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Official Samsung UNxxES8000 Owner's Thread - Page 301

post #9001 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

That's very true, which is why I said it really comes down to what looks better in his eyes.
That sharpness setting really does seem high. Did you use any test pattern when you came up with that setting? The reason I ask is because I had mine set at 20 until I actually used the WoW test pattern and realized, like many have said, that these TVs don't need any added sharpness. The test pattern became very jagged once going above 20 in sharpness and looks perfect at 0 (at least on my set), so I ended up leaving it on 0. I'm just curious if you used any test patterns to get to that sharpness setting or if it simply looks better to you set that high?

I didn't use any test patterns and have experimented with the Sharpness setting and it doesn't seem to make much difference when I drop it down - - only when I go up. (In that the sharpness I want is attained at the higher levels and when I drop it down - - 0 to 40 doesn't seem to be any difference in the picture)

I have the WOW disc - - so maybe I should look at it. What test pattern do you recommend for the "Sharpness" setting? I started to use the WOW disc for calibration but then was able to use the settings on this forum.

And...please correct me if I'm wrong, but the WOW calibration is via the Bluray player and probably not the same picture I see with my Directv satellite picture? Thx - much appreciated.
post #9002 of 16126
The light in the corner is wrecking your contrast ratio. Horrible place for a light. Very distracting.
post #9003 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

I didn't use any test patterns and have experimented with the Sharpness setting and it doesn't seem to make much difference when I drop it down - - only when I go up. (In that the sharpness I want is attained at the higher levels and when I drop it down - - 0 to 40 doesn't seem to be any difference in the picture)
I have the WOW disc - - so maybe I should look at it. What test pattern do you recommend for the "Sharpness" setting? I started to use the WOW disc for calibration but then was able to use the settings on this forum.
And...please correct me if I'm wrong, but the WOW calibration is via the Bluray player and probably not the same picture I see with my Directv satellite picture? Thx - much appreciated.

Before I got the WoW disc, I did the same thing with the sharpness setting and didn't really notice any difference either. If you change it to 0 based on the WoW disc, are you going to really notice anything? Maybe not, but it does make a difference in the sharpness test patter at least.

Since you have the WoW disc, which will be either a bluray or DVD disc depending on what you bought, I'd suggest going into "Expert" mode and selecting the "Sharpness" test pattern. There will be a white/grey background with a lot of black lines and circles all over. I looked at the large circle and started adjusting the sharpness on the TV. The line of the large black circle was sharpest without any jaggedness when the setting was at 0.

Since you already have the WoW disc, I'd suggest you do the following, which is exactly what I did:

*Use the disc to check your sharpness setting
*Use the disc to set your contrast (white levels)
*Use the disc to set your brightness (black levels)
*Use the disc to set your color and tint/hue settings (blue mode and expert pattern)
*Set the rest using Turbo's settings
*Tweak to your liking

All of those things you set using the disc will be spot on for your TV, which is what you want. Turbo's color settings will get you very close, but without a calibration meter you won't be able to do anything else. If there is anything off about his color settings, the blue filter with the disc will fine tune that based on your TV. That's exactly what I did and my picture is as good as it's ever looked. So much so that I have stopped tweaking it. I do plan on getting a meter at some point though.
post #9004 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

If the lighting in the room is very controlled, then there's really no reason to have the eco function enabled. I usually don't like my TV automatically adjusting the backlight, but this set does a very good job of it. Once I set my high and low backlight levels, the TV keeps the backlight right where it should be based on the ever changing light in my room. It's never too dark or too bright... just right. But like I said, I have a lot of windows in that room so the light getting in there varies widely throughout the day/night.

Thanks - light is on dimmer and only that bright for the picture. It usually is very, very low (night light setting).

