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HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software - Page 32

post #931 of 3436
I already have this disc http://www.avsforum.com/t/948496/avs-hd-709-blu-ray-mp4-calibration

I need to dig out a set of patterns to calibrate for SD as well.
post #932 of 3436
Steve, make sure you use the proper sized SD patterns to, I wouldn't use Getgray, they are to large for your Pioneer.
post #933 of 3436
Any suggestions for an SD disc source? I think I have Tom Huffman's but I need to check. BTW I just used ControlCal to get ISF mode up and running on my Pioneer 608D. Great little program to use alongside HCFR. I haven't ventured into the gamma controls but everything else worked like a treat. I'm just now looking at HDTVChallenged's BT 1886 gamma spreadsheet...
Edited by stevekale - 8/26/12 at 1:52pm
post #934 of 3436
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevekale View Post

EDIT: I had my worksheet running on the basis that luma Y was 0-1 rather than 0-100. So a reading of 0.04 is actually L* 0.4 which makes a lot more sense. Doof.

I see you caught the mistake before I could reply. 0.04 cd/m^2 is good but not nearly the best pioneer has produced. My set runs between 0.02 and 0.04 cd/m^2 depending on APL and I find the BT.1886 gamma function works quite well for most material. Regarding the i1pro recalibration, if it passes the white tile check then the xy coordinates are fine and I wouldn't bother. You can actually use the D3 Y luminance to correct the i1pro Y, it's quite good.
post #935 of 3436
APL? With the calibration run through I did last night using the ISF mode, 0 ended up measuring 0.018. I never focused on the 9G model when it came out having just dumped £5k into the 8G model a year earlier and not expecting them to stop production. Had I known, I would have traded up to the 9G. In any event, the display is still pretty good. I wonder at what point Panasonic will come to the realisation that the 8G and 9G panels are ageing and there's pent up demand for another high-end release. The technology is there.

Thanks re the i1Pro. I just use it for so much else (printer profiling etc). Maybe a trade-in on the i1Pro2...

PS: I need to post my calibration results at some point to get some constructive help on whether to tweak it further. I won't do it in this thread and will wait until I have the gamma side of things up and running. I had to teak tint which is a little disconcerting.
Edited by stevekale - 8/27/12 at 12:48am
post #936 of 3436
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevekale View Post

APL? With the calibration run through I did last night using the ISF mode, 0 ended up measuring 0.018. I never focused on the 9G model when it came out having just dumped £5k into the 8G model a year earlier and not expecting them to stop production. Had I known, I would have traded up to the 9G. In any event, the display is still pretty good. I wonder at what point Panasonic will come to the realisation that the 8G and 9G panels are ageing and there's pent up demand for another high-end release. The technology is there.
Thanks re the i1Pro. I just use it for so much else (printer profiling etc). Maybe a trade-in on the i1Pro2...
PS: I need to post my calibration results at some point to get some constructive help on whether to tweak it further. I won't do it in this thread and will wait until I have the gamma side of things up and running. I had to teak tint which is a little disconcerting.

APL=average picture level (or luminance) - The samsungs float blacks a bit.

0.018 cd/m^2 is very good and BT.1886 recommends a flat 2.4 gamma function for black levels 0.01 and below so try both. Starting a new thread with cal results is a good idea.
post #937 of 3436
Well I can't repeat it today. I wonder if a little ambient light sneaks in under the i1DPro. Going in circles a bit today as it seems I'm having trouble getting ControlCal settings to stick...

EDIT: by the way, I think the i1D Pro seems to let in a lot of ambient light. When I check my black luma at night with the lights off it registers 0.012.
Edited by stevekale - 8/28/12 at 3:22am
post #938 of 3436
steve, don't forget to press the save button for each memory (isf Night / isf Day) to "commit" the changes. You can actually go into a memory, make some adjustments.. if you exit, change memories or Inputs without save, changes will be lost and settings resort to the last saved.
post #939 of 3436
Got there in the end. See here http://www.avsforum.com/t/1426480/lx608d-calibration-with-hcfr-and-controlcal#post_22346724

One thing that would seem helpful would be to have a visible, updating dE measure when setting primaries. Rightly or wrongly I set secondaries looking at the continuous measures histograms.
post #940 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevekale View Post

One thing that would seem helpful would be to have a visible, updating dE measure when setting primaries. Rightly or wrongly I set secondaries looking at the continuous measures histograms.

