or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › 3D Central › 3D Tech Talk › Official Omega 3D passive projection system thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Official Omega 3D passive projection system thread - Page 5

post #121 of 584
Oh, and before anyone says it. I know the PLED-W500 is not a 1080P projector and that it not even 720P for that matter. It's got some ungodly low pixel count like 1100x900 or something, but regardless it is capable of some decent images and is great for gaming due to the image conversions it does.
post #122 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugrash View Post

Today I tried Nvidias 3D Vision Discover just to get a fresh idea of what it was like to use it, since it had been years since I had. I remember it worked ok, but not great due to the fact that I could never match the colors of the glasses to Nvidias output. I was more curious as to what is being called eye rivalry in the Omega Stereoscopic offering and if I'd experience it using their red/cyan set-up.
Well it seemed to me that the biggest factor was the lack of extinction between the images, besides of course color do to the limitations of such a basic format.
So it seems to me that although I have a 720P LED DLP projector that is not optimal for your filters, that I could still get a fairly enjoyable experience from them due to the claim of 99% extinction. Being that both the lenses and glasses are optimally calibrated to each other.
So the only factor would be a small or moderate loss of color . Which I'm willing to live with in order to ditch the shutter glasses.
So before I buy your system, I'm curious if eye rivalry due to color inbalance becomes a big issue if using a budget LED PJ like the PLED-W500. I would think with good extinction, that it wouldn't matter.
I plan on just gaming, so if the colors aren't as good as in 2D, I'll live.
I do have to say that my projector is a lot of fun for 2D gaimg. I can input a pseudo 2560x1600@60Hz image into it that looks great. It will also accept a full 2560x2048@30Hz signal but due to the diamond pixels of DMD 0.45 chip it uses, text is unreadable unless magnified by 200%. Both are done via VGA.
One other thing, what's minimum Hz output that will work with your system. I can get 1980x1080@29 per eye frame sequential to enable but the shutter glasses do not activate. I can due pseudo 1920x1080 and 1920x1200 at 120Hz, but pseudos are a no go for 3D and even 2D at that Hz will not enable in games.

I think you would still get decent color performance with your LED projectors, not perfect. as far as the omega filters they are not red/cyan. the signal to noise ratio or extiction ratio is 1000:1 with our filter set when installed correctly. i hope you try the filter system out.
post #123 of 584
Quote:
Originally Posted by l88bastard View Post

I just ordered two Viewsonic 8200pros and the Omega kit from Amazon.com
I have no idea how well these are gonna work since they don't have lens shift, but I love 3D gaming, so I plan on hooking these up to my 7970 MSI lightnings and giving it a go.
I shall report my findings smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by l88bastard View Post

This is the best 3D I have ever seen. Both projectors are able to produce full 60hz 1080P and the filters allow each eye to only see what each projector displays. There is no crosstalk, colors are excellent and brightness is perfect, which is amazing considering I am projecting on a WALL!!! Mafia II and Skryim look amazing in 3D on this setup.

I have tried many, many types of 3D displays and setups, but hands down The Omega 3D system and DLP projectors are the way to go if you want outstanding crosstalk free 3D while retaining the most picture quality and POP cool.gif

Yes, I'm fully aware that the omega system is not red/cyan, it's as you described a "Super Anaglyph ".

I'm also aware that red/cyan in no way (not even close), compares to the quality obtainable with your system when paired with optimal or even non-optimal projectors.

It's the above two posts that have me strongly considering going with your filters, even though my projector is in no way ideal.

Can you tell me if the effect suffers at low frame rates?

ATM I can afford your filters and a second projector, but unfortunately, not a second GPU.
post #124 of 584
Thread Starter 
Good, im glad you understand the performance. it is in effect super anaglyph ,i like to think of it as spectral multiplexing, in any case it will perform very well. as far as frame rates, there is no negative effect the filters have on that. that is purely a video processor issue. as far as a GPU i really like using a PC and a dual DVI video card . ive had great luck with the nvidia quadro cards, and ive gotten them used on ebay really cheap. ive used the FX4600 and i see one now for $80. on ebay. using stereoscopic player and a decent desktop pc or htpc will function fine.
post #125 of 584
I have a Mitsubishi HC1600 which I am still happy with, but have been longing to do a passive 3d system for some time now. I thought I would try to find another hc1600 cheap, but it is surprisingly hard. So I noticed that the Acer h5360 (new) can be had pretty cheap (as cheap as a used hc1600!). So I was thinking it would be fun to try to pair the acer up with my mits, and that would be a neat way to compare Omega's passive system to the 5360's shutterbox.

