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Official Sony HX850 Owner's Thread (46HX850, 55HX850) - Page 50

post #1471 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by fegam2 View Post

The resolution changes from 1080p to 1080p 12 bit when your playstation or 3D blu-ray player detects you 3D tv and then that's the signal that is send to the Hx850. If you have an xbox360 the resolution will be 1080p period. No need to worry, is perfecty normal and the picture quality remains the same. To change the languaje press the HOME button on your remote, then select the preferences menu and then languaje. Remenber that the Hx850 has an i-manual that's built into the menu, you can see it here if you want to http://esupport.sony.com/US/p/model-home.pl?mdl=KDL55HX850&LOC=3#/manualsTab.

If you don't own a calibration disc do yourself a favor and do the following (in order to have an excelent picture quality):
1. In preferences, Eco menu, make sure that "power saving" and "light sensor" options are turn OFF
2. Press Options on the control remote and then "Scene Select" and select "Cinema"
3. In preferences, Picture and Display, Pictures settings, Select "Cinema 1", then turn OFF Reality Creation and Smooth Gradiation. Set Cinemotion on Auto 1 and motionflow OFF for movies and games and "Clear" for cable tv and sports. Be sure that everything is turn OFF in "Advance Settings" except fot LED DYNAMIC CONTROL set to STANDARD(this is very important). All the rest stays the same, just adjust the backlight according to your viewing environment (increase it if your room is very bright and decrease it if its dark, try it until you like the way the picture pops.
4. In preferences, Picture and Display, Screen, select Wide Mode: FULL, Auto Wide: OFF and very important Display Area: FULL PIXEL (for this especif option to appear you must have a 1080p signal feed to the TV, game or movie doesn´t matter)

Ok I hope this will help you. This Tv has an amazing Picture quality. You will enjoy your games, movies and cable tv a lot more with this settings.

Very quickly and not to good explanation, Clouding is when you can see like clouds of light in dark scenes and Flashlighting is when you can see light bleeding from the corners of the tv. I know that all LED tvs have the flashlighting problem in one way or another, but in the HX850 is not that common like on some LED samsungs. When you use the LED Dynamic control on Standar it helps a lot to not have this problem

I have found that with certain newer movies, the xreality can really give it that extra bit of clarity but for some movies(usually older material) it just makes it grainy. Also you say to turn motionflow off on movies but I think again it comes down to the movie I always have it on clear when its on. I also watch alot of sports and have been watching american football lately and the quality tends to differ according to what network espn gets their coverage from. With some games the xreality and motionflow look really good and with games from other networks it doesn't look as good. For me personally I just take 30 secs to have a look if the movie or game etc looks better with the settings on or off. Just my 2 cents. I have every other setting turned off except LED Dynamic Control standard and cinemotion on auto1 when I have motionflow on.
post #1472 of 1970
Hi, it has now been a month with the HX850 and I can say I am really happy with this tv. I had to get used to the new technology and say goodbye to CRT Tube TV which served me very well. With any change there is always tradeoffs. I could never have a 46" tube tv in my living room but the 46" flat panel looks beautiful -- on and off.

Thank you HaRd2BeAr! for the advice about LED Dynamic Control! I was afraid to turn it back on because of my eye strain issue but with the ambient lighting (including the cheap $12 or so Antec Halo 6 LED Bias Lighting Kit) taped to the back of the set, I now am managing o.k.

LED Dynamic Control set to Standard improves the picture quality a lot!. From what I've read in the Home Theater , the contrast ratio goes from below average to excellent with the Dynamic Control enabled --
Quote:
Using the same technique, the contrast ratio with the LED Dynamic Control on Low produced a full-on/full-off contrast ratio of 10,467:1 (black level 0.003 ft-L). With LED Dynamic Control off (no dynamic dimming), the full-on/full-off contrast dropped to 2,633:1 (black level 0.012 ft-L). Clearly, we recommend leaving LED Dynamic Control in its Standard setting.
.

One thing I'd like to know more about is the difference between MotionFlow and Cinnemotion. I see Bass Gorilla above recommends setting "Cinemotion on Auto 1 and motionflow OFF for movies and games and "Clear" for cable tv and sports" and I am interested in knowing why these are best.

I don't have a new dvd or blu ray player yet, so I am using the AVSHD 709 test videos via wifi stream and usb stick to calibrate the tv. I picked up the Blue Filter glasses from THX. I read through several guides and watched the HDNation shows about callibration -- which helped me get my mind around the process. I am pretty happy with the brightness and contrast but the color is not quite right.

I am going to work on learning more about adjusting the white balance on a HDTV and will report back anything I learn/new settings I try.

