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Dimensions for sealed 18" sub box - Page 11

post #301 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaiii View Post

Any updates on the smaller flat packs (0.75 and 1.0 cu ft.)?

What's the latest on the dual opposed boxes? Each day I faithfully refresh your website. biggrin.gif
post #302 of 679
is the 18" something that will come soon, or has it been pushed back because there's too many projects. thanks!
post #303 of 679
Thread Starter 
Most of the boxes have been done for quite a while now. redface.gif The wait had to do with a couple things. One was the SEOS waveguide stuff came in that just hammered me for 3 weeks solid. Plus I wanted to send a couple of the subwoofer boxes out to some members to glue up and give any suggestions. Then of course test packing material so these things could be shipped okay.


I have to send out 2 more "test boxes" and we should be 100% ready to go. I also packaged up a sub box to fit the 15" MFW on Friday that will be going on tomorrow and a couple other ones. I will say that some people that ordered had some good patience waiting for me to figure out packaging and things like that. But I've pretty well got it figured out.


I know this is probably obvious, but one thing about these larger boxes that should be noted is that they are a bit harder to put together than the small bookshelf speaker flat packs. I've built many subwoofer boxes cut on table saws and now CNC's. The CNC units are certainly better, but they still require that you take your time when gluing them up to make sure everything is done right. And because of their weight, you still need clamps when gluing and make sure your all lined up.

The first boxes that were shipped went together just fine, but it was noted that they might be toooo accurate and a little extra "slop" in the joints with slightly wider rabbets and grooves might make things go easier. Then again, some said they liked how the braces held in place when they slightly tapped them into the grooves. The difference between a snug fit and a looser fit is only .01" when your talking about rabbet joints and grooves. biggrin.gif

I don't think anyone had any problems yet, but I am trying to think of issues that some could have in the future.
post #304 of 679
Is there a special order for the MFW's or do the normal 15" boxes work?
post #305 of 679
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maklar View Post

Is there a special order for the MFW's or do the normal 15" boxes work?

It was the 3 cu ft box. I just had the CNC cut some different baffles. They should match up to the 15" Dayton DVC model as well. I'll get all the options posted up as soon as I can. The lst has gotten fairly extensive.
post #306 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maklar View Post

Is there a special order for the MFW's or do the normal 15" boxes work?

I'm eagerly awaiting these boxes, as well as the dual-opposed! Great work Erich biggrin.gif
post #307 of 679
Haven't been around much in the last while, is there a website that shows all the flat packs available Eric?
post #308 of 679
pbc - diysoundgroup.com

Erich - I have 4 MFW's waiting for some boxes, please let us know when the option becomes available to order them.
post #309 of 679
So, there is a dual opposed flat pack enclosure being created for the MFW-15 driver? What's the internal cu. ft. and exterior dimensions?
post #310 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Bley View Post

So, there is a dual opposed flat pack enclosure being created for the MFW-15 driver? What's the internal cu. ft. and exterior dimensions?

I would think it would be a general purpose dual opposed 15" enclosure, doesn't make sense to make it specifically for the MFW-15 driver since you can't buy them new anymore.
post #311 of 679
Dual 15" cabinets would be huge... i think the only dual opposed that should happen is 2x12" at 3.5 or 4 cu ft
post #312 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by omegaslast View Post

Dual 15" cabinets would be huge... i think the only dual opposed that should happen is 2x12" at 3.5 or 4 cu ft

A dual opposed 15" doesn't have to be that much bigger than the 12" DO. Just go with a DO 15" in a 5cuft and that would work with most 15" available today as long as you provide the watts which are cheap enough now and DSP like the MiniDSP or DCX2496. A good box Q was important when DSP and monster amps were not readily available, now we can cheat the old rules with new technology.
post #313 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

If they were the current ones around 70lbs each, it looks like shipping would only be about $25 each. (Thank you FedEx discount)
That's not bad for about 600 miles away from 45239. But they are right on the line at the magic 70lb weight for UPS and FedEx. Normally 5lbs more doesn't add much of anything until it's over 70lbs.


If I figure 75lbs the price hops up to $33.61. I'm guessing with 2" baffles they would be closer to 85lbs. That would be $38.80.



But two 42 lb boxes would only be $19 each.........so it's actually cheaper (and likely safer) sending 2 separate boxes once weight gets up there over 80lbs. Two 37lb boxes would be about $17 each, about the same as shipping one 75lb.


