Issues with latest (1/12) Vizio firmware update - Page 3

Repair service will be here Tuesday morning. Will have to see what happens then.

Have noticed Vizio is deleting any comments on their Facebook page about problems with their stuff, while leaving up positive comments even if they're from people who can't spell. At this point they would have to give me an upgraded model for my trouble before I'd consider buying anything else from them.

Sports are obviously live and from a video source (30 frames per second) so those won't cause problems. The problem here is with material from film which is 24 frames per second. From what I've looked at it seems like HD-DVDs and analog sources (including tape and laserdisc) do it more often than Blu-Rays, I don't know if that has something to do with how my Blu-Ray player works or what. Hopefully it'll be fixed this week, then I can send my letter to Vizio asking them to explain how they let this happen.

Wow- checked the posts for their 3D set and many are reporting the same problem there. Given how too often the 'average' person doesn't know what proper video looks like, I'm wondering if this is affecting ALL of Vizio's internet-connected TVs and not everyone is noticing it? I don't think this problem shows if you keep the Smooth Motion 'feature' turned on, but of course that makes filmed material look like video and shouldn't be used except for an occasional laugh. I'd like to know if anyone else is using PAL sources and seeing the smooth motion forced on that.

Make sure to call Vizio and COMPLAIN! They will probably say that it's the first time they've ever heard about this problem, but the more complaints they get the less they'll be able to keep denying it.

Repair people are coming tomorrow- it seems like they want to try replacing the main board again so I'm not expecting much, but this time I won't let them leave without checking it out afterwards (and I'll get another $5.99 Vudu credit anyhow.) Sure wish someone would figure out how to make customized firmware for this thing.

Well, no luck- the board was replaced and the problem is still there. The person they sent this time claimed he couldn't see the problem, but he would ask either Vizio or someone else at the repair company what to do next. I will give them until next Wednesday to get back to me, if they don't then I'm really going to get mad.

By the way, as before the YouTube and Skype apps were still present on startup. Since they were part of the firmware update and were not up before then, I'm suspecting there is another area in the TV where firmware information is stored. "Version" is currently showing as VIZIO_C6.2.0_RC2. Last time the board was changed, on the 2nd day it installed another firmware update when turned on so it might not have had the latest firmware then but it still had the stuttering problem and the YouTube and Skype apps were pre-installed.

Pandora IS exiting properly this time, not going back after hitting Exit, instead staying on the TV station I have tuned in like it's supposed to.

And I got another $5.99 Vudu credit- I bet I'm going to be contacted by their fraud check pretty soon thinking I'm trying to cheat them, since this is the **FOURTH** board my TV has had and have gotten a credit each time!

Just linked this thread on Vizio's Facebook page again. Probably someone from the company has read this by now but has probably been ordered not to comment. I'll just say if they're reading this that it would be REALLY good PR for you right now if you would post something here acknowledging the problem and what you're doing about it. The more you remain silent, the worse it makes your company look and the more likely that we will replace your TVs with ANOTHER brand!

Turned the TV back on tonight and it updated the firmware- Version is now VIZIO_C7.0.1.0-S. Frame rate problem is still there, so is smooth motion being forced on PAL DVDs. Pandora however is still exiting properly.

No comments on Vizio's Facebook page yet, but they haven't removed the post either. Again, I'll be REALLY nice and give them til next Wednesday before doing anything else.

How's this for bad timing- I just found a multi-standard VCR at Goodwill; I have one PAL VHS tape I've kept around just in case I ever found a VCR that could play it, and the TV is forcing the smooth motion on just as it has been doing with PAL DVDs.

I'm thinking there's someplace else in the TV (other than the main board) where some info is stored- both times the main board was replaced, the firmware number was showing the previous version but it still had the frame rate problems and YouTube and Skype automatically showed up as installed 'widgets'- neither of these were available before the update, but they showed up anyways. I don't know everything about how this TV works, but this is what I've seen.

Still waiting to see if I'll hear from anyone by Wednesday. Has anyone else with this problem contacted Vizio recently?

Unfortunately it seems EVERY brand these days has some problems. I've had some incredibly bad experiences with Sony over the years which has made them the #1 brand to avoid, though to be fair my Blu-Ray player is a Sony since it was a Christmas present and it has been working reasonably well. I would not buy another LG product after their awful support for the BH200 disc player- it always stretched 4x3 material on standard and HD-DVDs, and they've stopped providing firmware updates altogether for it. Could have been a great machine otherwise. (Vizio's BD100 player is a turkey for different reasons, one being that they've also stopped updating it without fixing an audio problem.)

