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Official Samsung UNxxES8000 Owner's Thread - Page 444

post #13291 of 16125
Dredd 3D looks amazing. Tron Legacy 3D, too. I hear Prometheus 3D is one of the best, I have it but have not watched it, yet.
post #13292 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bladerunner1959 View Post

what confuses me is that when I plug in the "calibrated" settings we share here done by all the equipment....my tv displays a dim lifeless pic that enhances flashlight , clouding and a very yellow green pic.... I must be the one with the faulty optical nerve and macular degeneration.

Guys, don't think for a second I don't appreciate the efforts, to me a "correctly calibrated " picture is simply trashing this amazing panel that simply requires modest tweaking from the default modes.

You have to realize that using someone else's settings that are calibrated to their TV isn't going to produce the same PQ on another TV, My calibrated settings on my TV are absolutely stunning and the TV has never looked better. Very inky blacks, no clouding or flashlighting and the colors pop and are accurate. Cailibrating my TV isn't trashing it's PQ. Someone else using my settings, or others calibrated settings, might trash their PQ because those settings aren't calibrated for their TV.

I think the 60" Sharp panel is pretty similar from TV to TV. Most the calibrated 60" settings that people have posted are very similar. They are not exact from one to another, but it looks like most changes in the 60" settings are moving in the same direction, but not to the same degree. My 65" appears to calibrate a lot different than the 60", but I guarantee you that I"m getting the same outstanding picture that those people are getting out of theirs. For example, I cannot drop my brightness below 48 without major black clipping. The 60" appears to be able to drop brightness to 45-46 before any clipping occurs. If I were to use the 60" calibrated settings, I would be clipping black a lot and the PQ would obviously not be very good. If the 60" guys used my settings, they would probably have some washed out looking blacks and the PQ is not going to look that good.

Saying that calibrating these TVs trashes the PQ is not accurate. Also, I've always said that it's absolutely possible to get a freaking awesome picture out of these TVs without a meter. I personally like tinkering with this stuff and that's the reason I got the meter. If you (not you personally) don't want to learn how to calibrate or spend the money (and lots and lots of time) calibrating the TV, all you really need is a calibration disk to set white/black levels, color and tint and you'll get a great picture out of it. I would also suggest that people who don't have a meter stop messing with the color space settings and simply set it to "Auto". The "Auto" setting is very good and accurate. I can't see how anyone could set color space without a meter, so...
Edited by Jestered - 3/9/13 at 12:21pm
post #13293 of 16125
Question: How do i know if I suffer from this "twist" in my CIE Diagram. I Run the full greyscale, primary, and secondary color measures and my CIE Diagram shows as is: ciediag.jpg 227k .jpg file .

Is there a setting that activates the bubbles? Thanks guys.
post #13294 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

You have to realize that using someone else's settings that are calibrated to their TV isn't going to produce the same PQ on another TV, My calibrated settings on my TV are absolutely stunning and the TV has never looked better. Very inky blacks, no clouding or flashlighting and the colors pop and are accurate. Cailibrating my TV isn't trashing it's PQ. Someone else using my settings, or others calibrated settings, might trash their PQ because those settings aren't calibrated for their TV.

I think the 60" Sharp panel is pretty similar from TV to TV. Most the calibrated 60" settings that people have posted are very similar. They are not exact from one to another, but it looks like most changes in the 60" settings are moving in the same direction, but not to the same degree. My 65" appears to calibrate a lot different than the 60", but I guarantee you that I"m getting the same outstanding picture that those people are getting out of theirs. For example, I cannot drop my brightness below 48 without major black clipping. The 60" appears to be able to drop brightness to 45-46 before any clipping occurs. If I were to use the 60" calibrated settings, I would be clipping black a lot and the PQ would obviously not be very good. If the 60" guys used my settings, they would probably have some washed out looking blacks and the PQ is not going to look that good.

Saying that calibrating these TVs trashes the PQ is not accurate. Also, I've always said that it's absolutely possible to get a freaking awesome picture out of these TVs without a meter. I personally like tinkering with this stuff and that's the reason I got the meter. If you (not you personally) don't want to learn how to calibrate or spend the money (and lots and lots of time) calibrating the TV, all you really need is a calibration disk to set white/black levels, color and tint and you'll get a great picture out of it. I would also suggest that people who don't have a meter stop messing with the color space settings and simply set it to "Auto". The "Auto" setting is very good and accurate. I can't see how anyone could set color space without a meter, so...
Jestered - I've been following this forum for quite a while now with very keen interest. I don't chirp in because I'm not tech savvy like most of you folks. I sort of read, listen and try to learn from the gurus. I was just wondering if your banding and flashlighting problems are the same as you first posted when you got your 65 or have they changed at all with your tweaked settings?

