Official Ceton Echo Extender Info Thread - Page 47

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Timing is everything I guess. I just bought a tivo premier at the weekend after giving up trying to get TVGOS guide data to work on my Sony Tv and clear QAM channels provided by my cable provider. I went along to tivo.com to subscribe but the activation service is down this weekend !! Maybe a good omen. I stumbled on this product and subsequent thread. Perhaps I will hold out subscribing to tivo now !!

Did anyone get the news...?

Don't think there is any.

I didn't get anything last night. Maybe they only late on weeknights.

I was, however, checking my e-mail and spam folder frequently last night hoping to get the update on Echo's technical specs! As a side note, Ceton's email from September 11 also indicated we'd get an update on the Ceton Q.

Yes - That is what I was looking for specifically.

Wow, I think I need to come work for you, I get up at 6AM and don't get home untill after 7PM most days.

I would love to work @ Ceton. Wish I had the skills

I think it's fairly obvious why we haven't heard anything so far today. It's 2:56 EDT now, and they won't report to work until 4 PM Pacific time...
Edited by dsurkin - 10/1/12 at 7:45pm

Please refer to my previous message Here

I got the email from Ceton a little bit ago for the people that didnt get it here is what is says.


Ceton Echo Update
We’re still putting some finishing touches on the Echo software and beta units will not be going out this week. Alpha testing is going very well; it’s just taking a bit longer than we planned. We’ve built in extra time to the schedule for things like this and everything is still a go to have the Echo released in time for Holiday 2012.

We’ll provide an update on beta timing as soon as we can.

Ceton Q Update
Since previewing the Q at CES in January we’ve learned more about Microsoft’s plans for Windows Embedded, the operating system on which the Ceton Q is based (at CES we demonstrated the Q running on Windows Embedded Standard 7). While Windows Media Center is available with the consumer version of Windows 8, it is still unclear whether Media Center will be offered in the next version of Windows Embedded. We expected that question would have been resolved by now but it’s hasn’t. So, what to do???

We’ve been discussing a few different options internally for a while and frankly we haven’t decided the best path forward yet. What we have decided is that the Ceton Q as previewed at CES will not launch this year as we planned 10 months ago. It’s possible the Q will launch in 2013, either as initially envisioned or perhaps re-envisioned, but we can’t guarantee that at this point. We know there is a ton of interest in the Q and that this news will be disappointing to a lot of you but we think it’s important to be upfront about where things stand.

Ultimately, we want to make sure that we deliver great products that customers will love for years to come. Given the flux at Microsoft around some of the key components we were relying on, we simply don’t feel we can do that with the Q at this point.

Ceton Companion Update
And last but not least … the Ceton Companion. If you haven’t checked out the apps yet, it’s never too late. They’re a great addition if you use Windows Media Center with any type of TV tuner, not just Ceton tuners.

Since we launched Companion less than a month ago, we’ve rolled out updates to the Companion Services (the utility that runs on your PC) as well as to all versions of the app for the different platforms. We’ve also introduced a version for the Barnes & Noble NOOK as well as an update that optimizes the app if you’re using the new iPhone 5 and a version that supports the new Kindle Fire HD. Phew!

How many apps can you think of that launched on Apple iOS (including iPhone 5 optimized), Android, Kindle Fire and NOOK at basically the same time? Yeah, the Companion team is pretty amazing and has been awful busy as you can probably tell!

So that’s it for now. Please stay tuned for more on the Echo soon.

As always, thanks for all your support and encouragement!

-The Ceton Team

Even if they can't tell us when the beta will start, it would awfully nice if they would tell us what the Echo is capable of...

I kind of wonder if the almost/possible cancellation of the Q is playing a role in the lack of information about the Echo's features. stanger has long suggested that some of the key features we're looking for- features that aren't available with WMC and Xbox360 extenders- might only be available on Echos connected to a Q. If that's the case, that might explain why Ceton has decided not to share any information about the Echo yet.

Wow! to say I'm disappointed is an understatement.

The Q was what i was looking forward to the most. I have no desire to build/install and maintain an HTPC with media center, as such I have no need for the echo extenders or the ceton apps.

without the Q I dont think the Echos will be succesfull.


i hope I'm wrong and I hope ceton does eventually come out with the Q in 2013 but it doesnt look good.

The only path forward for Ceton if Windows Embedded w/ Media Center isn't an option is to build their own software from the ground up. Or perhaps to work with the XBMC folks to find a solution. Hitching their company's future to Microsoft, who obviously isn't that interested in media center, may not be very safe.

I think we can see the echo this year but won't have full expected potential. The delays will only start to bring to light the value equation @ 179 of only a tv box.

