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Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol - Page 5

post #121 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

True IMAX would have been 4:3

Doesn't true IMAX has an AR of 1.44:1?

Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

The Dark Night Prologue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

What about it?

I think I meant the AR of TDK could be an option, which is 1.71:1.
post #122 of 419
I certainly didn't want them to master the BD from the DMR IMAX master, which is probably what they did for TDK. I would rather they master the IMAX scenes from the IMAX stems and the rest from the 35mm stems preserving the most resolution possible from the source. I also wish they would have included a shifting aspect ratio to provide the most resolution possible for the IMAX sequences, which won't be the case with a 2.35:1 presentation. I honestly don't mind the opened up 1.78:1 aspect for this vice a 4:3 aspect. Again, I want the most resolution possible from the IMAX sourced video.
post #123 of 419
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buurke View Post

Doesn't true IMAX has an AR of 1.44:1?





I think I meant the AR of TDK could be an option, which is 1.71:1.

Its nearer 4:3 than any widescreen format was that I meant.
And Dark Knight was cropped so was not one thing nor the other and an appalling disc
post #124 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

I certainly didn't want them to master the BD from the DMR IMAX master, which is probably what they did for TDK. I would rather they master the IMAX scenes from the IMAX stems and the rest from the 35mm stems preserving the most resolution possible from the source. I also wish they would have included a shifting aspect ratio to provide the most resolution possible for the IMAX sequences, which won't be the case with a 2.35:1 presentation. I honestly don't mind the opened up 1.78:1 aspect for this vice a 4:3 aspect. Again, I want the most resolution possible from the IMAX sourced video.

Same. Wish they did this for TDK.
post #125 of 419
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post

Same. Wish they did this for TDK.

Cost evolved X the amount of people that think the TDK transfer is stunning = not worth it
post #126 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

What about it?

That ratio could be used for IMAX scenes on bluray.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

I certainly didn't want them to master the BD from the DMR IMAX master, which is probably what they did for TDK. I would rather they master the IMAX scenes from the IMAX stems and the rest from the 35mm stems preserving the most resolution possible from the source. I also wish they would have included a shifting aspect ratio to provide the most resolution possible for the IMAX sequences, which won't be the case with a 2.35:1 presentation. I honestly don't mind the opened up 1.78:1 aspect for this vice a 4:3 aspect. Again, I want the most resolution possible from the IMAX sourced video.

I never understood why TDK prologue IMAX scene looks so much better than the actual bluray. I noticed the difference immediately when i watched the BD. I went back to the prologue and wow, better detail, sharpness, color, everything. It's really sad. I can't believe people and reviewers were giving the BD high praise for PQ. The IMAX shots were pretty good, but compared to the prologue it's average. Don't get me started on the 2.40 shots.

What source did WB use for the prologue?
post #127 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

Cost evolved X the amount of people that think the TDK transfer is stunning = not worth it

Yeah I know. It's just sad, depressing...frustrating.

It's really annoying when I watch a low bitrate Apple 1080p trailer for TDK and most of it looks better than the BD (save for a good bit of blocking). The home release was raped with gross sharpening and contrast boosting. All the non-IMAX parts just look like old digital video. Yeck!
post #128 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

I certainly didn't want them to master the BD from the DMR IMAX master, which is probably what they did for TDK. I would rather they master the IMAX scenes from the IMAX stems and the rest from the 35mm stems preserving the most resolution possible from the source. I also wish they would have included a shifting aspect ratio to provide the most resolution possible for the IMAX sequences, which won't be the case with a 2.35:1 presentation. I honestly don't mind the opened up 1.78:1 aspect for this vice a 4:3 aspect. Again, I want the most resolution possible from the IMAX sourced video.

Couldn't agree with you more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

I never understood why TDK prologue IMAX scene looks so much better than the actual bluray. I noticed the difference immediately when i watched the BD. I went back to the prologue and wow, better detail, sharpness, color, everything. It's really sad. I can't believe people and reviewers were giving the BD high praise for PQ. The IMAX shots were pretty good, but compared to the prologue it's average. Don't get me started on the 2.40 shots.

I share the same opinion.
post #129 of 419
Lots of post but I have a simple question: is there a bluray version with shifting aspect ratios like transformers and the dark knight?
post #130 of 419
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by curtishd View Post

Lots of post but I have a simple question: is there a bluray version with shifting aspect ratios like transformers and the dark knight?

Nope
post #131 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buurke View Post

Couldn't agree with you more.



I share the same opinion.

I always have, too.
post #132 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattGuyOR View Post

I'm in the constant height group and am glad it's been cleared up now. 2.35:1 all the way through. Excellent!

http://thedigitalbits.com/#mytwocents

Yippy Kay Yea it's releases on 4/17 for both BB & NF...but it better be 2.35:1 or I won't watch it. Damn it, this nonsense has to stop. No more 1.85:1 and I don't care if it's the piano or the beaver. Watching anything in 1.85:1 blows and it ruins the whole experience of cinema
post #133 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoey67 View Post

Watching anything in 1.85:1 blows and it ruins the whole experience of cinema

I can't work out if this statement is serious or not....
post #134 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoFoHo View Post


I can't work out if this statement is serious or not....

