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Onkyo New AVR's TX-NR818,717,616 official Discussion [No Price Talk]Thread - Page 36

post #1051 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

Oh, ok ... not familiar with HK avrs.

I have always used Audyssey and I have also found it helps check everything (it helped me find a bad speaker once ... blown tweeter driver). In general, you must use the supplied mic and it really helps if placed on real tripod.

But I also wanted to mention ... it's perfectly fine to turn off Audyssey and set manual settings (especially since you have the meter). All that means is that you will be listening to the audio exactly as encoded in the media.

It wouldn't let me manually set the levels. Moreover, I even heard my (in ceiling) surrounds during the Audyssey run. I have no idea why the Audyssey didn't like it.

Anyhoo, I returned the Onkyo for HK AVR 2650 (not my first choice).

Thank you very much for your assistance.
post #1052 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by allargon View Post


It wouldn't let me manually set the levels. Moreover, I even heard my (in ceiling) surrounds during the Audyssey run. I have no idea why the Audyssey didn't like it.

Anyhoo, I returned the Onkyo for HK AVR 2650 (not my first choice).

Thank you very much for your assistance.

Hope it works out for you but still sounds like you have a connection or speaker issue.  Are you sure you connected your surrounds to the "side surround" connections?  It sounds like what you are describing could be a symptom of connecting them to the "rear surround" which is only valid for 7.1.  So Audyssey would find them but knows that is not valid without side surrounds as well.

post #1053 of 1105
Well, I bought the 616. I like it, for the most part. However, it's lacking 2 big features of my old Harmon Kardon 247:

1) Ability to rename inputs. Which is insane, as other older/lesser Onkyo receivers let you do this. Why not the 616??? Having meaningless names like "CBL/SAT" and "STB/DVR" is stupid. And my satellite receiver IS my DVR. On my HK247 I had things come up properly as "Dish", "Blu-ray/DVD", "Roku" and "Wii". Is it possible to do this on the 616 and I'm just missing something?

and even worse...

2) This unit will not accept 480p over component and output to HDMI. What... the... ****?[/I] mad.gif My ancient HK247 could do this without blinking. So my Wii is unusable. This is inexcusable and infuriating. I'd return it over this ridiculous crippled feature alone but for the cost of the shipping back I might as well just buy a component-to-HDMI converter. I shouldn't have to, though, in an AVR of this price and in 2013... and I worry about the added processing introducing noticeable lag which is a chronic issue with video games and AVRs.
post #1054 of 1105
^^^I think you need to delve into the settings more. You can do those options on older Onkyos, no reason why you wouldn't be able to on the newer ones.
post #1055 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by djPerfectTrip View Post

^^^I think you need to delve into the settings more. You can do those options on older Onkyos, no reason why you wouldn't be able to on the newer ones.

You're absolutely right. I was able to find where to change the input names. My bad.

However, the problem with the AVR not upscaling component video to HDMI apparently is a known crippling that there is no solution for. So my anger there remains justified, since my cheap 9yo Harman Kardon could do this. mad.gif

So I pick up a component-to-HDMI converter. The TX-NR616 just shows a blue screen when I switch to that input. If I disconnect the HDMI from the AVR and connect it directly to the TV, it displays fine and shows that it's 480p. So it's not the cable or the source.

I've tried multiple ports on the AVR. I've also tried other sources on the same ports and they display fine, so it's not a broken HDMI port on the AVR. When I hit the DISPLAY button on the remote, it says the input is "HDMI 4, 24 bit, UNKNOWN".

According to this, the AVR should accept 480p over HDMI just fine and upscale it to just about anything (my TV is 1080p):

http://onkyousacustomersupportblog.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/video-resolution-chart.png

So now what could the issue be? This is getting incredibly irritating.
post #1056 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by sremick View Post


However, the problem with the AVR not upscaling component video to HDMI apparently is a known crippling that there is no solution for.

So, pretty sure the old ones (like my 607) could do this also. Although, I don't have any Component devices any more, so I can't test it (not that that would prove much since I have different model).

 

But the real reason why I posted ...

