Official Panasonic 2012 Lineup and Information Thread [No Price Talk] - Page 10

Originally Posted by MrVizio

Interesting read. Seems that the improved brightness will translate more to savings on power consumption as most of us here don't pursue torchy pictures.

The reduced "pixel afterglow" and 2500 hz field are what I'm curious about. I experience "rainbows" on my GT30 and am very sensitive to the motion of an image. Perhaps these new specs will improve upon both.

The thing is, it always sounds so exciting at this stage. Hopefully these sets are a step up. I wouldn't be able to afford the 65vt50 til the end of the year, so I guess that's a good thing

Originally Posted by sfsteve

I saw that the comparison page says the vt50 has "96hz playback of 24p". Can someone tell me what that means?

Originally Posted by DaveZ06

I have the same problem with Panasonic plasmas. I don't really understand this. I see more of this "rainbow effect" on a Panasonic than I do on an LG, or Samsung. I'm hoping with the new drive system, and overall panel redesign, the effect is lessened. I actually made a thread about this issue a while back.

Originally Posted by DoctorM

Surprised I didn't notice this before (and haven't seen it mentioned here).

Is it trued that the ST50 panel uses the Infinite Black Pro panel that was only used in this year's VT30 TVs?

If that information is correct it's a really good reason to pay the difference between the 2012 and the marked down 2011 sets. Isn't it?

Edit: Btw, I'd take Plasma TV Buying Guide's info with a grain of salt. They make frequent errors. I remember them saying the S30 (not the ST) had the Infinite Black panel.

Already this year I see them saying the GT50 has the Infinite Black Ultra, which is only in the VT models.

Originally Posted by Nethawk

I haven't yet found a chart that shows the specifications and features of all three xx50 models on one page. I'm having a tough time deciding which to focus my attention on, and I have a big blank wall right now that needs to be filled soon. Any links to single page comparisons would be most appreciated.

TIA.

Originally Posted by DoctorM

Surprised I didn't notice this before (and haven't seen it mentioned here).

Is it trued that the ST50 panel uses the Infinite Black Pro panel that was only used in this year's VT30 TVs?

If that information is correct it's a really good reason to pay the difference between the 2012 and the marked down 2011 sets. Isn't it?

Edit: Btw, I'd take Plasma TV Buying Guide's info with a grain of salt. They make frequent errors. I remember them saying the S30 (not the ST) had the Infinite Black panel.

Already this year I see them saying the GT50 has the Infinite Black Ultra, which is only in the VT models.

Originally Posted by DaveZ06


Well, considering 2012 ST has faster phosphors, deeper blacks, higher brightness, improved filter, better speakers, and better overall design; I would say, yes. If the ST series maintains its low input lag, and I don't end up seeing the "rainbow effect" from their previous models; I'll most likely pick one up this year.

Originally Posted by Ayla

I'll wait for OLED prices to go down, so this would a nice TV until then, I hope.

Originally Posted by tommyv2


I get the same thing on Panasonic plasmas - just like the RBE but green or yellow. I don't see it on LG or Samsung sets as much.

Originally Posted by sage11x

Link to review/test where this is substantiated?

Originally Posted by NxNW

This effect, usually known as "phosphor lag", has been a passionately discussed topic on AVS since at least (and probably before) 2005 - see http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=603995 for one of the better threads on this topic.

If you are not sure if this bothers you, watch "Sin City" on your plasma. You will know immediately. Sin City is both black-and-white *and* "high key"( ie very contrasty, almost as if someone dialed the gamma up to about 4 in post production). These are perfect conditions for observing "phosphor lag".

As has been observed elsewhere, phosphor lag causes both rainbow effects (in all plasmas, 2D and otherwise) and "cross talk" in 3D plasmas. So recent improvements in decay times intended to reduce cross talk have actually helped with this "rainbow effect" as well.

The presumption is the 2012 lineup will have Panasonic's latest and best effort at minimizing decay times. Knowing Panasonic, the improvements will be real but incremental.

Originally Posted by DaveZ06

Then again, Panasonic has lowered the pre-discharge, so it should be deeper.

Originally Posted by DaveZ06


I guess the only thing that can't be substantiated is just how deep the black level is compared to last years ST model. Then again, Panasonic has lowered the pre-discharge, so it should be deeper. Other than that, Panasonic has already shown off how much brighter the 2012 panels are. Its entire panel has been redesigned from the ground up for the main purpose of increased brightness. Panasonic has reported about the ST/GT/VT models having faster phosphors than the 2011 models; just how much faster we don't know yet. The filter on the ST and GT model is from last years VT model. The sound quality from the TV itself should be improved with its "8-Train Speakers" system. Granted most speakers inside televisions suck to begin with, so this should be at least a decent upgrade. As for the design of the television itself, it seems better than last years pedestrian effort.

I have no reason to believe that what Panasonic is telling us about the new models aren't true. The only thing we don't know for sure is just how good the picture quality will be.

More about the new technology here.
More about the ST model here.

Originally Posted by DavidHir

I thought this was only on the VT50?