My friend has a 60" Mitsubishi rear projection tv and the 3d is ok, but not spectacular. I love going to the movie theater (imax in particular) and watching 3d movies. I would love to get more of that movie theater experience at home.

I am planning on picking up two 3d-xl's for this project.

So basically, I would like to confirm that two different DLP projectors can work with the Omega system with favorable results, if the images can be successfully aligned?
post #126 of 584
Quote:
Originally Posted by motorman45 View Post

ive been told i can sell the Geoboc G-501 for $1299 if anyone is interseted. the image alignemnt tool is well worth the price alone aside from beign a really good demultiplexer. it will do 1080p 60hz per eye as well. we will be dropping the price of the bundles we offered and i am building some rack mounted systems complete or without projectors

Motorman,

I have long followed the thread and bookmarked the following ebay link before but when I looked at it again today, the item is already gone. Is this Geobox G-501 still available for sale? and has the price of the bundles (including the Geo box, filters and 12 glasses) been reduced based on the above statement?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/3D-demultiplexer-Omega-passive-3D-kit-w-small-filters-VNS-Geobox-G-501-/310464322397?pt=Receivers_Tuners&hash=item48491d9b5d

Thanks,
post #127 of 584
Someone all ready consider using two BenQ W1070 DLP's? Quite bright when calibrated, vertical lens shift, 1080P DC3 rgbrgb color wheel and you can get two of them under 2000$.

Review
post #128 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Chef View Post

I have a Mitsubishi HC1600 which I am still happy with, but have been longing to do a passive 3d system for some time now. I thought I would try to find another hc1600 cheap, but it is surprisingly hard. So I noticed that the Acer h5360 (new) can be had pretty cheap (as cheap as a used hc1600!). So I was thinking it would be fun to try to pair the acer up with my mits, and that would be a neat way to compare Omega's passive system to the 5360's shutterbox.
My friend has a 60" Mitsubishi rear projection tv and the 3d is ok, but not spectacular. I love going to the movie theater (imax in particular) and watching 3d movies. I would love to get more of that movie theater experience at home.
I am planning on picking up two 3d-xl's for this project.
So basically, I would like to confirm that two different DLP projectors can work with the Omega system with favorable results, if the images can be successfully aligned?

it should work fine to use two different projectors provided you get them aligned. but in 3d viewing slight miss-alignments are not seen especially with our filters where there is no ghosting. you may find that the filters work better in one setup than another, that is try the left filter on one of the dlp projectors and the right on the other model, then switvh them. the slight different way each projector makes color will work better one way that it dose the other. just a thought.
the 3d-xl's are a good way to go but you could also consider the vip theater hdmi demux, it almost works out to the same cost whne you add splitters and such to the the optoma units.
post #129 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankwang90 View Post

Motorman,
I have long followed the thread and bookmarked the following ebay link before but when I looked at it again today, the item is already gone. Is this Geobox G-501 still available for sale? and has the price of the bundles (including the Geo box, filters and 12 glasses) been reduced based on the above statement?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/3D-demultiplexer-Omega-passive-3D-kit-w-small-filters-VNS-Geobox-G-501-/310464322397?pt=Receivers_Tuners&hash=item48491d9b5d
Thanks,

we do have one left and will be able to get more but our cost went up. we will bundle this with our optics, 12 pairs of glasses, email my coworker if interested gjarvis@omegafilters.com and say your from the avs forum and we can set something up.
it will be a little before we get more units on hand. that price you quoted was a while ago and im sorry to say we had to go up on it as the supplier upped their price. they are one of the best units for dual passive 3d. the vip theater box i believe the evolver is another more affordable option.
post #130 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaMiR View Post

Someone all ready consider using two BenQ W1070 DLP's? Quite bright when calibrated, vertical lens shift, 1080P DC3 rgbrgb color wheel and you can get two of them under 2000$.
Review

These look like one of the best possible projectors to try out dual passive projection 3D. the lens shift is great to see in this price range and these will work fantastic with our filters. i would love to build a stack with a pair. please let me know how they work if anyone tries these out. and they will be plenty bright. i use two 1700 ( rated ) lumen dlps for demos on a 14' screen with our filters and it is more than bright enough
post #131 of 584
Warpalizing and Blending is required for curved and/or panoramic screens.