 

I've often wondered about this "lesser signal upscaling to HDMI 1080p" feature. Like, what's the point. If a 480p or 720p signal hits the 1080p TV, it's automatically upscaled to the native resolution of the TV ... 1080p. So, what's the big deal ? ... am I missing something ... other than the AVR might be able to do it slightly better ... or worse as the case may be.

post #1057 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

I've often wondered about this "lesser signal upscaling to HDMI 1080p" feature. Like, what's the point. If a 480p or 720p signal hits the 1080p TV, it's automatically upscaled to the native resolution of the TV ... 1080p. So, what's the big deal ? ... am I missing something ... other than the AVR might be able to do it slightly better ... or worse as the case may be.

I don't disagree with you... right now, I really don't care where in the chain the upscaling takes place. The issue is, the AVR will not accept 480p over component and output anything, upscaled or otherwise, over HDMI. Which defeats the purpose of having a switching AVR and a single (HDMI) cable going from the AVR to the TV.

While I'm sure my AVR upscales better than my TV, I'd be happy at this point if the TX-NR616 sent 480p over the HDMI out. But it will not. Onkyo's "solution"... which somehow they can suggest with a straight face... is to drop the Wii from 480p to 480i... which not only switches from progressive-scan to interlaced, but even-worse destroys the widescreen 16:9 signal and drops you down to 4:3. Why should I be forced to downgrade to a 4:3 interlaced signal on my 1080p 16:9 TV simply because my AVR is inexcusably handicapped? It's very irritating. But since it'll happily upscale 480i over HDMI... just not 480p... that's Onkyo's happy "solution".

Anyhow, now the question is why the AVR won't even accept 480p in over HDMI...
post #1058 of 1105

More info:

 

http://onkyousacustomersupportblog.wordpress.com/2012/04/17/hdmi-upconversion-for-the-515-and-616/

 

Pretty stange matrix they got there ... I wonder if the 717 (and coming 626 and 727) are the same.

 

But read the chart again ... it shows only 480i can output to HDMI 1080p. Actually, it's the only Component "anything" that can output to HDMI at all.

 

So, everything else is cool (likely all other devices via HDMI)? It's just Wii that must be Component? Maybe just run it to the TV input, and run the audio to the 616?

post #1059 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

But read the chart again ... it shows only 480i can output to HDMI 1080p. Actually, it's the only Component "anything" that can output to HDMI at all.

If we're talking component, yes... I know. frown.gif But I've already resolved myself that the TX-NR616 is unresonably crippled in that regard, and moved beyond component input. I'm now using an HDMI input that is 480p and it still won't display it (read my earlier post for more details).
Quote:
So, everything else is cool (likely all other devices via HDMI)? It's just Wii that must be Component?
Yeah, so now I'm trying converting the Wii to HDMI before it reaches the AVR.
Quote:
Maybe just run it to the TV input, and run the audio to the 616?
Due to the several additional steps necessary to then switch to playing the Wii, this is an impractical solution and defeats the purpose of having a switching AVR. Plus, it shouldn't be necessary.
post #1060 of 1105

Well, again, back to the chart ... using HDMI for IN and OUT, native 480p should output to 1080p.

 

The problem now is likely that converter. Those things almost never work, especially if they do something with HDMI. Only chance is to read reviews and get one that works on a Wii or maybe Nintendo has an official one.

 

Running it to TV like I said is not ideal, but as long as it works (wide-screen, etc.), that's what matters ... I think you might be running out of options. If you have a Harmony, it will do the switching for you.

 

If you have Component In AND OUT, you might also be able to connect the Wii to 616 and run extra Comp. cables to TV ... but that's basically the same thing (and it must be tested to work, etc.).

post #1061 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by sremick View Post

I don't disagree with you... right now, I really don't care where in the chain the upscaling takes place. The issue is, the AVR will not accept 480p over component and output anything, upscaled or otherwise, over HDMI. Which defeats the purpose of having a switching AVR and a single (HDMI) cable going from the AVR to the TV.