Originally Posted by sage11x

Not saying it won't be-- but I'll believe it when I see it. I get that we all are excited to see what's next but it's important to keep that anticipation in check with a heavy dose of reality: the 2011 line was a 'two steps forward and one step back' kind of year for Panasonic. They dramatically trimmed weight/dimensions and power draw while simultaneously increasing the speed of the panel and lowering black level; but they also produced the dimmest line of plasma tvs in years, had several color issues (decoding and the dreaded green/pink blobs) and regressed severely on the burn-in/IR front.

I expect the 2012 line will have incremental improvements but until I see test reports from owners and reviewers I'll take panasonic's marketing boasts with a grain of salt...

Originally Posted by xCREEP1NGDEATHx

So just got my 55in ST50 in today and first impressions are generally good. The new louver filter is insane, it is just short of being a matte screen. Very good at not reflecting light, but I find some clarity/sharpness is taken away by having that type of screen (more so in video games). So its up in the air right now.

So far NO BUZZING! There is a little fan noise but that is to be expected. Aesthetically it looks very much like last years Samsung plasma TVs, which is nice. I haven't messed around with the setting too much, def. in need of calibration as out of the box the picture is just OK.

Input lag on video games doesn't even seem to be an issue, I am not using Game mode and I don't notice any input lag.

So far no sign of IR and I didn't run any break in slides, just let it warm up to room temp. And that is after playing video games with static images.

Can't comment on 3d since in all their wisdom, Panny decided not to include glasses and there aren't any 2012 Bluetooth glasses released yet. Fun!

Might try to use the ST30 calibration settings and see what that does or will have to wait a couple months for pro's to do this TV. So far I'm happy but I am still deciding on that screen for video games....

Originally Posted by RandyWalters

if i were to try to hang a new 50ST50 in place of my existing 46G10 those higher mounting holes forces me to raise my wall mount at least 3 inches higher up on my wall since the new TV's relocated upper mounting holes are over 3 inches higher than the top of my wall mount's TV brackets, but the problem is that i can only raise my wall mount two more inches since it's under my front window.

Originally Posted by MrVizio

That's very cool that you got one! Thanks for the report. Very interesting about the new filter. I'm sure you'll be flooded with questions, but I was wondering a few things.

First, did you/do you own a 2011 Panny plasma? How's this new set compare?

I did not, but I did have a 2011 Samsung and so far I can say the black levels are better, but I would say that mostly comes from having the dark matte like screen/filter. So far I have not noticed FBR or floating blacks.

How's the motion in games?

Motion in games looks good, not anything noticeably different from the 2011 samsung. Plasma is still the best for gaming IMO because LCD and LED can sometimes cause screen tearing when swinging the camera fast left to right.

Have you tried out any blu-rays?

Just a little of The Dark Knight this morning, it looked good.

Gradation. How's the false contouring/posterization/banding?

Not sure how to look for these things, but haven't noticed anything wrong with the TV yet.

What mode are you using (cinema, custom, etc.)?

I use my own custom settings for gaming, for regular cable tv/movies I used the st30 calibration settings and for blu rays I haven't found a perfect setting yet outside cinema.

And any other thoughts you come up with.

My biggest thoughts right now are that filter and how much to me it looks like the LGLW5600 edge lit LED tv when I tried it. There just seems to be a clarity difference to my eye, but it does keep the blacks looking real good.

Also, being my first panasonic, I have to say that I do not like the lack of picture settings/control. For example the Samsung would let you control cell light level along with brightness/contrast. Panasonic only has the panel brightness which to me is kind of like a dynamic contrast control. I also don't like how it handles aspect ratios. The only one I found that doesn't look ballooned up on the screen is Fill screen and Hsize 2. With the samsung the just scan size worked perfectly and figures looked smaller than 16:9 but on the panny it just makes the image blow up on the screen as well as all the other aspect ratios outside 16:9. I don't dislike the TV but the matte like screen and lack of picture options is making me seriously consider another TV either the samsung pn51e7000 when it releases or the sony hx929.

Thanks

Originally Posted by xCREEP1NGDEATHx

I answered all the questions my best inside of the quote so look carefully!

Originally Posted by xCREEP1NGDEATHx


TV wasn't experiencing this problem till i turned on the hockey game. Picture started off dim (where I had it set ) then all of a sudden popped to a very high brightness and continued to do this (like a strobe light) till it gave me a headache and i turned it off. Tried messing with the settings and didn't have any luck. This did not happen on any other programming, but i know its not a cable thing. Returning the Tv for the Sony Hx929 sunday. Sorry guys. Maybe it was just a fluke and hopefully not to the same degree the 2011 plasmas had.

Originally Posted by MrVizio

If this is true, than it's almost laughable. However, I'm not sure how familiar you are with the issue, but many people have confused normal scoreboard flashes and things during hockey games as FBr. So this may be a normal.

Also, some people like the look, the pop and punch, of LEDs. In that case, the Sony is good one.

Wish you could spend more time with the set, but you gotta do what ya' gotta do.

Originally Posted by xCREEP1NGDEATHx


No, it was pretty easy to see the drastic change in brightness. Even my wife went "woah!" I don't know how big the problem is because I did not see it in any other programming, games, movies. But I wasn't taking the chance anymore. Too many returned TV's, lol. Im hoping the Sony is good, had a chance to play around with it at the store and outside of viewing angle I thought the picture was pretty damn close to plasma even at handling motion.