Cheapest ever HTPC that's decent. Proud of myself. - Page 10

I do have a bit more to add here. (I will admit I like debating you, please don't view this as disrespect. Your one of my most respected posters here and your advice always have some level of value even if it's different than mine.)

First- Your suggesting a professional reviewer. But I can't honestly say that the reviewer is any better at making a judgement than me. I have built at least 25 PC's in last 5 years. I tend to think I can tell a totally crappy case from a good one.

I have even purchased $30 cases that include 400 watt PSU's. My case on my main machine cost me $350. It's clearly the best by every review I have ever seen on it. I know what levels of quality are like- My server case is a $225 case. My HTPC case is a $40 case.

When I actually spent my own money on both and built them side by side- I feel my opinion at least has some value to it. I paid $40 for both of these with free shipping. (Coolermaster and Antec)

Normally the Antec300 is $20 more. Given this- I can't say I would recommend it for a budget build for $20 more. At the same price- flip a coin both are great.

Second,

If you look at the review- the coolermaster was actually quieter in certain scenarios.

Consider it has no fan control- and the Antec won the sound test with the fan control on LOW. Makes sense. But look at the Fan speed on high. It's not significantly better. Nor is the coolermaster significantly worse.

I will tell you from having them side by side. both are real world about the same noise level, and if you turn down the fan speed on the coolermaster it's actually quieter. This is something the review did not do.

Third,

If you read the review specifically about the Coolermaster they had no negative things to say about it- and it did not place last. The review was actually positive.

Because of the fan control and dual fans the Antec was able to win the sound test and the thermal test in the review. Coolermaster comes with a single front fan only, while Antec comes with fan back and top with fan control.

This advantage let Antec win the comparison- but I would argue that $10 spent on quality fans would make the Coolermaster perform better in thermal tests than the Antec300. And considering the Antec does cost more- we are now talking about the coolermaster at the same price performing better.

Otherside is slowing down the fan with fan control and moving it from the front- (I did both) which clearly lowers the sound level of the Coolermaster too.

So while in stock trim- as reviewed - The antec was able to win the thermal test and sound test and no doubt this gave it it's top rating- In the real world it's not so certain.

The antec might have won that single review- but it certainly was not crushing victory.

If thermal performance was significant to any buyer- there is no doubt that with the myriad of fan options on the Coolermaster you could make it perform better in thermal testing than the Antec300 for the same price spend total.

And- if thermal performance was not important (it was not to me) you could easily move the front fan (when no HDD's) or even turn it off or slow it down and it's also easily just as quiet as the Antec.

The Coolermaster is lighter weight and easier to move- yet it's amazingly strudy and rigid because it's reinforced in all the right places.

The antec is heavier because it uses thicker metal- but it's not reinforced as well so for example- the motherboard tray has more give to it even with a thicker ply metal used.

You claim it had the worst cooling design- But I doubt you have used this case.

It has options for mutiple fans of multiple sizes on top, front, bottom and back. Just because it comes with a single fan in the HDD bay front of the case does not mean it has "worst cooling design"

Adding a $3-$7 fan is no different than adding a $3 power cable to the missing cable with the Antec PSU. Right?

The design of the Coolermaster is quite solid and well done. It does not come with tons of fans because probably cost is an issue and not everyone needs them. Consider it sells for $20 less than the Antec everyday street price, and that it can be configured with additional fans for less then $10 to perform much better in thermal testing than the Antec300- and- it can also be configured with reduced fan speed to be just as quiet.

While it might not be better to everyone- it's certainly worth a look.

And- To bring this all back into the original scope of my first post and suggestion- For $20 cheaper and assuming you can't get the Antec300 for the same price- It's not a bad option at all.

That is all I was ever saying. I think you think the Coolermaster is worse than it really is- and for some reason you think because I like it- then the Antec must suck. That is not the case either.

