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Smash on NBC HDTV - Page 5

post #121 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal1981 View Post

Not necessarily. A Broadway show's creation can be a very lengthy process with some serious retooling before it ever hits a real stage (that will apparently be the case with Marilyn as well). They could go into a second season with the show still not quite ready to open. When Uma Thurmond shows up as a big name star vying for the lead, that plot line alone could generate enough drama to last for multiple episodes. Then there can be very dramatic changes during the out of town runs. Again, the most recent notable example is Wicked which opened it's trial run in San Francisco. Robert Morse, a Broadway icon, was cast as the Wizard and was summarily fired to be replaced by Joel Grey. Lotsa heavy stuff can happen and it could make for some pretty good TV.

What he said.

As an example, in the walk-through, or whatever it was, they seemed to be ending the show with Marilyn and Joe D breaking up. You really need her death, and tragic details like DiMaggio setting her up with Frank Sinatra and stuff of that nature.

Earlier in the thread it was mentioned that they have dreams of actually presenting the play on Broadway, which makes a great deal of sense. Some of the songs are already pretty good.
post #122 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaded Dogfood View Post

What he said.

Earlier in the thread it was mentioned that they have dreams of actually presenting the play on Broadway, which makes a great deal of sense. Some of the songs are already pretty good.

I agree. The original songs have been very good. The ones that I really like are "Let me Be Your Star", "Mr. and Mrs. Smith" and the astounding "Lexington and 52nd Street". Will Chase still knocks me over when I watch it. Interesting trivia note: when Marilyn flopped on Broadway in 1983, Joe Dimaggio was played by Scott Bakula in his first major theatre role.
post #123 of 397
But this show is like forcing somebody to wade through the 20hrs worth of 480p encoded "behind the scenes, making of ..." extras on a BluRay release *before* they're allowed to watch the 2 hour feature film ...

I'm done commenting ... I'll probably stick out the season, but then it falls victim to my newly minted "no more new broadcast networks shows" rule.

Recovery by attrition.
post #124 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

But this show is like forcing somebody to wade through the 20hrs worth of 480p encoded "behind the scenes, making of ..." extras on a BluRay release *before* they're allowed to watch the 2 hour feature film ...

That's exactly the premise Spielberg had in mind when he came up with the idea...

"I've had this idea for quite a few years," Spielberg says in the video. "I'm really interested in what happens backstage ... For me, it's a complete mystery how they do it in theater."

"Choreographers battling with writers and actors auditioning in competition with each other," Spielberg adds, "That entire mix often sets off thermonuclear explosions, which I think makes good drama for television. It just makes good drama. Period."

The original concept was that each season would follow the production of a new musical; if any of them were "stage-worthy", Spielberg would make them into actual Broadway musicals.
post #125 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

That's exactly the premise Spielberg had in mind when he came up with the idea...

Temporarily breaking my "promise of no more comments."

And yet somehow I doubt anyone outside of the industry (or theater) really cares about these things. The only reason the ratings are holding up are:

1) It follows "Voice"
2) It's really just "Grey's Anatomy" set in the rehearsal hall ...

Then again, maybe all those hours I spent in rehearsal halls (as a would be musician) during my youth have inoculated me against "the mystery."
post #126 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

And yet somehow I doubt anyone outside of the industry (or theater) really cares about these things. The only reason the ratings are holding up are:

1) It follows "Voice"
2) It's really just "Grey's Anatomy" set in the rehearsal hall ...

I think it's pretty clear that you don't have to be a theater professional to enjoy shows like Smash, which dramatize the putting on of shows. Such things are interesting to those of us who are no more than musical theater fans. Proof of the pudding, I guess are Cole Porter's Broadway hit, Kiss Me Kate, first produced in 1948, and Kieban & Hamlisch's 1975 sensation, A Chorus Line, which ran on Broadway for 15 years. The reason such shows are popular doesn't have much to do with their soapy dramatic story lines, but everything to do with their music and dancing.
post #127 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I think it's pretty clear that you don't have to be a theater professional to enjoy shows like Smash, which dramatize the putting on of shows. Such things are interesting to those of us who are no more than musical theater fans. Proof of the pudding, I guess are Cole Porter's Broadway hit, Kiss Me Kate, first produced in 1948, and Kieban & Hamlisch's 1975 sensation, A Chorus Line, which ran on Broadway for 15 years. The reason such shows are popular doesn't have much to do with their soapy dramatic story lines, but everything to do with their music and dancing.

