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Official Panasonic ST50 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 154

post #4591 of 9468
8/5/12 at 5:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp0213x View Post

The oil paint effect was more obvious from the ps3 thumbnail but when the picture was blown up it look fine, didn't have much of a oil paint effect. Man its a great TV but if you aren't happy do what you gotta do.

I mainly wanted to see if you had the oil painting effect. I didn't want to bother you by asking you to play a variety of games to see if you notice the difference.

Some games are more obvious than others. It is readily apparent in the thumbnails but you can also notice it in some gaming wallpapers. The one I showed you wasn't a great example at all. I wish I sent you a better one.

If you have a lot of games/demos from PSN browse through each of them but let it sit on one of the games. Sometimes it will show a full image of the game in the background. It was really noticeable here. I showed a few screen shots of this a few posts back. Check out the Ratchet & Clank in game shot. I first noticed this effect while playing a Ratchet & Clank game.

Here are some photo's from jsynder82 from the UT50 thread that shows exactly what I am talking about and the problem I have.




You can clearly see the "oil painting" effect in the second picture.

I really do want to keep this TV. I really do. It wouldn't even be a huge issue if PS3 had its own scaler so it could handle the upscaling rather than the TV. The 360 does this. That's still not the point though. This shouldn't be an issue. I will have to decide what I want to do. I am going to test more games and see if I find it bothersome enough to warrant returning it for another set.
Edited by Frankie1588 - 8/5/12 at 6:06pm
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post #4592 of 9468
8/5/12 at 6:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhazard View Post

They actually don't, but keep trolling Panasonic threads because of your inferiority complex and insecurity and maybe you'll convince someone someday..... or not.
Um they do - I deal in fact not BS
Quote:
: The Sony KDL-NX720 series produces deeper black levels than any edge-lit LED-based TV we've tested. It evinces relatively accurate color, has a uniform screen for edge-lit LED, and can properly handle 1080p/24 sources. It has a beautiful, thin-profile exterior design with flush Gorilla Glass, it has built-in Wi-Fi, and its Internet suite includes numerous streaming services and widgets.
CNET
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post #4593 of 9468
8/5/12 at 6:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RicFlair View Post

Um they do - I deal in fact not BS
CNET

There is a forum for LCD Flat Panel I visit there also and like the Elite but you like the Sony and thats great but this is a forum for Plasma's and the Panasonic ST50 which most of us decided to buy for price and performance ratio is it perfect no as is no panel but bang for the buck it is the current leader like it or not with AV mags even bestowing it the title.
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post #4594 of 9468
8/5/12 at 7:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RicFlair View Post

Um they do - I deal in fact not BS
CNET
Nowhere in that quote does it say it gives the same blacks as plasma. It's comparing it's blacks to other edge lit LCDs and saying it's the best they've tested as far as those go. So much for your 'facts'.
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post #4595 of 9468
8/5/12 at 7:14pm
Quote:
Performance
Deep black levels are the Sony KDL-NX720's main strength, and although it scored the same 7 in this category as the LG LW5600 and the Samsung UND6400 series, if we had to choose one of the three based purely on performance, it would be the Sony by a nose. Color and video processing are both very good, as is screen uniformity. On the other hand we wish we could enjoy those black levels from wider viewing angles, and anyone who cares about 3D will want to look elsewhere.

You get more from the LED - you get great blacks and smooth motion and great colors can play your games.

I too own a Plasma a Panny to be exact.
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post #4596 of 9468
8/5/12 at 7:28pm
Ya, you forget to post down the negatives bud. XP rolleyes.gif

"The BAD:The expensive KDL-NX720 shows some blooming artifacts and crushes detail in shadows, and its image deteriorates more noticeably than usual when seen from off-angle. The design of its menu and Internet services is lackluster, and Sony does not include 3D glasses. Its 3D image is poor, with significant crosstalk, flicker when dejudder is turned off, and extreme intolerance to head tilt"

Ya....Plus your typical lousy motion smearing, unless you activate 120hz which completely destroys
the look of film making it look like 'video' and adds even more input lag to gaming. And knowing these Sony LCD's
you better believe this set does about 3 frames/40ms+....I'll never game or watch movies 'especially' on ANY LED or LCD ever again. Super OLED? Gimme Gimme!!! tongue.gif
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post #4597 of 9468
8/5/12 at 9:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RicFlair View Post

Sony LED - gives you inky Plasma blacks and an overall better TV .

