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Wii U - Page 20  

post #571 of 1142
Got in my preorder at Nintendo World. I asked (knowing the answer) if I could preorder a second for my brother, and the guy told me that during the original Wii launch he had people come in, pick up their preorder, then immediately start selling it on the street as soon as they got out the door. People: Always ruining things for other people.
post #572 of 1142
I didn't expect a pre-order rush, so I procrastinated until Saturday morning, not realizing that gamestop would sell out of pre-orders on Friday afternoon. So I went to Best Buy's website and found they had links for pre-orders on the home page of their video-game section...but all the links were broken. A rep at my local store investigated, found that they'd gotten an e-mail that morning that the links were broken and he manually entered in a pre-order for me for the black model. Apparently they rolled out the links early or wrong and I was the first of many such calls.

Now the links work, of course, but are 'sold out online'.
post #573 of 1142
Online Wal-Mart preorders still seem to be going strong for shipping on 11/18. They do make you buy a game and pro controller with it (yesterday you could choose a Wiimote Plus instead, but those seem to be gone now), but that's not really the worst thing in the world.
post #574 of 1142
For anyone still thinking Nintendo was going to redeem themselves and truly support off screen play... dash those dreams, mates:

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/interview/31784
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nintendo World Report 
NWR: For Wii Mode, will you be able to use the Wii U GamePad, and the Controller Pro to play Wii Games?

Marc Franklin: Clearly, in Wii Mode, when you bring either WiiWare and Virtual Console games, or you're playing a Wii game, you're able to use Wii peripherals.

Additional Nintendo Rep: I do know that you can't take it off the TV and put it on the GamePad.


and VC games, well, they require a bit more work than "login>click 'transfer'>game".
Quote:
NWR: Along the lines of downloadable games, the Virtual Console and WiiWare games will transfer over, as has been said. Will that be there day 1, and what kind of process do you think that will entail?

Marc Franklin: So yes, you can transfer your Miis, your WiiWare, your Virtual Console content from Wii to Wii U; basically you have to have both systems present, and an internet connection and an SD card for Wii U, and then you can transfer the content over. Once it's transferred over, there's a mode on Wii U called "Wii Mode" and then you can play your content through Wii Mode. In terms of timing, we haven't announced specifics on that yet, so more to come.


I'm reading this as: Wii Mode is NOT a part of the WiiU OS. It's a separate entity unto itself, and there's no Gamepad support at all for anything Wii.


At least for now.
post #575 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoozen View Post

For anyone still thinking Nintendo was going to redeem themselves and truly support off screen play... dash those dreams, mates:
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/interview/31784
and VC games, well, they require a bit more work than "login>click 'transfer'>game".
I'm reading this as: Wii Mode is NOT a part of the WiiU OS. It's a separate entity unto itself, and there's no Gamepad support at all for anything Wii.
At least for now.
Nothing surprising in any of that. Sounds like Wii Mode is a totally different OS, something like running Windows mode on a Mac. And honestly, I'm happy to see that our VC and WiiWare purchases will make the transition. Though it is disappointing not being able to play VC games on the GamePad. Seems like a match made in heaven.

I wonder, though, how Nintendo will sell VC content going forward? Will that also only be available in Wii Mode? Or will newly purchased content be playable in both modes?
post #576 of 1142
I hope the WiiU Pro Controller can be utilized as a Wii Classic Controller substitute on the WiiU (No desire to utilize the bulky gamepad as one). Not holding my breath of course, but it looks comfortable and is 100% wireless so I'd like to see them allow that.
Edited by Leo_Ames - 9/20/12 at 6:01pm
post #577 of 1142
Something interesting I realized about the Wii U's power while talking about the rumored hardware on another site.

Take Black Ops 2 for example, it is running at least 1280:720 (vs 4:3 720p stretched on the 360 and who knows what on the PS3) and at the same time rendering a 800:480 image of on the gamepad all at 60fps. That is a very large step forward in power, and if the "Full HD" was spoken accurately, then it is an even larger step forward in power.
post #578 of 1142
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-09-21-a-chat-about-the-power-of-the-wii-u-with-the-developer-of-a-wii-u-launch-title
Quote:
We know the Wii U's IBM-made CPU, made up of three Power PC cores, is one of its weaknesses, at least compared to the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360. But how will this impact the performance of Wii U games?

