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Dolby Atmos Theatre System - Page 23

post #661 of 918
BY ZHA: cool.gif

Our system Europa has the entire area except the screen coverage with black acoustical fabric but the designer has a very interesting exoskeleton in mind to support a myriad of polyhedrons, some concave some convex. While the fabric is black the lighting strips behind the structure can be iluminated to any degree including 6,500 kelvin. Also a light show could be syncronized to multichannel audio only performances.
post #662 of 918
Possible alternative to horns and ribbons from Germany.

Some say the rl-901 are the best in the world for monitoring.

They have introduced a complete line of passive speakers, including an inceiling version, this gets interestings because of the diverse size and form factors.

This is a pre introductory price list from 2 years ago.



Sight unseen these could be the best darn inceiling speaker in the world.

Then there is the passive coaxial line and some low coloration horns.



http://www.me-geithain.de/index.php/en/beschallung-en/products

The diversity of form factors will make some combination of these Gethains Ideal for the poormans Atmos.

LOOK AT THOSE SPL's I think I am on to something here....
post #663 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by CINERAMAX View Post

BY ZHA: cool.gif

Our system Europa has the entire area except the screen coverage with black acoustical fabric but the designer has a very interesting exoskeleton in mind to support a myriad of polyhedrons, some concave some convex. While the fabric is black the lighting strips behind the structure can be iluminated to any degree including 6,500 kelvin. Also a light show could be syncronized to multichannel audio only performances.


That's awesome.
post #664 of 918
Peter. Come to London to check out Auro and our plans for dual layout.

Neil

Ps we can do your backlit room fit out including substructure no problem ;-)
post #665 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by CINERAMAX View Post

So My question Film mixer (while I wrap my head around your response above and after I read the atmos book and the auro book tonight not to sound so ignorant):

What needs to be done to a room designed for ATMOS to be able to play AURO-LITE?

I will fill in the atmos book and post the pictures and then maybe you can orient me better.

The quick answer is that there isn't a way to do what you want.

Since Auro is 5.0 x 2 channel system (plus overhead), a single array of surrounds won't get you there...

If you want both, you need both...

For our company it was a matter of installing four more surrounds (2 more on each side forward of the console towards the screen) and and the overheads in the ceiling (where they also decided to install two subs (one over the mixer position and one further back over the client area for smoother, more even dispersion of bass managed low end...)

Auro would require not only all of the side and back wall fabric to be completely redone to accommodate the height arrays, but the entire front wall would need to be redesigned to add the LCR height speakers...)

In the end, they chose Atmos and additional full range corner surrounds for IMAX over Auro....

If we do a film that wants to release in Auro, we have a choice of 3 local facilities to do the remastering in....

"Gravity" has been the killer app for Dolby.... everyone in the business is talking about it.

There are 6 Atmos domestic releases to come before end of year, most of them mixed natively..

There is one film being released in Auro before the end of the year..
Edited by FilmMixer - 10/26/13 at 6:35pm
post #666 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by ceenhad View Post

Peter. Come to London to check out Auro and our plans for dual layout.

Neil

Ps we can do your backlit room fit out including substructure no problem ;-)

Thanks I have been meaning to Neil, but for some odd reason I have ended doing these really egregious red eyes Miami-Moscow- Burbank- Miami. I am heading out to finish Albiorix back in Moscow City.

I have got to finish the darn thing and be in Burbank the 14, again! November 14 Is a milestone day in our business. Which I may reveal , later....


"backlit room fit out including substructure " what? show me.

There is ISE around CES, maybe we can come visit then...
post #667 of 918
Are there any atmos theaters in western Canada?
post #668 of 918
Thank you Film Mixer for being so helpful.

After ducking and cringing for 90 minutes in Gravity,smile.gif I have never ducked while listening to a film before, I mean I dropped drink, cell phone, ipad, camera, It was a mess during the crucial parts. Robert from Bliss Home Cinema, seating next to me must have thought I was an idiot.biggrin.gif

Yeah and that tiltle being released is The Hobbit "Smaug" (which is no slouch either). I'll come equipped with a Fanny Pack to that one.

Please tell us about which ones you worked on in this thread so we can associate the Name with the cadre. Thanks again.

So has AURO had a smashing mix flick? Cause the red tails ones was ho hum...
Edited by CINERAMAX - 10/26/13 at 7:48pm
post #669 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by CINERAMAX View Post

Here you go Reddig...








Thanks Peter!! Wow impressive! From Chritsie all be darn.
post #670 of 918
No Prob Reddig.

Actually I have a chance to preview this system in auro with the movie BAD GRANDPA by Jackass. FilmBuddy (pardon the term of endearment), anything you can say about what to expect on that ATMOS track?

AVENTURA AMC 24 in North Miami room 19.Was specially setup with VIVE ATMOS and a Laser 4k (now gone) for Showeast. I called the cinema manager and asked him to do an informal poll with employees and perhaps some customers regarding the sound.

