the new stereo photo. The feature is great for adjusting parallax that's too wide for comfortable viewing. It can be done because the still actually contains more information than is used for a 1920x1080 3D photo. This is an example of how you can adjust 3D "depth" after the fact - by "pushing" or "pulling" the objects in the 3D frame. In effect, all you're doing is adjusting where the point of convergence is - in front of, behind or at the screen plane. Without scaling, there's not much you can do to adjust depth in a 3D video that's already been shot.
post #1407 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark View Post


As Petri says, the 3D brightness setting is not disabled when in auto detect mode. 3D depth is determined in any pre-recorded content by the cameras used to shoot the material. The only way to change that significantly would be to shift the images left or right and then scale the 2 images. You can't set it for the 6010, either.

For mpo files, you might want to consider a program like Cyberlink PowerDirector 10 for your PC (if you have one). You can drag mpo files onto the timeline, add some background music, and burn them to AVCHD discs. They play in 3D on your 3D Blu-ray player. It's quick and easy. I use it for stills from my Fuji W3 camera.

Awesome suggestion, I own PowerDvd 10 but had no idea this could be done. Thanks.
post #1408 of 3271
Hi Guy's,

I have been reading this forum with a lot of interest over the past few weeks.
Firstly I have to say it is great reading and thanks for the great effort put into
it.

I have been wanting to make the 3D leap into my HT, but have been very disappointed
with the projectors on display.

I have seen last years JVC (X3 I think, base model). Way too much flicker and ghosting.
I hated it. I thought I will just stick to 2D.

I then viewed recently the Panasonic 7000 and was shocked this got great reviews. I thought the
3D was terrible.

I just about gave up totally when a staff member told me to try the Optoma 33. Wow for a cheap
projector I was impressed. I then went back and viewed the 83. I watched for over an hour and
didn't see any ghosting or flicker. I now want to put something in my room.

I have a great 2D projector. Cineversum Blackwing 3. Based on the JVC RS40.
It really blows me away and I am super happy with it. So I was thinking of running a 2 Projector setup
adding a projector just for 3D (will never be used for 2D, so I don't care about 2D performance).

I am from New Zealand and we really are in the middle of nowhere. Optoma is the only DLP
brand sold here. We don't get Benq.

So here comes the questions.... Is there no Love for Optoma in the USA as
I really don't see much discussion on them?? Is there something wrong with them?

A lot of discussion here has been on how ghost free the Benq is. Is it similar
to the Optoma? Because they are both DLP based.
I am going to take my kids to Disney Land this year. Soon. So I was thinking of
picking up the Benq and putting it in my bag to take home if it is that good.

One thing that annoyed me with my Optoma demo was the Glasses rims. Is there
a better brand glasses that are bigger that can be used with the Benq?

One other thing that hasn't been discussed is the signal sent by emitters. I
have heard that they can play and mess with other equipment. Is that still
happening?

I thank any responses in advance. In NZ we are really starved for info as there
are not many here with the HT addiction.

Thanks Dono
post #1409 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

Awesome suggestion, I own PowerDvd 10 but had no idea this could be done. Thanks.

Oh, not PowerDVD - PowerDirector 10. It's by the same company.
post #1410 of 3271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Badas View Post

Hi Guy's,

I have been reading this forum with a lot of interest over the past few weeks.
Firstly I have to say it is great reading and thanks for the great effort put into
it.

I have been wanting to make the 3D leap into my HT, but have been very disappointed
with the projectors on display.

I have seen last years JVC (X3 I think, base model). Way too much flicker and ghosting.
I hated it. I thought I will just stick to 2D.

I then viewed recently the Panasonic 7000 and was shocked this got great reviews. I thought the
3D was terrible.

I just about gave up totally when a staff member told me to try the Optoma 33. Wow for a cheap
projector I was impressed. I then went back and viewed the 83. I watched for over an hour and
didn't see any ghosting or flicker. I now want to put something in my room.

I have a great 2D projector. Cineversum Blackwing 3. Based on the JVC RS40.
It really blows me away and I am super happy with it. So I was thinking of running a 2 Projector setup
adding a projector just for 3D (will never be used for 2D, so I don't care about 2D performance).

I am from New Zealand and we really are in the middle of nowhere. Optoma is the only DLP
brand sold here. We don't get Benq.

So here comes the questions.... Is there no Love for Optoma in the USA as
I really don't see much discussion on them?? Is there something wrong with them?

A lot of discussion here has been on how ghost free the Benq is. Is it similar
to the Optoma? Because they are both DLP based.
I am going to take my kids to Disney Land this year. Soon. So I was thinking of
picking up the Benq and putting it in my bag to take home if it is that good.

One thing that annoyed me with my Optoma demo was the Glasses rims. Is there
a better brand glasses that are bigger that can be used with the Benq?

One other thing that hasn't been discussed is the signal sent by emitters. I
have heard that they can play and mess with other equipment. Is that still
happening?

I thank any responses in advance. In NZ we are really starved for info as there
are not many here with the HT addiction.

Thanks Dono

You should add the Epson 5010 (or 6010, but not the 3010, which apparently ghosts much worse) to your list for consideration. IMO, ghosting is simply not an issue with this projector. It may not match DLP's almost completely ghost free image, but the overall effect is solid, smooth and as "real" looking as I've ever seen in a 3D display. YMMV, of course, but if you can, try to audition one before you buy something else.
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