I would recommend both to anyone, and provided one is cheaper than the other that is my recommendation to someone looking for a cheap but good PC CASE.

You guys are blowing this way out of proportion.

(thanks for the video btw... stardog. Lol)

I was suggesting a $17 Coolermaster to a guy with a total build around $100 ($35 motherboard, $20 RAM, $38 CPU).

To stretch this into a territory where I am saying get the crappiest PSU available because it's the absolute lowest priced on ebay for $9.99 and don't worry about a thing is just irresponsible. Even if it's fun

I am going to stand firm on my recommendation for him given the objective he has for low cost. (Keep in mind my personal HTPC has both the Antec300 and an antec ECO PSU)

he's just operating in a territory and budget that it makes sense. And there is nothing wrong with a coolermaster PSU for $17. To think, expect or suggest it won't work perfectly as designed and needed is silly.

this forum and many others are totally full of this notion that any PSU that's not high end is going to explode and burn up your whole system.

That is indeed rubbish.

For every Seasonic that goes into an enthusiast build, I bet there is 30 sub $20 cheapo PSU's going into retail machines.

What do you think Dell, lenovo, HP, and ACER use ??? Seasonic??? lol.

It's not exactly like you read about every one of them blowing up, or having a meltdown.

I have taken apart retail PC's before and I can tell you that the Coolermaster PSU I recommended the guy on a tight budget is clearly better quality inside.

please guys- Don't stretch my suggestion it's ok to get a cheap PSU into a territory and argument I did not intend by my comments.

PSU is indeed important. I paid $200 for mine on my main machine because I personally believe this. but to tell this guy with $100 in cheap parts laying on his table he needs to do the same is irresponsible.

This is the CHEAP HTPC EVER thread. Keep that in mind please.

CHEAP!

G530 + Asrock H61. Total cost under $100.

I used 8GB DDR3 Crucial I already had laying around. Probably will keep it, it was cheap enough for $30.

I installed it into an old gaming case I had.

ThermalTake Armor 10 bay black. I only used it cause I already had it and it is a 10 bay full tower.

I bought another drive cage on amazon. SO I have two 4 HDD cages, with one drive mounted below - and an SSD for the OS mounted in a 5.25 to 3.5 adapter plate (which also has the 2.5 HDD adapter plate in it from the SSD)

Currently it's made from drives I already owned. I bought a new Seagate 3TB for a parity drive because I needed a drive that was as large as my largest drive and I had a 3TB WD green already. I could not use any of my other drives for a parity drive.

I am running WHS2011 and Flexraid.

Still playing with it- but it's nice so far.

My final strategy will be to get a nicer motherboard with Intel LAN that is more appropriate for a server and perhaps an Ivy level i3 type CPU when they are released. But a $99 Sandy 2100 or even $49 G620 is really quite fine.

I think we really agree in theory in most of the important stuff:

-A PSU is imporant, and quality is important factor of PSU purchase decision
-Antec300 is a wonderful case in the $40-$65 range that near top of the class
-Antec Neo PSU is a great choice in the $30-60 PSU range.

What we disagree slightly on is:

-Coolermaster is equally wonderful and might be worth consideration since it sells for $20 less everyday street price. It's appropriate in this Cheapest EVER HTPC thread.

-It's ok to get a Cheap PSU for a very cheap PC build. Just because its' cheap does not mean it won't work as intended reliably. Just buy with common sense and research.

And please understand- I actually enjoy debating with you on this stuff so there is no disrespect intended by offering an opinion that is not in line with your own.

I also appreciate your attempt to clarify points and opinions I make so other readers looking on don't get the totally wrong impression.

perhaps- but I see it constantly for $17 and have purchased one before at this price.

I have never seen the Antec below $30 ever. It's rare for it to reach that even.

Consider that $17 vs $30 it's almost twice the price. That's at the special price for the Antec too.

When I think about how often I see the coolermaster for $17 vs how seldom I see the Antec Eco under $45 and it's easy to see why I recommended this for a super low budget build.