If you are projecting on a flat screen, it would not be needed if you had a projector with optical lens shift/keystoning.

Even if you used the GeoBox for screen alignment on a digital lens shift/keystoning projector, it would not improve any image reduction that occurs as a result.

It will however help to correct inevitable minor misalignments.

While it can correct greater misalignments, this also comes at the cost of image reduction due to digital processing.

The image misalignment on the youtube video I'm pretty certain was over exaggerated for demonstration purposes of the Geobox 501's capabilities.

If you are using a PC, warpalizing and edge blending software can be puchased as a stand alone product if you find it necessary to have.

As far as a demuxer, two 3D-XLs are quite capable of most needs concerning video. Not so much for gaming.

The only hardware supporting 1920x1080P@120Hz framepacking output over HDMI at the moment is the 7000 series AMD Radeon GPUs as far as I know.

So the VIP 3D Evolver is in my opinion an overpriced/overkill soloution and the same can be said for the GeoBox with the price increase.
post #132 of 584
I'm going to order small Omega 3D kit. Is this link right place to order this kit or should i buy it from ebay or some other place?
post #133 of 584
Quote:
Originally Posted by JaMiR View Post

I'm going to order small Omega 3D kit. Is this link right place to order this kit or should i buy it from ebay or some other place?

Yes, provided you are using a DLP Projector.

If it's LCD I think you'll have to get it from e-bay.

BTW motorman you need to relist or change the tags on Amazon, so the if a person types in Omega 3D they get a result.
post #134 of 584
If you type "Omega passive 3D "
it is on the first page
post #135 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugrash View Post

Warpalizing and Blending is required for curved and/or panoramic screens.

If you are projecting on a flat screen, it would not be needed if you had a projector with optical lens shift/keystoning.

Even if you used the GeoBox for screen alignment on a digital lens shift/keystoning projector, it would not improve any image reduction that occurs as a result.

It will however help to correct inevitable minor misalignments.

While it can correct greater misalignments, this also comes at the cost of image reduction due to digital processing.

The image misalignment on the youtube video I'm pretty certain was over exaggerated for demonstration purposes of the Geobox 501's capabilities.

If you are using a PC, warpalizing and edge blending software can be puchased as a stand alone product if you find it necessary to have.

As far as a demuxer, two 3D-XLs are quite capable of most needs concerning video. Not so much for gaming.

The only hardware supporting 1920x1080P@120Hz framepacking output over HDMI at the moment is the 7000 series AMD Radeon GPUs as far as I know.

So the VIP 3D Evolver is in my opinion an overpriced/overkill soloution and the same can be said for the GeoBox with the price increase.

i agree one dose not always need image warping/ digital alignment for most dual projector setups but it makes the image a bit better . all my first tests were with a pc and video card and no image warping ability and they looked great even without lens shift or keystone adjustments. the alignment video we made was greatly exagerated to show the function of the geobox and like the photos i posted here with poth projectors on and filters in place the 2D performance was great with the fine tuned alignment. there is a cost to the actual pixels used when a lot of adjustment is used but its pretty minor. a large miss alignement may give you 2.02 mega pixels on the screen instead of 2.07 for a pair of 1080 native projectors.

a good option would be a demux in one box that cost under $700, no fancy adjustments just demltiplex and have audio outs ?? right i may be able to help in that area.
post #136 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugrash View Post

Yes, provided you are using a DLP Projector.

If it's LCD I think you'll have to get it from e-bay.