The difference being that all of those examples have a run-time of 2.5 hours or less ... they are focused, distilled ... taut ... and they don't really portray the 10000+ hrs of sweat, tears, and ... tedium necessary to become become adept at one's "craft." Don't kid yourself. The reality is *not* being portrayed here.

The public just wants the final product ... or in this case, the soap suds Nobody wants to watch the actual tedium of the "work," unless you're the one actually doing it.
post #128 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

And yet somehow I doubt anyone outside of the industry (or theater) really cares about these things.

As virtually any storyline the backdrop is there to drive the characters. For me the making of aspect is irrelevant to whether I enjoy the show or not. Rather it's the characters interaction with one another of which can be done lousily or fantastically regardless of the backdrop. Much like with singing contests if I wanted to listen to wonderful singing I'd play a Diana Krall cd. It's the investment you develop in the characters that keeps you coming back. Which comes to my major complaint about the show the characters at times (for me) appear be more caricatures than characters and as such I tend to not really care about them.

As far as the backdrop itself I find it more interesting than less interesting so I'd say it adds to the show rather than detract. Again, that's not to say it plays a large role in whether or not I enjoy the show enough to watch it.

As Spielberg said... "It just makes good drama. Period." Or can if done properly.
post #129 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

The reason such shows are popular doesn't have much to do with their soapy dramatic story lines, but everything to do with their music and dancing.

... of which there was a helluva lot more than here. If only Smash would incorporate more singin' and dancin', the soap opera elements with pretty much two-dimensional characters wouldn't be so bad. At least that's something Glee understands.
post #130 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce73 View Post

At least that's something Glee understands.

Different markets. I never made it past 1/2 an episode of Glee and I'll make it one way or another through at least a season and half of Smash. My take is improve what you are attempting to do... don't change it to something different.
post #131 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

Different markets. I never made it past 1/2 an episode of Glee and I'll make it one way or another through at least a season and half of Smash. My take is improve what you are attempting to do... don't change it to something different.

Sure. But while we're waiting, how 'bout a reprise by Miss Peters?
post #132 of 397
My wife and I are very selective, and we find Smash to be very entertaining and often moving. Part of the pleasure is watching Katherine McPhee and seeing how far she's come from her days on American Idol. Not only a really fine singer but a VERY natural and vulnerable actress. Some of the songs in the show are truly high quality, and I think some variety of Marilyn will do well on Broadway one of these days. In general I believe the show has avoided cliches, although the bowling alley scene was a false note - too reminiscent of Glee. The dialog is mostly of very high quality, which makes all the difference.
post #133 of 397
Thread Starter 
Actually I really liked the twist toward the end of this weeks episode. Now both characters are kind of thrown adrift, with Karen seeming to have a better shot as a career name. To be honest I did not expect that.
post #134 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt L View Post

Actually I really liked the twist toward the end of this weeks episode. Now both characters are kind of thrown adrift, with Karen seeming to have a better shot as a career name. To be honest I did not expect that.

I enjoyed this week's show too. The singing and dancing continue to be great and it's dramatic threads have been fairly interesting. I'll be sticking with it for the foreseeable future.
post #135 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt L View Post

(...) Karen seeming to have a better shot as a career name.

What do you mean?

They said they wanted a star to be Marilyn. How does Karen have a better shot? She's even more of a nobody than Ivy.
post #136 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnesia View Post

What do you mean?

She's younger and arguably more talented. Not to mention without trying she has had very promising opportunities thrown at her. Regarding Marilyn I give her better odds on the simple fact Ivy had the part and was fired... Karen hasn't had her at bat. Of which she might never get but I think between the two the odds favor her.
post #137 of 397
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnesia View Post

What do you mean?

They said they wanted a star to be Marilyn. How does Karen have a better shot? She's even more of a nobody than Ivy.

I'm not referring to her playing Marilyn, just that she is getting opportunities, some that Ivy tossed away. She seems to be getting noticed by those who can help her.
post #138 of 397
Still liking this a lot (and not missing Glee at all) - but, this latest episode was the first time I saw McPhee's acting chops fall short. A couple of the scenes where she was trying to convey deep feelings for her fiance through facial expressions just didn't do it for me. Despite that face! Just a quibble - overall she is great and looks and sounds great. It will be interesting to see how the story goes forward with the changes just made.
post #139 of 397
A couple of the scenes where she was trying to convey deep feelings for her fiance through facial expressions just didn't do it for me.

