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Official Samsung UNxxES8000 Owner's Thread - Page 369

post #11041 of 16125
Can someone post their new Standard settings after the updates? I reset mine and then updated the few suggested and the picture looks off. I've adjusted a few things and it looks better. Previously my tones were on the cool side. They look better with some of my tweeks but from the comments here, it makes it sounds like they found the holy grail and would be interested to see their full settings.
Edited by metalsaber - 1/30/13 at 10:00am
post #11042 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalsaber View Post

Can someone post their new Standard settings after the updates? I reset mine and then updated the few suggested and the picture looks off. I've adjusted a few things and it looks better. Previously my tones were on the cool side. They look better with some of my tweeks but from the comments here, it makes it sounds like they found the holy grail and would be interested to see their full settings.
If the picture is too cool try adjusting the color temperature to warm1 or warm2.
post #11043 of 16125
Hi, can someone give me some advise about av receivers ? does it improve picture quality on the es8000? as that would be my only reason for giving the receiver if it improves picture quality especially for cable , my budget is $ 500
post #11044 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10k View Post

If the picture is too cool try adjusting the color temperature to warm1 or warm2.

I did and it looks better but still not "magical" as some have described. haha
post #11045 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by seansingh7326 View Post

Hi, can someone give me some advise about av receivers ? does it improve picture quality on the es8000? as that would be my only reason for giving the receiver if it improves picture quality especially for cable , my budget is $ 500

Simple answer is no. Buy a receiver/speakers to improve sound quality...not picture.
post #11046 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by seansingh7326 View Post

Hi, can someone give me some advise about av receivers ? does it improve picture quality on the es8000? as that would be my only reason for giving the receiver if it improves picture quality especially for cable , my budget is $ 500

You need a video processor/scaler, Check out the DVDO EDGE GREEN http://www.amazon.com/DVDO-High-Definition-Processor-Connectivity-Solution/dp/B001OOZU8I/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359571864&sr=8-1&keywords=dvdo+edge+green
post #11047 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

Which mode, Eagle. I know yours seems a little worse off than other, but on the 7500, I'm really not seeing a difference in Standard but Movie mode for me is much better than before.

Edit:
Sorry, just saw your other post. Being you have a 7500, it's not surprising me you're not seeing a difference. Personally, I can't imagine my Standard mode having less flashlighting than it already has though.

I'm using standard mode, and the "V" is very hard to see on some material, and other material, it's still very much there. It isn't even consistent on blacks. Sometimes the screen is very dark, or the bottom of the screen is in complete darkness, and I notice the "V" is virtually gone. Then, a few scenes later, the "right" amount of black is on screen and there's the "V" again. Very stange It certainly hasn't gone away, it just becomes more visible depending on what's on screen, and the shade of black. I also think contrast plays a part in how visible it is. If the bottom of the screen happens to be all black, but in the middle of the screen there's some bright parts, the bright parts seem to make the "V" extremely hard to see, to the point where it doesn't appear to be there at all.sometimes. But if the whole screen is darker, that's when it is most visible.

Movie mode is much worse - the "V" and other large blotches of clouding is just awful. In standard mode it's at least kept to a minimum at most times.

I'll post my full 2D and 3D standard settings later for anyone who is curious to give them a try. I spent a ton of time trying to get the color looking good to correct for the tint of the glasses, and I think I did pretty good.
post #11048 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

E2-

RE: "Standard still has just as much auto-dimming as ever for me - I still use the workaround and I can't see myself ever not needing to use it. With the workaround, standard seems the best mode for me - it offers the best image quality with the lowest backlight setting. Movie mode still needs to be set around 5 points higher to equal the brightness of standard mode. Standard mode is set to 7, and it's plenty bright enough at that setting. Movie mode on 7 is quite dim - noticeably dimmer than standard at 7, and too dim to enjoy viewing. At 12, it looks more like standard in terms of brightness, but then the "V" is much more visible thanks to the increased backlight. And I think movie mode just looks too dull and murky honestly, compared to standard. Standard looks quite natural to me - not blown out, not over-saturated - just natural. I have things pretty nicely balanced now. Movie mode just doesn't seem to compare."

I am not sure if this is the difference between the 8000 and other sets but there is a profound difference in how dimming is working on my TV after firmware update 1046 - - and for the better. The "V" is gone. Extremely dark black, inky blacks and absolutely pristine colors - - I mean I looked at CNN last night and even an old movie and I could not believe my eyes! Not trying to be a fanboy - - I'm just amazed that one firmware update can have this big a change in PQ.