I'm really thinking 2 shipping boxes is the way we're going to have to do this on the larger 4+ cuft boxes. But that's because these are beefed up enclosures.....




Way out west is a little different though. I'm using Sacramento 95831 and it should be some of the highest rates I've got. 70lbs is $45. 75lbs is $52. Two 37lbs are $32 each. 85lbs is $55. Two 42lbs are $35 each



So there it would be quite a bit cheaper to ship one box. I've got some really nice packing material for these if needed. But I'd still be worried about 85lbs being pushed off the back of a truck. A square 85lb smooth box is not easy to pick up or work with and you know how they'll be treated. I think my internal packaging could handle it, just not sure about the double thick cardboard box itself.

Erich,

I worked at a FedEx distribution plant for 1.5 years unloading trucks for about 3/4 of that time. I was 6'3" and 235lbs at the time and at the end of a four hour shift I still would have been frustrated with an 75 or 85lb box. When you are frustrated and tired -- gentle handling of an 85 lb box with no handles that is loaded flat in the very bottom of a truck is not going to happen. It pinches your fingers to pick up and just makes you mad. That was a tough job. I was a good sport about it, but I know there were a lot of people that would kick or throw a box out of a truck just out spite if it was heavy or difficult to handle. If there is a way to make a meaningful and strong handle on the box that might make the package handlers a bit easier on it. Something like these handles might help on the bigger boxes I don't know what they cost, or if your cardboard is strong enough to support them -- but just an idea.

http://allenfield.com/packaging/plastic-box-handle-1/heavy-duty-65/

Otherwise I encourage your idea of two smaller boxes. Even if you use those plasic throw away straps to secure the two boxes together. The plastic straps would at least provide a welcome grip to the handler.



Alternatively if you could put a piece of thin junk wood cut to size on the top and bottom of the package to help take the blunt of the external side and corner damage. I know all this adds to cost, but I'd probably be a customer who would pay a bit extra to make sure my boxes arrived perfect and could be assemebled without blemish, or crushed corners. If these precautions added $5 or $10 to the shipping price I'd be game. They could be optional for your customer.
Edited by Archaea - 7/14/12 at 7:31am
post #314 of 679
I would be for 2. I still have 4 MFWs waiting for a home.

Jake

Sent from my Rezound using Tapatalk 2
post #315 of 679
I have 8 MFW-15's that I bought from Erich around this time last summer that need a home. I want to do 4 dual opposed enclosures. I'd like to do 5 cu. ft. internal volume. I may still do my own boxes but, I'd be interested to see what Erich has in a flat pack kit. smile.gif
post #316 of 679
"Dual 15" cabinets would be huge... i think the only dual opposed that should happen is 2x12" at 3.5 or 4 cu ft"

omega, there are several 15" drivers that work well in a dual opposed smallish form factor. the appropriate size of the enclosure depends on the driver parameters, not just the diameter.

the epik empire is one among many. http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/empire.html
post #317 of 679
"I have 8 MFW-15's that I bought from Erich around this time last summer that need a home. I want to do 4 dual opposed enclosures."

i understand the benefits of dual opposed, but dual front firing look a little bit more badass in my estimation. :-) either way, with 8 mfw's you can't really lose.

288
post #318 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

A dual opposed 15" doesn't have to be that much bigger than the 12" DO. Just go with a DO 15" in a 5cuft and that would work with most 15" available today as long as you provide the watts which are cheap enough now and DSP like the MiniDSP or DCX2496. A good box Q was important when DSP and monster amps were not readily available, now we can cheat the old rules with new technology.

Considering the weight that the 18" is, a 5cu ft would be pushing it unless erich shipped it as two packages.
post #319 of 679
With the 5cuft dual opposed you can get away with just 2 braces like the Submersive since the dual opposed configuration cancels out the vibration in the enclosure. Done right it should weigh the same or less than the 18" 4.5cuft especially since 2 panels will have driver cutouts.
post #320 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

With the 5cuft dual opposed you can get away with just 2 braces like the Submersive since the dual opposed configuration cancels out the vibration in the enclosure. Done right it should weigh the same or less than the 18" 4.5cuft especially since 2 panels will have driver cutouts.

My thoughts exactly.
post #321 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjaudio View Post

With the 5cuft dual opposed you can get away with just 2 braces like the Submersive since the dual opposed configuration cancels out the vibration in the enclosure. Done right it should weigh the same or less than the 18" 4.5cuft especially since 2 panels will have driver cutouts.

Thats true.