My props are out to all you guys who have spent countless hours making this forum what it is and providing people like me the opportunity to benefit from your hard work. I just wish there way I could give back. Best to ya all!
post #13295 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamenoskili View Post

Question: How do i know if I suffer from this "twist" in my CIE Diagram. I Run the full greyscale, primary, and secondary color measures and my CIE Diagram shows as is: ciediag.jpg 227k .jpg file .

Is there a setting that activates the bubbles? Thanks guys.

The 100% looks decent. You should be able to get Red and Green better, and maybe Blue. If you have the same blue problem I have, you won't be able to get it much better than that though.

To get the saturation readings you need to go to the "Measures" menu, "Saturations" then "All colors". After getting those readings you'll see the saturation measurements on the CIE chart.
post #13296 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by quicknick View Post

Jestered - I've been following this forum for quite a while now with very keen interest. I don't chirp in because I'm not tech savvy like most of you folks. I sort of read, listen and try to learn from the gurus. I was just wondering if your banding and flashlighting problems are the same as you first posted when you got your 65 or have they changed at all with your tweaked settings?

My props are out to all you guys who have spent countless hours making this forum what it is and providing people like me the opportunity to benefit from your hard work. I just wish there way I could give back. Best to ya all!

I guess I got lucky with my 65" because I didn't have bad banding from the get go. I was able to almost get rid of it completely by raising contrast. It seems higher contrast makes it less noticeable. The green gain trick some of us used during calibration actually raised contrast even higher than the normal 100 max setting and I haven't really noticed much change in the banding because I never see it anyway unless I go hunting for it and even then I have to put some pattern or something on to finally see it. The only time I ever notice it in normal viewing is during some fast moving sports scenes. Mostly on golf. Sometimes during football, but not really. Even golf isn't bad, but I do notice it there at times. The clouding I had initially went away when I cleaned the screen. For whatever reason these TVs need a loving rub down which helps get rid of that. It seems to come back a little after awhile. I just started using that as an alert that it's time to clean the TV screens in my house.
post #13297 of 16125
Can anyone recommend a good receiver to go with the ES8000? I am going to ditch the old Onkyo. Is there anything in the Samsung family that's good? I'll be running PS3, 360, and a Wii U, and my Direct TV...so as many HDMIs as possible would be good. 5.1/7.1 doesn't really matter.
post #13298 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Echovolk View Post

Can anyone recommend a good receiver to go with the ES8000? I am going to ditch the old Onkyo. Is there anything in the Samsung family that's good? I'll be running PS3, 360, and a Wii U, and my Direct TV...so as many HDMIs as possible would be good. 5.1/7.1 doesn't really matter.

I had an Onkyo 606 and was going to get the Onkyo TX-NR616, but ended up going with a Pioneer Elite. The Elite is much more than the Onkyo, so if price is a concern, you can't beat that Onkyo for what you get at that price. I think Garnoch got one and I don't think he has any complaints. You get a lot of bang for your buck with that Onkyo IMO.
post #13299 of 16125
Yeah, I'd like to keep it under $500.
post #13300 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Echovolk View Post

Yeah, I'd like to keep it under $500.

You can get that Onkyo TX-NR616 on Amazon for $344. Check out the specs on it. You can't beat that at that price.
post #13301 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Echovolk View Post

Yeah, I'd like to keep it under $500.
The Denon 1913 is $400 on Amazon. It acts as an airplay receiver which is pretty cool. I have always had Denon, but I think there are a lot of great AVRs in the <$500 range. Here's a link http://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVR-1913-Networking-Receiver-Capability/dp/B007R8U5R6/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1362868079&sr=1-1
post #13302 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Echovolk View Post

Can anyone recommend a good receiver to go with the ES8000? I am going to ditch the old Onkyo. Is there anything in the Samsung family that's good? I'll be running PS3, 360, and a Wii U, and my Direct TV...so as many HDMIs as possible would be good. 5.1/7.1 doesn't really matter.

