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Captivators and Submersive comparison in my room - Page 4

post #91 of 263
3/6/12 at 10:12pm
Carp, I forgot to tell you that when I had my Hp's I never even used them for music. At that time I had Legacy Focus SE's and ran them full range. The Focus SE's, with the (4) 12" drivers had the cleanest, deepest bass I have ever heard from a tower. That is how I stumbled upon the Caps.
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post #92 of 263
3/7/12 at 5:53am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post



Honey Badger don't give a $*# ...That's a tough call.


ha -- for those that don't know the reference

I made the mistake of reading the posts about the Honey Badger (and playing the clip with the sound muted) while my students were reading quietly. It was like when you are in church and you're trying to keep yourself from laughing but you can't stop.

Next time a guy is going on and on about how his sub destroys everything else that will be the question for him. The Honey Badger has set the new standard.

"My sub kills your sub!!"

"I see... well, can it take down a Honey Badger??"
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post #93 of 263
3/7/12 at 5:56am
Thread Starter 
Kids are gone, just watched the clip with the sound on. Crying laughing right now.
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post #94 of 263
3/7/12 at 6:13am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carlm9 View Post

Carp,
I don't blame you,we are talking close to $7k on subwoofers. As for me, after talking to both you and Arch I decided to go with another powered Cap with the 4000w amp, run them up front and maybe even add some Cinema 12's, using the Caps as stands, sound familiar?

I am a little leary about the C12's. I am still looking for some Klipsch Ultra KL650's, but want to talk to someone that has heard both. Talk to you soon and thanks for the help.

Jason

So Jeff still had Caps with the 4000 watt amp? Nice. Let me know what you think of having duals. Try putting both Caps in the same corner just to see how crazy the output can be. I did it last night for the first time with passive Caps and it was a significant difference over having each in its own corner. Smooth frequency response be damned.
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post #95 of 263
3/7/12 at 6:16am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by carlm9 View Post

Carp, I forgot to tell you that when I had my Hp's I never even used them for music. At that time I had Legacy Focus SE's and ran them full range. The Focus SE's, with the (4) 12" drivers had the cleanest, deepest bass I have ever heard from a tower. That is how I stumbled upon the Caps.

Oh, I didn't know that. What did you crossover the Legacy speakers for movies?
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post #96 of 263
3/7/12 at 7:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post


Haha, no didn't want to mess with that. When we demo'd the Die Hard scene with the corner loaded co-located dual Caps the Submersive wouldn't have had a chance anyway.

He told me he loved the subs but somehow expected more (he has no experience with listening to subs, just reading the forums). I have always felt the same way. The real life experiences never reach the descriptions that you read. I remember buying my first SVS cylinder a decade ago and expecting this house shaking crazy beast to arrive... ah... no.

The one exception is hearing the dual Orbit Shifters. That made all other subs seem like toys in my opinion.

I don't mean for music, I like the Submersive better, and I don't mean for movies and sane regular levels - the OS was just like the other great subs at those levels.

But when it's let loose and ran way hot the Orbit Shifter's truly deliver on all those over the top comments that you see about Subwoofers on this forum. (some of those comments made by me too over the years!!)

I run my OS's level matched with the other speakers and they sound great. But I agree, there are a number of subs that could do that and it has been a while since I let them off the leash. Will have to do that this weekend just for kicks. Very much like having a fast car, if you don't occasionally use it, what's the point?
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post #97 of 263
3/7/12 at 7:20pm
How you feeling tonight carp?
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post #98 of 263
3/7/12 at 7:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Kids are gone, just watched the clip with the sound on. Crying laughing right now.

I would have never watched it without this post. Thanks a lot. Friggin hilarious.
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post #99 of 263
3/7/12 at 8:28pm
Carp, you're killing me. You know the SubM was also my favorite. I demand a listen when you get the goods.

I recently decided to put up a wall in my bsmnt and go ahead with a dedicated HT so that cuts my cubic footage in half (doubles the planning now though). I started a little build thread in the dedicated HT section and I am hoping for lots of feedback.

Now it will be only 2700 cubes. Maybe I'll have to let a SubM go all Honey Badger on it!

But, now that I will have a false wall an Orbit Shifter will fit behind it..........