As I mentioned in an earlier post - - "Standard" setting with all other processing off, Color Tone is "Standard" with "Auto" for Color Space. Brightness at 40 - Contrast at 90 - Backlight at 10. All other default settings.

Can this be the difference in dimming between the larger 65" 8000 and the other models?

Dimming is still present - - and a great way to check is to invoke the menu where you make your changes and you can see things going on. But I can see movie credits now. Before, they would dim out. Much more detail and the "V," for me, is gone. And without question, the blackest blacks I've ever seen on my TV.

Again, for all users, it seems that YMMV. Not sure why.

Very curious. Yeah, it may just be the different zones of the 8000 coming into play vs the 7500. Wish I knew. For me there really hasn't been any big changes since the update. Thankfully things haven't gotten worse, just the same. And the issue with the hub screen popping up after turning on the set is thankfully fixed now which is a big relief.
post #11049 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by seansingh7326 View Post

Hi, can someone give me some advise about av receivers ? does it improve picture quality on the es8000? as that would be my only reason for giving the receiver if it improves picture quality especially for cable , my budget is $ 500
Nope. There are some AVRs that supposedly upgrade the incoming signal, but not in your price range (they are usually over a grand). There are other standalone gizmos that are supposed to upgrade the image but I don't have any familiarity with them.
post #11050 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

Very very interesting. Thanks, man. That would explain why the definition of Dynamic Contrast almost perfectly matches that of Micro Dimming, and Black Enhancer in Movie mode definitely creates a CE Dimming feature. This would also explain why Black Enhancer is not able to be activated in Standard - because it's always on. But based on this, I'm surprised Dynamic Contrast can be activated in Standard, because like CE Dimming, I can tell something similar (Micro Dimming?) is always on in Standard. Almost as if adding Dynamic Contrast to Standard mode is doubling the amount that it's using. This would also explain why I can get Standard and Movie modes to look more closely alike by having Dynamic Contrast ON in movie mode but OFF in Standard mode.

I've noticed a similar effect. Having dynamic contrast on in movie mode helps it approach, but not reach, the appearance of standard mode with dynamic contrast off. Sometimes I have dynamic contrast on for standard mode, but for every scene it appears to help, there's another scene where it seems to hurt. It definitely seems to be a bit too much at times, even at low. Like you said, turning it on for standard almost seems like it's "doubling up" on the dynamic contrast. Myself I prefer a natural looking image, with maybe just a bit of punch, but not over-saturated or over-contrasty.
post #11051 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharkcohen View Post

What is this "V" that I keep reading about?

The infamous "V" is a pair of "clouds/clouding" that exist on some/many? of these panels near the bottom center of the screen, both at angles that appear to form almost a perfect "V" shape. It's most noticeable when the screen is displaying dark content. Some sets seem to have it and some don't. It always puzzled me that so many sets have the exact same clouding - it must be something to do with that are of the panel being a problem, or pehaps something behind the screen over-tightened, putting pressure on the panel. I still don't know why a tech can't just come and loosen the screws if that's all it would take ti relieve the stress and eliminate that are of clouding.
post #11052 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by llorc View Post

So Eagle_2 ,please post your current Settings
looks very nice !

llorc

I'll get them posted later this evening if I can find the time.
post #11053 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by eagle_2 View Post

The infamous "V" is a pair of "clouds/clouding" that exist on some/many? of these panels near the bottom center of the screen, both at angles that appear to form almost a perfect "V" shape. It's most noticeable when the screen is displaying dark content. Some sets seem to have it and some don't. It always puzzled me that so many sets have the exact same clouding - it must be something to do with that are of the panel being a problem, or pehaps something behind the screen over-tightened, putting pressure on the panel. I still don't know why a tech can't just come and loosen the screws if that's all it would take ti relieve the stress and eliminate that are of clouding.

Thanks for catching me up. I don't believe I have the V on my 55".
post #11054 of 16125
Has anyone purchased the 60" this past 2 weeks? if so, can you post what your build date and panel version is? I'm about to purchase another 60" and I'm curious which build dates are out now. Thanks
post #11055 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony5362 View Post

Rico, have you checked out Standard def on your direct TV yet? I know standard def sucks and I never watch anything but HD, but check it out now with this update. It looks so much better now. Almost close to HD.. Atleast that's how it looked with my Comcast cable.. I would imagine direct TV would look even better?

