AUDIOGON's new format - Page 11

Well, it took me about 30 minutes...just to send my buyer a message this evening. Google cursor spins and spins and spins...application error. Google cursor spins and spins and spins...application error. Sign out, open new window...sign back in; Google cursor spins and spins and spins... application error.

I know it's enough already, but seriously...has anybody ever seen anything like this? Where they took a popular, perfectly working site...and disabled it? I mean, for those who are just browsing...sure, it looks terrible, and maybe it's slow and you get lots of errors. But for those trying to buy and sell...it just doesn't work in any way that's "normal".

You can't change prices, you can't allow for PayPal fees; you can't leave feedback...and on, and on. They're trying to lock things down? Just about every ad I see these days says "Audiogon stinks...contact me directly at..."...lol; how long are they going to last like that?

Well...I said 3 months and they'll be done. Guess time will tell.

CD

As a buyer, I have not logged on AG in a month. I used to log 4-5 times a day. Now I have been spending money, amp and cables "$5k", local dealer. Not using AG till I see it working. Over the year I want more cables and a CD transport or player, might add a high end DAC.
Sorry sellers, AG is costing you cold hard cash!

surprise, surprise, the site is down again...

Listen, seriously; AFAIC what they're doing is a crime...it is FRAUD! They're charging people to list; they are not delivering a service. They are holding people's money, and not allowing prompt access to it. I can't contact my buyer, and he probably can't contact me. I can't get to My Page to conduct business.

I urge EVERYONE...ask for your fees back (they refunded close to $100 of mine, so they will do it...and I hope they go bankrupt in the process); and/or contact your State's Fraud Bureau.

Seriously...this is not just an inconvenience anymore; if they are charging people, it is a crime! Report it!

CD

I hadn't been on AG for years (used to love browsing, even for stuff I had little interest in, just to see what was out there) and caught wind of the "upgrade" when I stumbled across this thread a month ago.

Well guess what landed in my email today? A friendly reminder from AG that I still have a positive account balance. I actually had not completely forgotten about this but have had little need to use what was remaining (from a 10 listings / $40 promotion IIRC). I was tempted to request a refund, but after reading about trojans and other malware traced from their site, I think I'll write it off without ever having seen what a travesty they made of a website I remember quite fondly.

This snippet from the email is especially funny/sad/enraging knowing what has been said upthread:

"If you have not been on our site for awhile, we have come a long way since our launch in early January. We have restored a number of features and added new functionality since our launch and we encourage you to check us out. Our blog is a wonderful resource to get site information, as well as a place for you to provide us with feedback. Please read our blog updates at blog.audiogon.com."

Use a tablet like an iPad or android device or your smart phone to request your refund... This way you won't get infected. Don't let those assclowns profit off your money

What is sad, is whatever little progress these guys make...it's completely un-intuitive to their users. Yes, they might fix the zip-code search...and I know that's important to a lot of you; but how about being able to change the damn price of an ad! You mean if I think my speakers are worth $3k, but they don't appear to be gaining any traction at that price...I can't re-think it and change the listing to $2500 instead? (fwiw...you initially couldn't change the ad...only amend it; then they changed that..then they went back...and now, after a nice note from one of the new CSA gals, saying you couldn't edit ads anymore... I notice you can again. Wonder how it'll be tomorrow; then the day after that?)

Also...anyone notice they always (now) have the pics backwards; "1" comes up last, and your last pic comes up first. So...clever guy that I am, I decide to outsmart it; reverse the order I upload in. So I do that recently; 6 pics, and I decide which I want first, which last. However...the preview shows them in the "right" order; so I'm like "those f'ers finally fixed something"...no matter how small...lol. So I take all this time...removing the pics, and putting them back in order; fun little captions on them, etc. For heaven's sake; the actual ad still has them backwards...which is actually different from the damn preview! Oh...and the captions don't even work or show up.

