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Onkyo vs pioneer - Page 2

post #31 of 80
I wouldn't touch a Pioneer.
post #32 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

A true testament to the fact it doesn't live up to all the hype. 40000 + posts is not about how great it is, but why it makes systems sound, less than ones likes and tasts...
Auto setup is great for distance, levels, and at times Xovers (which is debatable). More then half the time I use dolby volume or THX which takes Audyssey out of the equation, cause it just sounds better...

Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post

Onkyo now packs a pair of gloves with every unit.. Problem solved...
Heat can be a issue with any high current amp, good venting is needed, a small fan is an easy fix, a small price to pay..

THX dolby volume think I know what you want to ear; you are right and they are all wrong.

Cheers
post #33 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post


A true testament to the fact it doesn't live up to all the hype. 40000 + posts is not about how great it is, but why it makes systems sound, less than ones likes and tasts...
Auto setup is great for distance, levels, and at times Xovers (which is debatable). More then half the time I use dolby volume or THX which takes Audyssey out of the equation, cause it just sounds better...

Most of it is discussing or more like debating on how things work like the most recent rlo discussion lol.
post #34 of 80
The new x09 line runs very cool compared to previous year models and even compared to some other manufacturers.
post #35 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnatalli View Post

the new x09 line runs very cool compared to previous year models and even compared to some other manufacturers.

+1
post #36 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by joehonest View Post


A true testament to the fact it doesn't live up to all the hype. 40000 + posts is not about how great it is, but why it makes systems sound, less than ones likes and tasts...
Auto setup is great for distance, levels, and at times Xovers (which is debatable). More then half the time I use dolby volume or THX which takes Audyssey out of the equation, cause it just sounds better...

Actually using Dolby Volume or THX does not take Audyssey out of the equation. You are still using the Eq that running Audyssey put in place. But you may be using a different curve and may or may not be using Dynamic Eq depending on your settings. Unless you actually turn off Audyssey you are using it.

That being said, I bought a receiver a couple years ago just for Audyssey and have not been disappointed. I would not buy one without it.

And the Audyssey thread is full of people to help you get the most out of it and understand what it is really doing.
post #37 of 80
Why does it always seem that if one even suggests a reciever without audessey they get dumped on? I've never used audessey so I can't say it doesn't make a difference or not, but to imply nothing else matters other than audessey is simply not right. I don't have an apple tv and at some point I would like to airplay to zone 2 independently, should I not take that into consideration? Not every audessey owner implies audessey is the end all be all, but there are those out there.
post #38 of 80
onkyo 809

Home & Theater Magazine, rated it #1 for Mid Range Amp. Runs symmetrical L/R channels, separate power, and pre-amp blocks, with a highly rigid chassis. The TX-NR809 offers a class-leading mix of power, features, and performance.

Special Features

HDMI Support for 3D Video and Audio Return Channel
High-Quality HQV® Vida VHD1900 Video Processor
Marvell Qdeo Video Chip for 4K Upscaling and Processing
ISF (Imaging Science Foundation) Video Calibration for Optimal
Video Performance

Network Capability Delivers Internet Radio and Network Streaming
THX® Select2 Plus Certified
Direct Digital Connection of iPod/iPhone via Front-Panel USB Port
Audyssey MultEQ® XT Advanced Room-correction and Speaker Calibration
Audyssey DSX and Dolby® Pro Logic® IIz Add New Dimensions to Surround Sound

I rest my case. Onkyo has no airplay? NP! Get an apply tv plug it in the amp with an hdmi cable your good to go! Wireless baby!
post #39 of 80
Glad you're happy with your purchase
post #40 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaty View Post

onkyo 809

Home & Theater Magazine, rated it #1 for Mid Range Amp. Runs symmetrical L/R channels, separate power, and pre-amp blocks, with a highly rigid chassis. The TX-NR809 offers a class-leading mix of power, features, and performance.

Special Features

HDMI Support for 3D Video and Audio Return Channel
High-Quality HQV® Vida™ VHD1900 Video Processor
Marvell Qdeo™ Video Chip for 4K Upscaling and Processing
ISF (Imaging Science Foundation) Video Calibration for Optimal
Video Performance

Network Capability Delivers Internet Radio and Network Streaming
THX® Select2 Plus™ Certified
Direct Digital Connection of iPod/iPhone via Front-Panel USB Port
Audyssey MultEQ® XT Advanced Room-correction and Speaker Calibration
Audyssey DSX™ and Dolby® Pro Logic® IIz Add New Dimensions to Surround Sound