The Denon AVR1913 is the best option sub $500. Solid performance, great sound/feature set for the price. AirPlay is a nice plus if you live in the iOS ecosystem. (The AVR doesn't come with built in wifi however so you'll have to network it with an ethernet connection)
post #13303 of 16125
That Denon does look nice. I may have to pull the trigger on it. Next question is, WTF do I do to get rid of all these remotes now? 2 from the Samsung TV, 1 for my Onkyo, and now 1 for my Direct TV box. Isn't the Samsung remote universal? For some reason, the tech from Direct TV couldn't get the DTV remote to work with the Samsung.
post #13304 of 16125
Get a Logitech harmony one. It works wonders
post #13305 of 16125
Jestered, its just crazy how "off" my tv can be from yours...i expect difference but not night and day.
post #13306 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoozthatat View Post

The Denon AVR1913 is the best option sub $500. Solid performance, great sound/feature set for the price. AirPlay is a nice plus if you live in the iOS ecosystem. (The AVR doesn't come with built in wifi however so you'll have to network it with an ethernet connection)

I agree. I got my new Denon AVR 1913 in the other day and it is amazing. I'm coming from a Pioneer, and I am very much blown away by the increase in "realness" of ambient sounds in my 7.1 set up. And the overall clarity. I know it sounds cheesy but watching the Walking Dead for the 1st time with my new receiver, I actually thought doors opening and shutting and little zombie moans and noises were actually there! I never got that feeling with the Pioneer, and listening to my new Denon (with the same 7.1 speaker setup) was comparable to taking cotton out of your ears.

My next test was to crank up the end battle scene in the Avengers where the giant metal Alien worm things were crashing into the skyscrapers and the rooftop scenes with ships whirring all around. I really got the sense that I was there for the first time (instead of the sense that everything was just incredibly loud). It was nice

The sheer amount of options is also a bit overwhelming which I appreciate. I hate being limited in what I can do, and this receiver does not disappoint with a wide variety of suprising flexibility and options. The onscreen GUI is actually not bad at all, and being able to set individual crossover for different speakers is nice as well
Quote:
Originally Posted by Echovolk View Post

That Denon does look nice. I may have to pull the trigger on it. Next question is, WTF do I do to get rid of all these remotes now? 2 from the Samsung TV, 1 for my Onkyo, and now 1 for my Direct TV box. Isn't the Samsung remote universal? For some reason, the tech from Direct TV couldn't get the DTV remote to work with the Samsung.

I'm not a universal remote guy. I like to have my Denon remote and my Dish satellite remote at hand at all times. Two remotes is very manageable. And the one "normal" Samsung tv remote I usually just pick up off the shelf if I want to use the Smart Hub
post #13307 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bladerunner1959 View Post

Jestered, its just crazy how "off" my tv can be from yours...i expect difference but not night and day.

10k and I are using the same meter, the same software and the same basic process, with a few tweaks, to calibrate both of our TVs. We both have basically the same readings for the most part, which means our TVs are outputting basically the same image/picture. If you were to put both our TVs side-by-side I'd bet they would look identical in PQ. You look at our settings though and they are not even close to eachother, which means there is a huge difference between my TV and his. Our settings are way different, but the meter and software is showing that we're both outputting basically the same thing.
post #13308 of 16125
Bladerunner & Jestered - I have personally tried many of the settings that have been suggested on this forum. Way back from the start - - the overidding need was to compensate for "out of the box" settings that were, quite frankly, not good.

My first attempt was to use the CNET - Katzmaier "Movie" settings - - which were horrific. Supposedly "accurate," - - calibrated and God awful. Those settings took ALL the pop and sharpness out of the TV set. It was akin to spraying a film on your screen.

I tried Nitra's, Garnochs and finally settled in on Turboman123's "Movie" setting for the first time using a "Movie" setting. Most of my watching, however, was always with the tried and true "Standard" setting.

The game changer for me was firmware update 1046.2. For the first time - - "Movie" settings with mostly "Default" and "Auto" color options yielded stone cold, stunning results. And, much to my surprise, the "Standard" setting became a little too harsh - - even for sports! At present, all I use is the "Move" setting.

Regarding calibration - - I applaud all the forum members who have taken the time and expense to provide insight to our Sammy sets and post their settings.

IMHO - - with the advance in the firmware updates - - i believe you can get an incredible picture with tweaked "Default" settings. I also believe that one man's calibration heaven can be another man's hell. Even though there should be some uniformity with these sets - - calibrated settings for the same model do not seem to equate to the same PQ.

Eventually, I will get into the calibration software & hardware - - but primarily for an addition to my theater - - a BenQ W1080ST projector. It will not have the same "tinkering" with settings that our Sammy sets have (frequency of firmware updates and effect on picture quality.)

For those "Calibrators" who perform firmware updates as they are pushed out by Samung - - I am very interested in seeing how these updates affect your settings and calibrations. Will this require new tweaking everytime a firmware update is performed? Any chage in your PQ? TBD.
post #13309 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

Bladerunner & Jestered - I have personally tried many of the settings that have been suggested on this forum. Way back from the start - - the overidding need was to compensate for "out of the box" settings that were, quite frankly, not good.

