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RED 4K 3D laser projector = $10K - Page 8

post #211 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by sstephen View Post

So, before today we knew it was a 4k 3d laser based projector slated to go for < 10k. 2 pages of posts later we know it is a 4k 3d laser based projector slated to go for < 10k

and the picture at the demo is "not" 24" big
post #212 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by sstephen View Post

So, before today we knew it was a 4k 3d laser based projector slated to go for < 10k. 2 pages of posts later we know it is a 4k 3d laser based projector slated to go for < 10k

We should be proud!! We accomplished this in only 2 pages, but it took them 12 pages in the Red forum
post #213 of 768
Have you guys checked out Endgadget today ?
There is an extensive (by Endgadgets standards) article on the REDray 4K Laser projector with lots of pictures and comments from the company's reps, including the promise that a home theater version will be available later this year for less than $10.000,00.
The writer also stated that the image was being displayed on a 24" screen...
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Marcos
post #214 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by MCaugusto View Post

Have you guys checked out Endgadget today ?
There is an extensive (by Endgadgets standards) article on the REDray 4K Laser projector with lots of pictures and comments from the company's reps, including the promise that a home theater version will be available later this year for less than $10.000,00.
The writer also stated that the image was being displayed on a 24" screen...
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Marcos

Do you guys know how to post videos on Facebook? lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h03oaRIJ8W0
post #215 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by MCaugusto View Post

Have you guys checked out Endgadget today ?
The writer also stated that the image was being displayed on a 24" screen...
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Marcos

Engadget corrected the typo.
post #216 of 768
No specs?
Max. Lumens?
post #217 of 768
LOL!

Quote:


Zach Honig MOD 15 minutes ago in reply to danielmpoulin

It's 24 feet ... apologies

The warning printed on the side of the projector;

Quote:


Warning

Dangerous thinking, delusional deadlines, grandiose goals, obsessive-compulsive and continual changes, endless electronics, equation-bending deviant logic, fluorescent nights, hypersensitive components and personalities.

Prior to being injected into the main accelerator, the particles are prepared by a series of systems that successively increase their energy. The first system is the linear particle accelerator generation 50-MEV protons, which feeds the proton syndication booster. There the protons are accelerated to 1.4 GEV and injected into the proton synchrotron, where they are accelerated to 25 GEV. Finally the super proton synchrotron is used to further increase their energy to 450 GEV before they are last injected into the main housing. Here the proton bunches are accumulated, accelerated to their peak 7-TEV energy, and finally circulated while photon collisions occur at the four intersection points within the human eye, thus creating images in the brain the world has never before experienced.
post #218 of 768
From The Verge report;

Quote:


But before the film began, RED's Jim Jannard came out and almost apologized. He let us know that for the moment, all we'd be seeing was 2K 3D in each eye while we wore our Oakley-brand 3D glasses.

In two days, though? In two days it will be 4K in each eye.

We were impressed with the footage either way — the 3D induced no headaches or eye-rubbing, and the Epic captured sharp footage in almost pitch-black scenes. The video looked fantastic through the projector, and was as richly detailed and clear as we've quickly come to expect from 4K.

4K 3D for both eyes is quite impressive and much needed for displaying 3D properly.
Must be the first projector to do so?
post #219 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cinema626 View Post

okay, i shoot and work with red cameras daily, i have seen a majority of red films in digital 4k. apparently you can tell anything about a film just by looking at it in the theater! your eyes must process the projected image and turn it into a raw file which your cyborg mac pro brain then analyses and tells you exactly what the fidelity of the image is.

the sensor does not really resolve 4k (http://magazine.creativecow.net/arti...ture-of-pixels). look at the file, you will see I am correct and the industry is well aware of this. thats why the newer cameras are resolving 4k by downsampling larger resolutions. its the reasons the alexa and the red have almost the same latitude, ahem, DR (seen the alexa do a little better). Alexa achieves true HD by downsampling from a 3.5k sensor.Just because your iPhone shoots 1080p doesn't mean it's actually 1080p when you get down to it. most cameras don't really resolve their advertised rez. it's fun to watch them play the numbers game and it keeps things interesting.