Thanks again! Stephanie
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaRd2BeAr View Post

My advice would be to turn LED Dynamic Control on Standard as this is the most important setting on the tv.

Aaron
post #1473 of 1970
Has anyone got the hx850 professional calibrated and did it make a big difference
post #1474 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by TDKreturns View Post

Has anyone got the hx850 professional calibrated and did it make a big difference

I am getting mine done on Thursday. I will let you know my results. I am a little reluctant to spend the money because I feel like using the chornitis settings so far has been pretty good, but I am going to do it anyway.
post #1475 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by stephsrecords View Post

Hi, it has now been a month with the HX850 and I can say I am really happy with this tv. I had to get used to the new technology and say goodbye to CRT Tube TV which served me very well. With any change there is always tradeoffs. I could never have a 46" tube tv in my living room but the 46" flat panel looks beautiful -- on and off.

Thank you HaRd2BeAr! for the advice about LED Dynamic Control! I was afraid to turn it back on because of my eye strain issue but with the ambient lighting (including the cheap $12 or so Antec Halo 6 LED Bias Lighting Kit) taped to the back of the set, I now am managing o.k.

LED Dynamic Control set to Standard improves the picture quality a lot!. From what I've read in the Home Theater , the contrast ratio goes from below average to excellent with the Dynamic Control enabled --
.

One thing I'd like to know more about is the difference between MotionFlow and Cinnemotion. I see Bass Gorilla above recommends setting "Cinemotion on Auto 1 and motionflow OFF for movies and games and "Clear" for cable tv and sports" and I am interested in knowing why these are best.

I don't have a new dvd or blu ray player yet, so I am using the AVSHD 709 test videos via wifi stream and usb stick to calibrate the tv. I picked up the Blue Filter glasses from THX. I read through several guides and watched the HDNation shows about callibration -- which helped me get my mind around the process. I am pretty happy with the brightness and contrast but the color is not quite right.

I am going to work on learning more about adjusting the white balance on a HDTV and will report back anything I learn/new settings I try.

Thanks again! Stephanie

The Entire point of purchasing the HX850 is mostly for the Led Dynamic Setting (Local Dimming) which dims the led in area where they are not needed (seperated in zones) to create deeper blacks. If someone has this setting set to off for normal viewing and movies, they should have save some money and buy a cheaper set.

Unless in game mode when you want to avoid all possible input lag scenario, Dynamic Led should always be set to Standard or possibly on Low. On some source material, on rare occasion, I've notice Dynamic led to standard create some fluctuation in contrast. But it's so rare and related to specific scene on the TV that I don't bother with Low Myself.

As for Dynamic Led in game mode, I would need to do more testing but so far, I think the amount if input lag in introduce is rather low. On a single player game where lighting reflexes aren't needed, it could easily be set on low or Standard to help the blacks.

As For Cinemotion and motionflow, we are talking at both frame interpolation and dejudder settings here. Both can be used to reduce blurry effects of LCD/LED.

Motion flow is often used first. What it does mostly is introduce more frames inbetween frames with calculated new frames to smooth out the offer. On the more advance settings (clear, clear plus and impulse) it adds black frames inbetween regular generated frames to remove even further the blur on the screen on fast movie objects. That's the reason you will notice the screen getting darker when you select one of these settings. Low and Standard will add frames but not black ones. I personally like to leave mine on "standard" but put it on "clear" when watching hockey. You can raise the backlit setting by one to compensate for the darker screen.

As for Cinemotion, someone else could brief you on more détails regarding but basically, Auto 1 will give youa very smooth effect that some people will call as "Soap Opera" effect. What I like about Sony is that their Cinemotion is not as much "in your face" as others like Sony. It helps reduce blur on fast moving scene and panning . Cinemotion 2 I think is more often used for Bluray players to properly handle 24p content.
Edited by Guibs - 1/28/13 at 11:14am
post #1476 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by stephsrecords View Post

Hi, it has now been a month with the HX850 and I can say I am really happy with this tv. I had to get used to the new technology and say goodbye to CRT Tube TV which served me very well. With any change there is always tradeoffs. I could never have a 46" tube tv in my living room but the 46" flat panel looks beautiful -- on and off.

Thank you HaRd2BeAr! for the advice about LED Dynamic Control! I was afraid to turn it back on because of my eye strain issue but with the ambient lighting (including the cheap $12 or so Antec Halo 6 LED Bias Lighting Kit) taped to the back of the set, I now am managing o.k.

LED Dynamic Control set to Standard improves the picture quality a lot!. From what I've read in the Home Theater , the contrast ratio goes from below average to excellent with the Dynamic Control enabled --
.