I can vouch for this as we always have Nick Jr. on for the kids. When I first got my ES last March, I remember thinking that SD channels looked better overall vs my D8000. And after this latest update it looks remarkably better than it did before (even when you stretch the picture which I don't normally do). I usually hate watching programs in SD, but if I had to pick a set to do that on it would definitely be this one
post #11056 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by gamermwm View Post

I can vouch for this as we always have Nick Jr. on for the kids. When I first got my ES last March, I remember thinking that SD channels looked better overall vs my D8000. And after this latest update it looks remarkably better than it did before (even when you stretch the picture which I don't normally do). I usually hate watching programs in SD, but if I had to pick a set to do that on it would definitely be this one

Lol! The stretching is so true. I was just checking to see just for curiosity because my Apple TV looks like Blu ray quality now, and my cable HD, depending on what channel, looks very close, so I checked HBO in std just to see, and i was shocked. I never saw any other TV look so good in Sd before. Honestly, the picture on my Apple TV now is so vivid and crystal clear where you see all actors makeup. So I checked my E8000 plasma, and yea it looks good from the update, but no where near as vivid, and sharp as this LED. What I mean is, I can't see the actors imperfections on the Plasma like I can with the 60" LED.
post #11057 of 16125
I was watching ottawa showing washing how its done last nite and even though the picture is sharp and clear I still find it hard to flow the puck, but if I use the stretch option it brings you in closer to the action.

I also watch a few sd programing and love the wide fit for them.
post #11058 of 16125
I wish I had the $9K to spend on the 75" ES9000 just to put side by side with my ES8000, because I seriously think they would look exactly the same right now after this last update. From what I've been hearing, the ES9000 has had no flash lighting and better black levels from the beginning, where as the 8000 had these issues, but doesn't anymore after this update. It would make total sense if Samsung waited to release this update so that the ES9000 really shines as the "top" model and now that its at the end of its cycle, and it didn't sell as well as they thought, they just released the update to make the 8000 to be on the same picture quality level. This is just my feeling and a few others around here. I'm not saying this is what happened, because I really don't know, I'm just saying that I wouldn't be surprised because when I saw the ES8000 at CES on the bright show room floor last year, it looked just like it does now. Inky black levels, and no flashlighting in the corners and excellent uniformity. Even the folks at Cnet loved it there, but not when they got the test model to review. Maybe they also thought the same as I do which is why they gave it such a bad review. Maybe if they went to review it now, it would get a way better review.idk..
post #11059 of 16125
SD material still looks horrible on my TV. Marvell QDEO processing probably makes it worse - - trying to upscale an already inferior signal.

No banana Anthony. mad.gif
post #11060 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

SD material still looks horrible on my TV. Marvell QDEO processing probably makes it worse - - trying to upscale an already inferior signal.

No banana Anthony. mad.gif

When I checked my 65" with my Onkyo upscaling it, Sd didn't look good either. Its on my 60" where the sd looks better. I would think the opposite since the receiver is upscaling to 1080p and nothing is upscaling the signal to 1080p on my 60". Its just 1080i and 720p with Comcast
post #11061 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony5362 View Post

When I checked my 65" with my Onkyo upscaling it, Sd didn't look good either. Its on my 60" where the sd looks better. I would think the opposite since the receiver is upscaling to 1080p and nothing is upscaling the signal to 1080p on my 60". Its just 1080i and 720p with Comcast

Hey - if it looks good on other TV's - - then great! I've just never been able to watch much SD content (like, zero!) since the advent of HDTV. If I had kept an old 17" Color TV around, I probably could watch it but with our beautiful Sammy picture on my 65" - I skip by all those channels.

Also - maybe native handling of SD content is better on 60"? Also smaller screen?
post #11062 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony5362 View Post

I wish I had the $9K to spend on the 75" ES9000 just to put side by side with my ES8000, because I seriously think they would look exactly the same right now after this last update. From what I've been hearing, the ES9000 has had no flash lighting and better black levels from the beginning, where as the 8000 had these issues, but doesn't anymore after this update. It would make total sense if Samsung waited to release this update so that the ES9000 really shines as the "top" model and now that its at the end of its cycle, and it didn't sell as well as they thought, they just released the update to make the 8000 to be on the same picture quality level. This is just my feeling and a few others around here. I'm not saying this is what happened, because I really don't know, I'm just saying that I wouldn't be surprised because when I saw the ES8000 at CES on the bright show room floor last year, it looked just like it does now. Inky black levels, and no flashlighting in the corners and excellent uniformity. Even the folks at Cnet loved it there, but not when they got the test model to review. Maybe they also thought the same as I do which is why they gave it such a bad review. Maybe if they went to review it now, it would get a way better review.idk..