OK people, I'm REALLY going to need some more backup from everyone else who is experiencing this problem. Things are starting to come to a head over here as I've been trying to get this fixed once and for all.

Video Tech Service in Sacramento replaced my board last week, when the problem wasn't fixed the person said he would research what to do next. Did not hear a word from them afterwards so called today and was told to call TWG, the company that is handling my warranty.

I called TWG, and after waiting almost 30 minutes on hold was told the message from Video Tech Service was that "the problem only happens on one DVD connected to one input, so therefore not a problem." That was completely false of course, I mentioned this thread so the person asked that I forward a link to them. I assume by now they have read this thread. I had to leave for a few hours, but got this email from them when I returned:

We are sorry to hear of the issues you are having with your Vizio television as a result of your firmware update. Unfortunately, the firmware update introduced by the manufacturer and any failure resulting thereof, unless explicitly recommended and authorized by TWG Innovative Solutions, the administrator of the extended warranty policy on your Vizio product, is not eligible for coverage under the terms and conditions of your contract as administered by TWG Innovative Solutions. Please refer to Section 3.G. of your policy, "WHAT IS NOT COVERED".
G. DAMAGE FROM ACCIDENT AND MISHANDLING, ABUSE, MISUSE, INTRODUCTION OF FOREIGN OBJECTS INTO THE COVERED
PRODUCT,UNAUTHORIZED MODIFICATIONS OR ALTERATIONS TO A COVERED PRODUCT, ANY COVERED PRODUCT WITH
REMOVED OR ALTERED SERIAL NUMBERS, FAILURE TO FOLLOW THE MANUFACTURER’S INSTRUCTIONS, AND EXTERNAL CAUSES
INCLUDING THIRD PARTY ACTIONS, FIRE, THEFT, INSECTS, ANIMALS, EXPOSURE TO WEATHER CONDITIONS, EXTREME
TEMPERATURE, WINDSTORM, SAND, DIRT, HAIL, EARTHQUAKE, FLOOD, WATER, ACTS OF GOD OR CONSEQUENTIAL LOSS OF ANY
NATURE;
There is the possibility that Vizio may pro-actively send a patch or fix to the latest firmware update in the near future, but we as the administrators of your extended warranty policy have no control over such actions by the manufacturer.
Sincerely,
NAME REMOVED·The Warranty Group
Claims Adjuster III, Service Administration
175 W. Jackson Chicago, IL, 60604


Still with me here? So after that, I called Vizio- I thought I had called their main office in Irvine, but had once again gotten their customer service in South Dakota. I told the first person I got there that I would give them ONE more chance- She asked for the whole story again then put me on hold to talk to a technician. After holding she came back saying she was told there was "absolutely no possibility of a firmware update causing a video problem. Firmware updates affect only the internet apps."

She then asked me all the usual questions like if I had tried clearing the memory, and what my picture settings were. She asked if I were using cable or an antenna, I replied that I had an antenna but didn't watch much TV anyways, but had noticed the motion problem occasionally on broadcasts. This is where it starts getting really good- she then asked me what else I had hooked up, and I mentioned I had both a Blu-Ray and HD-DVD player, plus a laserdisc player, one D-VHS machine, 2 regular VHS machines and a Beta. I said they were all hooked to my receiver and that sent them out to the TV through HDMI, but I had tried hooking items directly to the TV bypassing the receiver and the problem was still there. She then said "It seems with that much equipment, there must be something ENVIRONMENTAL that is causing the problem." It was at that point I politely asked for a supervisor. You can guess what I was really thinking by then.

After being on hold again, I was passed to someone saying they were an "Executive Manager" and would take care of me. He of course wanted the entire story of how this happened again, and he also denied that a firmware update could be causing this and also said that HE HAD NOT HEARD OF THIS PROBLEM BEFORE. I told him at this point I didn't care what was causing it, only that the TV was NOT doing this beforehand, and I wanted it fixed. I also informed him that other people who contacted Vizio were ALSO told that "they had never heard of this problem before", so I was getting very suspicious. His reply was "Well, if we sell 250,000 TVs, and six people have a problem, that doesn't mean there's a problem."