I think zoey replying about he's had enough of people whining on what aspect ratio it is and how better one is than the other. He's happy its finally being released. Could be wrong..
post #135 of 419
Personally, all of this is something I never even paid attention to until it came up here. For as long as I've had and as many times as I've watched The Dark Knight, I've never paid attention to the shift until last week. It's because I get so engrossed in the film that such an effect draws you in to the story more when done properly, as in The Dark Knight. Since last week, I've come to realize that it's almost more like a character in the film rather than an effect.

I loved this film and consider it 1b with the first MI being 1a for it's classic feel. This is a day one buy for me as long as it's not over priced. I do have some concern about the quality of the transfer but I'm prepared to take the chance.
post #136 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoey67 View Post

Yippy Kay Yea it's releases on 4/17 for both BB & NF...but it better be 2.35:1 or I won't watch it. Damn it, this nonsense has to stop. No more 1.85:1 and I don't care if it's the piano or the beaver. Watching anything in 1.85:1 blows and it ruins the whole experience of cinema

Really? Maybe you have a smaller screen than me but I don't have any issue with either aspect ratio. Composition is everything, and I've seen plenty of films that have looked great in both aspects.

My only complaint with 2.35:1 is the lack of resolution compared to 1.85:1 material, which is why it is disappointing that the MI release won't feature a shifting aspect to try and preserve as much of the added resolution as possible. I guess when 4K come along there won't be as much of an issue since a 2.35:1 film will still have more resolution than a 2K 1.85:1 film. Only time will tell!
post #137 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

My only complaint with 2.35:1 is the lack of resolution compared to 1.85:1 material, which is why it is disappointing that the MI release won't feature a shifting aspect to try and preserve as much of the added resolution as possible.

It's only more resolution in that there's extra picture using pixels above and below the 2.35:1 frame. The center 2.35:1 portion of the IMAX shots will of course use the same number of pixels as every other 2.35:1 movie.

The reality of the situation is that movies like this, Dark Knight, Tron Legacy, etc. are composed to be safe for constant 2.35:1 projection. They have to be. The number of theaters that can project the full 1.44:1 IMAX ratio are dwindling, as IMAX converts its theaters to digital equipment with a screen ratio of 2.0:1. When I saw Ghost Protocol in a Digital IMAX theater, the "opening up" of the IMAX shots amounted to just a tiny sliver of extra picture at the top and bottom that wasn't noticeable unless I specifically looked for it.
post #138 of 419
True, so long as they are composed that way. But you also hope that the master used for the BD is using the IMAX negatives for the IMAX scenes and then simply cropping them vs using a 35mm negative or a DI taken from a 35mm negative.

I didn't see MI4 in a digital IMAX theater, I saw it in one of the rare ones that actually have the right screen and use a real IMAX projector. Digital IMAX is great for a big, bright screen experience (as is Regal's impressive RPX presentations) but it is a far cry in resolution from a true IMAX film presentation.
post #139 of 419
Also, Tron Legacy was not filmed in IMAX. They simply opened up the frame for the action sequences to provide a larger experience. None of the scenes were actually captured using true IMAX cameras, as is the case with TDK, MI4 and TF2.
post #140 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

True, so long as they are composed that way. But you also hope that the master used for the BD is using the IMAX negatives for the IMAX scenes and then simply cropping them vs using a 35mm negative or a DI taken from a 35mm negative.

Fair point. The "Big Screen Edition" Blu-ray of Transformers 2 has noticeably better picture quality during the IMAX scenes than the standard Blu-ray, and not just due to the aspect ratio changing. I actually watched that one on a 2.35:1 screen with the IMAX footage cropped, and the improvement in clarity still stood out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

Also, Tron Legacy was not filmed in IMAX. They simply opened up the frame for the action sequences to provide a larger experience. None of the scenes were actually captured using true IMAX cameras, as is the case with TDK, MI4 and TF2.

Right, I was really only referring to that one from the point of view of a movie with shifting aspect ratios.
post #141 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Fair point. The "Big Screen Edition" Blu-ray of Transformers 2 has noticeably better picture quality during the IMAX scenes than the standard Blu-ray, and not just due to the aspect ratio changing. I actually watched that one on a 2.35:1 screen with the IMAX footage cropped, and the improvement in clarity still stood out.

I agree. If TDK had been authored with the same level of care, I think it would be a vastly better looking disc than it is. The IMAX sequences all look great, but the rest is pretty underwhelming. With Tron Legacy I see no difference in picture quality at all throughout, only a change in aspect, which is what I would expect given the way they produced/shot it.

With MI4 I was anxious to see if Paramount would do the same thing as TF2 and if the same level of detail increase would be apparant. I saw MI4 right after it opened in true IMAX and the IMAX scenes weren't nearly as impressive in terms of fine detail as when I saw TDK the same way. They still looked great, but the reels looked a bit used and washed out despite being one of the first days shown. I never saw TF2 in true IMAX.