My first attempt was to use the CNET - Katzmaier "Movie" settings - - which were horrific. Supposedly "accurate," - - calibrated and God awful. Those settings took ALL the pop and sharpness out of the TV set. It was akin to spraying a film on your screen.

I tried Nitra's, Garnochs and finally settled in on Turboman123's "Movie" setting for the first time using a "Movie" setting. Most of my watching, however, was always with the tried and true "Standard" setting.

The game changer for me was firmware update 1046.2. For the first time - - "Movie" settings with mostly "Default" and "Auto" color options yielded stone cold, stunning results. And, much to my surprise, the "Standard" setting became a little too harsh - - even for sports! At present, all I use is the "Move" setting.

Regarding calibration - - I applaud all the forum members who have taken the time and expense to provide insight to our Sammy sets and post their settings.

IMHO - - with the advance in the firmware updates - - i believe you can get an incredible picture with tweaked "Default" settings. I also believe that one man's calibration heaven can be another man's hell. Even though there should be some uniformity with these sets - - calibrated settings for the same model do not seem to equate to the same PQ.

Eventually, I will get into the calibration software & hardware - - but primarily for an addition to my theater - - a BenQ W1080ST projector. It will not have the same "tinkering" with settings that our Sammy sets have (frequency of firmware updates and effect on picture quality.)

For those "Calibrators" who perform firmware updates as they are pushed out by Samung - - I am very interested in seeing how these updates affect your settings and calibrations. Will this require new tweaking everytime a firmware update is performed? Any chage in your PQ? TBD.

That's pretty much exactly what I've said. I guarantee you though, once you actually calibrate your projector and understand exactly what it is you're dialing in, if you put that meter on your ES8000 and run the readings, you will see how inaccurate your grayscale and colors are and will want to fix that. I'm not at all saying that the PQ isn't good how you have it now, but when you see how inaccurate those things are you'll want to fix it. Especially since you'll already have the equipment to do so.
post #13310 of 16125
Thinking to try my luck with 65. Based on the vertical banding, it seems viable options would be Amazon or Bestbuy due to the possible return. If the first one doesn't make it, I might try another one before giving up. Are Amazon or Bestbuy my only options? or do you contact Samsung directly?
post #13311 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by parodielin View Post

Thinking to try my luck with 65. Based on the vertical banding, it seems viable options would be Amazon or Bestbuy due to the possible return. If the first one doesn't make it, I might try another one before giving up. Are Amazon or Bestbuy my only options? or do you contact Samsung directly?

There's no reason to contact Samsung unless you're wanting a repair, which I wouldn't do on a new TV. I would go with Amazon first if they don't charge you tax (they do here in Texas). If Amazon collects tax in the state your in, I'd go with BestBuy if they'll price-match.
post #13312 of 16125
Question to US owners

In the past, I considered importing a Samsung from US (due to price difference), and I might consider it again for the F8000. But what voltage/frequency can the ES8000 do in US. Can anyone check the label at the back of their panel? Thanks.
post #13313 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by turboman123 View Post

Question to US owners

In the past, I considered importing a Samsung from US (due to price difference), and I might consider it again for the F8000. But what voltage/frequency can the ES8000 do in US. Can anyone check the label at the back of their panel? Thanks.
Turboman, it is 110-120v 60hz only. The tv doesn't use that much power though so if you really wanted a USA one and your power is different you can cheaply get a transformer to convert power
post #13314 of 16125
Jestered - I'm looking forward to learning how to properly calibrate - - but here are some observations:

1. 100% calibrated to "Standards" doesn't always equate to the picture your eyes think is best. What wins? My eyes, always. So I'll be interested to see if "Calibrated" = "Better PQ!"
2. I really think the firmware updates will alter your PQ. So I'll be following your comments if/when you do perform Samsung firmwarre updates.
post #13315 of 16125
I have been playing with some of your settings on my 65" 8000, thank you. I tried searching, but can not find settings for 3D? Can someone please point me in the right direction? I am watching Dredd right now, playing with settings. I can not change the 10p white balance, so the regular settings won't work.
post #13316 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

Jestered - I'm looking forward to learning how to properly calibrate - - but here are some observations:

1. 100% calibrated to "Standards" doesn't always equate to the picture your eyes think is best. What wins? My eyes, always. So I'll be interested to see if "Calibrated" = "Better PQ!"
2. I really think the firmware updates will alter your PQ. So I'll be following your comments if/when you do perform Samsung firmwarre updates.