What is the buzz on these speakers in Hollywood? anything? At least we know the ceiling doesn't look like crap.biggrin.gif




I am dreaming of building a research screening room that can be rented out for dailies in Miami that plays every form of DCI content, with d-box 4k,2k , atmos, auro, HFR, Laser and air conditioned (ventilated ) seats.


I am really trying to stay away from horns, I WANT TORUS TOO (might have to give up on that idea) which might be a problem with the horns so I was thinking of using VIVE ( I thought perhaps with a Torus if I use a 2 channel TRINNOV to perfectly time domain-align 2 center channels above an below the screen that for ATMOS the Torus might be salvaged) (for AURO now that FILMIXER laid the cards.... forget it, there is no dsp in the world that will compensate for additional lcr's).

They TRINNOV say that is their claim to fame is phantom center channel re-positioning Curt's stuff was well received at AES. I will soon fire up the ADA Cinema Reference in Albiorix so I guess I can play with that a bit.

The point being These seem excellent speakers and in talking to the guys I spillt my drink on in the Gold Key Dolby Atmos demo, the other guy is also a Spanish last name which is nice for me to hear me being Cuban and all that he won best HT at CEDIA (anyone knows?) he is from LA, cause we all agreed on what the best sounding amplifier is D'Agostino (by the way why is that company not answering the phone this week?) and I asked them what they considered the best speakers and they both said wisdom, and I thought they too have a great sound so Wisdom/Vive it's all the same sh(t. No?biggrin.gif

What is the buzz on Vive. I really dislike Jackass but if the soundtrack is good, isn't it all shot on handycams anyways? I want to hear a good movie with these speakers and atmos.
post #671 of 918
Bad Grandpa was not mixed in ATMOS.

The only film I did was "The Heat." It was really what we referred to as ATMOS Lite. We originally mixed in 5.1 and only found out after the fact they would release in ATMOS. So we only spent a couple of days dining the ATMOS up mix. I was happy with the results and the director has decided to do native ATMOS for his next film.
.
post #672 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by brwsaw View Post

Are there any atmos theaters in western Canada?

Dolby Atmos Movie Theater Locator
post #673 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

So we only spent a couple of days dining the ATMOS up mix.
.

Love the idiomatic expression.
post #674 of 918
Thanks.
I should have Googled it before posting.
The closest one is over 1300 km/800 miles away.
post #675 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

There are 6 Atmos domestic releases to come before end of year, most of them mixed natively..

FilmMixer,

Are you at liberty to name them? I want to hear some films mixed from scratch in Atmos instead of a bump-up of a 5.1 or 7.1 native mix.
post #676 of 918
post #677 of 918

Nice link appreciate it!
post #678 of 918
FilmMixer,
Was wondering if you may know why many of the blockbusters that have come out lately have filters (20hz, 30hz+, etc) in the audio tracks neutering the LFE. Why would they expend the extra time and resources to do this when it'd be so much better without them?
post #679 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddig View Post

Nice link appreciate it!

x2
post #680 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnty View Post

FilmMixer,

Are you at liberty to name them? I want to hear some films mixed from scratch in Atmos instead of a bump-up of a 5.1 or 7.1 native mix.
Unfortunately, haven't found a list that separates native Atmos mixes from Atmos upmixes. The list at Dolby's website won't give you what you're looking for. You have to find articles on-line about the mixes (which is how I discovered that 'Oblivion' was the first movie natively mixed in Atmos).
post #681 of 918
Yeah. Way cool. What surround speakers and where would you guess they are crossed over at?
post #682 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Unfortunately, haven't found a list that separates native Atmos mixes from Atmos upmixes. The list at Dolby's website won't give you what you're looking for. You have to find articles on-line about the mixes (which is how I discovered that 'Oblivion' was the first movie natively mixed in Atmos).

Good link, TMcG. But, as sdurani points out, there's no indication of how the Atmos soundtrack was created. I was hoping FilmMixer or someone who works in the mixing industry would know which mixes were native and could share that info.
post #683 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Unfortunately, haven't found a list that separates native Atmos mixes from Atmos upmixes. The list at Dolby's website won't give you what you're looking for. You have to find articles on-line about the mixes (which is how I discovered that 'Oblivion' was the first movie natively mixed in Atmos).

I don't think the term "upmix" is correct when talking about object based solutions... most people would use that term to denote that the track was run through a processor to create more channels.

The process for what we term "native" and "not native" only describe where in the mixing process the objects and panning metadata are created.

Depending on what platform you are using (i.e. Neve Console vs. Pro Tools "in the box" for example) there may be benefits to starting in 7.1 and completing the Atmos and/or Auro mixes after the fact.

Regardless, there are great examples of both types of work flow.

"Oblivion" and "Planes" were both premixed and final mixed in Atmos, and the down mix/fold down occurred after the fact.

"Gravity" was first mixed in 7.1, and then the Atmos mix was created after the fact.

What is most important is to know that you are going to release in Atmos/Auro from the get go and plan accordingly...