While I'm sure my AVR upscales better than my TV, I'd be happy at this point if the TX-NR616 sent 480p over the HDMI out. But it will not. Onkyo's "solution"... which somehow they can suggest with a straight face... is to drop the Wii from 480p to 480i... which not only switches from progressive-scan to interlaced, but even-worse destroys the widescreen 16:9 signal and drops you down to 4:3. Why should I be forced to downgrade to a 4:3 interlaced signal on my 1080p 16:9 TV simply because my AVR is inexcusably handicapped? It's very irritating. But since it'll happily upscale 480i over HDMI... just not 480p... that's Onkyo's happy "solution".

Anyhow, now the question is why the AVR won't even accept 480p in over HDMI...

That's a feature they reserved for higher models. The 717 and 818 will up convert any analog signal to an equal or higher resolution HDMI signal. It will even down convert some of them too (1080i to 720p). Whether this is because they arbitrarily limited it at the factory or if it is due to different video processing chips in the 717 and 818 - who knows?

Some of the older models (like the TX-NR807) would up convert analog to another analog resolution - but only EU models. The US was analog to digital only.
post #1062 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

The problem now is likely that converter. Those things almost never work, especially if they do something with HDMI.
Except it does work. If I go directly from the converter into the TV, it's fine and the TV confirms it's 480p coming out of the HDMI of the converter.
Quote:
Only chance is to read reviews and get one that works on a Wii
Why would it have to specifically work with the Wii? 480p component is 480p component.
Quote:
or maybe Nintendo has an official one.
Nope.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rworne View Post

That's a feature they reserved for higher models. The 717 and 818 will up convert any analog signal to an equal or higher resolution HDMI signal. It will even down convert some of them too (1080i to 720p). Whether this is because they arbitrarily limited it at the factory or if it is due to different video processing chips in the 717 and 818 - who knows?

Some of the older models (like the TX-NR807) would up convert analog to another analog resolution - but only EU models. The US was analog to digital only.
I understand what you're saying, but what infuriates me is that my nine-year-old cheap, basic, low-end Harman Kardon AVR-247 did it. Nine years ago. mad.gif So it hardly seems now in 2013 to be a "luxury" feature one would reserver for "higher-end models" any more than one need buy a Ferrari to get a stereo and power windows in a car.
post #1063 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by sremick View Post

Except it does work. If I go directly from the converter into the TV, it's fine and the TV confirms it's 480p coming out of the HDMI of the converter.
Why would it have to specifically work with the Wii? 480p component is 480p component.
Nope.
I understand what you're saying, but what infuriates me is that my nine-year-old cheap, basic, low-end Harman Kardon AVR-247 did it. Nine years ago. mad.gif So it hardly seems now in 2013 to be a "luxury" feature one would reserver for "higher-end models" any more than one need buy a Ferrari to get a stereo and power windows in a car.

But they do *do* this. I was flabbergasted when I found out the 626 stripped out iPod USB control and now it is no longer supported.

Me: "But it was in there last year and it worked great, why remove it?"
Them: We added Bluetooth support in place of it. So deal with it.
post #1064 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by rworne View Post

But they do *do* this. I was flabbergasted when I found out the 626 stripped out iPod USB control and now it is no longer supported.

Me: "But it was in there last year and it worked great, why remove it?"
Them: We added Bluetooth support in place of it. So deal with it.

Android, Blackberry and Windows Phone users are probably much happier with Bluetooth than Airplay or iPod USB control.
post #1065 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by allargon View Post

Android, Blackberry and Windows Phone users are probably much happier with Bluetooth than Airplay or iPod USB control.

It means nothing to those users, but basic USB support is already in there. Bluetooth and iPod USB control is not a "one or the other" proposition either. It was in there, it wasn't broken, and it was removed. That is the issue.