Ah, then there is the sweet sound of the SubM. I remember when it started playing at Archaea's meet we both had sudden grins.
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post #100 of 263
3/8/12 at 4:55am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

How you feeling tonight carp?

Ha, I was so tired I crashed before 9:00 last night and didn't even go into the basement. Maybe I didn't go because I didn't want to see my lonely, empty, room.

On top of that, I've lost my speakers stands, well I guess one of them since I'll use the Submersive on one side. Time to talk to Alex at eD.
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post #101 of 263
3/8/12 at 5:07am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jedimastergrant View Post

Carp, you're killing me. You know the SubM was also my favorite. I demand a listen when you get the goods.

I recently decided to put up a wall in my bsmnt and go ahead with a dedicated HT so that cuts my cubic footage in half (doubles the planning now though). I started a little build thread in the dedicated HT section and I am hoping for lots of feedback.

Now it will be only 2700 cubes. Maybe I'll have to let a SubM go all Honey Badger on it!

But, now that I will have a false wall an Orbit Shifter will fit behind it..........

Ah, then there is the sweet sound of the SubM. I remember when it started playing at Archaea's meet we both had sudden grins.

You should come over this weekend and check it out! I'm buying the sub I borrowed from Counsil so you could hear what that is like in a 3300 cu ft room. I already know I'm going to buy another one of course.
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post #102 of 263
3/8/12 at 5:10am
Thread Starter 
*Homer Simpson voice*

Ohhhhhh false wall with an Orbit Shifter behind it.....
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post #103 of 263
3/8/12 at 5:13am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morrischestnut60 View Post

I would have never watched it without this post. Thanks a lot. Friggin hilarious.

Haha, yeah.

Our school recently switched mascots to the Ravens. I would have preferred Honey Badgers. T-shirts would rule. Picture of a Honey Badger half passed out from venom eating a snake's head on the front. The back has the quote, "Honey Badger don't care...Honey Badger don't give a ****."
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post #104 of 263
3/8/12 at 9:27am
There's already a Honey Badger T Shirt
http://www.snorgtees.com/t-shirts/ho...ger-don-t-care
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post #105 of 263
3/8/12 at 10:28am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jedimastergrant View Post

Carp, you're killing me. You know the SubM was also my favorite. I demand a listen when you get the goods.

I recently decided to put up a wall in my bsmnt and go ahead with a dedicated HT so that cuts my cubic footage in half (doubles the planning now though). I started a little build thread in the dedicated HT section and I am hoping for lots of feedback.

Now it will be only 2700 cubes. Maybe I'll have to let a SubM go all Honey Badger on it!

But, now that I will have a false wall an Orbit Shifter will fit behind it..........

Ah, then there is the sweet sound of the SubM. I remember when it started playing at Archaea's meet we both had sudden grins.



Here is a link to Grant's basement for those who are interested, great looking space and I love the idea of closing it off with a new wall.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post21738911
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post #106 of 263
3/8/12 at 11:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mojomike View Post

I think you might be missing the point that bhazard was trying to make. It's not about power. The amp in powered Cap, much like the amp in the Submersive, uses DSP processing to optimize the performance of the sub it's powering. It flattens and tailors the response as well as provides limiters and filters and such. The passive Captivator doesn't get the benefit of DSP processing and optimization unless the user has the external equipment to do what would be done inside the amp of the powered sub. Did you optimize the performance of your Caps and tailor them to their peak performance? If not, they were performing at a disadvantage compared with the Submersive which had been factory tweaked by Seaton.

Thank you for pointing this out. The powered version sounds much better due to the built in DSP. The passive versions can be upgraded to powered.
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post #107 of 263
3/8/12 at 1:22pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Permanian View Post

Thank you for pointing this out. The powered version sounds much better due to the built in DSP. The passive versions can be upgraded to powered.


I agree that the powered version sounds awesome, I heard it at the first GTG back in May. However I did prefer the Submersive for music even then. For movies my preference was the opposite, but music is my priority (not by as wide a margin as before.)

Also, I do have (did, it's getting fixed now) a sms-1 so I experimented with all kinds of frequency responses including flat, house, mid-bass hump, etc.

I have to admit this (to myself too...)

My ultimate goal is to have dual Submersives nearfield for music only and Dual Orbit Shifters up front for movies only.