I personally think the bracing is overkill on most of these. Circular window [O] brace and a half circle [( brace for the back would be all i would do.

My Edesign 21x21x25"

xcGcn.jpg

57lbs with 3 braces
Edited by omegaslast - 7/14/12 at 4:19pm
post #322 of 679
Something like that would be great for a flat pack, imagine trying to cut those braces yourself without a CNC eek.gif
post #323 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Bley View Post

My thoughts exactly.

I agree, it should be workable concept.
post #324 of 679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Here's a photo of the 22" cube with the LMS. I'm pretty confident that I will get some blank baffles made up for these boxes and then make this size box with the 2" thick baffles for the LMS. The main thing is that we now have the correct diameters.



Anyone have an idea for other drivers that could be used for this 4.5 cu ft enclosure? Is the 15" Titanic better suited for the 3.5 cu ft or 4.5 cu ft?


The one I'm interested in is the ULX-18 ...

http://www.istonline.ca/mach5_uxl_18.html

Thought I read it works well in 4.2 cubes anyhow (well, the older IXL anyhow, but I don't imagine the newer one being that diff when it comes out).
post #325 of 679
Actually, now I recall where I saw the 4.2 cubic foot metric. That's actually Ricci's test box for 18" cubes. Seemed to perform pretty darn well in that box though...

http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=75

Methinks you need to make a baffle available for it. tongue.gif
post #326 of 679
fingers crossed for updates!
post #327 of 679
Some new subwoofer flat packs and kits have shown up on the site...biggrin.gif

Curious about the exterior dimensions of the 1.5 cu ft. dual opposed box...
post #328 of 679
I was wondering when the kits were going to show up. Now all we need is kit pricing.

Looking at the 15" Dayton kit, although I think I would prefer the HF to the HO.
post #329 of 679
Hi Erich,

The sub flat packs look great.

Just a thought--and I'm not trying to create more work for you, you're already doing an incredible amount--but I was wondering if you're CNC machine could cut grill frames as an option for the subs.

If it's something that could be done for not too much extra work on your part, I would gladly pay extra for something like that.

Either way, I'll be buying a couple flat packs soon. Just waiting to see what all of the options will be.

Thanks!
Dan
post #330 of 679
Thread Starter 
Sorry I haven't checked this thread as much as I should have.

Yesterday I did take photos to get the kits going. I'm working to figure out pricing right now.

As for the MFW box? Yes, some were made and shipped out for trials. Plus they match up fine with the Dayton DVC driver that is still available. Because that sub isn't a massive beast, a new box was designed with one vertical and one horizontal brace. That lowered the price by a significant margin. I just need to get photos posted.


Here's the thing: People that got some of the first round of boxes liked them. BUT, even though they assembled them okay, there was a little worry about the average guy that hasn't done this before. I've assembled most of the models and put the horizontal braces in first before the sides and back go on. The verticals then slide into dado grooves. While putting one together, I added the wood glue into the grooves and along the brace's edge. I took a photo for some directions I was writing up. Waiting just that short amount of time must have swelled the wood a little and the glue got tacky. As the brace went in, it slowed down and didn't go all the way to the rear panel! No big deal, I grabbed a piece of scrap wood and a hammer and tapped it in. Done.

BUT, if that was someone that has never worked with wood glue and they waited a minute or so to figure out what to do, the glue would have set and they would have had problems. I don't like that when people are spending money on their stuff. I could see someone getting nervous and trying to pull the brace back out. At that point, it's a lost cause.

So I spent way too long figuring out a better method. And I'm happy to say that they're now super easy. I thought about adding small pieces of wood to act as shelves (sticking out about 2" from the inner wall)....cut the braces about 1" smaller so they can be dropped in and glued to the shelves. But that adds more pieces and people wondering if it would still be as strong. Of course the glue is stronger than the wood, but not everyone knows that. This option might eventually get used on some boxes.


GOOD NEWS: The newly designed enclosures are done and ready to go. And much easier. Instead of dados cut along the sides, top, and bottom; they are now on the back panel. You lay the back panel down, and glue the bracing in those grooves. The sides no longer have dados, so you simple glue them up without needing to line up the braces or slide the braces in.

What will I do with the boxes that the CNC company already cut? I'll assemble them myself and sell them as completed boxes. There's absolutely nothing wrong with them, I just worry about someone gluing them up that's never done that before. Most of us could assemble them. But I have to remember the ones that might live in an apartment with no tools.
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