I hear ya man. Well the 75ES9000 is basically just an overpriced, oversized D8000 (both have edge lit dimming & similar features). And I remember you saying you have a D8000 so just take some side by side features fed with the same bluray source, to your ES8000 with the latest update. I for one would like to see the comparison
post #11063 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

I've just never been able to watch much SD content (like, zero!) since the advent of HDTV...I skip by all those channels.

As you said, I believe it's because you don't watch any SDTV so you don't notice the subtle differences. I've got the 55" ES8000 and I'm sure of the improvement, based on my hours and hours as a captive audience watching kid shows haha
post #11064 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony5362 View Post

When I checked my 65" with my Onkyo upscaling it, Sd didn't look good either. Its on my 60" where the sd looks better. I would think the opposite since the receiver is upscaling to 1080p and nothing is upscaling the signal to 1080p on my 60". Its just 1080i and 720p with Comcast

That's actually one of the biggest misconceptions regarding these TVs. Most people think they need a source device that is going to upscale so they get a better picture, which in most cases is simply not true. The thing that most people don't realize is that your TV is already upscaling any signal it gets to 1080P, unless the source signal is already 1080P. The fact of the matter is that the TV will almost always do a better job of upscaling than your device will. I used to NEVER let any of my devices do the upscaling. I now however let my new Elite AVR do the upscaling because I believe it probably does a better job than the TV would. Probably not by much, but hey...

So, you should never let any device upscale the signal unless you believe it will do a better job than the TV will on it's own, which it normally won't, unless you have good equipment with very good video processing.

Now that is out of the way (until people start disagreeing with me), even though your source on your 60" isn't dong any upscaling, your TV is, and does a very good job of it.
post #11065 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

That's actually one of the biggest misconceptions regarding these TVs. Most people think they need a source device that is going to upscale so they get a better picture, which in most cases is simply not true. The thing that most people don't realize is that your TV is already upscaling any signal it gets to 1080P, unless the source signal is already 1080P. The fact of the matter is that the TV will almost always do a better job of upscaling than your device will do. I NEVER let any of my devices to the upscaling. I do however let my new Elite AVR do the upscaling because I believe it probably does a better job than the TV would. Probably not by much, but hey...

So, you should never let any device upscale the signal unless you believe it will do a better job than the TV will on it's own, which it normally won't, unless you have good equipment with very good video processing.

Now that is out of the way (until people start disagreeing with me), even though your source on your 60" isn't dong any upscaling, your TV is, and does a very good job of it.

Jestered - I may have asked this before and I apologize if I'm repeating myself - - what model is your Pioneer Elite AVR? I'm using the SC65 - and I think it helps with video processing. I've compared the OTA signal versus the upscaled 1080i to 1080P from my Pioneer SC65 and I like the upscaled picture better. Also a little more control although I keep things pretty standard (default) without a lot of additional (external) processing.

My Sammy set still has problems in thinking it's getting 3D content (weird, stretched picture) - - from the AVR - - but I just live with it. You can turn that feature off in the menu but then it's a pain with 3D material and switching to 3D Directv channels.

Regardless of what equipment you have - - a lousy source signal is made worse, in my opinion. when it's trying to be "upscaled." So I can understand watching the SD content with your kids. I am curious, though - - do they ever remark on how crappy the signal is? Kids are pretty smart.
post #11066 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

That's actually one of the biggest misconceptions regarding these TVs. Most people think they need a source device that is going to upscale so they get a better picture, which in most cases is simply not true. The thing that most people don't realize is that your TV is already upscaling any signal it gets to 1080P, unless the source signal is already 1080P. The fact of the matter is that the TV will almost always do a better job of upscaling than your device will. I used to NEVER let any of my devices do the upscaling. I now however let my new Elite AVR do the upscaling because I believe it probably does a better job than the TV would. Probably not by much, but hey...

So, you should never let any device upscale the signal unless you believe it will do a better job than the TV will on it's own, which it normally won't, unless you have good equipment with very good video processing.

