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Budget subwoofers discussions, opinions and questions thread - Page 77

post #2281 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post

Might have to pick up a sub-1200 or sub-1000 for the study! Need to order those Micca mb42x's too!



Saw those Micca on Amazon and was curious. Any reviews on them?
post #2282 of 2778
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post

Might have to pick up a sub-1200 or sub-1000 for the study! Need to order those Micca mb42x's too!

If you want to check out some other inexpensive speakers have a peak at the HVL-1 (they don't cost a lot, but they aren't as cheap as the Micca's). I used those for a while during the SUB-1200 review -- figured it would be a good match, a budget subwoofer and budget speakers -- so I do know what the Dayton/WaveCrest combo sounds like. The HVL-1's will be the next review I publish, so I won't divulge too much, but I will say this; I was not disappointed with the combo. wink.gif And they're covered with the exact same vinyl wrap, so they look identical.
post #2283 of 2778
The HVL-1s look respectable enough. A good price too. I look forward to the review.
post #2284 of 2778
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

OK. I have to ask. Any thoughts on how the Dayton Audio SUB-1200 might compare to the Bic F-12?

It would be purely speculative on my part, but from what I've read of the F12 I would surmise it has the ability to go deeper while the SUB-1200 is perhaps a bit more articulate.
post #2285 of 2778
Thanks. I know youve never personally heard an F12 but that still means a lot.
post #2286 of 2778
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Thanks. I know youve never personally heard an F12 but that still means a lot.

You thinking about picking up another subwoofer?
post #2287 of 2778
Im always thinking about it. Ive been fighting getting an LV12r for months. Thought maybe Id just replace my F12 with something a little more accurate. If I could sell my F12 and RW12d I would have gotten the Rhythmik a long time ago.
post #2288 of 2778
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Im always thinking about it. Ive been fighting getting an LV12r for months.

Succumb to the urge. You won't regret it... wink.gif
post #2289 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by smokarz View Post

Saw those Micca on Amazon and was curious. Any reviews on them?

http://noaudiophile.com/Micca_MB42x_Bookshelf_Speakers/

http://www.budgetphile.com/2013/12/budget-speaker-review-micca-mb42x.html

Quite a few more out there. For the money, they seem to be some very solid speakers. For my case they'll be used on my desk so I'd like something that's not overly big, but still sounds good & these seem to fit the bill wonderfully. Hopefully I'll pick them up really soon and I'll let ya know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Im always thinking about it. Ive been fighting getting an LV12r for months. Thought maybe Id just replace my F12 with something a little more accurate. If I could sell my F12 and RW12d I would have gotten the Rhythmik a long time ago.

Having trouble selling the F12 and rw-12d? I'm surprised by that. Have you put them on your local Craiglist yet?
post #2290 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post

Having trouble selling the F12 and rw-12d? I'm surprised by that. Have you put them on your local Craiglist yet?
No. Last time I tried to sell something on Craigslist all I got was a bunch of creepy people contacting me. I should put them in the Classifieds here though. What do you think would be a fair price?
post #2291 of 2778
Haha I agree. Very weird people call me, but I've been lucky to get some normal people from local forums that wanted them.

The bad thing is going to be shipping them. It'll cut into the price a good amount with their size and weight. If it's local you could sell the rw-12d for $250 rather quickly I'd think. I got $280 and $275 for each of mine. Paid $275/ea. Not sure about the F12.
post #2292 of 2778
Agreed. It would have to be local only to make any sense. If I could get $250 and $100 for the F12 that seems pretty fair. I would get the lv12r the next day. We'll see. Thanks.
post #2293 of 2778
Yup. Do it.


post #2294 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by ousooner2 View Post

http://noaudiophile.com/Micca_MB42x_Bookshelf_Speakers/

http://www.budgetphile.com/2013/12/budget-speaker-review-micca-mb42x.html

Quite a few more out there. For the money, they seem to be some very solid speakers. For my case they'll be used on my desk so I'd like something that's not overly big, but still sounds good & these seem to fit the bill wonderfully. Hopefully I'll pick them up really soon and I'll let ya know.
Having trouble selling the F12 and rw-12d? I'm surprised by that. Have you put them on your local Craiglist yet?

