11.x sound for CIH theaters discussion - Page 3

Those of you running 11.x channels, what receiver/preamplifier are you using? Thanks!

-Sean

I've setup the heights and I have to say I'm very impressed it really adds to the front soundstage. No regrets there.

I'm running 11.2 channels with the Denon 4311ci AVR. This reciever can send signals for all 11.2 speakers, including heights and wides at the same time, but only has amplification for 9 speakers. You have to use a separate amp for either the fronts or heights. I use an Outlaw 7 channel amp for separate amplification. I use the Denon preouts for front left and right, center, and left and right wides. That way the whole front stage is using the same amplifier. I use the Denon amplification for the left and right heights, surrounds, and back speakers.

I really like the 11.2 system, but on a few movies, occassionally the dialogue from a character off screen will sound like it's coming from the wide speaker, a little too far off screen, and it pulls me out of the movie. Other than that, I really like the expansive soundstage.

Thanks! I've been looking at the Denon and the new Onkyo, I plan on using external amps for all 11 channels so I was hoping to see an 11 channel preamp but I haven't run across one yet. I've moved into a house and I finally will have a dedicated space for my stuff so I'm looking at expanding to 11.x, I'm just having trouble deciding which way to lay the room out. With these new channels it seems like a room that is wider than it is deep might be the better option.

-Sean

If you're using a projector, there are benefits to a deeper rather than wider room. Getting the wides into a good position was a challenge for me, but you only really need to be concerned with the angle of the speakers from the main listening position. A receiver or pre/pro with room correction technology will compensate for distance. I don't know of any preamps that do Audyssey DSX or Dolby IIz. You can run the Denon in preamp mode where the signal bypasses the amplifier section. Prices are pretty good because the receiver is getting a little long in the tooth (though the tech is state of the art).

Marantz recently talked about the upcoming AV8801 which will be full 11.2 (basically a Denon 4520 without amps and some audiophile touches added). I believe towards the year end... And you bet the successor of the Onkyo PR-SC5509 will do 11.4 (as the new top dog AVR will also do it).

Finally!!

Yes - "finally" indeed. At least for this current channel centric technology perhaps it's most likely been finalised - particularly if we're now talking about a separate pre-amp unit encompassing DSX, Neo X and Pliiz (requiring outboard amplification). And if it is, then that's good because it seems to me that maxing out the whole 11.xx channel based format thingy for home cinema has been relatively quick - from Onkyo in particular.

The game is moving on to object based algo's now though. I for one am more excited about this than the 11.xx based stuff. But maybe that's just me.
I think the ability to set up our rooms according to where we can best situate surround speakers, and at what ever number we choose to be optimum, is going to be a huge plus for a lot of us.

I wonder how many other hardware manufacturers are now going to even bother to bring 11.xx boxes to the market.....or whether they'll wait a little and introduce MDA or Atmos based technology in their next set of AVR's.

Perhaps 2013 is going to be a true watershed year for home cinema audio......

In the mean time, Onkyo released the manual of the TX-NR5010, the receiver that shares almost anything but the amps with the upcoming PR-SC5510 pre-pro (which is the successor to the PR-SC5509). The new AVR still only has 9 amps on board, but it will do 11 channels if an external 2ch amp is added for the wide channels, using the pre-out RCA's. I believe the TX-NR3010 does the same. (main dif between 5010 and 3010 is the 5010 has toroidial transformer). So, the TX-NR5010 does about the same thing as the Denon 4311 (and 4810 I believe), only later...

While the 11.4 mark is lead to believe four subs can be managed, this is not the case, since the four sub outputs are twinned. Only two subs channels are independently calibrated, with two outputs per channel. Still, it will be interesting to compare both the Onkyo PR-SC5510 and the Marantz AV8801, the two first true 11.2 pre-pro's. I am biassed towards the Marantz, but it will be significantly more expensive...

Hi,

A Denon 4311 Audyssey (MultEQ XT32) Pro calibrated amplifying 4 rears SL/BL/BR/SR Klipsch THX Ultra2 KS525s' + an Onkyo PA MC5500 amp for 7 fronts WL/HL/L/C/R/HR/WR all Klipsch THX Ultra 2 KL650s' + Crown K2 amp driving 2* JBL Pro 4645c. All speaker locations are adequate regarding DSX angling requirements.

At my usual ref -8 listening level all this gives a VERY immersive and life-like/real sound. Once tasted, it's impossible to return to usual 5.x/7.x listenings.

Now even though I've been an Onkyo for many years, I'll probably switch my actual 4311 for the next Denon 4520 when it becomes available, as I want to compare DSX 11 and DTS Neo X 11, Audyssey Pro compatibilty being a pre-requisite.

Hugo

PS: the 2.35 format screen is 2.60m. wide + JVC X30, nobody's perfect...
Edited by Hugo S - 8/27/12 at 7:33am

 

 

I will be ordering the 4520 this coming week, already have installed the heights and wides to my current 7.1 system and have added a second sub.

My room is only 19x14 dedicated room that only has sonex 2 inch sound absorbers as room treatment leading to a 'dead' room.  I will be replacing several of the absorbers with DIY skyline diffusers for the intended purpose to liven the room and to hopefully make the room sound larger than it is especially with all these speakers.

I've been running the Denon 4520CI on my 11.1 speakers for a few weeks now and really like it.  I moved up from an Onkyo 3009 (since sold) and 9 channels.  My room is quite large (20' wide X 30' deep) and the screen is 127"W/54"H CIH with A-lens and Epson 6010 projector.  I have been thinking about adding the XPA-3 for the L/C/F, but the Denon seems to be powering all 11 speakers pretty well.  I have all DefTech with the front being large towers (BP7002, CLR2500) that provide LFE amplification built-in.  Probably, the XPA-3 is not really necessary, but I keep thinking it might help, given the room size and large speakers.  Volume level is usually around -21 or -22db for full throated sound for a quite enveloping experience.  Can't help but wonder about that amp though...

I'm using a left over Pioneer AVR (110w) to drive the Front Heights for now.  That's sufficient power for the smaller Height speakers with the Denon driving the rest.  The Denon is rated at 150w/channel and is probably delivering something a bit less than that.  I'm not unhappy with the sound at all, just felt like there might be room for improvement and/or more headroom with the XPA-3 driving the F/C/L speakers. 

 

Thanks for the good wishes - as it turns out, the power was only out briefly here and no damage as of this morning (Tuesday). 

 

Here's an older photo of my HT.  It's taken from the rear at about 30' from the screen.  The bottom of the 2 rear surrounds are visible in upper right corner and the 2 sides are also visible by the bar and next to the curtains.  The fronts are obscured.  The screen is 127" X 54" and the projector has since been replaced.

 

Its going to look awesome

I have read several posts claiming a PR-SC5510 is on it's way, but I have been unable to find any sources of this information. Is there an article somewhere?
Thanks

Anyone?........

That is looking good mtbdudex The Wides should be placed as in an arc so that they are at about +/-60 degrees separation from centre. They would probably work closer given Surrounds are generally +/-90 degrees apart and many of us have our main speakers much closer than ITU-R recommendation of +/30 degrees. 90, 60 and 30 are multiples of 30, and where 60 is also half away. Therefore I think it is safe to move the wides anywhere that is also half way between the main and surrounds, if that makes sense. It would seem your L and R sit just outside the Scope screen, so if your wides had to sit at +/-70 degrees, I don't think it would be a problem.