Biggest myths in audio that tick you off/General things in audio that tick you off. - Page 18

What is the advantage of a $300 power cable?

a) it is irrelevant that other "things" have not been "figured out"...

b) you bring nothing to the table that even meets a very loose definition of evidence... bring something to the table, and then it's "worth discussing"... otherwise, it's the same old "well i heard it" routine... which is easily discarded as "evidence", due to much proven science on how the humans "work"...

c) again, the type of testing you denigrate is accepted in every other branch of science... the advance of "science" is based upon the bedrock of controlled testing...

d) i find it rather interesting that you are trying to portray your viewpoints as the majority, when the exact opposite is true... and not only that, project that majority as holding "beliefs", when it is you attempting to project "beliefs" (beliefs that have been repeatedly been proven wrong, and never been proven right, no less)...


darn, i seemed to have missed those... maybe i will continue to get lucky...


that would appear to be the theory (which implies the poster does not grasp the concept of a null hypothesis, which is a rather basic concept), along with the corollary of "if there is one thing that science doesn't understand, that means science understands nothing"... which is a rather intriguing rabbit hole to go down...


yup. a fact that appears completely lost upon the poster... the "how something works" has no bearing on whether you can test results (dealing with classical physics anyway)....


to the seller, there's a big advantage...

heck, i don't have 300 dollars worth of cables in my entire system... i guess that makes me part of the "1 percenters", since i don't even have 1% of my funds "invested" (term used very loosely) on cables/wire....

For some "interesting" reading material check the last few pages of the polk speaker thread. Thats where he cut his teeth here on AVS.

He since has expanded his reach by posting his nonsense in this thread, and as I hoped, several respected and knowledgeable AVS members have attempted to show him the light.

Your feel that Science is at its infancy because we can’t ‘create’ bodyparts and seamlessly replace or repair them? I guess fairydust, magic, and wishful thinking is the answer. I mean - Just look at the average life expectancy throughout history. In the 1700's the average life expectancy was roughly 35. SCIENCE has more than doubled it. We will someday get there though. For instance, Scientists have created retina structures in the lab by synthesizing stem cells. Someday this technology will be used to repair eye damage. If the world were to end today and all knowledge gained throughout history lost – Science would find a way to learn it all again and reach the same conclusions that we have today. Facts are facts whether you believe them or not.

I'd just like someone to figure out how to cure tinnitus.

I mean, I really thank Jim Marshall for the wonderful years I spent in my youth as a roadie, but now I'd really like for my ears to stop ringing.

+1

Then we are also within a lifetime of a lottery based system for reproducing. Or else, our population will get a bit crazy. I believe we were designed to expire when we do.

my sympathy bro, I've been suffering for almost 2 years, there must be a cure somewhere

I really wanted to like my $1200/pair audio cables, the $400 power cord, the cable lifters and $200 AC outlet but they were all indistinguishable from their much lower cost brethren.

The sincere pleading of my audiophile friend that "these products really do make a difference" led me to try them. I like the guy and think it is great he has something he is so passionate about.

I still get the Mapleshade Catalog and it always has something featured that is good for a laugh or two. Best to not take things too seriously ...

As much as I am in favor of double blind testing and measurable evidence, I am at the same time of the opinion that we are indeed in the infancy stage of how human mind works and what causes every person to perceive the same sound differently(preference). Human mind is not completely predictable yet with the scientific knowledge that we have, and science is always in the direction of making everything predictable, be it speakers or cars or tv

Really? It's amazing to see people and their beliefs separated as easily as I did in this thread. If you want a good laugh folks just take 10 minutes of your time and read.

Bob Lee said it best: Good god, those threads are hilarious! Reading through them is like watching Copernicus wander through a conference of astrologers.

Hypocrisy drives me up the wall.

They myth of no tone controls. ..Ridiculous. The idea that having tone controls in the signal path leads to audible degradation of the signal is outright silly. What this myth does is let gear companies off easy. ..By giving fewer features they appear more enlightened. ..How convenient.

If you're a music lover, rather than merely a gear lover, you should want contour controls that allow you to enjoy ALL music no matter how well, or poorly, it's recorded.

John 'Zaph' Krutke has a really good blog post about the ignorant supposition that tone controls are inherently evil.

http://zaphaudio.com/blog.html check the March 31 2011 section.

Hope for the best, EQ for the rest.

Wasn't there a test recently which showed people could not tell the difference between expensive speaker wire and coat hangers?

I can't speak for others, but I found it extremely difficult to hang up my shirts with speaker wire.

You need thicker gauge and cable hangers to do it properly.

For me it's much simpler. If someone claims they can hear a difference (for example) with their high dollar cables, versus a properly designed and constructed "cheapie", then there should be no problem with them being able to easily tell the difference in a DBT - if their claims are that the difference between the two is "night and day" (or such a similar clam).

It's a different situation if these claims are much different - such as someone saying they are extremely subtle. In that case, so be it. If people feel good blowing $1k on a high dollar cable for "subtlety", that is great.

I just have never seen anyone be willing to step up to the plate and put the argument to rest in a properly conducted DBT (in other words, not one like Axiom does) - particularly from the ones claiming significant differences (i.e. their claims of "golden ears"). I think if the results showed something significant, it would provide an excellent foundation for further examination. As much as I am a skeptic, I would very quickly fall into the opposite category.

But it's not there. My opinion is that those making the claims are primarily concerned about their egos, beliefs, and experiences being potentially shattered - and that is why they won't allow themselves to be put into such a situation.

If one is blind, how would he know if it were night and day, let alone someone who is double blind!

Something to contemplate: maybe that's why the saying "night and day" applies so well, because one would not be able to tell if he were blind?

Gosh, I hadn't thought of it that way.

I hereby propose the phrase "like night and day in the desert" to describe huge differences in audio performance, so that double-blind testing can still examine the truth of such claims.

-Max

Actually there have been a couple of DBT conducted by forum members who participate in the high end room. Interesting results and sentiment coming from these folks - in the end copper is copper, DBT could not favor the high end offering.

Ditto for people that say it takes 'months' yes literally months for them to perceive the subtle and nuanced difference of a pair of cables. Why it never dawns on them that it could simply be psychological? Who knows.


The other thing to take into consideration is the ability to take an interconnect and design it in such a way to alter the sound and then market the difference.

I would still like someone to pick 5 out of 6 times my MIT EXP2's vs my Belden's. You can have the MIT's if you correctly pick them 5 of 6 and they are your favorites. So not only do you have to pick the change, you have to pick the better sounding each time.

I love my PS audio power cables much better than my regular ones! Oh yeah, the reason is they look better and they have a removable ground. I bought them used for $20 each.

That's when the return policy expires.

Most people "SHOULD" admit that alot of us (just learning stage) thought this way after a look in the crutchfield mag or talked to just one moron at best buy.Thats how they want us to think. Thats how I thought untill sombody set me straight, m still being set straight, mostly by people here! Thank you for pulling me out of the newby stage, and remeber we all thought that way or somthing like it once.

I'd love to have a 10 band EQ for each of my 7 channels. But where is it?

The ego, their beliefs, their convictions .... all color the mind and make you hear things that do not exist. In other words predicting it is not quite a science yet.

Not to turn this thread into a religious one, but the same happens with God and proof of it's existence.

I guess the reality is that if the wire is not always copper or contains impurities at different price levels, then it could be the case.

The fact that even the most basic copper wire is very clean (thanks to mass production and economies of production) is making the "high-end" wires same as basic copper wire.