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HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software - Page 46

post #1351 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by vega509 View Post

you can enter the sensor matrix in the Measures Sensor Configure panel.

Ok, but if it could be possible to add option like it was "Manually edit..." Load/Save .mhc file
Now it don´t save matrix with .chc file
post #1352 of 3437
Thread Starter 
It's difficult to go backwards, I'll see what can be done with the current scheme. In the meantime I have updated the previous link zip file with a new testing version.

changes:

-fixed dE CIE94
-fixed dE calculation in luminance/sat measures pages
-fixed luminance calculation in luminance/sat graph
-removed black level dE calculation
-added BT.1886 gamma target (replaces previous "optimized regression")

note that the BT.1886 target values use your white and black level measurements from the grayscale page. If you don't trust your meter to give you a good black level reading then enter it manually in the 0% stimulus Y box.



HCFR 20Calibration.zip
post #1353 of 3437
I have to agree with Make73... the load ccmx option was nice. But I really appreciate the work you (and John) have done zoyd, thanks again.

So in your 'CIE94' versions, HCFR will use CIE94 for color gamut and CIELUV for grayscale? (edit: this seems to be the case, because my grayscale measurements are the same, but my color gamut numbers are different)
Also, BT.1886 is new to me. With this option, my original calibration targeting 2.35 is now ~2.5! Is this normal? Should we be targeting a similar range (ie 2.2-2.4) using bt.1886?
Edited by rahzel - 2/3/13 at 4:59pm
post #1354 of 3437
rahzel,

Here is a link that will give you more than enough info about BT.1886.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1409045/how-power-law-gamma-calibration-can-lead-to-crushed-blacks

Larry
post #1355 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

rahzel,

Here is a link that will give you more than enough info about BT.1886.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1409045/how-power-law-gamma-calibration-can-lead-to-crushed-blacks

Larry
Thanks Larry. Ya, I've browsed through that thread before, but not in great detail. I guess I was just lazy and wanted a quick answer. smile.gif But I'll give it a read.
post #1356 of 3437
rahzel,

Then try this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1450925/what-is-bt-1886-gamma.

Larry
post #1357 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

I have to agree with Make73... the load ccmx option was nice. But I really appreciate the work you (and John) have done zoyd, thanks again.

So in your 'CIE94' versions, HCFR will use CIE94 for color gamut and CIELUV for grayscale? (edit: this seems to be the case, because my grayscale measurements are the same, but my color gamut numbers are different)
Also, BT.1886 is new to me. With this option, my original calibration targeting 2.35 is now ~2.5! Is this normal? Should we be targeting a similar range (ie 2.2-2.4) using bt.1886?


yes, all grayscale dE is done in CIELuv space and color in CIE94 unless you select the option to revert back to CIELuv for color. When you select BT.1886 gamma reference it does two things.

1. Draws a BT.1886 reference gamma curve (white squares) on the gamma plot, you should try and get yours to lie on top of that if possible.
2. Calculates the target Y in the gray scale measures page in order to achieve 1.

If you have a very low mll the target curve will be almost flat at gamma=2.4, if you have a higher mll the target curve will dip down at the lower stimulus levels. This will help to avoid crushed blacks but you need a multipoint gamma adjustment to do this. Remember that you need to take your viewing environment into account as well, a 2.4 gamma may not be suitable if there is much ambient light. If all you have is a single gamma control I would shot for an average of the BT.1886 curve for your display.
post #1358 of 3437
My ST50 has an MLL of ~0.0028fL. I prefer a higher gamma because my room has controlled lighting.

I only have a 2pt system with a gamma slider so I'm aware that I'm not able to get my gamma curve to lineup with the bt.1886 curve. I had my slider at 2.6 before, which made the gamma around 2.33avg using the power law formula. With the bt.1886 formula, it puts it around 2.5avg. Setting the slider to 2.4 puts the gamma closer to the bt.1886 target (which is ~2.32 avg). So the bt.1886 gamma curve is fixed? You can't change the target? When I change the target in HCFR, it doesn't move the reference curve. I know my ST50 doesn't have a multipoint adjustment, but my LG LCDs do and I plan on re-calibrating them soon. And again, since I have controlled lighting, I prefer a higher gamma.