One thing I'd like to know more about is the difference between MotionFlow and Cinnemotion. I see Bass Gorilla above recommends setting "Cinemotion on Auto 1 and motionflow OFF for movies and games and "Clear" for cable tv and sports" and I am interested in knowing why these are best.

I don't have a new dvd or blu ray player yet, so I am using the AVSHD 709 test videos via wifi stream and usb stick to calibrate the tv. I picked up the Blue Filter glasses from THX. I read through several guides and watched the HDNation shows about callibration -- which helped me get my mind around the process. I am pretty happy with the brightness and contrast but the color is not quite right.

I am going to work on learning more about adjusting the white balance on a HDTV and will report back anything I learn/new settings I try.

Thanks again! Stephanie

No problem Stephanie, glad you're finding the Sony better.

I would agree with the motionflow, cinemotion settings. Clear is best for removing motion blur without adding the soap opera effect, however any motionflow is said to add soap opera to 24p film material. Having said that, i did try a couple if blu rays with motionflow clear and didn't notice the soap opera effect and i kno how bad the soap opera effect is having set motionflow to Standard (which is awful for any content imo).

As for cinemotion, can't remember 100% what its for, from memory it is cadence detection for interlaced material.

Aaron
post #1477 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gage33 View Post

I am getting mine done on Thursday. I will let you know my results. I am a little reluctant to spend the money because I feel like using the chornitis settings so far has been pretty good, but I am going to do it anyway.

Please let me know as well. thanks
post #1478 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gage33 View Post

I am getting mine done on Thursday. I will let you know my results. I am a little reluctant to spend the money because I feel like using the chornitis settings so far has been pretty good, but I am going to do it anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zEeMeR786 View Post

Please let me know as well. thanks

It will be most interesting seen the final settings of your set. Please take not if the calibration is done with the Led Dynamic Control ON or OFF (no matter if its on Standar or Low), because I always wonder wich way is the correct way to do it. I am also curious of how the technician will handle the motionflow.
post #1479 of 1970
Quick question. Anyone with an hx850 with flashlighting in both bottom corners that decided to keep their tv anyway? Just curious what people in a similar position ended up doing.
post #1480 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guibs View Post

Quick question. Anyone with an hx850 with flashlighting in both bottom corners that decided to keep their tv anyway? Just curious what people in a similar position ended up doing.

I just kept mine, I mean just the right corner is bright nothing distracting at all. I think you could be overreacting
post #1481 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guibs View Post

Quick question. Anyone with an hx850 with flashlighting in both bottom corners that decided to keep their tv anyway? Just curious what people in a similar position ended up doing.

I have a hx950 that has clouding but am keeping mines. If it doesn't bother the way you watch TV than I would keep it. If it is somethig that is bothering you or distracting from your viewing pleasure than return it. You could get lucky and get a better set or not so lucky and get a worse tv with dead pixels, banding, flashing ect..

If it was me I would keep it as that would not bother me but it's your money.
post #1482 of 1970
You wont find any 850 sets left. They are sold out everywhere. Sony even took them off their website. Some sites list them as in stock until you attempt to checkout and it lets you know it is out of stock.

I bought a floor model hoping no issues but there was a dead pixel and a bad band on the left side of the tv. In my opinion your paying the extra money for the local dimming which should eliminate flashlighting. If flashlighting were okay you would buy the sony ex640.

Return it and wait for the w900a to come out or grab the 950 while full array still exists. I went ahead and bought the samsung es7100 because it was such a good deal. No problems but i do believe sony has a more consistent picture on all their sets. Even if i keep it i will most likely get the w900a next fall if the price is right. Hey i might even grab the new full array if one comes out. Otherwise i wont get another tv for years and by then hopefully OLED will be mainstream affordable. But im sure it will come with a whole new set of issues... Sighh
post #1483 of 1970
EDIT: Nevermind found it
Edited by quik - 1/29/13 at 1:19pm
post #1484 of 1970
Already return my set 2 times. This is my 3rd actual HX850.

With full screen picture (like TV HD feed) it doesn't bother me. It's when I Watch movie with black bars. Sometimes, depending on the scene, the corners remains black enough while other times, it's pretty obvious. After 2 weeks, I keep having my eyes going there to see if flashlighting when it happens.Worst is on videogame loading screen since I disable Dynamic led to keep input lag to a minimum.

I already remove the back panel of my TV to either unscrew a bit (1/4) or screw them a bit harder in both corners with minimal changes. Putting the screw a bit more tight seemed to have help a little but it sure didn't eliminate the issue.