There I said it.
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post #108 of 263
3/8/12 at 1:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

I agree that the powered version sounds awesome, I heard it at the first GTG back in May. However I did prefer the Submersive for music even then. For movies my preference was the opposite, but music is my priority (not by as wide a margin as before.)

Also, I do have (did, it's getting fixed now) a sms-1 so I experimented with all kinds of frequency responses including flat, house, mid-bass hump, etc.

I have to admit this (to myself too...)

My ultimate goal is to have dual Submersives nearfield for music only and Dual Orbit Shifters up front for movies only.

There I said it.

Hey Carp, keep it up and you will catch my illness. It will never stop and it has nothing to due with if something may be better or not, it is just tryinbg out new things! At least you managed to free up some room going smaller! Then again there is always the CapS! I really enjoy trying out new stuff because even when I keep what I think sounds or performs best to me I still get bored and want to try something new.
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post #109 of 263
3/8/12 at 2:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

I really enjoy trying out new stuff because even when I keep what I think sounds or performs best to me I still get bored and want to try something new.

This is our greatest strength/weakness as audio enthusiasts. Common sense would be to buy a system and keep it until it dies. Like you, I feel we only live once, and I would rather experiment and find new things/new ways to enjoy myself with this hobby. It is expensive, and it has killed my savings ability, but when I die all that money saved won't do much for me in the grave. I'd rather live and spend a bit while I'm still young (just turned 30).

This mindset has brought me much satisfaction with my new system. I would have never had any of the equipment I currently have without this forum. I would have never known the awesomeness of the SubM, or how XT32 fixed most of the problems with my room. Sure I'm out a few thousand because of it, but it was well worth the money spent to me.

If a girl points out how unnecessary and expensive all the audio equipment is, I just point to her shoe closet.
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post #110 of 263
3/8/12 at 3:17pm
Thanks for the link Carp. I have not had many replies so I hope this helps. Maybe I need to give some more pictures of the space or ask a few more questions but I need all the help I can get while in the planning stages. I am down in the bsmnt now doing some measurements to see if an Orbit Shifter will fit. Behind the screen near the middle....yes. In the corners.....almost.

I think I will wait till you get a twin for your SubM and then take a listen. I know first hand how much more insane twins are. My 8 month old boys are overwhelming right now. I just ordered a bumper sticker for my wife that says "Experience Wild Life..Raise Twins".

I think I will name my subwoofer "Honey Badger".

150,000 cubic feet? Honey Badger don't care!
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post #111 of 263
3/8/12 at 3:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhazard View Post

This is our greatest strength/weakness as audio enthusiasts. Common sense would be to buy a system and keep it until it dies. .

For many it is a sickness. Buy, sell, buy some more. Never content, for some it is the "buy" aspect, the purchase, the new toy.
I have thought about this frequently. Why is there so few women here at the forums? Guess their not interested in audio equipment or extremes.
And realize this, for most this "never content, buy more" behavior would not go on if it were not for this forum, or others like the ID or manufacturer's forums. The comparos, GTGs, the dialog, the bravado feeds this appetite. Hey some have more money than they know what to do with it and it doesn't hurt. But for some with limited or finite resources, its a deep hole.
The never satisfied illness......it is pretty common.
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post #112 of 263
3/8/12 at 4:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by polizzio View Post

For many it is a sickness. Buy, sell, buy some more. Never content, for some it is the "buy" aspect, the purchase, the new toy.
I have thought about this frequently. Why is there so few women here at the forums? Guess their not interested in audio equipment or extremes.
And realize this, for most this "never content, buy more" behavior would not go on if it were not for this forum, or others like the ID or manufacturer's forums. The comparos, GTGs, the dialog, the bravado feeds this appetite. Hey some have more money than they know what to do with it and it doesn't hurt. But for some with limited or finite resources, its a deep hole.
The never satisfied illness......it is pretty common.

Since I added the 3rd Submersive, and then upgraded the amps to HP amps, I have completely cured my "upgraditis." I have no further urge to add more or "better" subs. These subs do everything I could ask of them with ease and aplomb.

I once wrote an employee evaluation for one of the best employees I've ever had. Under "Suggestions for Improvement", I simply wrote, "Improvement not possible or necessary." I feel the same way about these subs.

I hope MK gets to that point some day.

Craig
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post #113 of 263
3/8/12 at 4:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post

I once wrote an employee evaluation for one of the best employees I've ever had. Under "Suggestions for Improvement", I simply wrote, "Improvement not possible or necessary."