It took me 6 months to sell my dual Klipsch RW-12D. I sold them for $400. The person I sold them to had to drive like 3 hours for them.
post #2295 of 2778
Dang. That's no fun
post #2296 of 2778

Ok guys i have been on here for the last few days trying to narrow things down. Any help would be great. My budget is in the $200 only want to go higher max $300 if it really makes a big difference (I have seen how you guys like to try and get people to go higher and higher :)). I want a good sub for both music and movies.

 

My current top choices based on this forum with current prices are:

 

Bic F12 $205

Dayton sub1200 $109

JBL ES250PBK $200

 

any thoughts? are suggestion i am in no real hurry to buy so i could wait if something frequently goes on sale.

 

Thanks

post #2297 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryBalzer View Post
 

Ok guys i have been on here for the last few days trying to narrow things down. Any help would be great. My budget is in the $200 only want to go higher max $300 if it really makes a big difference (I have seen how you guys like to try and get people to go higher and higher :)). I want a good sub for both music and movies.

 

My current top choices based on this forum with current prices are:

 

Bic F12 $205

Dayton sub1200 $109

JBL ES250PBK $200

 

any thoughts? are suggestion i am in no real hurry to buy so i could wait if something frequently goes on sale.

 

Thanks


The BIC F-12 is good but the BIC Acoustech PL 200 is better overall and can be bought for $280 to stay in your budget. I read the review here http://home-subwoofers-review.toptenreviews.com/ and it rates highest out of the 10 reviewed. I plan on buying one in February, after recovering from Christmas :eek:.

post #2298 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by B1ueleader View Post


The BIC F-12 is good but the BIC Acoustech PL 200 is better overall and can be bought for $280 to stay in your budget. I read the review here http://home-subwoofers-review.toptenreviews.com/ and it rates highest out of the 10 reviewed. I plan on buying one in February, after recovering from Christmas eek.gif .
I agree. For the extra $75 it would be worth it over the other 3.
post #2299 of 2778

Thanks guys i will wait until it goes on sale and get the PL 200.

post #2300 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryBalzer View Post

Thanks guys i will wait until it goes on sale and get the PL 200.
Contact acousticsounddesign.com and ask Mike what is the lowest price he will take for one.
http://www.acousticsounddesign.com/core/view_BigProduct.cfm?pid=1555&sc=28
Edited by Bond 007 - 12/29/13 at 2:35pm
post #2301 of 2778

Hey all, thanks so much for starting this thread and posting all of this information about subs. It has been really helpful for someone like me who doesn't know much about subs or even all that much about home audio.  As you can probably tell, I am in this thread looking for information and help in finding a new sub.  Based on what i can tell from reading the previous posts, i believe i have included all the information that would be helpful for you to recommend a sub that might be best for my situation.

 

I am looking fora sub in the $300 range with possibly extending to $350, however, that will be tough to get by the wife who doesn't really see the need for a sub (300 is a stretch as it is).  I have a 12x21x8 room with the back wall being half open to the middle level.  The room is the lower level of a tri-level house so if you can picture the middle floor with a half flight of stairs down to the family room with what is essentially a half wall on the back side.  I am currently running a Yamaha RX-V675 with two Def. Tech. BP 6B towers with an Energy XL-C-1 center.  I also currently have an old Optimus SW 14 passive sub hooked up that was given to me and will be installing some Energy Take 2.2HV-1's as the rear surrounds.  I know that i likely wont get the full bass feel at my budget but would obviously like to come as close as I can.  I have read good things about the BIC PL-200 and can pick one up for $280.  Is there anything else that i should consider or that you would recommend? Or should i go grab the PL-200 and call it good?

 

Also, is it worth keeping the old passive sub hooked up once i get a new sub?  I don't know much about passive subs.. well really i don't know much about any subs.

 

Sorry for the long winded post.  And thanks again for the help and for posting all of this information for all of us that are looking for help.

 

Thanks again.