At the Tokyo Game Show earlier today Eurogamer spoke with the developer of one of the biggest Wii U launch games, Warriors Orochi 3 Hyper, to find out.

The playable version of the game on the Tokyo Game Show floor is not up to the performance levels of past Dynasty Warriors games in terms of frame rate and number of enemies on screen, and is shown up considerably by Dynasty Warriors 7 Empires, the PS3 exclusive also playable on publisher Tecmo Koei's stand.

Akihiro Suzuki, producer of the Dynasty Warriors franchise, admitted this was the case when quizzed by Eurogamer, and pointed to the Wii U's CPU by way of explanation.

"One of the weaknesses of the Wii U compared to PS3 and Xbox 360 is the CPU power is a little bit less," he said. "So for games in the Warriors series, including Dynasty Warriors and Warriors Orochi, when you have a lot of enemies coming at you at once, the performance tends to be affected because of the CPU.

"Dealing with that is a challenge."

The exact specifications of the CPU, including clock speed, remain undisclosed for now, but developers, including those Eurogamer spoke to for an investigation into the power of the Wii U, have confirmed it's slower than the CPU inside both the PS3 and Xbox 360.

But one of its strengths is said to be its custom AMD 7 series GPU, and the 1GB of RAM available to games: double that of the PS3 and Xbox 360.

This, Suzuki said, means the Orochi development team had the opportunity to create visuals better than those possible on PS3 and Xbox 360.

"Developing on new hardware in itself was a challenge, and also making that launch date was a challenge," he said. "But from a visual standpoint, based on the performance of the Wii U, we knew the game had the capability of having much better graphics than games on PS3 and Xbox 360. Make no mistake, from a visual standpoint, it is able to produce better graphics. So our challenge was to make a higher quality graphics. We were able to meet that."

Suzuki vowed that the performance of the game will be improved before release. He better get his skates on: Warriors Orochi 3 launches alongside the Wii U on 30th November.

"While the visuals are great, as is being able to improve them, we had to deal with the lower CPU power and how we can get around that issue," he said.

"Actually, we're still working on that. If you see the demo on the show floor and you try it, you'll probably feel it's not up to the PS3 level. But we're working on it!"

As part of Eurogamer's investigation into the power of the Wii U, Digital Foundry boss Richard Leadbetter expressed concern about the Nintendo console. "It'll be interesting to see how future Face-Offs work out," he pondered. "I expect that GPU focused games will benefit from smoother frame-rates and lower levels of screen-tear, but cross-platform titles highly dependent on CPU power could end up noticeably worse off."

According to Suzuki, the main issue is that developers are still wrapping their head around the CPU, and so are yet to work out how best to use it.

"For the PS3 it has multiple CPUs and an SPU, so you can calculate the various motions of the characters on the CPU so overall it runs smoothly," Suzuki explained. "The Xbox 360 CPUs are formulated so they can spread out the processing power so things run efficiently.

"With the Wii U being new hardware, we're still getting used to developing for it, so there are still a lot of things we don't know yet to bring out the most of the processing power. There's a lot that still needs to be explored in that area."

Edited by Monger - 9/20/12 at 11:32pm
post #579 of 1142
That just seems kind of crazy to me. I'd never doubt eurogamer on this, they're the best in the biz when it comes to console tech....but it has less overall CPU power than the 360 and PS3? What are they thinking?
post #580 of 1142
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WXk1B6FPeQI&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DWXk1B6FPeQI

The Super Mario World vibe is not subtle at all. They should just straight up call this NSMW.

My heart says hell yes....but deep down I know they can do better than this. It'd still be an instabuy even for my dusty old Wii, which could probably pull it off almost as well.
post #581 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoozen View Post

For anyone still thinking Nintendo was going to redeem themselves and truly support off screen play... dash those dreams, mates:
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/interview/31784
and VC games, well, they require a bit more work than "login>click 'transfer'>game".
I'm reading this as: Wii Mode is NOT a part of the WiiU OS. It's a separate entity unto itself, and there's no Gamepad support at all for anything Wii.
At least for now.