That's when you know your employee is in the wrong position.

.....or you are!!

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post #114 of 263
3/8/12 at 5:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by polizzio View Post

For many it is a sickness. Buy, sell, buy some more. Never content, for some it is the "buy" aspect, the purchase, the new toy.
I have thought about this frequently. Why is there so few women here at the forums? Guess their not interested in audio equipment or extremes.
And realize this, for most this "never content, buy more" behavior would not go on if it were not for this forum, or others like the ID or manufacturer's forums. The comparos, GTGs, the dialog, the bravado feeds this appetite. Hey some have more money than they know what to do with it and it doesn't hurt. But for some with limited or finite resources, its a deep hole.
The never satisfied illness......it is pretty common.

This is our crack!
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post #115 of 263
3/8/12 at 5:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by the Son View Post

That's when you know your employee is in the wrong position.

.....or you are!!


Cute.
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post #116 of 263
3/8/12 at 5:24pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jedimastergrant View Post

Thanks for the link Carp. I have not had many replies so I hope this helps. Maybe I need to give some more pictures of the space or ask a few more questions but I need all the help I can get while in the planning stages. I am down in the bsmnt now doing some measurements to see if an Orbit Shifter will fit. Behind the screen near the middle....yes. In the corners.....almost.

I think I will wait till you get a twin for your SubM and then take a listen. I know first hand how much more insane twins are. My 8 month old boys are overwhelming right now. I just ordered a bumper sticker for my wife that says "Experience Wild Life..Raise Twins".

I think I will name my subwoofer "Honey Badger".

150,000 cubic feet? Honey Badger don't care!

Almost meaning it's not do-able?

Ok, I'll let you know when it gets here. I went ahead and bought one, should be here in a couple weeks.

I like that you are still considering the OS by the way!!
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post #117 of 263
3/8/12 at 7:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post


I hope MK gets to that point some day.

Craig

Put the shoe on the other foot. Perhaps upon hearing MK's system, mains and subs, you might find yourself wanting...
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post #118 of 263
3/8/12 at 8:11pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Hey Carp, keep it up and you will catch my illness. It will never stop and it has nothing to due with if something may be better or not, it is just tryinbg out new things! At least you managed to free up some room going smaller! Then again there is always the CapS! I really enjoy trying out new stuff because even when I keep what I think sounds or performs best to me I still get bored and want to try something new.

For me it's not as much about the curiosity, at least not yet. As of now, I know exactly what I want since I've heard a lot of subs in the past year.

Case in point. I'm completely happy with my speakers now that I have great sound for both music and movies all in one speaker. I can't see myself changing. I guess a good test to see if I have the disease will be if I start thinking about changing speakers - I just can't see that happening.

No, for me I just want the type of headroom I heard at the GTG with the Orbit Shifters for movies combined with the Submersives for music. I guess I'm half way there!! Well, not as far as dollars go, but as far as subs go.

I have officially ordered the 2nd Submersive so now the decision becomes do I put them both in the right front corner, seperate them in each front corner, or put them both nearfield. In the short term I think I'll go seperate in each front corner so I don't have to buy speaker stands right away.

I'm looking forward to doing a lot of experimenting, problem is I did not take Luke's advice and take some of the money from the Cap sale and buy an omnimic.

I guess that means you have to come over some more Luke!!
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post #119 of 263
3/8/12 at 11:44pm
The Omnimic is a valuable tool but remember.....sounds, like vision, tastes, smells.....is a very.....very subjective thing! Trust your ears and your gut carp.
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post #120 of 263
3/9/12 at 10:25am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabalocker View Post

The Omnimic is a valuable tool but remember.....sounds, like vision, tastes, smells.....is a very.....very subjective thing! Trust your ears and your gut carp.

Agreed, I'm glad I did, I'm loving the Submersive.

However, I really did love those Caps too. Have you guys noticed that it seems like the only head to head sub comparison where owners of either don't get their panties in a wad and start bashing the other sub or say how great their sub is in comparison is when the Captivator and Submersive are compared?

It's nice that there is a mutual respect for the capabilities for each sub from their respective owners.

In fact when I started this thread I was pretty confident that it wouldn't turn into a "my sub is better than your sub" thread and not surprisingly, it hasn't.
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