The blacks arent close. Sony makes a few good sets. Make sure you research their models if you decide to head in that direction. All sets have their trade offs.

If the panny doesnt work out for you give the Samsung plasmas a whirl. They look really nice too.
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post #4598 of 9468
8/6/12 at 12:27am
I have been talking with a user from HDJ who has a PS3 and may not have the oil paint effect that I get with material at 720p. Does anyone else here have a PS3 and wouldn't mind helping me out a bit? I just would like to see how common this problem is and whether a not a replacement could possibly fix this issue.
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post #4599 of 9468
8/6/12 at 1:01am
Frankie, I don't know if this will help but I had a 50st with my PS3 hooked to my Denon AVR-4311CI then into the ST50. I only played GT5 (Grand Turismo 5) and there was no sign of the oil painting that you were talking about. I am not sure if GT5 is set at 1080i/p or 720p. I know the Denon up scales the signal to the ST50. The problem I had was IR after playing for 2 hours. I replaced a 1080i Panasonic plasma that I had for 6 years with the ST50 and I would see IR in the 1080i set but it would disappear after watching the TV. The ST50 still had IR from the tach and speedometer from GT5 after watching TV for several days after playing. I had the ST50 set in game mode.
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post #4600 of 9468
8/6/12 at 2:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie1588 View Post

That is very good to hear! My ST was manufactured in February. Would you mind posting a couple comparison shots for proof? Do you have a PS3? Is it possible to tell what the manufacturing date is without opening the box?
Here is another pic that shows it even more.
http://i47.tinypic.com/15xmx4x.jpg

Same question from me: how can i check the production date before buying a tv?
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post #4601 of 9468
8/6/12 at 5:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp0213x View Post

Finally got my ST50 55 inch up running after running 100hr of slides. I am very impressed with the ST after returning the VT. The ST appears to be much sharper PQ then the VT, I am not sure if it has to do with the filter. When I had my VT I noticed a lot more softness with PQ. The problem was more visible with my box set to 1080i. Changing it over to 720 seemed to help the PQ a bit. The ST doesn't seem to suffer from any of the PQ softness regardless if set 720 or 1080i, looks awesome on both and I am using component video. I think the ST does a better job handling the cable content. The picture is more clean and crisp more defined with all content.

Could this be firmware version related problem since some ST owners seem to be complaining about softness too?
I have so far only SD sources connected to my ST and picture is a bit soft but that was expected feature for 55" TV.

Is there any difference in sound quality from TV build in speakers between ST and VT?
I was only able to compare sounds in store conditions and not side by side but I think it was about the same quality in both units. It would be nice to hear comments about sound quality differencies from someone who has actually had both sets at home.
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post #4602 of 9468
8/6/12 at 6:02am
how do I check hours of use on this set?
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post #4603 of 9468
8/6/12 at 6:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Detonation View Post

Just got my TV recently. One of the first things I've noticed is that the picture doesn't completely fill the screen - there's about an 1/8 inch black gap around the picture. I've adjusted the aspects as well as turned overscan off (HD Size > Size 2) but can't manage to get the picture to fill the entire screen. Is this normal? This is on both antenna and HDMI inputs.

Bump. Can anyone answer this?
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post #4604 of 9468
8/6/12 at 6:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Lebowski View Post

Could this be firmware version related problem since some ST owners seem to be complaining about softness too?
I have so far only SD sources connected to my ST and picture is a bit soft but that was expected feature for 55" TV.
Is there any difference in sound quality from TV build in speakers between ST and VT?
I was only able to compare sounds in store conditions and not side by side but I think it was about the same quality in both units. It would be nice to hear comments about sound quality differencies from someone who has actually had both sets at home.