The whole business with her fiance and the jealousy over the other woman just puts me to sleep. Back to the bi!chery amongst the show biz types, please.
post #140 of 397
The critique of this show in this thread is pretty much all right on. But it's still kinda fun. I'm enjoying the Ellis character, the divorce fights (it's close to home right now), and anytime Davenport is onscreen.

Mainly Davenport. It may be a clich├ęd character, but he's been great.
post #141 of 397
How can you like Ellis? He's such a weak, selfish person. I think the show would have been much, much better without him...
post #142 of 397
He's evil. Evil is fun in such settings. I want to see how far he will go. Apparently quite a ways.

With a show like this (completely predictable) it is sometimes amusing to "watch" the writers rather than the show. Like...30 Rock.
post #143 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiky View Post

He's evil. Evil is fun in such settings. I want to see how far he will go. Apparently quite a ways.

Ellis finally got his clock cleaned by Eileen. The presumptuous little twerp was firmly reminded of the Rock's mantra "Know Your Place! when she made it clear what producers actually do. When she ordered him to answer the phone, the crestfallen puppy look on his face was priceless. As for the episode itself, it was much better than last week's. The writing was crisper and the soap opera elements were well played. the McPhee/Hilty duet in Times Square was very good. One very funny note. One of the large building posters was for Gypsy with Bernadette which ran 9 years ago. It was put up to apparently cover a poster for Smash itself. That would have been awkward as hell especially with the two leads shown prominently
post #144 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cal1981 View Post

As for the episode itself, it was much better than last week's. The writing was crisper and the soap opera elements were well played. the McPhee/Hilty duet in Times Square was very good.

I liked this week's show, too, and thought the Times Square duet was its high point. Thought the soap opera parts of the story were, well, soapy, but they were well performed.

Who was the guy with the dyed blonde hair who was the lead in the production number and threw Ivy off of the stage when she got out of control? Like all of the other musical theater talent in Smash, he was terrific.
post #145 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I liked this week's show, too, and thought the Times Square duet was its high point. Thought the soap opera parts of the story were, well, soapy, but they were well performed.

Who was the guy with the dyed blonde hair who was the lead in the production number and threw Ivy off of the stage when she got out of control? Like all of the other musical theater talent in Smash, he was terrific.

Norbert Leo Butz, Tony winner for Dirty Rotten Scoundrels and the original Fiyero in Wicked. He's big time Broadway A-list.

Another plus last night was Karen finally leveling Ivy with "Derek hit on me before you". That was almost as good as Ellis getting his.
post #146 of 397
Thread Starter 
The other funny thing I noticed in the Times Square duet was a big ad for "The Finder" on Fox...
post #147 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I liked this week's show, too, and thought the Times Square duet was its high point. Thought the soap opera parts of the story were, well, soapy, but they were well performed.

Not to mention enjoying Karen/Kathryn in the tight green body suit.
post #148 of 397
Well, I guess I'm in the minority here, I hated the Times Square duet. My wife and I are about ready to dump this show because of what we call the "Glee" moments. They are in the streets of NY and a guy is playing a keyboard, they start singing some stupid pop song and bang; that keyboard now sounds like a full band with about 15 invisible backup singers and the auto tune is turned up all the way. Both my wife and I rolled our eyes at that scene and she said she was ready to drop this show if they keep doing more and more of this kind of stuff.

The show is best when it sticks to its Broadway roots, when it tries to do pop I want to run away.
post #149 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by rolltide1017 View Post

Well, I guess I'm in the minority here, I hated the Times Square duet.

I have never watched Glee (outside of perhaps 1/2 an episode) and I'm not a fan of break-out singing. At the same time these vignettes are clearly within the vision of the show and as such I take them in spirit versus literally. Along the lines of seeing imagination than reality. It's one of the powers of storytelling... not all stories have to be linear or factual. Often it's more enjoyable if they aren't.
post #150 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

I have never watched Glee (outside of perhaps 1/2 an episode) and I'm not a fan of break-out singing. At the same time these vignettes are clearly within the vision of the show and as such I take them in spirit versus literally. Along the lines of seeing imagination than reality. It's one of the powers of storytelling... not all stories have to be linear or factual. Often it's more enjoyable if they aren't.

Agreed and the bottom line is that it's TV show and is going to take a lot of liberties in certain areas. Whether you like Glee or not, it has set a standard of sorts for this kind of a show, especially with the younger demographic.
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