I kind of figured as much. It looks like it's completely possible to buy, for example, NES Zelda on Wii U although you had it on Wii and transferred it over. Good thing I never bought anything from Wii Shop.

I suppose this is the scary future of digital downloads everyone's always complaining about.
post #582 of 1142
New pic showing size of the console and controller together:


Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

That just seems kind of crazy to me. I'd never doubt eurogamer on this, they're the best in the biz when it comes to console tech....but it has less overall CPU power than the 360 and PS3? What are they thinking?

In house developed games will look fine, Ninty always gets great things out of consoles with their own engines, but for PS4/720 multi platform games... I'm not feeling so sure, and news like this gets me thinking that they missed a great opportunity really re-attract the core gamer set, likely because they were so focused on the gamepad. Time will tell.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

deep down I know they can do better than this. It'd still be an instabuy even for my dusty old Wii, which could probably pull it off almost as well.

I mean, yeah, I've not actually played this yet, and YT videos aren't the best for showing actual quality, but save 1080p (and maybe the framerate?) output, this looks like it could easily have been a Wii game. It's just not that different... fun, sure. but not jaw dropping.



I'm such a downer these days.
post #583 of 1142
my biggest hope is that I enjoy playing NSMBU with the Wii U controller more than any graphical changes. I wanted to like NSMB but could not get past the Wii controller. There were a few other Wii games I might have liked had it not been for my dislike for the controller.
post #584 of 1142
Well, we can probably all agree that NSMBU would have been a must buy as a 360/PS3 title. tongue.gif
post #585 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

That just seems kind of crazy to me. I'd never doubt eurogamer on this, they're the best in the biz when it comes to console tech....but it has less overall CPU power than the 360 and PS3? What are they thinking?

Look who the developer is for one thing. Second, look at the Dark Souls PC port, some devs suck at porting to unknown hardware designs. Third, the Wii U's CPU is clocked slower and uses a vastly different architecture from the PS3 (which is probably ths games lead platform)

Obviously not every dev is going to be masters of the new hardware from day one, just look at how long the PS3 took for devs to start to get a hang of how it works.
post #586 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

That just seems kind of crazy to me. I'd never doubt eurogamer on this, they're the best in the biz when it comes to console tech....but it has less overall CPU power than the 360 and PS3? What are they thinking?

Look who the developer is for one thing. Second, look at the Dark Souls PC port, some devs suck at porting to unknown hardware designs. Third, the Wii U's CPU is clocked slower and uses a vastly different architecture from the PS3 (which is probably ths games lead platform)

Obviously not every dev is going to be masters of the new hardware from day one, just look at how long the PS3 took for devs to start to get a hang of how it works.

I'm sure they'll get better with it. But he's directly saying the CPU is less powerful, not that it's a radical design that needs adjusting to.

For the longest time we've been getting mixed signals about the power of the Wii U, it may very well be that the CPU is less powerful, and the GPU is more. And the GPU should get priority but....a CPU less powerful than last gen? That's pushing it. Not even the Wii dared that.

Ultimately I guess it doesn't matter because Nintendo knows how to do a lot with a little, some Wii games still looked great. First party games will be the only reason to own a WiiU...but can that alone really support the platform?
post #587 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

I'm sure they'll get better with it. But he's directly saying the CPU is less powerful, not that it's a radical design that needs adjusting to.
For the longest time we've been getting mixed signals about the power of the Wii U, it may very well be that the CPU is less powerful, and the GPU is more. And the GPU should get priority but....a CPU less powerful than last gen? That's pushing it. Not even the Wii dared that.
Ultimately I guess it doesn't matter because Nintendo knows how to do a lot with a little, some Wii games still looked great. First party games will be the only reason to own a WiiU...but can that alone really support the platform?
Just means that multiplatform games that are CPU intensive will look a little less impressive on Wii U. That's it. I don't think most Wii U owners will care. Either they already have a PS3 or 360, or they're just happy to be able to play the latest CoD regardless of slight performance differences. This isn't a "next gen" console, no matter how badly some people want to believe it is.
post #588 of 1142
It's a really odd console cycle. The Wii U looks like it will be setting itself on the sidelines, AGAIN. I'm not sure what 3rd party developers will do in a years time, when MS and Sony starting release plans for new consoles with heavier hardware.