I don't game but 2 stations that are 720p here in Houston still look great on OTA so I believe its source dependant and rather than hiding the flaws seems to show them in all their weakness kinda the same thing we warn people about when a DILA projector is installed it will show every weakness the source has.
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post #4605 of 9468
8/6/12 at 6:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by grunt66 View Post

Frankie, I don't know if this will help but I had a 50st with my PS3 hooked to my Denon AVR-4311CI then into the ST50. I only played GT5 (Grand Turismo 5) and there was no sign of the oil painting that you were talking about. I am not sure if GT5 is set at 1080i/p or 720p. I know the Denon up scales the signal to the ST50. The problem I had was IR after playing for 2 hours. I replaced a 1080i Panasonic plasma that I had for 6 years with the ST50 and I would see IR in the 1080i set but it would disappear after watching the TV. The ST50 still had IR from the tach and speedometer from GT5 after watching TV for several days after playing. I had the ST50 set in game mode.

Would you mind hooking up the PS3 directly to the TV and trying? You won't notice the issue unless you let the TV upscale the image. Let me know if you notice an oil painting effect in 720p by viewing your friends' avatars and other images that show up when you hover over a game on your harddrive.

I just want to know if this is a widespread issue or if I can possibly avoid getting this problem again by opting for a replacement. I really hope I don't need to go with a different set.
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post #4606 of 9468
8/6/12 at 7:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie1588 View Post

I mainly wanted to see if you had the oil painting effect. I didn't want to bother you by asking you to play a variety of games to see if you notice the difference.
Some games are more obvious than others. It is readily apparent in the thumbnails but you can also notice it in some gaming wallpapers. The one I showed you wasn't a great example at all. I wish I sent you a better one.
If you have a lot of games/demos from PSN browse through each of them but let it sit on one of the games. Sometimes it will show a full image of the game in the background. It was really noticeable here. I showed a few screen shots of this a few posts back. Check out the Ratchet & Clank in game shot. I first noticed this effect while playing a Ratchet & Clank game.
Here are some photo's from jsynder82 from the UT50 thread that shows exactly what I am talking about and the problem I have.


You can clearly see the "oil painting" effect in the second picture.
I really do want to keep this TV. I really do. It wouldn't even be a huge issue if PS3 had its own scaler so it could handle the upscaling rather than the TV. The 360 does this. That's still not the point though. This shouldn't be an issue. I will have to decide what I want to do. I am going to test more games and see if I find it bothersome enough to warrant returning it for another set.

What are your settings on the PS3 and ST50 including aspect etc.?
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post #4607 of 9468
8/6/12 at 7:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

What are your settings on the PS3 and ST50 including aspect etc.?

I am using RGB limited with TV set to match. I have super white turned on on the PS3. Deep color is also set to automatic. I toggled all these settings with no difference.

My TV settings are D-Nice settings after 100 hour panel prep. I tried changing all kinds of settings on the TV and the PS3 and to no avail. I even tried a different HDMI cable and HDMI port.

I am just curious how many others can test this for me so I can determine if a replacement would suffice or if I would have to unfortunately consider another set.
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post #4608 of 9468
8/6/12 at 7:40am
I wonder if all these games that were originally meant to be viewed on a 20 inch monitor are starting to show just how bad they are when blown to 55 inches.
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post #4609 of 9468
8/6/12 at 7:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie1588 View Post

I am using RGB limited with TV set to match. I have super white turned on on the PS3. Deep color is also set to automatic. I toggled all these settings with no difference.
My TV settings are D-Nice settings after 100 hour panel prep. I tried changing all kinds of settings on the TV and the PS3 and to no avail. I even tried a different HDMI cable and HDMI port.
I am just curious how many others can test this for me so I can determine if a replacement would suffice or if I would have to unfortunately consider another set.

It looks like 480, or lower, resolution or the effects of zoom to me.

Have you tried turning off deep color? I've read that it can cause problems.
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post #4610 of 9468
8/6/12 at 7:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

It looks like 480, or lower, resolution or the effects of zoom to me.
Have you tried turning off deep color? I've read that it can cause problems.

Are you saying 720p looks fine on your set from the PS3 or are you telling me what you think the issue is?