When you are in continuous measure mode, activate the Measures tab, and choose Free Measures from the dropdown above the data grid. Here you will find the real time dE value you're looking for. The dE cell is even shaded in the color that you are currently working on.

Additionally, in Preferences/Advanced, if you tick the "Detect primary colors during user measures" checkbox, you can see your CMS adjustments in realtime on the CIE chart.
post #941 of 3436
Ah thanks. I was watching the CIE chart when setting the primaries. And what dE is currently being used by HCFR?
post #942 of 3436
Thread Starter 
CIE1976
post #943 of 3436
I have to say, after 3 hours of chasing my tail, I'm really not sure I believe the running dE in Free Measures. I would run Free Measures and have very low dE for all primary/secondary points. I'd then do a Primary/Secondary run and the dEs would explode and the points plotted on the CIE chart were way off. Turn on Free Measures and with no change to any display settings, dEs would drop back down again.
post #944 of 3436
I have a request. I ma using HCFR V3.0.4.0 with the X-Rite i1Display Pro. The two work together very well. However I would like to be able, on occasion, to measure ambient light. The i1Display Pro is equiped with a white diffuser for this purpose. However when I engage the diffuser, I get an error message and measurements stop until I disengage the diffuser. This might be an issue with the Argyll device driver. Any ideas?
post #945 of 3436
I notice on 3.0.4 hcfr you can calibrate your meter (i1D2) by using white screen refresh for plasma and not the black inside dvd case.

Will this method also work in version 2.0.1 hcfr which requires the dvd case? So I dont have to take the meter down every 15 minutes to calibrate.

I'am going back and forth from the two software versions as I see a little better stability in reading the low end in the 20.,30 ire windows using 2.0.1.
post #946 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by Padex View Post

Same here, using correction matrix gave greenish picture. Using no correction got satisfied result with ColorMunki Display and my LG 50PK350 plasma display. Noticed that if contrast was set too high on LG then I got red/blue tint at whites. Reducing contrast to 70 (~ 80 cd/m2) got very nice whites and nice warm picture.

After that I was seeing also red tint too much. So I put in Zoyd's correction matrix and used LG's 20 point calibration controls, got it near perfect: deltaE <= 2 at all IRE levels. Dramatic improvement in PQ. No color tints at all now. Grey patterns all perfect, great contrast and colors. Never seen this kind of PQ before. Thank you all for the great work.
post #947 of 3436
Hi dschlic1,

I'm trying to use the same configuration ( HCFR V3.0.4.0 with the X-Rite i1Display Pro) on windows 7 but I have problems with the Argyll driver. Did you use this configuration with windows 7? Do you know how to solve the driver problem with windows 7? I was looking in the forum for the driver issues on windows 7 but I haven't find any solution?

Thanks.
post #948 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

APL=average picture level (or luminance) - The samsungs float blacks a bit.
0.018 cd/m^2 is very good and BT.1886 recommends a flat 2.4 gamma function for black levels 0.01 and below so try both. Starting a new thread with cal results is a good idea.

BT.1886 always includes a black offset so it's never just 2.4

Here's the curve for 100cd/m white and as 0.01 cd/m black.
post #949 of 3436
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti View Post

BT.1886 always includes a black offset so it's never just 2.4

If one is trying to match a CRT operated at low black level the recommendation states:

"For moderate black level settings, e.g. 0.1 cd/m2, setting the LB of the EOTF to 0.1 will give a satisfactory match to the CRT. In the event the CRT is operated at a lower black level, e.g. 0.01 cd/m2, the EOTF will provide a better match with LB set to a lower value such as 0.0 cd/m2."