If they had to pay a license fee to put it in, then perhaps, but the receivers run Linux and they use lots of the features of that system. That reminds me: I have to see if I can get the 626 to run the iPod driver from last year's model...
post #1066 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbroadbelt View Post

Everything runs through the Onkyo with only the main HDMI (ARC) out to the Vizio main HDMI (ARC) input, that's only cable to the TV. I didn't want to run an optical cable to the receiver. I was able to watch Netflix, Amazon, blah, blah, with sound coming from TV's HDMI cable to receiver with TV/CD selected on the Onkyo. I took everything apart to rearrange components and ARC audio hasn't worked since. Any clues or help is appreciated.
Hopefully, you've figured out by now that your problem was this: Only one of the TV's HDMI inputs supports ARC; it's the input labeled ARC. You probably plugged your AVR into one of the other (non-ARC) inputs on the TV.
post #1067 of 1105
posted this in the speaker section...but it has gotten no replies...so i thought i would try here as well....


Hey guys....a few years back i made my first step into the "real" audio world when i purchased an Onkyo 907 HTiB setup...i know HTiB are looked down on, but at the time it came with the Onkyo 605 and the speakers were much better than i previously had. I got a good deal, and the 605 was the "it" receiver at the time...

I recently got a steal on a Onkyo 616 as an upgrade for the 605...and also came across a speaker deal that I want to run by some people....

The Speakers are Triangle Plaisir TEC41WGPC KUMA Wenge Floorstanding Speakers. Now personally i had not heard of Triangle before and it was difficult to find any reviews. All i could find was that they are French, and are known for making some high end stuff....

I emailed Triangle and they told me that the "Plaisir" is very similar to their "Color" series which retail for $899 each for the floor standing speakers and have quite good reviews from what i've seen. The rep said that the components are near identical, but it is the finish of the box that is different...even said the "sound is the same"

Now...I want to make sure that everything will play nicely between my Onkyo 616 and these speakers if i purchase them...

According to the PDF the customer service rep sent me here are the specs on the speakers...


KUMA
Wenge vynil finish / black front panel

Floorstander
3-way bass-reflex
Includes an electronic protection system

Mid drive unit: TRIANGLE T16E_F100P_E120cm
Baas drive unit: TRIANGLE T16E_F100PE_160cm
Tweeter: TRIANGLE TZ209

Sensitivity (dB/W/m): 90
Bandwidth (+ - 3dB Hz - kHz): 45 - 24
Power handling (W): 100
Repetitive peak power (W): 200
Ways: 3
Nominal impedance: 6
Minimum impedance: 3,9
Low frequency roll-off (Hz): 400
High frequency roll-off (KHz): 3,0
Dimensions (mm, H x L x P): 965x188x275
Net weight (kg): 15,50

Is there anything that would cause an issue here with my Onkyo?? Also...i originally planned to purchase 2 (F R/L) but is there any reason I couldn't purchase more and use them as surrounds as well??
post #1068 of 1105

Never heard of them but based on the specs they should be easy to drive with the Onkyo and I see no issues.

post #1069 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by primetimeguy View Post

Never heard of them but based on the specs they should be easy to drive with the Onkyo and I see no issues.

any issue with running a couple of them up front and keeping the older Onkyo Speakers hooked up as my surrounds...basically it would be mixing impedance raitings?...These are 6ohm...while the Onkyos are 8...
post #1070 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metfanant View Post


I recently got a steal on a Onkyo 616 as an upgrade for the 605...and also came across a speaker deal that I want to run by some people....

The Speakers are Triangle Plaisir TEC41WGPC KUMA Wenge Floorstanding Speakers.
Now...I want to make sure that everything will play nicely between my Onkyo 616 and these speakers if i purchase them...

Power handling (W): 100
Repetitive peak power (W): 200

Nominal impedance: 6
Minimum impedance: 3,9

Is there anything that would cause an issue here with my Onkyo?? Also...i originally planned to purchase 2 (F R/L) but is there any reason I couldn't purchase more and use them as surrounds as well??

 

Unknown to me, but they sound pretty high-end. Will they play? ... sure. Will they play rock-concert loud? maybe.

 

Never really seen variable power and impedance like that. Is it 100w or 200w? Is it 6 or 4 ohms? Just match up your specs to see if 616 can handle them.