Mine doesn't look like low res in 720p. It just has that smudged oil painting look to it. The PS3 is also not being zoomed in. Full with Size 2 is what I have.

Also I have tried toggling deep color with no change at all.
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post #4611 of 9468
8/6/12 at 9:16am
Here's a question do 720p games in general look better on a 42" or a 50"
The biggest set i've gamed on funny enough has been a 46" LCD.
I'd imagine past 50" 1080p would be ideal. Viewing distance is also important obviously. I'd be sitting around 11 feeta way viewing stance wise.
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post #4612 of 9468
8/6/12 at 9:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie1588 View Post

Are you saying 720p looks fine on your set from the PS3 or are you telling me what you think the issue is?
Mine doesn't look like low res in 720p. It just has that smudged oil painting look to it. The PS3 is also not being zoomed in. Full with Size 2 is what I have.
Also I have tried toggling deep color with no change at all.

I don't own a game console. I'm going on the images you posted. I know that D-Nice settings call for all processing to be off but have you tried turning them on one by one? Also, are you playing in custom mode and did you apply D-Nice's settings specifically to the input for the PS3 (I'm assuming that you have more than just the PS3 connected to the tv)?

What I would do is take the game to BB and get them to hook up a PS3 to a ST50 and see what comes up. If you don't see the same thing then document the settings- every single one, going deep into every available option, including the Setup options (no need to document the color settings).
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post #4613 of 9468
8/6/12 at 9:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie1588 View Post

I am using RGB limited with TV set to match. I have super white turned on on the PS3. Deep color is also set to automatic.

Shouldn't it be set to RGB unlimited, instead? Also turn off Deep Colour and Super White. Is it a 720p, 1080i or 1080 game? Could be that the PS3 720p problem has come back, where it is downgrading to 480p instead. Then when the TV upscales the 480p to 1080p you get the oil painting effect.
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post #4614 of 9468
8/6/12 at 11:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by gomess023 View Post

Wow this thread has some serious stans in here. Don't act like you understand everything. This isn't your thread, where everyone follows your itenarary. No not all my questions were spamming about input lag, I dont have a lot of posts I also asked about burn in and static images as this is my first plasma I plan on getting. I only asked the question about three times because no one answered and I was waiting in best buy to buy this set. I asked a specific question that applies to specific people ( those that tried online fps gaming), after I got an answer I didn't come back on the thread. Again let me reiterate it's 2012 and people don't only watch movies and tv. Gaming is huge, amongst all demographics. Two reasonS I didn't use the search feature
1) it's 2012, not everyone's surfs on a computer on thier desk, we are on the move a lot and use our phones and tablets for little things like reading a forum, hell I do office work on my phone. Unfortunately the search feature doesn't work so great all time on a hand held
2) Despite its clunkiness i did use it and I read a lot of the posts and most are very contradicting. Half the people are saying it's feels like no input lag and with another guy even showing 16-17ms response time in game mode. While the other guy I think his name is like josban something continuously saying it has a bad input lag. So yeah lots of contradicting info.
So I thought I would ask a direct question that only if you experience it can answer. So calm down, take a chill pill, relax if there are some questions you can't answer.

Hey, Stan . . . You just asked about lag on the ST50 again yesterday after posting this, but ON THE LCD FLAT PANEL THREAD!

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1131464/input-lag-wars-post-your-input-lag-results-of-your-lcd-display-here-for-reference/3600#post_22279808

To quote you . . . "lots of contradicting info" . . . That won't change no matter how many times you ask. Save your thumbs.
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post #4615 of 9468
8/6/12 at 12:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wallijonn View Post

Shouldn't it be set to RGB unlimited, instead? Also turn off Deep Colour and Super White. Is it a 720p, 1080i or 1080 game? Could be that the PS3 720p problem has come back, where it is downgrading to 480p instead. Then when the TV upscales the 480p to 1080p you get the oil painting effect.

RGB Full or limited doesn't matter because you can set the TV accordingly. I did try both anyways with no difference.