Ninty always some of the best and most skilled devs in the business, who know how to bleed every bit out of their CPUs and GPUs. What I'm afraid of is that they've set themselves up to fail with 3rd party devs AGAIN. Anyone who owned an original Xbox or the Dreamcast knows what it's like when the game is developed on a weaker platform and then ported over and not really converted in any meaningful way (thus creating an inferior port that fails to be successful, creating a downward spiral for third party producers).

A powerful GPU is great...but the gamecube was the most graphically powerful system of it's generation and we see how that ended up. Ninty made money, but it was always in third place.
post #589 of 1142
Copy and Past from a gamefaqs topic that raises a very good point about the Wii U cpu comments.

LHS_2012 posted...
Now, we all know there have been some conflicting dev impressions on developing for the Wii U. Some devs say getting a game running smoothly on the Wii U was a piece of cake, while others said it was far from hassle free. What's going on?

Well, let's take a look at what the developers are doing. First, let's cherry pick Darksiders developer Vigil Games and Namco's Harada, as they provided probably the earliest and most well known contrasting statements. What do they have in common? Well, they're porting games for launch, both games have already been released though. What's the difference? Well there's the obvious: Vigil praised the ease of porting Darksiders II while Harada said the slower CPU cause problems in the porting process of Tekken. But there's also a difference a lot of people have overlooked: Vigil is a western dev while Namco is Japanese. Now now this isn't going to become a rant about which is better, far simpler actually.

Ask yourself this: between the HD consoles, which is the console of choice in the west, and which is the console of choice in Japan?

The reason we are getting conflicting impressions may be this: Vigil likely started Darksiders II on the 360 and ported to the other consoles it was to be released on, as most western developers do. The similarities between the 360 and Wii U hardware have already been stated awhile ago, so it makes sense a 360 port runs fairly easily on a Wii U, right?

Now let's look at Namco. The PS3 is by far the home console of choice in Japan over the 360. Japanese developers start projects with the PS3 in mind, and then (maybe) go to the 360. What does this mean for the Wii U? Well, the PS3 and Wii U are basically opposites when it comes to hardware: The PS3 uses it's powerful CPU to overcome it's fairly weak GPU, while all rumors point to the Wii U having a beast of a GPU, but a slow CPU. When porting a PS3 game to the Wii U with little optimization, since the Wii U's CPU just isn't designed to handle all the work, you run into trouble.

If you look at the comments on Wii U's hardware, you'd probably notice western devs are largely positive, while the two negative comments come from Namco and Tecmo: both Japanese. I'm just guessing here, but maybe the problem is just part of the porting process. As of yet we don't really know how the Nextbox and PS4 will be designed, so we can't really say how the Wii U's CPU "issue" will affect future games.

Here is the topic for those who want to read through it.

http://gamefaqs.com/boards/631516-wii-u/64104814
post #590 of 1142
I'm waiting until we hear from the Belgians before I draw any conclusions
post #591 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Copy and Past from a gamefaqs topic that raises a very good point about the Wii U cpu comments.
LHS_2012 posted...
Now, we all know there have been some conflicting dev impressions on developing for the Wii U. Some devs say getting a game running smoothly on the Wii U was a piece of cake, while others said it was far from hassle free. What's going on?
Well, let's take a look at what the developers are doing. First, let's cherry pick Darksiders developer Vigil Games and Namco's Harada, as they provided probably the earliest and most well known contrasting statements. What do they have in common? Well, they're porting games for launch, both games have already been released though. What's the difference? Well there's the obvious: Vigil praised the ease of porting Darksiders II while Harada said the slower CPU cause problems in the porting process of Tekken. But there's also a difference a lot of people have overlooked: Vigil is a western dev while Namco is Japanese. Now now this isn't going to become a rant about which is better, far simpler actually.
Ask yourself this: between the HD consoles, which is the console of choice in the west, and which is the console of choice in Japan?
The reason we are getting conflicting impressions may be this: Vigil likely started Darksiders II on the 360 and ported to the other consoles it was to be released on, as most western developers do. The similarities between the 360 and Wii U hardware have already been stated awhile ago, so it makes sense a 360 port runs fairly easily on a Wii U, right?
Now let's look at Namco. The PS3 is by far the home console of choice in Japan over the 360. Japanese developers start projects with the PS3 in mind, and then (maybe) go to the 360. What does this mean for the Wii U? Well, the PS3 and Wii U are basically opposites when it comes to hardware: The PS3 uses it's powerful CPU to overcome it's fairly weak GPU, while all rumors point to the Wii U having a beast of a GPU, but a slow CPU. When porting a PS3 game to the Wii U with little optimization, since the Wii U's CPU just isn't designed to handle all the work, you run into trouble.
If you look at the comments on Wii U's hardware, you'd probably notice western devs are largely positive, while the two negative comments come from Namco and Tecmo: both Japanese. I'm just guessing here, but maybe the problem is just part of the porting process. As of yet we don't really know how the Nextbox and PS4 will be designed, so we can't really say how the Wii U's CPU "issue" will affect future games.
Here is the topic for those who want to read through it.
http://gamefaqs.com/boards/631516-wii-u/64104814