The article you quoted is 4 years old and with many flaws. The now 2 year old Epic resolves 4k easily with its 5K sensor. We work with Red footage daily and have edited over 20 feature films shot with Red Ones and Epics. Our rental company has provided Red Ones and Epic to over 30 feature films and hundreds of commercials...and we are just a small company. Red cameras have shot hundreds of feature films, including major blockbusters like the upcoming Spiderman, The Hobbit Trilogy, TGWDT, Prometheus just to name a few.
I referenced TGWDT because not only was it shot at 4k, but is was finished in 4k and delivered via DCP to the cinemas in 4k. If you watched in projected digitally from a 4K projector, the difference is clearly visable. I also saw a 35mm print which looked nice, but not as good as the 4k DCP

The Hobbit is being shot in 5K 3D at 48fps...can any other current cinema camera do that?
post #220 of 768
RED CEO Jim Jannard "now it's real and it's running"
post #221 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalfx View Post

The article you quoted is 4 years old and with many flaws. The now 2 year old Epic resolves 4k easily with its 5K sensor. We work with Red footage daily and have edited over 20 feature films shot with Red Ones and Epics. Our rental company has provided Red Ones and Epic to over 30 feature films and hundreds of commercials...and we are just a small company. Red cameras have shot hundreds of feature films, including major blockbusters like the upcoming Spiderman, The Hobbit Trilogy, TGWDT, Prometheus just to name a few.
I referenced TGWDT because not only was it shot at 4k, but is was finished in 4k and delivered via DCP to the cinemas in 4k. If you watched in projected digitally from a 4K projector, the difference is clearly visable. I also saw a 35mm print which looked nice, but not as good as the 4k DCP

The Hobbit is being shot in 5K 3D at 48fps...can any other current cinema camera do that?

what is the article wrong about? it isn't about epic specifically but about the marketing of resolution in general. And we know how important marketing is in this cut-throat camera industry (i assume you're at HCI or keslow, but didn't something happen at arri burbank with their computers?) The hobbit is ostensibly '5k'. we both know the epic can only resolve to around 4k, and it is slightly less. I have still not seen 4k from their 5k sensor that did not have some aliasing. I did see GWDT at arclight on the christies. maybe with leicas it's possible? I just left sony studios this weekend after watching footage from the f65 and leica summilux-c lenses on state of the art 4k projectors. It is the only true 4k I have ever seen. there is no need to shoot anamorphic anymore even with the 8k sony sensor. I watched as the DIT blew the F65 image up and he pulled stuff out of the shadows and highlights that I have never seen done before in my life. There was 20+ stops available. It was UN. REAL.

Call me old fashioned but even on the new 4k cine projector that I watched the footage on with the colorist still did not handle motion as well as film. 48/60fps is a whole different game but seasoned and stubborn cinematographers still like 24, it's just something we've got to deal with. Though I was amazed at what I saw from sonys new 8k sensor (both greater resolution as well as greater latitude than film and any other '4k' camera i've seen), for some reason I walked out of the lot reminding myself it's still a freakin camcorder. Then again I've never managed to get even 13 stops out of 35.
post #222 of 768
I know Epson/Seiko was working on a 4k lcos chip about 3 years ago. Sony just dropped a bomb with its vw 1000. Is this projector going to be the big bertha and kill everything else off with this monumental technological breakthrough? Red just killed off the planned obsolecence of their competitors. I wonder if this could bring sbout the demise of some companies
post #223 of 768
The projector looks BIG... perhaps too big for my hush box...

So we know it exists, now we need data - lumens, contrast ratio, physical size, noise ratings...
post #224 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cinema626 View Post

I just left sony studios this weekend after watching footage from the f65 and leica summilux-c lenses on state of the art 4k projectors. It is the only true 4k I have ever seen. there is no need to shoot anamorphic anymore even with the 8k sony sensor. I watched as the DIT blew the F65 image up and he pulled stuff out of the shadows and highlights that I have never seen done before in my life. There was 20+ stops available.

Nonsense. No camera has 20 stops to offer for now. The Sony is at 14-15 stops max. And it ain't 8K for sure. Not enough pixels for that. It's a solid 4K though.
post #225 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by mhafner View Post

Nonsense. No camera has 20 stops to offer for now. The Sony is at 14-15 stops max. And it ain't 8K for sure. Not enough pixels for that. It's a solid 4K though.

I mean... It's just a fact. That is spec. It doesn't resolve 8k. But it is 8k in the sense that red is 5k. I saw the dynamic range with my own eyes in the color suite. There are about 15 stops which could be deemed usable but for kicks we were able to push it more (don't expect to see that in a film, but the information IS there). It can do up to 120 fps in true 4k downsampled from 8k. In the future it will be interesting to see how far they can push the sensor. I suspect approaching 5k.
post #226 of 768
Yeah, RED hasn't been very good with predictions when it comes to price and availability of their gear.
post #227 of 768
But don't forget, they basically started at zero and are still a relatively small company. They sure have more experience manufacturing their stuff now than they did when their first camera was announced.
post #228 of 768
There is a post on the red forum that states "Yes, I was told that it requires a silver screen and that the one used in the demo is a Stewart screen with 2.0 gain."