Also if a game is displaying 720p then it will say so. If I force 1080i/p and 480p and the game doesn't support software scaling to 1080i/p then it drops to 480p and says so in the info bar. I get this effect in any resolution outside of 1080i/p. Again this is not a problem on 360 or my DVR cable box because they can both be set via hardware scaled to 1080i/p so it will not depend on the TV for up scaling like the PS3 does.

I also tried altering many settings like the next poster mentioned regarding deep color and super white. No change. I actually asked best buy if they could hook up a ps3 and they thought I wanted to bring mine in. They said no because my ps3 might have a virus lmao. Not sure how I would unleash a virus to a TV never mind doing so with an HDMI cable.

I also see this effect when I watch an HD broadcast in 720p. I can have it set to 1080i so its not a big deal. I just don't understand if people consider this oil painting effect to be normal. It looks incredibly smudged with a clear oil painting look.
Edited by Frankie1588 - 8/6/12 at 1:01pm
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post #4616 of 9468
8/6/12 at 2:07pm
I wasn't sure what to search for, tried "viera connect", no real answers. Anyone have an issue connecting via wifi, to stream Amazon (or anything)? I connected once, but most of the time says I have no connection. I have Linksys wrt54g, sitting within 10' of the TV. I have other stuff connected to the 4 wired connectors, so I was hoping wireless would work. Any good troubleshooting guides?
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post #4617 of 9468
8/6/12 at 2:19pm
I am considering a 60" ST50 and GT50. I am mostly a TV watcher (OTA and TW Cable) and will likely do via Tivo. Which would be the better one and does the ST50 also have the same buzzing issue?
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post #4618 of 9468
8/6/12 at 2:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tcat View Post

I wasn't sure what to search for, tried "viera connect", no real answers. Anyone have an issue connecting via wifi, to stream Amazon (or anything)? I connected once, but most of the time says I have no connection. I have Linksys wrt54g, sitting within 10' of the TV. I have other stuff connected to the 4 wired connectors, so I was hoping wireless would work. Any good troubleshooting guides?

Did you go through the setup and enter your password? Have you tried setting the address manually? Can you see the tv through your router?
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post #4619 of 9468
8/6/12 at 2:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by biguvula View Post

I am considering a 60" ST50 and GT50. I am mostly a TV watcher (OTA and TW Cable) and will likely do via Tivo. Which would be the better one and does the ST50 also have the same buzzing issue?

The GT50 doesn't have any more buzzing issues than any other properly functioning Panasonic. What is the environment like where the tv will live? Do you plan to get the tv professionally calibrated?
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post #4620 of 9468
8/6/12 at 2:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie1588 View Post

RGB Full or limited doesn't matter because you can set the TV accordingly. I did try both anyways with no difference.
Also if a game is displaying 720p then it will say so. If I force 1080i/p and 480p and the game doesn't support software scaling to 1080i/p then it drops to 480p and says so in the info bar. I get this effect in any resolution outside of 1080i/p. Again this is not a problem on 360 or my DVR cable box because they can both be set via hardware scaled to 1080i/p so it will not depend on the TV for up scaling like the PS3 does.
I also tried altering many settings like the next poster mentioned regarding deep color and super white. No change. I actually asked best buy if they could hook up a ps3 and they thought I wanted to bring mine in. They said no because my ps3 might have a virus lmao. Not sure how I would unleash a virus to a TV never mind doing so with an HDMI cable.
I also see this effect when I watch an HD broadcast in 720p. I can have it set to 1080i so its not a big deal. I just don't understand if people consider this oil painting effect to be normal. It looks incredibly smudged with a clear oil painting look.

I'd take the game in, not call, and get the sympathy of one of the salespersons to hook it up for me. It's worth a try- no?

I'm sorry if I missed it, but how far are you sitting from the tv? I must admit that I don't see an oil painting/smudged effect on the pictures you posted earlier but instead an effect that looks like looking at a print through a magnifying glass. That's the reason for some of my questions, however your further comments about HD in 780 & 1080i, as it relates to your problem, leave me puzzled. Maybe just looking at another ST50 at BB with a cable feed could lead you to the answer you're looking for. You could also take some 720 material on a thumb drive to test - be sure to check it on your tv first though.
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