1. I think that's what most people don't quite understand. I didn't understand it either until I got the meter and started this journey. The "pop" and brightness that most people like is going to come from the luminance level that you set. There's really no standard to this. It's simply set by the calibrator based on what you prefer. If you like more pop and brightness, then you'll set a higher base luminance level. Once that's set, then you'll go on to calibrate accurate grayscale and color based on that particular luminance level. The "standards" in calibration is mostly making sure you have correct color and gray level. There shouldn't be any argument there. Grayscale and color is either correct, or it's not. How you want to present that color is up to you. I personally don't like my luminance above 125 because it just seems to bother my eyes after about 30 minutes of watching TV. I still have plenty of "pop" though, so it doesn't degrade what I want out of my picture at all.

2. I'm curious how much FW updates will make a change in tweaking the calibration too. The biggest PQ firmware update was 1046, which is what I started calibrating with. 1047 didn't change much in PQ, so I only had to make very minor adjustments that probably had no impact on actual viewing.

The bottom line is that you can calibrate based on standards and still have that "pop" and brightness if that's what you're wanting. But, you'll also have accurate grayscale and color. You can also calibrate based on standards and dumb down the colors if that's what you're looking for. Their both still standard and correct calibrations.

I struggled with spending the $$ on this meter because I thought it was going to give me a dull picture, because that's what I thought calibrating would do. I was totally prepared to calibrate and take the $$$ loss by going right back to my tweaked non-calibrated settings. Boy was I wrong! Once you get the meter and start learning the process, I bet you that you will have a, "Ah! I get it!" moment.

I'm still learning this thing myself. There is no one way of calibrating and then you're done by the "standard". That's why I'm still working on mine. I've calibrated to "standard" many times, but there were things I didn't like, so I had to fix those things, then go back and properly calibrate color and grayscale. It's still the standard calibration method though (except for gamma). You'll see when you have a go at it.

This isn't directed to you, but I'm shocked that I have to defend myself for calibrating my TV. Where's that coming from?
Edited by Jestered - 3/9/13 at 7:49pm
post #13317 of 16125
I have an "ah, I get it" moment every time I run hcfr. Let me tell you though, this is a tedious and time consuming project, but its fun. And yes, to input any settings posted by other users is a risk in itself. A simple color and grey scale test with a meter will reveal exactly that, unless of course you are extremely lucky. I have to agree on what jestered said about his TV and 10k's having probably the same PQ. Even though settings are completely different. Question for jestered and 10k, do you guys use 100% or 75% color patterns when testing?

Sent from my RAZR MAXX HD - Tapatalk
post #13318 of 16125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamenoskili View Post

I have an "ah, I get it" moment every time I run hcfr. Let me tell you though, this is a tedious and time consuming project, but its fun. And yes, to input any settings posted by other users is a risk in itself. A simple color and grey scale test with a meter will reveal exactly that, unless of course you are extremely lucky. I have to agree on what jestered said about his TV and 10k's having probably the same PQ. Even though settings are completely different. Question for jestered and 10k, do you guys use 100% or 75% color patterns when testing?

Sent from my RAZR MAXX HD - Tapatalk

I use 100%, but have messed with 75%. At some point I plan tinkering more with the 75% patterns, but have more work to do with 100% before I do that. I know 10k and Turbo have both calibrated using both 100% and 75% and a mix of both.
post #13319 of 16125
Jestered, you articulate your efforts and journey very clearly. The information you share is extremely valuable and appreciated. Please don't feel as though you need to defend anything. You are one of the new icons of this thread. Keep it up please.

I have been exposed to "correct and calibrated" TV's since 97 and of course always sensitive to the presentation in the theater when a particular movie house is considered accurate, correct and as the director intended.

So through all of the countless samples of correctly calibrated picture I have been exposed to ...i simply have not been able to embrace them...inevitable is the effort to tweak life back into the picture. Yes, I stated way back in this thread, probably in June, that I am the anti tweaked calibrator. Like Rico, I let my eyes do the judging.

I wish I could find that holy grail of calibration settings and be happy ....lol, I gave up on that quest ions ago...during the DVD era in 2000...prehistoric! Lol

Watching "dark shadows" right now, a very nice transfer.
post #13320 of 16125
Jestered,

Very well said. Just for the record -- I don't think that anyone is necessarily saying you have to justify your calibrations. Certainly not me!

It's all about getting the best picture we can out of our sets and sharing our experiences.

Your thorough explanation of how you approached the calibration process and expectations really helps me understand that I can still get more out of my already fantastic, stone cold beautiful picture!

Net-net - I am now looking forward to investing the time and money to learn how to calibrate my Sammy set (and soon projector) to get the max out of my Home Theater experience.

Thanks - Rico
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