I really hope that Warner's eventual release of TDKR is handled more like TF2 and not sourced from a DMR print. I would LOVE to see a reissue of TDK that got it right as I think it could look incredible on BD with the right care and attention.
post #142 of 419
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

I agree. If TDK had been authored with the same level of care, I think it would be a vastly better looking disc than it is. The IMAX sequences all look great, but the rest is pretty underwhelming. With Tron Legacy I see no difference in picture quality at all throughout, only a change in aspect, which is what I would expect given the way they produced/shot it.

With MI4 I was anxious to see if Paramount would do the same thing as TF2 and if the same level of detail increase would be apparant. I saw MI4 right after it opened in true IMAX and the IMAX scenes weren't nearly as impressive in terms of fine detail as when I saw TDK the same way. They still looked great, but the reels looked a bit used and washed out despite being one of the first days shown. I never saw TF2 in true IMAX.

I really hope that Warner's eventual release of TDKR is handled more like TF2 and not sourced from a DMR print. I would LOVE to see a reissue of TDK that got it right as I think it could look incredible on BD with the right care and attention.

And yet TDK prologue looked miles better, the whole disc is a mess
post #143 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

And yet TDK prologue looked miles better, the whole disc is a mess

I agree. The TDK prologue is one of my favorite demos to show off a display. The color and framing are better than the actual movie. I can't say if there is a difference in detail.
post #144 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buurke View Post

Couldn't agree with you more.



I share the same opinion.

I watched TDK for the first time on my new projector the other night - in additional to the fact that the opening does indeed look better in the prologue preview, i was shocked by the amount of ringing/moire effect on certain scenes especially in the non-Imax segments. The sequence where the kidnapped news anchor is giving his plea while people around town are watching it on TV - the fine detail of the TV speakers go crazy in a mess of moire effects. These are artifacts that plagued nonanamorphic dvd transfers and shouldn't be anywhere near a title like this.....
post #145 of 419
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by oleus View Post

I watched TDK for the first time on my new projector the other night - in additional to the fact that the opening does indeed look better in the prologue preview, i was shocked by the amount of ringing/moire effect on certain scenes especially in the non-Imax segments. The sequence where the kidnapped news anchor is giving his plea while people around town are watching it on TV - the fine detail of the TV speakers go crazy in a mess of moire effects. These are artifacts that plagued nonanamorphic dvd transfers and shouldn't be anywhere near a title like this.....

And yet 90% of people, reviewers and forums think its one of the best discs ever made....
post #146 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmike007 View Post

And yet TDK prologue looked miles better, the whole disc is a mess

Maybe I'm missing something here. When you refer to the prologue, you are referring to the opening sequence of the film correct? I thought the rest of the IMAX sequences were just as impressive, especially the one when Fox arrives in Hong Kong on the helicopter. Or is the "prologue" something else that I'm missing??
post #147 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by oleus View Post

I watched TDK for the first time on my new projector the other night - in additional to the fact that the opening does indeed look better in the prologue preview, i was shocked by the amount of ringing/moire effect on certain scenes especially in the non-Imax segments. The sequence where the kidnapped news anchor is giving his plea while people around town are watching it on TV - the fine detail of the TV speakers go crazy in a mess of moire effects. These are artifacts that plagued nonanamorphic dvd transfers and shouldn't be anywhere near a title like this.....

I will look at this scene tonight but I know there have been lots of reports of moire and aliasing on this disc that ended up being a setup issue and not an issue with the disc itself. It usually comes from scaling, image processing (NR) or something along those lines. I know for awhile there were lots of complaints about aliasing and moire in the opening of the film as you approach the glass building, but it always ends up being a setup issue.
post #148 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

Maybe I'm missing something here. When you refer to the prologue, you are referring to the opening sequence of the film correct? I thought the rest of the IMAX sequences were just as impressive, especially the one when Fox arrives in Hong Kong on the helicopter. Or is the "prologue" something else that I'm missing??

they are referring to the prologue scene featured as a preview on the BATMAN BEGINS bluray. proof positive that TDK could look better than what is being lauded by some people as a "great" reference disc.
post #149 of 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

I will look at this scene tonight but I know there have been lots of reports of moire and aliasing on this disc that ended up being a setup issue and not an issue with the disc itself. It usually comes from scaling, image processing (NR) or something along those lines. I know for awhile there were lots of complaints about aliasing and moire in the opening of the film as you approach the glass building, but it always ends up being a setup issue.

i have seen the moire effects from the opening scene that were caused by scaling artifacts. i have eliminated those in my new setup but still see crazy moire noise in that scene where the tv anchor is reading his script under duress (look at the TV speaker grill).

the IMAX scenes obviously look miles better as a whole...but seeing the prologue on the other disc after all these years opened my eyes to how much better they could still look.
post #150 of 419
I didn't even know it was on the BB BD. I will have a look tonight to compare! Thanks!
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