Now that is out of the way (until people start disagreeing with me), even though your source on your 60" isn't dong any upscaling, your TV is, and does a very good job of it.

I agree, but my Onkyo 818 has the same processor as the Elite I think. The thing is, my 60" looks a little better, but that could also have to do with my 65" having a different panel that has visable banding where my 60" doesn't. The other thing is, before this update, my Onkyo did an amazing job at upscaling the signal. Where now, not so much.. Maybe the update did something to help with that as well? I may end up just not using the processor now for certain sources since it looks good without it on my other set that doesn't have it.
Edited by Anthony5362 - 1/30/13 at 3:02pm
post #11067 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

That's actually one of the biggest misconceptions regarding these TVs. Most people think they need a source device that is going to upscale so they get a better picture, which in most cases is simply not true. The thing that most people don't realize is that your TV is already upscaling any signal it gets to 1080P, unless the source signal is already 1080P. The fact of the matter is that the TV will almost always do a better job of upscaling than your device will. I used to NEVER let any of my devices do the upscaling. I now however let my new Elite AVR do the upscaling because I believe it probably does a better job than the TV would. Probably not by much, but hey...

So, you should never let any device upscale the signal unless you believe it will do a better job than the TV will on it's own, which it normally won't, unless you have good equipment with very good video processing.

Now that is out of the way (until people start disagreeing with me), even though your source on your 60" isn't dong any upscaling, your TV is, and does a very good job of it.

I find that these Samsung displays do an excellent job with upconversion and deinterlacing. I do use a Toshiba HD-XA2 for my DVD upconversion, but for everything else I let my display do the video processing.

Even laserdisc looks good on this thing (as good as it can, anyway).
post #11068 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

My Sammy set still has problems in thinking it's getting 3D content (weird, stretched picture) - - from the AVR - - but I just live with it. You can turn that feature off in the menu but then it's a pain with 3D material and switching to 3D Directv channels.

I was having this issue until I disabled BDWise in the TV.
post #11069 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

Jestered - I may have asked this before and I apologize if I'm repeating myself - - what model is your Pioneer Elite AVR? I'm using the SC65 - and I think it helps with video processing. I've compared the OTA signal versus the upscaled 1080i to 1080P from my Pioneer SC65 and I like the upscaled picture better. Also a little more control although I keep things pretty standard (default) without a lot of additional (external) processing.

My Sammy set still has problems in thinking it's getting 3D content (weird, stretched picture) - - from the AVR - - but I just live with it. You can turn that feature off in the menu but then it's a pain with 3D material and switching to 3D Directv channels.

Regardless of what equipment you have - - a lousy source signal is made worse, in my opinion. when it's trying to be "upscaled." So I can understand watching the SD content with your kids. I am curious, though - - do they ever remark on how crappy the signal is? Kids are pretty smart.

Rico- I have the VSX-53 and I believe we share the same Marvell QDEO video processing in the AVR. That's a very good video processor, which is why I choose to let the Elite handle the up-conversion over the TV. I never watch SD content, so I can't comment on whether it's gotten better or not. It's crap IMO, so I don't watch it. I also don't have kids, so I'm not forced to watch it there either.

It's bad that more people don't realize the TV is upscaling everything to 1080P unless the source signal is already 1080P, which is then displayed 1:1. Not only are people using devices that upscale, and poorly, but there's a lot of duplicate processing going on, which is always going to produce an inferior picture. For example:

You should NEVER let your cable or sat box do any kind of conversion. EVER! I have been practicing this for years, so I apologize if I'm mistaken, but I don't think any of those box's convert to 1080P, so most people set them at 1080i or 720P. That's a major problem because you have the cable or sat box doing a conversion, then that signal is being sent to the TV where it's converted again to 1080P. You're essentially taking a source signal and putting it through 2 conversion processes. The cable or sat box is going to do a bad job of it too. So ideally you want the cable or sat box to send the signal untouched to the TV (or AVR) and let the TV (or AVR if you have a good one) do the only conversion of the source signal. It's only done once that way and not multiple conversions before it gets to the TV, which is always bad.
post #11070 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony5362 View Post

I agree, but my Onkyo 818 has the same processor as the Elite I think. The thing is, my 60" looks a little better, but that could also have to do with my 65" having a different panel that has visable banding where my 60" doesn't

Yep. I'm fairly certain your Onkyo has the same processor that my Elite does.
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