Anyway, here is the gamma curve for my ST50 using the bt.1886 formula:
adqZqyrZ.jpg abyTyZrD.jpg
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

rahzel,

Then try this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1450925/what-is-bt-1886-gamma.

Larry
Thanks again Larry.
Edited by rahzel - 2/4/13 at 2:12am
post #1359 of 3437
There is an error when trying to save the meter correction file.



I have tried every directory in the HCFR folder with the same error.
post #1360 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

So the bt.1886 gamma curve is fixed? You can't change the target?

It's determined by your white and black level but will never exceed 2.4. With BT.1886 reference you have to think about gamma calibration a little differently. With the other options (display, display+black compensation etc.) you are fitting functions to your measurements to yield a single parameter (gamma). With BT.1886 you are adjusting Y(x) to match a predetermined function that is calculated based on your white and black level.
post #1361 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by vega509 View Post

There is an error when trying to save the meter correction file.



I have tried every directory in the HCFR folder with the same error.
That may be from Windows 7 UAC security in the Program Files subfolders. You should be able to save it in your Documents folder, or you can change the permissions on the HCFR folder.
post #1362 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdbimmer View Post

That may be from Windows 7 UAC security in the Program Files subfolders. You should be able to save it in your Documents folder, or you can change the permissions on the HCFR folder.

This happens on winxp as well, the matrix save/load stuff simply is not working at the moment. If you need to use a matrix you will have to cut and paste the whole thing from notepad into the sensor matrix edit box until this is fixed.
post #1363 of 3437
Okay, thanks.

One thing I noticed is the meter changes to "simulated" when I open a previously created .chc file. I didn't have any meter connected at the time, so I don't know if it does that when one is connected.
post #1364 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdbimmer View Post

Okay, thanks.

One thing I noticed is the meter changes to "simulated" when I open a previously created .chc file. I didn't have any meter connected at the time, so I don't know if it does that when one is connected.

yes, the simulated meter with the saved data will come up if the probe file you saved is not connected.
post #1365 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

It's determined by your white and black level but will never exceed 2.4. With BT.1886 reference you have to think about gamma calibration a little differently. With the other options (display, display+black compensation etc.) you are fitting functions to your measurements to yield a single parameter (gamma). With BT.1886 you are adjusting Y(x) to match a predetermined function that is calculated based on your white and black level.
Thanks.
post #1366 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Was able to get .thc file load/save working. The files must be stored in the Etalon_xxxx sub-directory where xxxx depends on meter driver being used. Currently the load dialog is only available when opening a new probe instance. Also fixed a couple of minor graphing/page reporting issues.


HCFR Calibration.zip
post #1367 of 3437
Did you do something with the gamma graphs/measures? I noticed on the version you uploaded before, if I changed the formula between display gamma and bt.1886 gamma, my measures were different. On this version, the gamma measures are the same between display gamma and bt.1886 (like it was before).
post #1368 of 3437
I used the last zip with i1D3
Is there a way to get absolute Luminance values for each IRE in cd/m2 based on % Gray 100?
I'd like to see target values to set Gamma without manual pre calculating based on % Gray 100 value and expected % per Gray
I'd like to adjust RGB levels based on selected Test Color to expected target, but I don't see that target value in HCFR.

What I'm missing?