I rest my case. Onkyo has no airplay? NP! Get an apply tv plug it in the amp with an hdmi cable your good to go! Wireless baby!

what case are you resting exactly? Different reviewers use different methods and different bench tests, it proves what they like, not what's "the best"

http://reviews.cnet.com/av-receivers...-34647681.html
post #41 of 80
I recently have had the pleasure of setting up the Onkyo TX-NR609 and the Pioneer vsx-1021 as well as the Denon 1912. Myself and my father in law were both in the market for a new reciever so i read some of the biased reviews on all 3 and had a hard time deciding so we did what any audio enthusiest would do, We bought all 3 and took a test drive! I'll start with the Onkyo. This turned out to be our least favorite of the 3. No airplay, it does have internet radio via a wireless dongle (which i still have by the way) Ill be honest in that most of the features of all of the 3 recievers my father in law could care less about except one, It must work well with a Harmony one remote! The Onkyo was a pain to get programmed because every time i selected the watch TV activity it would switch the reciever correctly then after 2 seconds it would switch to TV fron cabl/sat every time. I tried for hours and finally got it to work by adding a delay then a signal command to set it back to cabl/sat. However i didn't like the feel overall on the Onkyo and the sound wasn't quite as crisp as the Denon or the Pioneer. The feel part may have to do with i'm coming off a Harmon Kardon reciever that i have had for about 9 years and would would buy another one if the quality was up to par with what the Harmon once was. Verdict- Onkyo went back.Just a sidenote, The Onkyo did run hotter than the Pioneer and the Denon by a significant amount. On to the Denon 1912. WE both really like this reciever. It has internet but only wired, airplay,3D ready, audessey, Ipod connectivity, ethernet, etc.The sound from this reciever sounds more expensive that it is, just plain sounds pleasing to (OUR) ears. Not as extensive to set up as the Onkyo and everything worked with the Harmony remote the first time. The Audessey was off a little and i had to make some tweaks but all in all does a good job but the fact that it has AUDESSEY would not be a deciding factor for me to buy this reciever. There seems to be alot of people out there that would not buy a reciever if it didn't have AUDESSEY and i guess all i can say is you have probably never ran a mixing board or an intricate EQ. Having or not having wireless ethernet was not a deciding factor because my father in law didn't even wanna hook it up (all he wants is NETFLIX) which he gets via a wireless dongle and his blue ray player. Lastly the Pioneer and my favorite of the 3. The Pioneer has Ethernet wired or wireless (I run mine wired), airplay, Ipod/ipad connectivity via included cable, bluetooth, no AUDESSEY but mcacc which i feel actually did a better job of setting up in my home than AUDESSEY. The sound was on par with the denon and was pretty clean out of my JBL floor standing speakers and 200 watt sub also JBL. I really like this reciever so far and as i said, I would take a mcacc setup just fine over the audessey setup or vice versa. I really like the android app from pioneer for this reciever. I would like more settings that my Harmon had like area, or hall and to play out of the front and rear speakers without including the center channnel. There is a setting for that but a couple more option would be ok with me. The Pioneer is a breeze to set up if you are at all familiar with reciever setups and i feel is the easiest of the 3. As said the Denon 1912 and Pioneer vsx-1021 are very close in sound quality and clarity. I am still tweaking the Pioneer as it is the one i kept and my father in law kept the Denon. He has stated that after seeing mine set up and listening to it he might have bought a pioneer as well but is happy with the Denon. A couple things like the HDMI inputs already labeled game1 and game2, and cabl/sat on the denon instead of BDR/DVR and assignable on the pioneer (which are changeable) may be easier and more suited for the novice installer. All in all We are very happy so far with our purcheses and these are our opinions based solely on our tastes.
Just a quick note that C-net rated the Onkyo 3rd of the 3 as well and the Denon 1st over the Pioneer stating that music clarity was just a touch better and the Denon had one more HDMI port as the leading reasons for beating out the Pioneer.
post #42 of 80
Thanks for all the info so far, I'll be going to the local fs/bb this weekend to see what I can get most likely will be denon 2112ci/3112ci or the vsx-1021/1121k
post #43 of 80
@iceman...

you DO realize that your "problem" with the onkyo was because you had hdmi control turned on in the avr, correct?

"There seems to be alot of people out there that would not buy a reciever if it didn't have AUDESSEY and i guess all i can say is you have probably never ran a mixing board or an intricate EQ."

ummm...

there's more, but the lack of paragraphs isn't worth taking apart...
post #44 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I wouldn't touch a Pioneer.