 

Onkyo 616 Specs:

 

All Channels : 115 W (6 ohms, 1 kHz, 0.7%, 2 channels driven)

 

Front L/R: 100 W (8 ohms, 20 Hz-20 kHz, 0.7%, 2 channels driven, FTC)
125 W + 125 W (6 ohms, 1 kHz, 0.1%, 2 channels driven, FTC)

 

Speaker Impedance:  6 ohms - 16 ohms

 

Personally, I think I would put more money into amp. They sound power hungry.

 

I would not buy another pair for surrounds. Something smaller would work better (unless you like "All Channel Stereo" and/or the room is huge). But even then, you are going to need a lot of amp power to get them to play. If this is home Home Theater, remember that all speakers must be balanced to one system. Also, a $200-$300 sub-woofer will go a long ways.

 

And if you got a real Onkyo-605 before, you don't have to call that a HTiB ... it was simply a "audio package". A HTiB would not have a real 605 (it would have been a similar but lesser model).

post #1071 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metfanant View Post


any issue with running a couple of them up front and keeping the older Onkyo Speakers hooked up as my surrounds...basically it would be mixing impedance raitings?...These are 6ohm...while the Onkyos are 8...

I think mixed impedance is ok (since they are different channels) but don't quote me on that.

 

What are the little Onkyo speakers rated at ? My guess is that if you installed them all as you suggest ... and ran Audyssey ... the Triangles are going to be turned way down and the Onkyo speaker's level is going to be turned way up. So, you pay $1800 for front speakers that are turned down.

 

Have you looked a Polk Audio, Definitive Tech, Klipsch ... maybe something a little more mainstream.

post #1072 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

Unknown to me, but they sound pretty high-end. Will they play? ... sure. Will they play rock-concert loud? maybe.

Never really seen variable power and impedance like that. Is it 100w or 200w? Is it 6 or 4 ohms? Just match up your specs to see if 616 can handle them.
the way i understand it (admittedly could be completely wrong) is that the speakers are rated at 100w...but the max power they can handle would be 200w...but obviously that would be for short burts, not sustained
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

And if you got a real Onkyo-605 before, you don't have to call that a HTiB ... it was simply a "audio package". A HTiB would not have a real 605 (it would have been a similar but lesser model).
nah, it really was a HTiB...the HT-SP908...onkyo calls it a "Home Theater Package" but its a legit 605 in there...

http://www.onkyousa.com/Products/model.php?m=HT-SP908&class=Systems&source=prodClassOnkyo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

I think mixed impedance is ok (since they are different channels) but don't quote me on that.

What are the little Onkyo speakers rated at ? My guess is that if you installed them all as you suggest ... and ran Audyssey ... the Triangles are going to be turned way down and the Onkyo speaker's level is going to be turned way up. So, you pay $1800 for front speakers that are turned down.

Have you looked a Polk Audio, Definitive Tech, Klipsch ... maybe something a little more mainstream.

The Onkyo's speakers as listed on Onkyo's website are all 8ohm with a "max power" of 110W

http://www.onkyousa.com/Products/model.php?m=SKS-HT750&class=Speaker&source=prodClass

as for looking for something more mainstream...I wasn't really looking just stumbled across a deal...i wouldn't be paying $1800 for the two speakers...they would be $99 each
post #1073 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metfanant View Post


the way i understand it (admittedly could be completely wrong) is that the speakers are rated at 100w...but the max power they can handle would be 200w...but obviously that would be for short burts, not sustained
nah, it really was a HTiB...the HT-SP908...onkyo calls it a "Home Theater Package" but its a legit 605 in there...

http://www.onkyousa.com/Products/model.php?m=HT-SP908&class=Systems&source=prodClassOnkyo
The Onkyo's speakers as listed on Onkyo's website are all 8ohm with a "max power" of 110W

http://www.onkyousa.com/Products/model.php?m=SKS-HT750&class=Speaker&source=prodClass

as for looking for something more mainstream...I wasn't really looking just stumbled across a deal...i wouldn't be paying $1800 for the two speakers...they would be $99 each

Don't be fooled by high MSRP.

 

"$200 a pair" front speakers are a better match for 616 and old Onkyo HTiB speakers (as center, surrounds and I'm guessing Sub).