It's stuff like that, which makes me wonder what the heck goes on in the mind of the design team. I mean, don't they get there's a pecking-order to the pics? A guy doesn't want to see the box or the remote first...lol

But as I've said before...all of that is small potatoes; annoying, but small potatoes. The real problem with the site is the speed and reliability. If they understood, even one small iota, the nature of sales...they'd realize communication is everything! A guy wants to buy, you need to strike while the iron is hot; if a guy wants to pay, you want to get paid before he changes his mind...if you want to buy, you need to do it quickly... before someone beats you to the punch, right? The other day, I had a deal that was worth over $4k to me...and I couldn't contact the buyer, because AG was giving application error, after application error for like a half-hour straight. I got lucky; my guy was good (and probably just as frustrated he couldn't get a hold of me)...but what if he'd gotten cold feet? Or decided the hassle of AG just wasn't worth it?

So...I, like many of you...see it as worthless, as a place to sell and buy right now. The only way to use it, is take advantage of the traffic, and re-direct people to you "off-site". That's completely contrary to how they make money, and it's going to cost them the site IMO; but they asked for it. Users have asked, and asked...and asked; please...until you get the bugs worked out, give us a site that works; give us the old site back. But I think they only see it as a way for the customers to keep ripping the site off, and refuse to budge. They are actually too blind to see they are losing more money this way, than the alternative. I have little sympathy...and agree the term "ass-clown" is a perfect fit.

CD

OK...anyone else's username coming up "invalid" all of a sudden??

EDIT- and now it does...5 minutes later. Ahh...new AG.

CD

So are you saying that you listed on Audiogon, found a buyer, and then sold offline thereby avoiding paying Audiogon their fee?

Potent forecast....MORE App Errors on agon tonight. WTF!

The other site was myaudiophileads or something. AVguide has one but kind of whack (conflict of interest?). Audio asylum a good bet, but Stereolist.com seems to have most promise.

Yes, for the most part the same practice with the "old AudiogoN" as well as eBay. Most buying done the same way, as I prefer to deal directly with seller/buyer.

That's theft. No matter how you look at it, rationalize it, or justify it. It's the same as walking into a store and stealing an item. You think they don't know people like you are scamming them? You don't think it affects not only the companies finances but the psychology of the people who work there?

You've put a price on your integrity of a few bucks? That's all it's worth? You enter into a business arrangement and then rip off your partner?

Who pays for people like you? The cost is passed on to me and others and part of that cost is maybe degraded service because if a 100 people like you scam a $100 a month in fees; that's the price of 2 or 3 employees who could be working to make Audiogon a better site and business.

Normally, I'd agree with you; and this poster does say he always did it..."old" or "new" AG...so I guess these extenuating circumstnces don't apply to him. However, with regard to the functionality and reliability of the "new" AG, I say they are getting what they deserve.

As I've noted previously...to my eye, most of the ads these days say "please contact me directly". IMO, this is counter-intuitive to what AG is trying to accomplish in two ways: 1) it decreases their collectible fees, and 2) it increases the chance for fraud.

Way to go Audiogon! I'd love to be a fly on the wall at their "corporate" offices. I can't imagine they're making much, if any, money on this venture. I still maintain...unless serious changes come, sooner rather than later...they can't stay afloat much more than a few months after this fiasco.

CD

^^^^

I can't practice or condone selective honesty. I have always believed that once I give myself permission to do the unethical, its that much easier to do it again whenever its convenient... and it then begins to corrupt all areas of my life.

The solution is simple...if I don't like the way a company does business, I don't do business with them. To go in with the intention to defraud means that the person doing that is no better than the company they've rationalized as being deserving of being defrauded.

I'm a business man who has been badly stung by people with free-floating morals.

It's not moral superiority I'm advocating, it's just basic human morals and conduct.

I have to agree with you. Once you start making integrity relative or situation specific, then it becomes a matter of where do you draw the line, and that line could keep changing. It's a cliche, but two wrongs don't make a right.

See...I don't look at it as a moral decision. This isn't just a matter of not liking some of the "new" AGs choices; they are putting a barrier between you and your money, with their ill-functioning site. Where does their moral obligation lie? Is that stealing from me?