 

EDIT: Sorry forgot to add that this will likely be 90% movies and tv and gaming and 10% music.


Edited by kayakerkid - 12/31/13 at 4:24pm
post #2302 of 2778
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kayakerkid View Post

I have a 12x21x8 room with the back wall being half open to the middle level.  The room is the lower level of a tri-level house so if you can picture the middle floor with a half flight of stairs down to the family room with what is essentially a half wall on the back side.  I am currently running a Yamaha RX-V675 with two Def. Tech. BP 6B towers with an Energy XL-C-1 center.

Given your situation the PL-200 is definitely worth considering. The 'half open to the middle level' might pose some challenges for you, but in general the BIC should do fairly well.

That mixture of DefTech and Energy for the front stage is interesting. I would think such disparate speakers would present audible differences. Do they actually blend properly?

Whatever subwoofer you opt to get I would strongly consider getting rid of the SW 14. Trying to integrate and tune vastly different subwoofers can be an arduous task, and is not for the faint of heart.
post #2303 of 2778
Thanks for the quick response. The energy center was given to me so I figured I would hook it up and use it. I dont notice anything strange with the balance of the energy and def techs, although it is possible that I just dont know what I am listening for. With regards to the Bic, my brother has a Velodyne dps12 that he really likes, would these be comparable or is the Velo going to be considerably better. I found a used one for 300 that would also be an option.

If down the road I sneak some cash away from the wife, would you think there would be big difference in changing the center channel to a def tech? What creates the issue with using the current setup I have? Is it simply a different type of sound which just makes it difficult to get a good blend?
post #2304 of 2778
Thread Starter 
The Velo would be a nicer subwoofer, were they both being offered new today. The DSP12 is more than likely 6-8 years old at this point though, so I'm not sure it's worth too much now. The PL200 is good for the money, but sound quality wise the Velodyne would have had it beat.

'timbre matching' of the front 3 speakers is a topic unto itself, and the reasons why that is desirable are many and varied. The short of it is that more than 3/4ths of the HT experience emanates from the left, right and center channels (cumulatively). If they aren't matched, and don't sound the same, you'll often hear a distracting imbalance.
post #2305 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

The Velo would be a nicer subwoofer, were they both being offered new today. The DSP12 is more than likely 6-8 years old at this point though, so I'm not sure it's worth too much now. The PL200 is good for the money, but sound quality wise the Velodyne would have had it beat.

'timbre matching' of the front 3 speakers is a topic unto itself, and the reasons why that is desirable are many and varied. The short of it is that more than 3/4ths of the HT experience emanates from the left, right and center channels (cumulatively). If they aren't matched, and don't sound the same, you'll often hear a distracting imbalance.

INMO, this is a somewhat debatable point. While it is optimal to have exactly matching front channel speakers; modern AVR EQ like MCACC can make for a relatively seamless sound-field. We have sort of an extreme case with a center above and below a 110" FP screen. I was worried about "coumb filtering" and balance issues, but the MCACC system EQed everything in a few minutes and the dialog now seems to come from the center of the screen instead of below or above. We have different speaker brands above and below (including a Def Tech center above) and a different make below and we can detect no "anomalies". By equalizing the SP and routing low frequencies to the sub, the results are satisfying.... Or maybe we just don't have "golden ears" wink.gif
post #2306 of 2778
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by humbland View Post

INMO, this is a somewhat debatable point. While it is optimal to have exactly matching front channel speakers; modern AVR EQ like MCACC can make for a relatively seamless sound-field. We have sort of an extreme case with a center above and below a 110" FP screen. I was worried about "coumb filtering" and balance issues, but the MCACC system EQed everything in a few minutes and the dialog now seems to come from the center of the screen instead of below or above. We have different speaker brands above and below (including a Def Tech center above) and a different make below and we can detect no "anomalies". By equalizing the SP and routing low frequencies to the sub, the results are satisfying.... Or maybe we just don't have "golden ears" wink.gif