3D - all lights off with Bias Lighting being purchased.
post #9005 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

Before I got the WoW disc, I did the same thing with the sharpness setting and didn't really notice any difference either. If you change it to 0 based on the WoW disc, are you going to really notice anything? Maybe not, but it does make a difference in the sharpness test patter at least.
Since you have the WoW disc, which will be either a bluray or DVD disc depending on what you bought, I'd suggest going into "Expert" mode and selecting the "Sharpness" test pattern. There will be a white/grey background with a lot of black lines and circles all over. I looked at the large circle and started adjusting the sharpness on the TV. The line of the large black circle was sharpest without any jaggedness when the setting was at 0.
Since you already have the WoW disc, I'd suggest you do the following, which is exactly what I did:
*Use the disc to check your sharpness setting
*Use the disc to set your contrast (white levels)
*Use the disc to set your brightness (black levels)
*Use the disc to set your color and tint/hue settings (blue mode and expert pattern)
*Set the rest using Turbo's settings
*Tweak to your liking
All of those things you set using the disc will be spot on for your TV, which is what you want. Turbo's color settings will get you very close, but without a calibration meter you won't be able to do anything else. If there is anything off about his color settings, the blue filter with the disc will fine tune that based on your TV. That's exactly what I did and my picture is as good as it's ever looked. So much so that I have stopped tweaking it. I do plan on getting a meter at some point though.

Thanks - - today is a vacation day and I'm on my way to the man cave to perform the WOW test as recommended.
post #9006 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricoflashback View Post

Thanks - - today is a vacation day and I'm on my way to the man cave to perform the WOW test as recommended.

No problem! Just want to point out that I wouldn't use the blue filter that comes with the disc. You actually don't need it with our TVs. Instead of using the blue filter, simply set the RGB color mode to blue (in the TV settings) and use the color/hue tests on the disks to set those properly. Because you're only displaying blue on the TV, you don't need the filter and it's much more accurate because the blue filter with the disc is not exactly the right color blue.

Also, remember to write down your new settings and transfer them to the HDMI input for your normal TV watching. Otherwise you'll only have those settings active for whatever device you used with the disc.

Let us know how it turns out!
Edited by Jestered - 12/28/12 at 2:32pm
post #9007 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by turboman123 View Post

Movie mode: further calibration optimization
I have been hesitating between Standard picture mode, and Movie. I really dislike flashlighting/clouding so the dimming in Standard mode in dark scenes helps to hide the clouding. But then darks get crushed which I also dislike.
So following is an attempt to improve move mode to address those problems. I used a new Display3PRO meter which should be quite accurate.
First task is to increase display contrast (not the same as contrast setting). For a given max peak white, if I have higher display contrast, then I can reduce backlight which reduces flashlighting/clouding.
My settings are for a half dark room with peak white around 120cd/m2.
For a given backlight setting, I can increase peak white by increasing contrast setting. In movie mode, I could go up as high as contrast=100 without RGB output hitting a limit, causing clipping as they say. I could also bump up white balance gain to increase peak white without causing clipping. In the end that gave me a peak white of 115cd/m2 with a backlight of 5.
I lowered brightness setting (which influences minimum black) until it just reached a minimum. I did not reduce brightness further because that would crush above black. Brightness setting was then 45 or 46.
With gamma set at +1, I then got almost a constant gamma at 2.22.
There is also a new gamma target called BT1886 which I understand was adopted as a new standard. See discussion here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1409045/how-power-law-gamma-calibration-can-lead-to-crushed-blacks
BT1886 has the effect that gamma is lowered in dark scenes. This means that darks are a bit brighter than a constant gamma. Visually, I think it helps against flashlighting/clouding because it "lifts up" a dark scene so that flashlighting/clouding becomes less apparent.
Following are calibration results with constant gamma and BT1886 gamma. I achieved the BT1886 target by increasing the setting for 10p white balance at level 1, 2 and 3.
CalibrationSummaryDetailed.pdf 2365k .pdf file
constant.jpg 60k .jpg file
bt1886.jpg 61k .jpg file
BT1886 gamma at 5% and 10% is not quite smooth. A 20p white balance control would help there.
(Note: PRE=BT1886 and POST=constant gamma)
Following is colour calibration. The ES8000 has a very good linearity for different saturation levels.
AdvancedColorManagementReport.pdf 2644k .pdf file
My settings for Movie are then:
Warm2
Backlight 5
Contrast 100
Brightness 45
Sharpness 20
All special picture modes and motion modes Off
White balance offset 25, 25, 22
gain 38, 50, 26
Custom Color Space:
R 48, 3, 0
G 4,47,3
B 0, 5, 47
Y 52, 47, 4
C 3,47,50
M 44, 5, 45
For constant gamma:
Gamma +1
10p white balance level 1, 2 and 3: all 0
For BT1886 gamma:
Gamma 0
10p white balance: level 1 all +6, level 2 all +3, level 3 all +1.
(Level 4 to 10: minor corrections. Not worth mentioning)