He said the next step would be to get together with some 'engineers' and check out some TVs over the next couple days, and get back to me possibly by Friday. I don't know if they will either try again to repair my TV, replace it, or try to convince me this isn't really a problem and there's nothing else they can do, but this is where I need EVERYONE reading this who has had this problem to CALL Vizio and re-iterate that you are ALSO having this problem! Please post whatever you have done and what responses you have gotten here.

If Vizio ends up refusing to fix this once and for all either by repairing or replacing the TV, I am going to look into what legal action I can take. If I do that, I will need as much back-up as I can get there as well.

I've done the "clean storage" several times and that does nothing. Were the YouTube and Skype apps still showing on the widget gallery, even if not connected to the internet?

Keep watching material shot on film and see if your TV does it again. On some stuff it's random, but my test disc has been "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" on HD-DVD. There are MANY parts in that, including a few seconds into chapter 2, where it does this. (For a number of strange reasons I also have this movie both on regular DVD and Blu-Ray, and it does NOT do it on those, at least not at the same places.)

Interesting- they're included on mine when the memory is cleared (I deleted Skype since I don't have the camera for it, but when re-set it comes back as a default.) I see you have a different model though.

STILL can't believe some of the things I heard from Vizio's service people today...

The frame rate on internet video is never perfect, however I still see the frame rate go a bit jittery during movies on Vudu in HD quality (my internet service isn't fast enough to use HDX.) "Scream 4" was the first movie I noticed that on. Again, I can re-play these scenes when this happens and it will appear normal the 2nd time. I have not noticed the jittery frame rate on Netflix, but the frame rate on their movies is generally poor anyways. I HAVE however noticed a few things on Netflix and Vudu which force the smooth motion on, same as they do on my PAL video sources- I checked a couple British TV series including "He Knew He Was Right" and "Kingdom", which were shot on film but the TV forced the frame interpolation on making them look more like video. A number of Filmation cartoons like Fat Albert, Archie's Funhouse and He-Man had the same effect, as did their "Ghost Busters" cartoon which is on Vudu. Bringing up the TV's System Info onscreen, it shows the Vertical Frequency during these as 25. Netflix videos that did not trigger the smooth motion showed as 29.97. Checking a PAL DVD, the Vertical Frequency on that showed as 50 while NTSC showed as 59.94 and stayed the same when playing a Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. (I did not bring up the PAL problem with the Vizio people today because doing so would likely have made their heads explode. I brought that up to someone a few weeks ago and he admitted that he had never heard of the terms NTSC or PAL. It amazes me that a TV company would hire people to represent their product who know less about it than I do. And I just have to throw in here, because it's funny: At Fry's I once asked a salesperson if a particular receiver would pass a PAL signal and he said "No, that's against copyright law." The receiver did pass it, by the way.)

Looking back I think they may still be wrong about the firmware 'never' affecting video performance- it certainly does a bit more than just control the internet apps. This TV did not have "Game Mode" when I first got it, but it appeared as an option after a firmware update. (Turning this on is supposed to bypass more video processing, but when I've turned it on it's caused the picture to go black very briefly and has not solved the frame rate problem either.) When I had the 552, it originally moved the picture into a small box on the side of the screen when the picture controls were brought up, but after the first firmware update the picture stayed at its normal size when adjusting the picture. But again, I don't care what caused the frame rate to do what it does, all I know is it wasn't doing it before and I want someone to fix it.

Thanks- please post what you find tonight, also if you find any problems contact Vizio and report what happened with them here.

Whoever is in charge of their Facebook page should be fired- they've been deleting perfectly legitimate comments about problems with their stuff. Someone yesterday posted a video of an older Vizio plasma malfunctioning and they said they called customer service and was told it was because "it's old and outdated technology". I posted a comment "Let's see if Vizio responds to this intelligently, or if they delete it and hope nobody saw it." Sure enough, the post is now gone. (This person was out of warranty so of course they shouldn't expect Vizio to fix it for free, but for customer service to say what they did is unbelievably stupid. Yes, plasmas are old technology, and none of them work anymore. Of course CRTs are even older, and that's why absolutely no working models are left on the face of the earth.)

By the way I will admit to never having heard the term "field dominance" before. I looked it up, it would be a plausible explanation for this except that it does it with progressive sources. I just watched Charlie and the Chocolate Factory on HD-DVD again (with director's commentary this time), with the player set to 720p. Motion problems were more subtle and less frequent, but they were still there. Checked parts at 1080i and they had the same problems as it did in 1080p.