I agree 100%. I will be closely following the release of the Tivo Mini in “this fall.” Hopefully it will not require a subscription and it can pair with the Tivo Premiere easily for a similar setup to the Q + Echos. The Premiere only has 4 tuners, but it appears that Tivo will be the only player in this market space now. Bummer.

This is all conjecture at this point. The fact remains that only Ceton knows the capability of the Echo.

For those of of with well functioning media centers, the q doesn't really factor at all and the heart of ceton's technology lays in the echo. I think it still comes down to how this device handles media files because the tv part is a given.

I have to agree...its easy to make too much of the Q's delay. On the other hand, I would really like the echo even it the Q doesn't pan out. I have no problem maintaining a WMS server and using devices that require no monthly fees to support. I really would like to get this beta puppy under way to see how viable this configuration would be for my situation. On the other hand, Microsoft's position is really begining to wear on me. So what else if new?

The big advantage of working with Windows Media Center, as I see it, is that they already have CableCard certification. As far as I know, XBMC does not, and for Ceton to start from scratch would entail a very long lead time.

Someone had a suggestion that Ceton should acquire Windows Media Center from Microsoft. Nice idea, but I don't think Microsoft would go for it.

I'm almost positive this is the case. That and if there are features that are broken in the alpha they don't want advertise them in advance just to have to take them away. They would rather just introduce them as "new" features in the 1.5 firmware update, which makes sense.

So bottom line is hold fast. I think we have another 2-3 weeks for echo beta. Until then I'll be exploring how I can pro long the life of my sage tv setup. (it's a shame folks got caught up in MS media center it's such overall an inferior product to what sage tv was. Only plus it had was implementing of drm to access copy once material via cablecard. Of which I much preferred capturing via analog hole so I could do what I want)

Hey Andy, how come you got this email and I didn't? Maybe The Cetonites got tired of my bugging them on The Green Button forum.

OK Ceton, here is how you fix this and maintain your awesomeness streak:



Deliver the echo before the holidays that does everything a normal extender does plus netflix, and plus playing high bitrate MKVs with good codec support.

Redesign the Q so that it still runs win7 embeded and media center but also have a version of xbmc that can be seamlessly accessed at the same time, then slowly develop support for live TV via your tuner products in xbmc. Basically do what every windows media center nerd already does by installing xbmc along side it to fill in the gaps, just polish it up and make a good seamless experience while continuing to develop the xbmc side so you have a backup plan when Microsoft drops the other shoe. Please just be our SageTV.

That won't work. Win7 embedded has all the same Media Center bugs that it always had and MS won't fix. You can't ship that as a product - consumers would be pissed.

This is more/less what I was thinking around the time the Q was announced. Obviously Ceton knows/knew they can't stay with WMC long term and probably factored their own development of DVR software as a longer-term goal. IMO, I saw the Q w/Windows Embedded as a stepping stone for them to develop their own DVR solution in parallel - but now that embedded w/WMC may not be a possibility, it's pushed this projected timeline way earlier than planned (again, my own speculation).

Perhaps they refactor their plan, release the InfiniTV6 stand-alone for a burst of revenue while they work on their own DVR platform to deploy with the Q late 2013-2014? Tough call...

Yeah, I haven't been bugging them at all but I didn't get this email either. I did get the last one, though.

Hence why they'd have to work to get that certification, whether for a standalone product they build themselves, or alongside XBMC (which would be less expensive, and could be much faster to market). With XBMC, they would need to develop an architecture that supports extenders as well, which opens up a potentially huge market opportunity. WMC is a good base, though as many have pointed out, has bugs and limitations that would need to be addressed. I also feel it's very unlikely that MS would agree to sell that off.

There is no CableLabs certification required for the DRIR (the software that works with the tuner - WMC, for instance). It only needs to use an approved DRM mechansm (I believe the only approved ones are WM-DRM, Real Helix, and DTCP) and pass whatever approval is required to implement that DRM by the DRM owner.

Eric:

Thanks for joining in. If I understand you correctly, it means that Ceton could, hypothetically, license an already existing CableLabs certified mechanism. So even if Microsoft doesn't license WM-DRM, Real Helix or DTCP could license their system to Ceton, Ceton could build upon or license the open-source work of XBMC, MythTv, etc. and create the Windows media system we have been waiting for.

Hey, you guys build it, I'll probably be first in line to buy it.

Except that that would mean Ceton would have to redo/recertify the InfiniTV to output Real Helix or DTCP protected streams vs WM-DRM since it's the tuner that decrypts and wraps the stream, not the application. And the same would be true of the SD Prime and Hauppauge too, or they wouldn't work with Ceton's hypthetical Helix or DTCP based DVR software.