What is your color and tint set at?
post #9008 of 16126
Does anybody have any advice on the best picture settings for both movies and xbox, I understand this has probably been covered in here somewhere already (there are 301 pages of this stuff), any help would be greatly appreciate.
post #9009 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by scrimptonMike View Post

Does anybody have any advice on the best picture settings for both movies and xbox, I understand this has probably been covered in here somewhere already (there are 301 pages of this stuff), any help would be greatly appreciate.

Give the Guide in my signature a shot and there are are several setting here for people not buying calibration equipment or hiring someone. Feel free to try any of them. Each panel is a little different. Good luck, man!
post #9010 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisjmccord View Post

Ok, well so if I don't care about the color black/silver etc, and don't care about the camera and all those hokey things they are using it for, do the dimming zones mean a lot to how I plan to use this TV? Sports, kids shows, video games, movies, etc...?
I do like the future proof stuff that was mentioned in the 8000 and 7500 series. So maybe 7500 is as low as I'd go? But then I need to see the price difference, cause usually a few hundred more is worth it for me to have the higher model.
Looks like the 60" 7500 is $2497 and the 60" 8000 is $2797, for a different stand and Pro Micro Dimming vs. Ultimate....hum...then looking at the 60" 7100 its $1997, and just doesn't have the camera, the smart interaction, or infrared enabled (not sure what that means?), and doesn't have the smart touch remote. I planned to get that keyboard remote anyway, so not sure thats a big deal either...so even more hummm...could I do without all that stuff and save $1200?
What is CMR? the numbers are different on each one of the 8000, 7500, and 7100 series.
Also if I want 65', the 8000 is my only choice.

I was thinking the same thing but when you're talking those prices, the $300 difference didn't come into place in my choice. I just went with the features that meant something to me. That being said, there is a large price difference with the 7100, but it didn't have the features I wanted, or thought I wanted. I think CMR was already explained before I could write this so I'll leave it at that. You are correct about a 65" though - unless you're loaded and want a 9000. smile.gif
post #9011 of 16126
If anyone has been convinced by bolt, FYI you can pickup the 55 inch VT50 for $1699 which is a pretty smoking price.

http://www.paulstv.com/Plasma-Televisions/Panasonic-TCP55VT50.asp

code: SAV300
post #9012 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Gosselin View Post

What is your color and tint set at?

He didn't post those because they didn't change. Leave them at the default.
post #9013 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mavinwow View Post

If anyone has been convinced by bolt, FYI you can pickup the 55 inch VT50 for $1699 which is a pretty smoking price.
http://www.paulstv.com/Plasma-Televisions/Panasonic-TCP55VT50.asp
code: SAV300
I already sold the ES and purchase made.
post #9014 of 16126
Im thinking about pulling the trigger on a new TV, I think I will stick with LED and Samsung
In my neck of the woods, a 60" 7050 or 7100 is $2000 or a 60" 7500 for $2000
So the 7500 is pretty much a no brainer, just a better all around TV
There doesnt seem to be any deals on any 8000s well $2800 not really a sale.
So do you think I should get a 7500 now or wait for a sale on a 8000
If the prices were alot closer Id just get an 8000. I have viewd both TVs they werent
side by side, I thought they were both excellent for picture quality.
One more thing the store I can get the 7500 at only has a 7 day return policy.
Do you think its wise to take a chance and not get any extended warranty, the extended
warranty will run about $300 for a 3 year.

Happy New Year
post #9015 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

I already sold the ES and purchase made.

