budget sub choices

Hello, long time lurker here starting a home theater project. I'm on a budget, I'm currently selling off my vintage video game collection and turning it into a home theater. I have everything picked out (already bought front floor standing speakers and reciever) except the subwoofer. We're coming from a htib setup, so the 2 speakers are already better. We had the polk audio psw10, but we sold it because it just wasn't enough on the low end.

I can't measure exactly right now because the tape is in my gf's car, but the room is roughly 20x20x10ft. The budget is about $250 for the sub, ouch. Here is what I have picked out so far:

Unfortunately it won't let me post links because I am a new member, so I will have to post model numbers for you to look up, sorry

$200 until the 18th on newegg

psw505

and this is out of my range, but would be nice

Dayton Audio C1500K 15" Powered Subwoofer Kit

I'm not too sure about the polk audio. But I do have an alternative and that's why a came here to the diy section. I happened to have these sitting in my basement for last 4 years, here's the pics and specs:

Sony XS-L1236



Audiobahn AW121T

infinity 1252W



What I would like to know is if say, I could build a box for the 2 cheap-o xplods and purchase an amp that can power them both, and have better results than the two retail choices that I'm looking at. Time and work is not a factor, I'm always doing some pointless tinkering with my spare time. I know making 2 separate boxes for 2 of my subs would be ideal, but I figured it would be cheaper to drive them both with one decent amp in an upright standing ported box. Just gotta come up with some kind of fabric grill to cover the horrid looking things.

edit: They are 4ohm's, so if I have to run them in series, no big deal.

I've been reading a lot, and you guys get a lot of questions about car subs in home theater, but I don't know what to think since I already have the subs, so this really brings down the price with my low budget. And if I do go this route and don't like the sound of these old cheap subs, I can always just buy some real ones down the road and toss these things (although if I were to buy real ones I would prefer 15", so I may make the box a little wider if I can just in case).

Thanks in advance for your input!

Also, is it ok to run 2 subwoofers from one amp? I was thinking if this doesn't sound like crap then I'll make a second one with the other 2 subwoofers. If it does sound like crap, I'm just going to build a single 15" one and forget this "stacking" idea.

I like your amp suggestion of a used EP2500/EP4000. I was originally looking here:

parts-express subwoofer amps (still can't post links)

I didn't realize there were such good amps like you suggested, I just started researching. Do you have any other suggestions like that? Right now I'm set on getting a used 2500. I'm curious if it will power all 4 of these.

I decided that I won't really be mixing them in the same box, they will have a divider between them, and will each have their own port. I'm going to hook all of these speakers up to my car after class today to see if they even work, let alone sound any good before I buy anything. I'll update on that later, thanks for the input.

I just wanted to clarify, I don't doubt the amp can power all of the subwoofers, I've just never tried building one of these before, so I don't really know how to wire it up yet. I have some reading to do, and when I get everything I'm sure I'll be back here to ask some questions about hooking everything up with the ohms and what-not.

So going with the diy setup with the crappy subs is the better way to go as opposed to getting the psw505 right?

Thanks for the input. I'm going to go diy, I like the idea of getting a decent amp and having the option to get better subwoofers / build new boxes in the future without having to worry about an amp. I'll update when the project is finished or if I need help.

I want to go with the ep2500, and I see a used one for auction on ebay for pretty cheap. I know you said to test a used one first, but I think I'm gonna take the chance because the seller has a 14 day return policy.

tundrSQ, thanks for the suggestion, but I couldn't find very many discussions on that series of subwoofers.

So I only sold half of my games, and I made more money than I thought all of them would sell for so my budget has increased. I went ahead and ordered the ep4000. I was going to get an ep2000 but we are going to do a projector home theater in the basement when we buy our house, so we figured we may as well get the extra power since we don't know how big our basement will be. For now we will be powering the cheap old 12" car subs until we decide on the new subs.

We are trying to decide between these from parts-express:

2x Dayton Audio DCS450-4 18" Classic Subwoofer 4 Ohm

or

1x Pyle Pro PDW18125 18" High Power Subwoofer (If the rest of the games sell well, we could afford 2 of these)

I just started researching this whole world of diy, so I'm pretty much going in blind. Because of our layout, if we go with 2 subwoofers, they will have to be in a single tall box (about 4 feet high max). Is there any advantage to running 2 subwoofers when you aren't spreading them out around the room? If it's not very significant, is this pyle brand any good as an alternative to the 18" dayton classic? According to the specs it's much more powerful for an extra $15. We would prefer a ported box because we want it to go lower. Size isn't really a problem as long as it doesn't go above 4ft.