This whole idea of "if you don't like the way they do business, go elsewhere"...is a little naive. What if Amazon changed, and was no longer usable; would you just find (what?) an alternative...or would you lobby to have them fix it? AFAIC, Audiogon might have held an even greater share...relative to their segment...of the market than Amazon.

Besides...if even they thought it was unreasonable...for people to circumvent their system right now...you don't think they could put an end to it? What...they don't read the ads being placed at their own site? If they don't...then my feeling they deserve to be circumvented is even stronger.

CD

I appreciate and understand your perspective.

My view of AG and any other site that it is simply a tool to link buyers and sellers worldwide. After the link is established, I prefer to transact on a personal level, particularly when "significant" dollars are involved. Once a connection is established, it simply becomes a negotiation between buyer and seller.

I have no stake in AG. They are certainly aware of "scammers" like me. I think the new site was developed as an attempt to circumvent this practice. Maybe they should increase their listing fees, collect more money upfront, maybe fee based on a percentage of asking price? This would cetainly get prices to a realistic level. Does anyone pay full asking price for an AG listing? Isn't negotiation implied? When negotiations begin, the fees become part of the equation. Fees as a percent of sales should only apply to auctions. AG provides no intermediary function that I'm aware of so why pay an intermediary fee?

Is Audiogon even updating their listings anymore? The same "new today" items have been up for almost the last 24 hours. I posted a product on there 12 hours ago and it still hasn't show up on the listings page.

I hate the way their forums work. It can take a day to get a reply approved for posting.

The sad thing is that the admins think their new format is killer. Yes, it killed their traffic. I rarely go there now.

I browsed a little today, and there is but a fraction of listings there used to be on the old site. People are obviously staying away.

I would definetly make a new website to get all the customers they are losing. I just do not know anything about making a website and do not have the time. This is a great opportunity to be a competitor I think.

That appears to be the case. I've been patiently waiting for a particular amp to come up for sale. I made an offer on one a couple of months ago only to have the offer I made to the seller get lost in the new AG system. A few hours later I find it has been sold for less than my offer. The seller felt bad for a couple of reasons - mainly because he could have made more money but also that I've been wanting that amp for a long time now. I may have to snag the next one to come along on ebay.

So...where has all the 'for sale' audio gear gone? AG seems to have about 1/3 what they used to have.

Agreed.

Mike

The sad thing is, I doubt the current group that runs it...despite claims of being the old regime...really understand just how off business is. Forget raw traffic; sure, there are a lot of new scammers...and people from whatever rock they dredged them up from under; no one I know likes it anymore.

Let me repeat; I still use it (only until something "better" does come along)...just don't like it, and there's a HUGE difference.

CD

Have you noticed, hardly anyone posts pics anymore? I guess they figure why bother; everything is being done "off" AG anyway.

CD

After 2 emails to the Audiogon adminstator my listing finally did show up some 20 hours after I tried to post it. Yes it was there finally BUT (isn't this always the case) it arrived in the lineup where it should have been yesterday, not at the front of the new listings. So essentially I paid full price for a listing that will only get a fraction of the views it should have since it was never in the New Listing front page. To make things even better, I did actually get (2) inquiries.........both of which asked me if my item was still for sale, said they were happy with the condition (even though there are no pics) and if I take the auction down they will send me a casier check right away. How coincidental they BOTH had the same pitch. Audiogon SUCKS IT!!

On the hopes that someone from audiogon reads this let me just say that I used to use their site quite a bit in the past. It was awesome. I recently tried to use the site and was severely disappointed. There are hardly any listings anymore. I deleted ag as a bookmark...totally worthless.

Yeah...those who've caught on, realize you can't list with a "buy it now" anymore...because people end your auction just to steal your address and telephone #; which AG forces to be fed to the "buyer".

Way to think it through new AG!

CD

New phishing scam sent out because of the "New" Audiogon!! Be AWARE!!