My Home Theater "invasion" started in 1996 with the following AVR's:
1. 1996(Apr)>Onkyo TX-SR525-no DD then.
2. 1997(summer)-Kenwood with DD
3. 2000-2009-Denon AVR-5700: DTS, DD and EXT-IN(analog In's), 140W/CH
4. 2009-2010-Onkyo TX-SR875
5. Aug 2011-NEW Onkyo TX-SR875>Present
The selections speak for themselves. Back in 1997 while pursuing a DD AVR I listened to both the Kenwood and the Pioneer. My first HDTV was NOT bought until 2007.
Finally my route postal carrier has a Pioneer VSX1120 which I helped him set-up. Biased or however you care to look at it this Pioneer VSX1120 simply put can NOT dance on the same floor with my Onkyo or my former Denon for that matter. I had just remembered he had a problem and had to wait for his HDTV so I suggested to him to bring it to my house. I disconnected my Onkyo and connected his Pioneer to my Home Theater set-up. I have already spoken> my Onkyo by a KO in the first round
joerod I'm with you Pioneer does NOT have an AVR to sell me. If I divorce myself from Onkyo my next AVR would be a Denon. I don't have anything against Pioneer. I had their High End laserdisc players and DVD players. Pioneer does NOT have a blu ray player that can mess with Oppo BDP-83
BTW I think I have objectively argued my case.
post #45 of 80
No, I adjusted all of the settings and it still did it. as stated, this is what MY ears told me to buy, If yours are telling you to buy somthing else then do so. End of paragraph!
post #46 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnson636 View Post

Why does it always seem that if one even suggests a reciever without audessey they get dumped on? I've never used audessey so I can't say it doesn't make a difference or not, but to imply nothing else matters other than audessey is simply not right. I don't have an apple tv and at some point I would like to airplay to zone 2 independently, should I not take that into consideration? Not every audessey owner implies audessey is the end all be all, but there are those out there.

Has actually nothing to do with Audyssey but a missing EQ system.
Those components which influence the sound most are
a) room acoustics
b) room acoustics
c) speakers
d) amps and AVRs
...

Because people usually have no choice in actively modifying the room acoustics by physical means, the nearest best way then is EQ, which helps the room, the speakers and the seating position at best.
If you got a "plain" pure old amps without everything else, you might have the (theoretically) best sounding electronics, but may be one of the worst or mediocre sounding systems. By employing one (i.e. any) modern EQ system, you are getting (most of the times) a much greater improvement in SQ than with anything - even exotic and expensive - else.

The only thing which counts at the end is SQ at your favorite listening position, no matter how it is achieved. Taking cost and usefulness into the equation, in the overwhelming number of applications (cases) this is acoustic treatment or EQ not esoteric electronics, speakers and accessories, contrary to what the "industry" says. Everything else will only enter the equation as a number behind the decimal point for those affected, which includes most of us.
If you got an (almost) perfect room and the money, then we can talk about those "HigherEnd" products.
post #47 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by icemanls2 View Post

No, I adjusted all of the settings and it still did it. as stated, this is what MY ears told me to buy, If yours are telling you to buy somthing else then do so. End of paragraph!

obviously, you did not adjust the "correct" ones... as what you described is the function of hdmi control...

it's hard to take a "review" seriously when the user can't set the system up "right"...

fwiw, i'm no fan of onkyo's... but i am a fan of "fact and accuracy"...
post #48 of 80
Pioneer vsx-1120---500.00 Onkyo TX SR-875 1200.00 Why would you think the pioneer would run with an onkyo that costs over twice as much? Apples and oranges.
post #49 of 80
Then i suppose all of the people that have wrote into the Harmony forum on here stating they had HDMI control turned off as well are all wrong and none of them know what they are doing?? Come on.
post #50 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by icemanls2 View Post

Pioneer vsx-1120---500.00 Onkyo TX SR-875 1200.00 Why would you think the pioneer would run with an onkyo that costs over twice as much? Apples and oranges.

My dollars speak this way:
My first Onkyo TX-SR875 I paid $625(S/H incl.) for it used. My second one was brand new in the box for $380.00. If you want to buy a $500 Pioneer VS my $380 Onkyo(S/H incl.) then what apples or oranges are you going with, HELLO? Keep driving your cheap Camaro while I drive my super deal Corvette
post #51 of 80
@gurkey That was a very objective post as icemanls2's was, but most of the post are not objective, it's more like hatred. If a person has a problem with room correction and wants to eq his/her sub then it would make all the sense in the world to get a reciever with audessey. I have an AVR-391 and a VSX-21 Elite and I would say I don't have a sure locked prefernced brand. I even considered buying another Denon to see what all the hype is about audessey, But I wanted preouts and in order to get a denon with preouts I'd have to go all the way up to the 3312ci which is almost $700 more than the 1121 Lots of people love there brand, but why can't it end at loving your brand; you don't have to hate or dislike a brand just because you love another. It just seems that you must defend yourself if you purchased or even consider a reciever that doesn't have audessey.
post #52 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnson636 View Post

... But I wanted preouts and in order to get a denon with preouts I'd have to go all the way up to the 3312ci which is almost $700 more than the 1121 Lots of people love there brand, but why can't it end at loving your brand; you don't have to hate or dislike a brand just because you love another. It just seems that you must defend yourself if you purchased or even consider a reciever that doesn't have audessey.