Perhaps you have bronze ears instead... smile.gif

Issues such as comb filtering and timbre matching are related to physical aspects of the speakers design and configuration that simply can't be EQed out. MCACC might have masked them to an extent, but if you have either of the aforementioned issues they will still exist post EQ I'm afraid. Perhaps you aren't as sensitive to it then others, which has it's advantages I would imagine, but mismatches such as those do plague many others.
post #2307 of 2778
Just saying, if someone wants to mix and match their front three, I say let em. tongue.gif

-
Edited by BeeMan458 - 1/1/14 at 8:42am
post #2308 of 2778
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

Perhaps you have bronze ears instead... smile.gif

Issues such as comb filtering and timbre matching are related to physical aspects of the speakers design and configuration that simply can't be EQed out. MCACC might have masked them to an extent, but if you have either of the aforementioned issues they will still exist post EQ I'm afraid. Perhaps you aren't as sensitive to it then others, which has it's advantages I would imagine, but mismatches such as those do plague many others.

Hi Jim,
I respect your views and your contributions have helped many here, including me, with sub choices.
I understand that everyone is different. After having been into HT for so many years, I think that the audio part of it is way oversold. Modern AVRs do an amazing job of setting up "average" speakers. You reach a point of diminishing returns rather quickly...For instance, at the risk of getting flamed, I think that this "budget sub" thread is a good example of what I'm talking about.
We went the "high end" route with a new SVS Ultra a few years back. Did it shake the house? Yes, no doubt about it. Did it add very much to most movies? That's a different question.
One of the best and most cost effective decisions we made was to sell the SVS and return to our HSU. We then spent a few hundred dollars on Buttkickers for the couch. We can now turn up the tactile "shake" while keeping the volume at reasonable levels and saved a ton of money.
IMO, invest the money saved in a good display (FP or large flatscreen). You will have a much nicer HT experience. YRMV. biggrin.gif
post #2309 of 2778
The ability for MCACC to get the overall system integrated is outstanding. I have used Audyysey and MCACC and prefer MCACC. Some of the Elite AVR's have a timber matching feature that makes it much easier to mix speakers and get a great result. Everyone's room, ear and personal tasted are different.
post #2310 of 2778
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by humbland View Post

I understand that everyone is different. After having been into HT for so many years, I think that the audio part of it is way oversold. Modern AVRs do an amazing job of setting up "average" speakers. You reach a point of diminishing returns rather quickly...For instance, at the risk of getting flamed, I think that this "budget sub" thread is a good example of what I'm talking about.

We went the "high end" route with a new SVS Ultra a few years back. Did it shake the house? Yes, no doubt about it. Did it add very much to most movies? That's a different question.
One of the best and most cost effective decisions we made was to sell the SVS and return to our HSU. We then spent a few hundred dollars on Buttkickers for the couch. We can now turn up the tactile "shake" while keeping the volume at reasonable levels and saved a ton of money.

We certainly diverge on the "oversold" aspect, but I am after all the guy who started a bunch of the budget sub threads so I certainly understand your position... wink.gif

Several years ago I saw a huge need with regards to how things were being covered, with seemingly anything under $300 or so being virtually ignored. That's actually how I got into reviews initially; no one really cared about evaluating those inexpensive products, so I started doing it myself. However, I've always been into finer audio systems -- since my teenage years even -- so I do appreciate the high end equipment. Is there an audible difference? Absolutely, but is it for everyone? Definitely not.

There are all manner of reasons for that I suppose; some aren't able to hear the differences, others can't afford the equipment and there are those who simply don't care all that much about sound quality. Probably half a dozen other reasons as well, all of which are fine. What an individual considers acceptable is entirely up to them, and as you've probably seen I've never been the person to push somebody in a direction they don't want to go in. I just recently published a review of the Dayton Audio SUB-1200, which costs a mere $109, so I do still believe deeply in the budget category. However, the JL Audio E112 I'm evaluating now sounds a whole lot better to me. smile.gif

If your system works for you then nothing else really matters. In the end you've achieved something far too many others haven't; satisfaction. I've seen a lot of people constantly chasing the next best thing, and never appear content with what they have. That's unfortunate because you tend to lose the main goal of all this anyway; enjoyment.
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