I think your thinking I am not saying the ECO is better. I believe it is and run one on my own HTPC. But I am not going to tell a guy who has spent three weeks piecing together the cheapest build he could- on a tight budget he needs to spend double on his PSU for an ECO.

Can I ask two questions:

Do you think the ECO is a better choice at average price of say $40 vs Coolermaster at average price of $20 for a super low budget build?

and,

Is there any reason you don't think the $17 Coolemaster PSU would work perfectly for less cost?

Agreed. I can see where you thought that.

While I am suggesting that for a really tight build and budget it's ok to get a cheap PSU- please don't think I am saying get a total hunk of crap.

We share the same notions about a good PSU.

I will also admit my tolerance for risk is a bit higher than some, and I don't buy into the argument that people make about any non high end PSU not being a valid option.

I have a $350 PC case and a $200 PSU in my personal PC. Clearly I think both are very important.

But I would not think twice about running a $35 ECS board of a $17 PSU and I think it's a better option than the Antec Neo even at a great price of double that ($35)

I mean - wasn't someone talking about re-using an old dell case and PSU ???

Certainly my budget $17 PSU has an advantage in both performance and reliability over that option.

I do appreciate you covering up my mistakes and clarifying issues for others that might get confused.

Yeah you can get a $9.99 ebay PSU with no name on it- but clearly there is a reason why you might want to get something else.

I would disagree on this one. I learned that "good" memory and "cheap" memory are often only 5$ or $10 apart - and that there is indeed a difference.

Nothing is more frustrating than a bad stick of Ram. It's a real pain in the ass to isolate and troubleshoot, and it's frustrating to operate a PC with a memory stick issue.

The entire process sucks, and it's never worth the few dollars you save buying suspect ram. I stick with known MFG with proven track records.

For me these days I have had good luck with Crucial, Gskill and Mushkin.

I bought off brand memory in past and has issues with it.

The cost difference in actual dollars between "cheap" and "good" for memory is the smallest gap of all components. I mean you can spend $30 or $300 on a motherboard easily.. and you can spend $30 or $300 on a Case or PSU too.
But Ram it's only separated by a few bucks.

Get good RAM and save yourself the headache.

I am way more afraid of a bad stick of RAM than a cheap PSU failing. It's much more common for a defective stick of ram too.

Lol. Basically the same way I feel about PSU.

I know there is a difference in quality- but I have purchased sub $20 PSU's and had great success with them. I have never been burned so I think it's not a big deal.

I have been burned by Memory many times. I have RMA-ed many sticks.

Funny how personal experience changes the way one thinks.

reality is neither is right nor wrong and it's each individual's right to personally decide themselves.

I had such a bad experience with my Core2/Asus Maximus build and Crucial Ballistix DDR2 that I think I would rather have a PSU melt down my CPU and board than every have a memory issue again. It's just easier and less frustrating to spend a couple hundred bucks and be done with the frustration with a new PC. BSOD randomly.. is the most annoying thing ever. I ended up pumping the voltage to the DDR2 to something like 2.8v - or something totally stupid before I could get it stable. This after two RMA's. I actually did have a bad stick in each RMA... What are the odds? 3 in a row ?? Each time Memtest confirmed they were faulty.

If it was not for crucial great customer service and support I would have sworn them off. But actually I still buy crucial even though I think it's decidedly lower quality- because I have a little piece of mind knowing they would back me up.

But that is now- when troubleshooting a stick or changing the voltage is a piece of cake for me. But back when I was new to memory trouble shooting- it was quite a frustrating experience. Nothing is worse than building a new system and it not running stable for two full months. I am now scared of Memory issues.

Great !!!

I thought that would do it. Glad it's working out good for you!

Nice job piecing together a capable but very affordable HTPC.

That's once of the best $200 total cost builds I have seen in sense of pure value.