BTW motorman you need to relist or change the tags on Amazon, so the if a person types in Omega 3D they get a result.

i know its not easy to find. i will see if i can get that changed. ebay has bee way easier to sell from. amazon requires a upc code for every product. easy if your selling something that already has one or is listed on there. we have far more things listed on ebay. extra glasses, other sized kits etc...
post #137 of 584
Hi Motorman, any word on the GeoBox G301? - would love to get a bundle on that with Omega DD3D LCD pkg now that my 2nd PLV-Z2000 is on its way. G501 is a overkill for me (also out of budget range...). thx!
post #138 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jo2k View Post

Hi Motorman, any word on the GeoBox G301? - would love to get a bundle on that with Omega DD3D LCD pkg now that my 2nd PLV-Z2000 is on its way. G501 is a overkill for me (also out of budget range...). thx!

i can get them but the cost is actuallu more than the 501 at this point. they both have geometric correction. the more affordable version is the 201. it dose not have geometric correction but is an all in one demux. i am working on getting that as an option.
post #139 of 584
Thread Starter 
post #140 of 584
Thread Starter 
3D Product_comparison_chart.pdf 34k .pdf file

here is a short list of what the different boxes can offer from vns
post #141 of 584
Quote:
Originally Posted by motorman45 View Post

i can get them but the cost is actuallu more than the 501 at this point. they both have geometric correction. the more affordable version is the 201. it dose not have geometric correction but is an all in one demux. i am working on getting that as an option.

Is the 201 available for purchase? Where can one pick it up?
post #142 of 584
Thread Starter 
i should be able to offer them soon. getting a couple in a few weeks.
post #143 of 584
I need to get this set up going soon, so I am going to go with a 3DXL x 2 set up, but I am not sure what I need for an hdmi splitter. Amplified? Sync'ing? Will just any splitter work? I've spent an hour trying to search the forum, but I either don't know the right question, or I am overlooking something. Please help?
post #144 of 584
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Chef View Post

I need to get this set up going soon, so I am going to go with a 3DXL x 2 set up, but I am not sure what I need for an hdmi splitter. Amplified? Sync'ing? Will just any splitter work? I've spent an hour trying to search the forum, but I either don't know the right question, or I am overlooking something. Please help?

from what i can tell any hdmi 1.4 splitter would work for the two 3d-xl's. sync shouldnt be an issue. there are several youtube videos of setting one up i think. not two but it may help.
post #145 of 584
It's hard to beat 2 Optoma 3D-XLs, since they have been selling for $215 quite often and also include a good pair of DLP Link glasses.

You'll only need an amplified splitter if the cable run from your source to the 3D-XL is over 15ft, even at 25ft you might not need one.

You do want to make sure that you get one with enough bandwidth to pass the signal to your demultiplexers.

Once the signal reaches the 3D-XL and is demultiplexed, it comes out as a new signal. So you are good for another 15-25ft.
post #146 of 584
hello motorman45, can you get me more info on the 201 geobox? i need just a simple L/R separation-demuxing. i hope it will be low-budget since the optomas are quite expensive for what they can offer for me... thank you!
post #147 of 584
I got my Omega 3D kit in the mail yesterday, and played around a little bit with them before going to bed (I thought I could slap the system together in about an hour, but four hours later I finally made it to bed!). I am just testing the water, so to speak, so I can make a decision on how I want to have my permanent display set up--and I also promised a friend that I would build him a 3D theater as well. This is (keep in mind its only a test run!) my set up:
Code:
                             -->3D-XL--->Mitsubishi HC1600
                            /
3D Bluray-->HDMI splitter--<
                            \
                             -->3D-XL--->Acer H5360
First impression: when I finally had everything all put together, I found myself believing that the Omega 3D is going to prove to be far superior to shutterbox technology.

To be honest, I was less than satisfied with the results I achieved, but that is simply because of how different my projectors are. My five year old HC1600 just can't hang with my new Acer H5360 as far as brightness and color goes, and the Acer doesn't even compare with the placement flexibility of my HC1600 (the HC1600 has two dimensions of keystone correction, while the Acer's is a complete joke). So it took some finesse to get the images lined up, and when I did, getting color and brightness to match was unattainable for my skill set. True to what motorman told me, I found that the left Omega filter was too much for the HC1600, but the right filter did a decent job. Both filters seemed to work ok for the Acer. But even finding the best filter combination left me with much to be desired as far as color/brightness matching is concerned, but the two pj's were miles apart before the filters were put on. I did the best I could with matching them up, mostly by turning brightness waaaaaaaaaaaaaay down on the Acer.