IMO, at this point and with our growing comfort of these new formats, I think the starting point can not be used as a reflection on what the final product will sound like... most studios are allocating the resources to get it right regardless.
post #684 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambesolman View Post

FilmMixer,
Was wondering if you may know why many of the blockbusters that have come out lately have filters (20hz, 30hz+, etc) in the audio tracks neutering the LFE. Why would they expend the extra time and resources to do this when it'd be so much better without them?

I don't think that filtering is a common practice when authoring material for consumer formats.

In most cases, the content doesn't exist in the original material..

Some sound designers and mixers make an effort to create such material, some don't.

Some mixers filter the LFE, some don't.
post #685 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

I don't think that filtering is a common practice when authoring material for consumer formats.

In most cases, the content doesn't exist in the original material..

Some sound designers and mixers make an effort to create such material, some don't.

Some mixers filter the LFE, some don't.
But what reasons would persuade a mixer to use filters? It's the "why" that I don't understand.
post #686 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambesolman View Post

But what reasons would persuade a mixer to use filters? It's the "why" that I don't understand.

Because there might be information in the audio you don't want, can't hear, etc.

The discussion keeps coming up using descriptors like "neuter" and "compromise."

There is no grand conspiracy to change the artistic intent that the director and sound crew worked for months to create.

There are no theaters that can reproduce <18Hz content with any consistency.

We have a spec, and an industry accepted tuning.

If a mixer feels that they will gain headroom in the LFE channel for audible material, they may choose to introduce a slight roll off to the content being fed to that channel.

Again, we don't have these "neutering" brick wall filters on our consoles.

And again, the use of the word "filtered" is incorrect in 99% of the discussions the LFE discussions.

In most ceases, the material wasn't there from the start... a number of sound designers I've talked to confirm this.

These are my opinions, and obviously there are others in the business that spend the effort and time creating ULF content, either by design or by accident.... I can tell you, however, I've never been in a sound designers room, or a mixing stage, where someone is constantly analyzing the frequency content of what is being sent to the LFE channel.

I personally am not overly concerned with creating material under 20Hz, because very few can reproduce it accurately.

I also don't want to discount the desire of those seeking to do so., and I personally don't HPF my LFE (but I do LPF it at 80Hz.)

Preference, choice and taste... those are three "why's" to your question.

(as a side note, Marti might chime in on how his mix for Oz translated from a larger servo driven sub system in a big dub stage to his very powerful multi sub Meyer system (which is designed not only for even response over a large portion of his room, but also copious extension, output and head room.)
post #687 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

Because there might be information in the audio you don't want, can't hear, etc.

The discussion keeps coming up using descriptors like "neuter" and "compromise."

There is no grand conspiracy to change the artistic intent that the director and sound crew worked for months to create.

There are no theaters that can reproduce <18Hz content with any consistency.

We have a spec, and an industry accepted tuning.

If a mixer feels that they will gain headroom in the LFE channel for audible material, they may choose to introduce a slight roll off to the content being fed to that channel.

Again, we don't have these "neutering" brick wall filters on our consoles.

And again, the use of the word "filtered" is incorrect in 99% of the discussions the LFE discussions.

In most ceases, the material wasn't there from the start... a number of sound designers I've talked to confirm this.

These are my opinions, and obviously there are others in the business that spend the effort and time creating ULF content, either by design or by accident.... I can tell you, however, I've never been in a sound designers room, or a mixing stage, where someone is constantly analyzing the frequency content of what is being sent to the LFE channel.

I personally am not overly concerned with creating material under 20Hz, because very few can reproduce it accurately.

I also don't want to discount the desire of those seeking to do so., and I personally don't HPF my LFE (but I do LPF it at 80Hz.)

Preference, choice and taste... those are three "why's" to your question.

(as a side note, Marti might chime in on how his mix for Oz translated from a larger servo driven sub system in a big dub stage to his very powerful multi sub Meyer system (which is designed not only for even response over a large portion of his room, but also copious extension, output and head room.)

Always appreciate the insight!

biggrin.gif
post #688 of 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambesolman View Post

But what reasons would persuade a mixer to use filters? It's the "why" that I don't understand.

I would guess because most pro cinema theater subwoofers -3db point is 30hz so for the most part they arent decine to reproduce ultra low frequencis. Not every theate but most id say. Also with it filtered it also protects from blowing woofers with these sytems that are pounded on on a day to day basis.
post #689 of 918
Curious... do these theaters use full range surrounds or cross over to higher frequencies?

I am wondering what the benefit is to surrounds that can play down to 40-50 Hz versus those that can only play down to 80-100 Hz as I am looking at new surrounds myself and am debating the advantage of one that plays lower. I had a conversation with an expert recently and he seemed to prefer a surround that could play to lower frequencies but I didn't get the 'why'...
post #690 of 918
Film mixer, do the specs for Atmos specify mixing discrete down to how low?
40hz, 60hz, or there is no spec and left up to each production?


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