Another Q. - is there a way to run "View images" generator continuously, in a loop?
In this way I can see results on another monitor and do TV controls adjustments at the same time and see updated resulting chart

thanks
post #1369 of 3437
I have tried the last zip with I1D3.
The Greyscale & Primary/Secondary are OK, but the Sat measurements are KO because the image display is wrong.
post #1370 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

Did you do something with the gamma graphs/measures? I noticed on the version you uploaded before, if I changed the formula between display gamma and bt.1886 gamma, my measures were different. On this version, the gamma measures are the same between display gamma and bt.1886 (like it was before).

yes, it's now the correct behavior.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikek753 
I'd like to see target values to set Gamma without manual pre calculating based on % Gray 100 value and expected % per Gray

The last line in the gray scale measures box "gamma Y" is what you want.
Quote:
I'd like to adjust RGB levels based on selected Test Color to expected target, but I don't see that target value in HCFR.

HCFR doesn't work that way. You have a bullseye target and then deltaxy and deltaluma values which update in real-time during continuous measures if you have enabled "detect primary colors during user measures" in preferences.
Quote:
Another Q. - is there a way to run "View images" generator continuously, in a loop?

No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kerlucum 
The Greyscale & Primary/Secondary are OK, but the Sat measurements are KO because the image display is wrong.

Can you explain, perhaps with a screenshot?
Edited by zoyd - 2/5/13 at 6:34am
post #1371 of 3437
Hi Zoyd,

I made an other try (W7) and I can see that the 0% & 100% are black images.



An other point is the incompatibility of the .chc file with the previous version.

Your's shows the luminance in the left part of the primary/secondary while the V3 shows the RGB barrels.

Perhaps this is the source of issue.
post #1372 of 3437
thanks for all your answers.
One more Q.
Do I need to load any file and which one for my i1D3?
When I press calibrate sensor nothing been calibrated it just got back without asking me to do any black or etc measurement.
How do you calibrate i1D3?
How to get reference reading to see how my sensor is off or near to expected?
No, I don't have any other sensor, but one i1D3.

Mike
post #1373 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikek753 View Post

thanks for all your answers.
One more Q.
Do I need to load any file and which one for my i1D3?
When I press calibrate sensor nothing been calibrated it just got back without asking me to do any black or etc measurement.
How do you calibrate i1D3?
How to get reference reading to see how my sensor is off or near to expected?
No, I don't have any other sensor, but one i1D3.

Mike

Some recommend putting up a 30% gray pattern to calibrate the D3, I don't calibrate mine.

Reference readings are taken from another meter, preferably a spectrophotometer or a reference meter. With only one meter you will either 1. take chances on matrices that others have posted (not good as each meter is slightly different), 2. just use your meter as is, or 3. find someone nearby with a spectro or reference meter you can create a correction file with.
post #1374 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kerlucun View Post

Hi Zoyd,

I made an other try (W7) and I can see that the 0% & 100% are black images.

[

thanks for the report, that's a bug in the view images generator, I'll post a fix later.
post #1375 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

The last line in the gray scale measures box "gamma Y" is what you want.

thanks for the answer.
Somehow I can't scroll down to see that last line under gray scale.
Yes, right scroller is all way down, but the last line isn't visible anyway.
I'm on Win 7 64bit, 1080p display.

Does it scroll correctly for everyone else?
post #1376 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikek753 View Post

thanks for the answer.
Somehow I can't scroll down to see that last line under gray scale.
Yes, right scroller is all way down, but the last line isn't visible anyway.
I'm on Win 7 64bit, 1080p display.

Does it scroll correctly for everyone else?

post #1377 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by vega509 View Post


Wow, thanks ;-)

I didn't know those control the size of that table
Now, I can see whole table biggrin.gif
post #1378 of 3437
Anyone know of a spreadsheet that calculates DeltaE for gray scale?
post #1379 of 3437
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

Was able to get .thc file load/save working. The files must be stored in the Etalon_xxxx sub-directory where xxxx depends on meter driver being used. Currently the load dialog is only available when opening a new probe instance.

I hope you can fix that like it was so it can be used and load also to old measurements without sensor connected and no matter which folder have those .mhc files.
post #1380 of 3437
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

thanks for the report, that's a bug in the view images generator, I'll post a fix later.

Latest build with fix for "view images" saturation runs.


HCFR Calibration.zip
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