 

Still say you should look at Polk Audio (at Newegg) or some of the other brands I mentioned (at Amazon). You can build a "matched set" a little at a time for $100-$200 a speaker.

post #1074 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

Don't be fooled by high MSRP.

"$200 a pair" front speakers are a better match for 616 and old Onkyo HTiB speakers (as center, surrounds and I'm guessing Sub).

Still say you should look at Polk Audio (at Newegg) or some of the other brands I mentioned (at Amazon). You can build a "matched set" a little at a time for $100-$200 a speaker.

im not fooled by the high MSRP...and understand the importance of "matching" a setup...my entire point in all of this was just kind of stumbling across this deal (saving $400 per speaker) and don't want to pass it up if they are going to 1. Work 2. Sound good....

anything is going to be an upgrade to the Onkyo speakers im currently running...and while i like quality audio im far from an audiophile (heck i think my Onkyo's sound great lol tongue.gif)

these just seemed like a worthy upgrade considering the $99 price on sale
post #1075 of 1105
I have 2 questions with the NR616

1. Can you turn off the white light that surrounds the volume knob on the front of the receiver?

2. Does this receiver work with an IR remote like a Harmony?
post #1076 of 1105
Found the dimmer button on the receiver, that's a nice option. No more light on the volume knob. Still can't find anything in the manual about ir
post #1077 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by 413X3 View Post

I have 2 questions with the NR616

1. Can you turn off the white light that surrounds the volume knob on the front of the receiver?

2. Does this receiver work with an IR remote like a Harmony?

2. Yes, its a standard programmable universal remote. See page 5 in OM and also IR codes in back. Onkyo's remote hasn't changed much over the years. But you're right, it really doesn't say IR anywhere, but it obviously is.

 

I use a Harmony 670 on my Onkyo-607, and I also tried my new Harmony 650 with it as a test. We have a Harmony 650 thread here:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1237145/official-logitech-harmony-650-600-remote-thread

post #1078 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesla1856 View Post

2. Yes, its a standard programmable universal remote. See page 5 in OM and also IR codes in back. Onkyo's remote hasn't changed much over the years. But you're right, it really doesn't say IR anywhere, but it obviously is.

I use a Harmony 670 on my Onkyo-607, and I also tried my new Harmony 650 with it as a test. We have a Harmony 650 thread here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1237145/official-logitech-harmony-650-600-remote-thread

Thanks, I misspoke. Not IR, but does it work with IF? I want to close the cabinet door and use an RF remote like the Harmony Ultimate
post #1079 of 1105
Quote:
Originally Posted by 413X3 View Post


Thanks, I misspoke. Not IR, but does it work with IF? I want to close the cabinet door and use an RF remote like the Harmony Ultimate

Ya, RF ... big difference.  smile.gif

 

But anyway. Yes, sure (as I understand the system) but that's part of the remote solution (not the AVR).

 

The Hub and the wired IR Blasters are a big part of the system. Without those, it couldn't control 99% of the Home Theater components out there (since they are all IR based). I suggest you grab the PDF manual. The Hub itself might have a Blaster built-in. If it does, then each device won't need a wired external blaster. The IR light tends to bounce around pretty good and should as well inside a closed cabinet.

 

If I had a Harmony Touch, I think I would miss the buttons (and having to look at the remote closely each time). I guess it makes up for that in flexibility.

 

There are similar RF (WiFi) systems. But with those, the remote is whatever WiFi device you already have (iPad, iPhone, iPod, etc.).

https://thinkflood.com/products/redeye/

 

If it's just the closed cabinet thing, you don't have to go RF. They make remote IR extender systems which are cheaper.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Cables-To-Go-Infrared-IR-Remote-Control-Repeater-Kit/21118570

post #1080 of 1105
Yeah I'm leaning towards sticking with my Harmony One and just getting IR extenders like what you linked me to. Just need to find an extender that works properly with my Directv dvr, apparently reading reviews on amazon, not all do.
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AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Receivers, Amps, and Processors › Onkyo New AVR's TX-NR818,717,616 official Discussion [No Price Talk]Thread