I bought Dredd 3D for the purpose of checking out the 3D systems (the Acer paired with a single 3D-XL is a system in its own, which I played with while waiting for the Omega filters). While there was a huge gap between the two projectors in color quality, some scenes did match fairly well, and it was there that I was able to enjoy what the Omega system had to offer. A smooth, natural, deeper 3D than the damn shutterbox. I realize that it is technically not "deeper" but I *perceived* the depth better.

So while I am hopeful about the results that are possible with the Omega system, I am perplexed on where I should go from here with projectors. Two 3D theaters is a costly venture, and I was hoping to do one theater with two HC1600's, and another with two Acer H5360's. But I have severe doubts about the HC1600's performance ability--although, to be fair, the Acer is ridiculously bright and colorful, so I may find that two 1600's together may work a lot better, but I now know how much "pop" I can get with the Acers, so will I ever be satisfied? Then I have the Acer's severely limited placement flexibility. I have major doubts about getting two of those nightmares lined up. Since I have the Mits lined up pretty darn good with the Acer in its "dead even, straight forward, no tweaks" position, I can let the Mits stand in for the Acer, and move the Acer 6" higher or so, and see if I can get it lined up again. If so, then I will definitely go with two Acer's.

Anyway, I am hopeful about the Omega's potential, and pleased with what I have seen so far. My only complaint is the reflective quality of the insides of the glasses. Even with the lights off, enough light leaked into the inside of my glasses to reflect light back and forth between my prescription glasses and the Omega lenses to be at least mildly distracting, but I did not give myself a chance to get "immersed" into the movie. The IMAX glasses have a glare that I notice when I first put them off, but do not bother me much when I watch a movie, and I believe the same will be true of the Omegas.
post #148 of 584
The fact that you are getting any satisfactory results with your markedly mismatched non-optomized DLP projectors, looks promising.
post #149 of 584
Thread Starter 
the HC1600 is a pretty low lumen projector, less than half the lumens of the acer, that would be the biggest issue i would think. depending on the trow you have to use in your theater space alignment should not be too bad with two acers, after all in 3D mode each eye dose not see the others image so those small missalugnments of the corners are not seen. i dont use any keystone with my optoma hd20's and when not using my geobox it aligns just fine. color differances are also a concern using two differnt units but it can work. i did a test not long ago with one of my HD20's ( 1080 native) and an ifocus IN104 ( 720 ) and was able to get the two to work decently for a dual stack. i wouldnt want this to be my setup but the question was asked so i tried it. if i use thegeobox i get near perfect alignemnt but the color and brightness diff was there but not a show stopper
a couple of $500 DLP projectors that are the same is not a bad way to go for 3D better than most theaters. after all "passive" 3D in theaters is not really that. there is a wheel inside the cinema projector of an active pannel in front switching L to R just like active glasses, its just that you dont have to wear the active shutters on your face. True passive is done with dual projectors...
post #150 of 584
I played with my test set-up quite a bit yesterday and did manage to get a pretty decent color match between my two oddball projectors, but there still was a lingering problem with highlights and shadow detail. Sometimes I would get a really bright highlight on one projector and not the other, and sometimes one projector would completely miss shadow detail. But I did see a whole lot of well-matched scenes, and I am excited to get matching projectors to use with the Omega system. I do think a good system could be achieved with pairs of either projector, but I am going to go ahead and order another H5360, and see what I end up with there.

My original plan was to get a couple of ViewSonic Pro8200's, but the low, low price of the Acer for the high lumens, plus shutterbox 3D, ensnared me. I am thinking that the ViewSonics would have been the better course to take heading into an Omega passive 3D system.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: 3D Tech Talk
AVS › AVS Forum › 3D Central › 3D Tech Talk › Official Omega 3D passive projection system thread