Same here
post #9016 of 16126
Just watched nemo in 3d with the kids on the es8000 and wow! Good 3D. My new 3D demo movie.
post #9017 of 16126
Sold my ES on Ebay while watching TotalRecall tonight... My VT50 arrives in the morning....
post #9018 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

That's very true, which is why I said it really comes down to what looks better in his eyes.
That sharpness setting really does seem high. Did you use any test pattern when you came up with that setting? The reason I ask is because I had mine set at 20 until I actually used the WoW test pattern and realized, like many have said, that these TVs don't need any added sharpness. The test pattern became very jagged once going above 20 in sharpness and looks perfect at 0 (at least on my set), so I ended up leaving it on 0. I'm just curious if you used any test patterns to get to that sharpness setting or if it simply looks better to you set that high?

Yeah, sharpness does damages the signal. It's being fed a digital signal so there is no need. Above zero just adds artifacts and damage to the image.
It's not going to make up for some crappy ultra-compressed signal your cable provider sends out and some discs are already over-sharpened to begin with (and it won't bring back any details on the blu-ray that aggressive DNR turned into wax-works, it will just make the edges of objects jaggy or ring.)
post #9019 of 16126
Agreed, a good picture always starts with 0 sharpness.
post #9020 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by sabesh View Post

I don't think that it's worth the price difference in terms of functionality and image quality. The only reason that I got the 8000: I was able to get it on sale for just CAD $2150. I got lucky, as none of the Boxing day sale prices came close.
However, if you want to future-proof your TV somewhat, the 7500 & 8000 are great options, as they are MHL ready and support Samsung's Smart evolution kit. MHL devices are about to hit the mainstream, with Roku already on board:
http://www.roku.com/streamingstick
Samsung's smart evolution kit appears promising, as it can upgrade CPU, GPU and possibly other h/w functionality.
If you are not interesting in future proofing, the 7100 should be a good choice. Cheers.

I have a new 60" ES7100. I was under the understanding that Samsung's smart evolution kit was applicable to the 7100 as well as the 7500 and 8000 to future proof the 7100. I gather that I am incorrect. I am still within the exchange/return period at Best Buy. Should I upgrade to the 7500?

Regards,
post #9021 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

I was thinking the same thing but when you're talking those prices, the $300 difference didn't come into place in my choice. I just went with the features that meant something to me. That being said, there is a large price difference with the 7100, but it didn't have the features I wanted, or thought I wanted. I think CMR was already explained before I could write this so I'll leave it at that. You are correct about a 65" though - unless you're loaded and want a 9000. smile.gif

Thanks Garnoch, now I'm just trying to decide what features I really want or think I need. My 3 year old son has seen the demo movie playing on the Sammy's in Best Buy that shows the kid playing Angry Birds with his hands and that Smart Interaction stuff, but I wonder how much I'll really use that and if its just part of the price tag that I don't need it to be. More research I guess...
post #9022 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by theLDP View Post

I recently purchased a 55ES8000. I hooked up my TV to my system. Dish hopper, Denon 1909, PS3 all hooked up with HDMI. Everything worked but my Dish. When I turn on the dish my sound completely goes out(through the denon) and the dish locks up. The PS3 works fine through my Denon. I hooked up the dish directly to the TV and all is good. If I leave the TV off and turn on the denon and hopper I get sound. The Dish crashes and I loose sound when I turn on the TV. I can hook up two other TVs and everything is OK. Anyone had this happen or know what could be wrong?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garnoch View Post

That is WEIRD. Glad to see you walked through all the different scenarios though. Do you have ARC enabled? Something might be screwy with the inputs you are using, like the Hopper is connected to the input that is actually selected for ARC. I'm just throwing out ideas because I have no idea what that issue is about. Let us know.