So it really depends on what EOTF you assume the material was mastered on, in combination with your display abilities.
post #950 of 3436
To rafeta:
I am using Windows XP Pro. I have heard that the Argyll drivers have problems with 64 bit Windows 7. I have a 32 bit Windows machine that I will try running ColorHCFR.
post #951 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by rafeta View Post

Hi dschlic1,
I'm trying to use the same configuration ( HCFR V3.0.4.0 with the X-Rite i1Display Pro) on windows 7 but I have problems with the Argyll driver. Did you use this configuration with windows 7? Do you know how to solve the driver problem with windows 7? I was looking in the forum for the driver issues on windows 7 but I haven't find any solution?
Thanks.

the i1Display Pro does not need any driver for HCFR 3.0.4.0. Windows 7 detects the meter, and HCFR uses it as is. If you installed the i1 software, be sure its processes are terminated before starting HCFR.

the i1Pro does not work with HCFR 3.0.4.0.
post #952 of 3436
There is no problem using the i1 display pro in win7. I am using a colormunki display with no issues. (Same driver)

I suspect that the problem is that the x-rite software is running in the system tray.

Edit: I see I was a bit late...
post #953 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti View Post

BT.1886 always includes a black offset so it's never just 2.4
Here's the curve for 100cd/m white and as 0.01 cd/m black.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

If one is trying to match a CRT operated at low black level the recommendation states:
"For moderate black level settings, e.g. 0.1 cd/m2, setting the LB of the EOTF to 0.1 will give a satisfactory match to the CRT. In the event the CRT is operated at a lower black level, e.g. 0.01 cd/m2, the EOTF will provide a better match with LB set to a lower value such as 0.0 cd/m2."
So it really depends on what EOTF you assume the material was mastered on, in combination with your display abilities.

So the spreadsheet from the other thread is correct or incorrect? My Kuro is 0.015 cd/m2 black when measured at night. Isn't 100 cd/m2 a very low contrast setting?
post #954 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

If one is trying to match a CRT operated at low black level the recommendation states:
"For moderate black level settings, e.g. 0.1 cd/m2, setting the LB of the EOTF to 0.1 will give a satisfactory match to the CRT. In the event the CRT is operated at a lower black level, e.g. 0.01 cd/m2, the EOTF will provide a better match with LB set to a lower value such as 0.0 cd/m2."
So it really depends on what EOTF you assume the material was mastered on, in combination with your display abilities.

I'll have to double check with the guys in the lab, but I'm nearly certain BVM's weren't hitting black levels below 0.01, especially not in an environment with ambient light (meaning any light). Also that note is for the alternate bt.1886 that is explicitly about matching an in use CRT. My post and comment about the standard BT.1886 formula, not the alternate CRT matching one.
post #955 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevekale View Post

So the spreadsheet from the other thread is correct or incorrect? My Kuro is 0.015 cd/m2 black when measured at night. Isn't 100 cd/m2 a very low contrast setting?

The spreadsheet is fine.

100cd/m to 0.015 is a 6500:1 contrast ratio, which is very good.

As for if 100cd/m is low output on a kuro, I'm not sure about that I haven't played around with many.
post #956 of 3436
Thread Starter 
Reread it, the note refers to the primary function. The alternative follows.
post #957 of 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoyd View Post

Reread it, the note refers to the primary function. The alternative follows.

Re-reread it.

It still only applies to when you are trying to match two displays that are next to each other.
post #958 of 3436
First of all, thank you guys very much for HCFR and the AVS HD disc!
I already owned a colormunkie photo and searched for a way to calibrate my new TV with my color meter. Works like a charm, thank you very much! smile.gif

Only thing I'm wondering is, that my saturation results are way off on yellow, magenta and cyan. The 100% saturation is fine, but the 25-75% are scattered pretty much and not evenly distributed. Since there is no way to adjust these I'm wondering what is wrong?
post #959 of 3436
Hi there,

I am from germany, after some years with my Panna PX80 I shortly bought the 50STW50.
After running D-Nices Slides for some days now, I was thinking of calibrating it myself. I am new into this.
So I hope you might help me. Which set are you recommending to me? Spyder 4 Express with the HCFR software?
I already downloaded the 709 MP4 material that (as far as I know) will be played directly over USB from the Panny?!

I read about a HCFR self build sensor... where can I get this one?

Thank you pretty much
post #960 of 3436
Will colorhcfr work with the new Xrite EODIS3 i1Display Pro?
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