So looks like a new screen will be needed if you don't have silver one already.
post #229 of 768
Would be good if they offered an active solution as well for HT for those who don't wish to change their existing screens........................
post #230 of 768
Or even better with offering spectral filtering, such as Omega. Seems that they could provide filter retrofit options, since they are cool with modular design ethic. I can see Omega or third party providing filters - it would likely be one of the first "mods" to this projector when it comes out if spectral isn't offered as an option. Too many people are not find of silver screens (I'm too happy with my 148" 2.8 HP scope screen)
post #231 of 768
I really wish that RED would release some specs. I can't believe that no one at NAB has yet asked what kind of imaging technology is being used (why this would be a secret is beyond me). What does "no calibration" mean?

This seems like it was either revealed too early or was revealed just to screw with the market.

I hope that I am wrong but this seems like a case of "all sizzle, no steak."
post #232 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post

Would be good if they offered an active solution as well for HT for those who don't wish to change their existing screens........................

It does not have to be active; Dolby 3D works without special screen and I really I hoped Red would have moved into that direction, with a few leaps forward of course... I'm quite disappointed about the the silver screen requirement. I bet their 4K 2D looks mind blowing until those of us hyper-allergic to the speckles/screen texture start noticing that. Their NAB demo is said to use a 2.0 gain Stewart Silver 5D which has much much more visible gain layer than my current ST130.

Suggested modular filtering would obviously be super-nice, too.
post #233 of 768
Using a screen that retains polarization with simultaneous L+R 3D makes engineering sense.

However I guess many can and will use this projector without a silver screen to project plain vanilla laser gamut,4K high frame rate 2D
post #234 of 768
Initial reports is that image quality is extraordinary, however would be great to have more objective data & reporting (seems a lot of 'fanboy' activity on the red forum).
post #235 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by slickrock View Post

Or even better with offering spectral filtering, such as Omega. Seems that they could provide filter retrofit options, since they are cool with modular design ethic. I can see Omega or third party providing filters - it would likely be one of the first "mods" to this projector when it comes out if spectral isn't offered as an option. Too many people are not find of silver screens (I'm too happy with my 148" 2.8 HP scope screen)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tn1krr View Post

It does not have to be active; Dolby 3D works without special screen and I really I hoped Red would have moved into that direction, with a few leaps forward of course... I'm quite disappointed about the the silver screen requirement. I bet their 4K 2D looks mind blowing until those of us hyper-allergic to the speckles/screen texture start noticing that. Their NAB demo is said to use a 2.0 gain Stewart Silver 5D which has much much more visible gain layer than my current ST130.

I don't think you can use filters with lasers. Lasers are very narrow bandwidth, if you filter them there is nothing left. The Dolby type systems relies on two distinct wavelengths for red, green and blue respectively. Since the laser only has one wavelength of each color to begin with you can't filter it and get two like a lamp based system which starts off with a spectrum.

In order for it to work you would need 6 lasers with different wavelengths. That seems very expensive and I don't even know if there are available lasers with the suitable wavelengths.

Active glasses should work though. Especially since it seems to have a very high update rate with 120 fps possible.
post #236 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by deandob View Post

Initial reports is that image quality is extraordinary, however would be great to have more objective data & reporting (seems a lot of 'fanboy' activity on the red forum).

That forum is out of control with the hype and spin. It makes the AVS forum look rational in comparison. I didn't think that was possible.
post #237 of 768
Yes, even beats the apple hype
And there seems to be a few detractors as well. Strange for a pro video company to have such polarised opinions about it in the market.

This projector certainly looks interesting, it has the potential to be groundbreaking, however how much of it is hype is yet to be seen.
post #238 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohlson View Post

Using a screen that retains polarization with simultaneous L+R 3D makes engineering sense.

However I guess many can and will use this projector without a silver screen to project plain vanilla laser gamut,4K high frame rate 2D

So what happens why you try to project 3D with one of these passive systems on a non-silver screen, e.g. a Stewart ST130?
post #239 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post

So what happens why you try to project 3D with one of these passive systems on a non-silver screen, e.g. a Stewart ST130?

You will get almost complete cross-talk. I.e. it will look more or less like the image without using glasses.
post #240 of 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by slickrock View Post

Or even better with offering spectral filtering, such as Omega. Seems that they could provide filter retrofit options, since they are cool with modular design ethic. I can see Omega or third party providing filters - it would likely be one of the first "mods" to this projector when it comes out if spectral isn't offered as an option. Too many people are not find of silver screens (I'm too happy with my 148" 2.8 HP scope screen)

at page number 10 post 188 i have already explain it why it will not work today with laser but other explain it as well.
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