Never could figure out the issue. I do not have ARC on the 1909. It's too old. I had to connect the hopper using HDMI to the ES8000. Then used optical to the Denon for my audio. It must be something with the Denon???? I talked with some tech support personnel and they think this is the case.
Edited by theLDP - 12/28/12 at 10:15pm
post #9023 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mavinwow View Post

If anyone has been convinced by bolt, FYI you can pickup the 55 inch VT50 for $1699 which is a pretty smoking price.
http://www.paulstv.com/Plasma-Televisions/Panasonic-TCP55VT50.asp
code: SAV300

If I could get one at that price over here I'd have one for the bedroom to warm the place up, the cheapest 55 here is equivalent to over $3000
post #9024 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Gosselin View Post

What is your color and tint set at?

hello Derek
I did not change color and tint, so they are at 50.
I made the changes in custom color space.
post #9025 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmay91472 View Post

I noticed that Turbos settings were calibrated using the warm2 setting. Does using warm 1 or normal throw everything off in regards to the white balance and gamma target?
When using warm1, and if you still want the target that calibrators like ISF use, then you have to make stronger adjustments in white balance. I do not know about gamma.
With warm2, the smallest corrections are needed in white balance on my panel.
post #9026 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jestered View Post

It seems most people use Warm 2, which I'm assuming is because it's closest to the desired 65K color temperature. If you use those settings, but not Warm 2, then you will be changing the color temperature and it won't match what he was trying to achieve with those settings. If you don't care about having your color temperature set at exactly 65K, then change to Warm 1 or whatever you feel looks better. I'd suggest giving it a day or two to see if your eyes get used to it before changing the Warm 2 setting.
Also, those settings are for his actual TV, so you probably aren't getting exactly 65K with those, so it's up to you to decide what your eye likes looking at better.
When people start from the out of the box Samsung setup, and then go to Warm2, initially it looks not right, not "blue" enough. But you need some time for the eye to adjust.
My settings were for ISF like standards, which are made for HD reference sources like bluray. But if you use STB, then it is maybe not correct because STB program suppliers maybe use some picture tweaking which need a different setup on the panel. There are no standards as far as I know. So difficult to say what is a good setup for STB.
The main point in the settings in my post 8007 was how to do a setting to minimize flashlighting effect, and not crush darks. For Movie mode, I achieved that by increasing Contrast, White Balance Gain and the settings +6, +3 and +1 for the lowest levels of 10p white balance.
post #9027 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by theLDP View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by theLDP View Post
I recently purchased a 55ES8000. I hooked up my TV to my system. Dish hopper, Denon 1909, PS3 all hooked up with HDMI. Everything worked but my Dish. When I turn on the dish my sound completely goes out(through the denon) and the dish locks up. The PS3 works fine through my Denon. I hooked up the dish directly to the TV and all is good. If I leave the TV off and turn on the denon and hopper I get sound. The Dish crashes and I loose sound when I turn on the TV. I can hook up two other TVs and everything is OK. Anyone had this happen or know what could be wrong?
Never could figure out the issue. I do not have ARC on the 1909. It's too old. I had to connect the hopper using HDMI to the ES8000. Then used optical to the Denon for my audio. It must be something with the Denon???? I talked with some tech support personnel and they think this is the case.

Thanks for the update. It definitely doesn't sound like it's Samsung related but that is still a very odd issue. Look for Dish and Denon updates and when you see one, try it again. Happy to hear you found a workaround though.
post #9028 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by turboman123 View Post

When people start from the out of the box Samsung setup, and then go to Warm2, initially it looks not right, not "blue" enough. But you need some time for the eye to adjust.

I totally agree. And once you get used to how it's suppose to look and go back, everything looks blue and you realize you made the right call. That being said, there are people that just prefer a cool picture though.
post #9029 of 16126
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisjmccord View Post

Thanks Garnoch, now I'm just trying to decide what features I really want or think I need. My 3 year old son has seen the demo movie playing on the Sammy's in Best Buy that shows the kid playing Angry Birds with his hands and that Smart Interaction stuff, but I wonder how much I'll really use that and if its just part of the price tag that I don't need it to be. More research I guess...

Exactly. Once you figure that out, you'll be good to go. I love Angry Birds but I have to admit, I never use it on the TV. Your son might really get a kick out of it though.
post #9030 of 16126
Happy New Year everyone.

If/When I have some time, I'll pop in again.
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