I don't think you have to "defend" yourself when buying a receiver that doesn't have Audyssey. But poeple will get corrected when they are misinformed about something. I like the "sound best to me" brand and it happens to be Denon because of Audyssey. I enjoyed my previous Pioneers but not as much.

On another note, If you are reffering to ccotenj when you talk about "not objective posts", I would try to keep him on your good side. I've been here for about a year and his posts are very informative. It is obvious that he knows what he is talking about and you may need his help one day. I don't know him but I've gathered that if you ask him the right question, you will get the right answer....just saying.

Just out of curiousity, why do want preouts?

cheers
post #53 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I wouldn't touch a Pioneer.

I would.
post #54 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by jproy13 View Post

On another note, If you are reffering to ccotenj when you talk about "not objective posts", I would try to keep him on your good side. I've been here for about a year and his posts are very informative. It is obvious that he knows what he is talking about and you may need his help one day. I don't know him but I've gathered that if you ask him the right question, you will get the right answer....just saying.

Just out of curiousity, why do want preouts?

cheers

I absolutely have no idea why you felt the need to defend ccotenj as I in no way implied anything at all about him/her. I haven't attacked anyone for that matter. I was talking in general in regards to "not objective posts". If I get on someone's (noone specifically) bad side simply because I'd choose a reciever without audessey, then I'm not the one with the problem.

I want preouts to run amps. Just something I wish to do down the line.
post #55 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnson636 View Post

I absolutely have no idea why you felt the need to defend ccotenj as I in no way implied anything at all about him/her. I haven't attacked anyone for that matter.

my bad then, just the way your post was perceived

Quote:
I was talking in general in regards to "not objective posts". If I get on someone's (noone specifically) bad side simply because I'd choose a reciever without audessey, then I'm not the one with the problem.

agree

Quote:
I want preouts to run amps. Just something I wish to do down the line.

I just ask cause a while back, a member on another forum didn't see the need for room EQ of any sort because he was going to add an amp to "improve" the sound, which goes without saying is incorrect.

cheers
post #56 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by jproy13 View Post

I just ask cause a while back, a member on another forum didn't see the need for room EQ of any sort because he was going to add an amp to "improve" the sound, which goes without saying is incorrect.

cheers

I agree with you. Have you ever had that "something" within you that won't go away and the only way to get rid of it is to get that "something", That's me with an amp. No real rhyme or reason for adding an amp than just something in me.
post #57 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnson636 View Post

I agree with you. Have you ever had that "something" within you that won't go away and the only way to get rid of it is to get that "something", That's me with an amp. No real rhyme or reason for adding an amp than just something in me.

lol, trust me, I absolutely do. I can tell you this much, I don't need one as my room is average size and my speakers are quite efficient (93db, 91db,90db), but every couple of days I find myself scrolling down the classified ads or the manufacturer's site for some deals. I will own one, just because.
post #58 of 80
I have a Pioneer 1121-k, and I use an Anti-mode 8033c along with it.

This combo exceeds or beats anything Onkyo offers for the price. XT is no XT32. The anti-mode offers excellent sub eq which exceeds what XT can do, and will work with any receiver.

The Onkyo 809 with an anti-mode would be great too, just $200 more expensive.
post #59 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhazard View Post

I have a Pioneer 1121-k, and I use an Anti-mode 8033c along with it.

This combo exceeds or beats anything Onkyo offers for the price. XT is no XT32. The anti-mode offers excellent sub eq which exceeds what XT can do, and will work with any receiver.

The Onkyo 809 with an anti-mode would be great too, just $200 more expensive.

I am reading on this "Anti-mode 8033c" that you speak of, if I understand correctly, it is for subs. Can it work in collaboration with Audyssey or MCACC in your case? Like Audyssey or MCACC taking care of the speakers and Anti-mode 8033c taking care of the sub?
post #60 of 80
I've never heard of anti-mode. I'll have to research this.
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