Its plausible, but Suzuki specifically said it was less powerful than both the PS3 and 360.

Im sure in either case it cant be a huge difference. But its disappointing nonetheless, that 7 years from the 360's launch, this is even in question. Even if its not bona-fide next gen, there should be nothing about it that trails the ancient current gen.
post #592 of 1142
I got these a few days ago!

img2496j.jpg
post #593 of 1142
How, where and how much.
post #594 of 1142
Pen - I'm fairly certain that those are just GameStop preorder display boxes. smile.gif
post #595 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by darklordjames View Post

Pen - I'm fairly certain that those are just GameStop preorder display boxes. smile.gif

I know, I love gamestore promo materials. Fake Wii U boxes can also be used to troll random shoppers at Walmart. biggrin.gif
post #596 of 1142
^
They are the Gamestop promotion boxes. See if you can still get them at your local store if its still on display. They don't normally allow customers to have them supposedly but some are lenient since they know customers like stuff like this. When the store gets rid of them, they destroy/recycle them so if you like something, see if you can get them so they find a new home!

I got mine at my local store and all I did was ask the manager and was given a yes. The catch was that I had to take all 3 instead of a single one because they were all attached together; I'll give the other two to friends or something.
post #597 of 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Copy and Past from a gamefaqs topic that raises a very good point about the Wii U cpu comments.
LHS_2012 posted...
Now, we all know there have been some conflicting dev impressions on developing for the Wii U. Some devs say getting a game running smoothly on the Wii U was a piece of cake, while others said it was far from hassle free. What's going on?
Well, let's take a look at what the developers are doing. First, let's cherry pick Darksiders developer Vigil Games and Namco's Harada, as they provided probably the earliest and most well known contrasting statements. What do they have in common? Well, they're porting games for launch, both games have already been released though. What's the difference? Well there's the obvious: Vigil praised the ease of porting Darksiders II while Harada said the slower CPU cause problems in the porting process of Tekken. But there's also a difference a lot of people have overlooked: Vigil is a western dev while Namco is Japanese. Now now this isn't going to become a rant about which is better, far simpler actually.
Ask yourself this: between the HD consoles, which is the console of choice in the west, and which is the console of choice in Japan?
The reason we are getting conflicting impressions may be this: Vigil likely started Darksiders II on the 360 and ported to the other consoles it was to be released on, as most western developers do. The similarities between the 360 and Wii U hardware have already been stated awhile ago, so it makes sense a 360 port runs fairly easily on a Wii U, right?
Now let's look at Namco. The PS3 is by far the home console of choice in Japan over the 360. Japanese developers start projects with the PS3 in mind, and then (maybe) go to the 360. What does this mean for the Wii U? Well, the PS3 and Wii U are basically opposites when it comes to hardware: The PS3 uses it's powerful CPU to overcome it's fairly weak GPU, while all rumors point to the Wii U having a beast of a GPU, but a slow CPU. When porting a PS3 game to the Wii U with little optimization, since the Wii U's CPU just isn't designed to handle all the work, you run into trouble.
If you look at the comments on Wii U's hardware, you'd probably notice western devs are largely positive, while the two negative comments come from Namco and Tecmo: both Japanese. I'm just guessing here, but maybe the problem is just part of the porting process. As of yet we don't really know how the Nextbox and PS4 will be designed, so we can't really say how the Wii U's CPU "issue" will affect future games.
Here is the topic for those who want to read through it.
http://gamefaqs.com/boards/631516-wii-u/64104814
I wouldn't trust Vigil when it comes to performance issues. Neither Darksiders nor Darksiders 2 performs very well on consoles or PCs. Great games they may be, but not for tech or performance reasons.
post #598 of 1142
I'd think it's very obvious what's going on with the "moar powerful" and "it's weaksauce!!1" reports. Does the game in question more heavily bump in to GPU restrictions or CPU restrictions on current consoles, specifically the 360?