And last question. Can you guys point me towards some good software for finding out the cubic feet of the enclosure and ports, because I've been punching in numbers into random software spit out by google, and it's driving me insane... no consistency.

Ok you mean this right, RSS390HF-4 ? I see the dayton's get good reviews, and that's why I was looking at them. I'm aiming for a "bang for buck" deal, and the buck is low. That's why I thought going with entry level 18's was a good idea, especially since we will have to fill an entire basement with bass at some point.

I was skeptical about the pyle, everyone is trying to inflate their power ratings, but for that speaker it's saying 800 watts rms. It was ringing a scam bell with me, but my foolish side was saying maybe it's true...

Thank you for the 2x combo of software, I'll stick with that for now.

Acendant Audio is looking a little too expensive. I'm starting to think I will go down to a 15" reference dayton. I was attracted to the 18" daytons, I figured 2x huge subs would be badass. My new budget would allow 2x 18" dayton classics, so it can also allow a single Dayton Audio TIT400C-4 15" Titanic Mk III Subwoofer 4 Ohm.

So what do you think will sound better? I wish I could demo these things lol.

haha I was just looking at that thread. That's overkill for me, but I like it.

@subjga, the 15" hf does look good. Are there any 18" subs worth buying in my range? I thought they would be cool, so maybe I still need to be talked out of that phase.

An even more important question that hasn't been answered though, will 2 subwoofers in the same box be worth it? I've googled around and haven't come up with an answer. I know that if you put 2 in different sides of the room you get a more full effect, but is it a waste of time/money to build a speaker with a sub on top of a sub?

So I've decided on the dayton reference hf 15", thanks for the help with that. Depending on how much the rest of the games go for on fleabay, I may get 2 of them. I started messing around with winisd pro to get an idea of what the box is going to be like, but I haven't quite gotten a grasp on it yet.

Here are the specs for it:

Specifications: Power handling: 500 watts RMS/800 watts max VCdia: 2-1/2" Le: 1.00 mH Impedance: 4 ohms Re: 3.3 ohms Frequency range: 18 - 800 Hz Fs: 18 Hz Magnet weight: 150 oz. SPL: 90 dB 2.83 V/1m, 87 dB 1W/1m Vas: 9.95 cu. ft. Qms: 3.10 Qes: 0.49 Qts: 0.42 Xmax: 14 mm Dimensions: Overall diameter: 15-5/16", Cutout diameter: 14-1/8", Depth: 6-5/8".

I'm trying to find out what size the box is going to be, because like I said, I have a big space to put it in, but it can't go over 4ft. So I want to know if I'll even be able to get 2 and make a big vertical box.

So when I run the numbers through, it tells me I need a 12.494 ft^3 box tuned to 16.82. I don't know if that is the frequency that I should be shooting for, that's just what the software's input. The graph (which is alien to me) goes up, and then straightens out and goes completely horizontal. The graphs that I've seen in examples go up and then back down slightly, which leads me to believe that I'm doing something wrong. It also leads me to believe that I have no idea what I'm talking about but I am stubborn and persistent.

And then the ports, I don't understand how to make them and not get port noise. In the beta version, you get the "vent mach" thing, but for the pro version, I don't see an option to see if you're going to have too much port noise.

A sealed box would be nice, so much easier to figure out. The reason for going with a ported box is because we want to be able to get down to 18 - 20hz range if possible. I also have to take into consideration some kind of high-pass filter so I don't kill them. Anyone else have a response to my previous post?

I got the ep4000, which I believe has a high-pass filter of 30hz, so it isn't going to do the trick for me.

the 4ft height limitation is because it will be going under a window, and I don't want it too block the window. Depth and width however are not a problem.

The box isn't too big for me, so I think I'm just going to build it how winisd pro is telling me to. I'm still now sure how to tell if the ports are the right size. Is winisd beta accurate enough on the port noise calculations with multiple ports (vent mach)? If it is, I'll use that instead, because I can't figure out how to use the pro version.

I also need an opinion on the high-pass filter. Do I need one? It has to be cheap, because my budget is going to be thin after I purchase the sub(s). I think I saw some that look like little adapters between the rca and amp input. Are those any good, and what frequency should I be cutting off at, if I even need to at all?

Thanks, I'm pretty sure I won't have any more questions after that