We can pretty safely say that the Wii U CPU is a newer-gen PowerPC like the 360, at roughly 2.0-2.5ghz with probably 3 cores and maybe two threads each. It's very likely a slightly weaker version of the 360's CPU (lower clock, newer generation, better performance per clock). That's pretty okay as even by today's standards the 6-thread 3.2ghz 360 CPU is something of a beast, vastly overpowering the fairly modest GPU that it is paired up with. I make an educated guess at a lower clock-rate, as the small size of the Wii U will physically restrict the size of heatsink that can be put in there and therefore how high of a clock can be thermally dissipated. The end result is games heavily relying on CPU and raw clock-speed things like AI and physics will be harder to port from the 360 architecture. War games with lots of individual moving units spring to mind.

We can also very safely say that the GPU and RAM bandwidth vastly outstrips what the 360 has on board. In terms of RAM, high-clock DDR3 is bog standard these days, and it would simply cost Nintendo more cash to try and use something slower. RAM many times faster than the 360's is free. The GPU is very much in the same state, it would cost more to produce something close to what the 360 has on board. A GPU 2-4x faster than the 360's ATI solution is free. The end result is games that rely heavily on shader effects and bandwidth are easy to port from the 360. Super-pretty adventure games with four baddies on screen at once sounds about right.

If GTA4 or Skyrim was being ported to the Wii U, we'd hear that it is weak. Both games really want 4.5-5.0ghz and three cores to run optimally. If Rage or Borderlands 2 was being ported we would likely hear that the system was significantly more powerful than a PS3/360, as they are both more GPU bound than anything.

As for any PS3 to Wii U comparisons? The developer complaint there is obvious. "I already optimized for the retarded design of a single core with a pile of specialized partial-cores. That doesn't port very easily to a pile of symmetrical cores." It isn't that the PS3 "uses it's powerful CPU to overcome" anything. It's simply retarded propietary CPU design versus elegant symmetrical design that the entire rest of the world uses.
post #599 of 1142
darklordjames, I think you nailed it for the most part.

I think the CPU will be pretty on par with the 360's, as most US devs are having no issues with it. Since devs have said slightly slower, it may be closer to 3.0ghz than 2.0ghz. I think more devs would voice up if it was that slow.

Thanks to ibm retracting the power 7 statement, we now know nothing about the CPU other than it is clocked lower than 3.2ghz and it has three cores. (and even that is an educated guess)

At least we know the basics of the gpu. A custom e6760 that has been fairly heavily modified is the most likely suspect based on several press releases. (and that too is an educated guess)

I can't wait for someone to tear a system apart and finally settle this once and for all.
post #600 of 1142
"Since devs have said slightly slower, it may be closer to 3.0ghz than 2.0ghz."

You're forgetting two generations of PowerPC evolution. 2.0ghz of PPC7 is probably 2.6-2.8ghz worth of the 360's PPC5. 3.0ghz is pushing it in thermal terms in that tiny case, unless there are only two cores. There would just be too much heat on a 32nm process, especially when paired with a much beefer GPU than the 360 has. Again, educated guess, but clock speeds are more likely to be in the 2.0-2.5 range. With 3.0ghz of PPC7 we would be hearing that the CPU is noticeably quicker than a 360, not just on par, as it would be like having a 3.8-4.0ghz 360 CPU to work with.
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