I could always return and wait for a newer model but I know better. I've been shopping for 3 years and every year, uniformity is an issue with LED. Unfortunately, as said before, I see flickering on bright objects on plasma so I am hesitant to buy one in case it gives me headhache.
post #1485 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guibs View Post

With full screen picture (like TV HD feed) it doesn't bother me. It's when I Watch movie with black bars. Sometimes, depending on the scene, the corners remains black enough while other times, it's pretty obvious. After 2 weeks, I keep having my eyes going there to see if flashlighting when it happens.

It's not just the black bars. I noted earlier that blooming was minimal though evident in dark scenes in American Horror Story and The Wire and could be avoided by turning LED Dynamic Contrast to Low. Well, after a few more weeks, I've been noticing the zones varying in brightness more and more, including "normal' full-screen content, to the point where it's too distracting to keep the TV. This is with ACE and all the other crazy features except local dimming set to off. Turning local dimming off is the only way to truly eliminate it, and the black level then is not much better than my CCFLs from 2007-2008, and the uniformity and flashlighting is much worse. My 46HX850 has also been spontaneously restarting within a minute or so of powering on maybe once a week. And the "smart" features are simply terrible. I don't see myself buying another LED TV. Will wait for the 2013 plasmas to become available.
post #1486 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by tima94930 View Post

It's not just the black bars. I noted earlier that blooming was minimal though evident in dark scenes in American Horror Story and The Wire and could be avoided by turning LED Dynamic Contrast to Low. Well, after a few more weeks, I've been noticing the zones varying in brightness more and more, including "normal' full-screen content, to the point where it's too distracting to keep the TV. This is with ACE and all the other crazy features except local dimming set to off. Turning local dimming off is the only way to truly eliminate it, and the black level then is not much better than my CCFLs from 2007-2008, and the uniformity and flashlighting is much worse. My 46HX850 has also been spontaneously restarting within a minute or so of powering on maybe once a week. And the "smart" features are simply terrible. I don't see myself buying another LED TV. Will wait for the 2013 plasmas to become available.

My current hx850 has not restarted once but my second one did it a few times.

As for the dynamic led issue, I only noticed it once and ironically, it was with my second hx850. I have not witness the full flickering or full screen dimming with my 3rd one. If it is happening, it is subtitle enough that I can't see it. Again notice these with my second unit so maybe it's related to a defective part in the tv?

Waiting on next year model is like winning at the lottery. I have been shopping for a tv since 2010, each year come with its load if defect issue that either make you wish you had bought last year model or the next. Flashlighting and clouding were issues back in 2010. After returning a few set, I decided to wait a few years for the, to correct the issue. Flash forward to 2013 and the issue is still there.

I was looking at plasma, even if I notice flickering in bright colors. It seems Panasonic took a step back this year with image retention. Their tv are all easily marked with logo while it was not the case 2 years ago. 2 years ago, Panasonic plasma had rising black (huge and very discussed issue). I guess Panasonic corrected that issue but their new panels are more sensitive to IR. it seems they fix and issue but introduce a new one. Same goes with LCD/led. Tv are slimmer and the blacks are a lot better but they stopped worried about screen uniformity and now it's plaguing the majority of led/LCD.
post #1487 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guibs View Post

As for the dynamic led issue, I only noticed it once and ironically, it was with my second hx850. I have not witness the full flickering or full screen dimming with my 3rd one. If it is happening, it is subtitle enough that I can't see it. Again notice these with my second unit so maybe it's related to a defective part in the tv?

It's not whole-screen dimming. The 46HX850 appears to have 16 rectangular zones covering the whole screen, 8 on each side, and they independently brighten and dim depending on the moment-to-moment content. I gave a couple of specific examples in earlier posts, but I began noticing it in more and more content the longer I had the TV. It ranges from unnoticeable, to subtle, to unsubtle and distracting, with the latter becoming more and more common for me.
Quote:
Waiting on next year model is like winning at the lottery. I have been shopping for a tv since 2010, each year come with its load if defect issue that either make you wish you had bought last year model or the next. Flashlighting and clouding were issues back in 2010. After returning a few set, I decided to wait a few years for the, to correct the issue. Flash forward to 2013 and the issue is still there.

I really don't want to try another LED TV; prior to the HX850, I tried an EX645, and it had bad clouding, flashlighting, and banding. Overall, I like my 3 CCFL TVs I bought in 2007-2010 better than these LED sets, and I've resumed searching for a working TCON board to repair my 40W4100.
Quote:
I was looking at plasma, even if I notice flickering in bright colors. It seems Panasonic took a step back this year with image retention. Their tv are all easily marked with logo while it was not the case 2 years ago. 2 years ago, Panasonic plasma had rising black (huge and very discussed issue). I guess Panasonic corrected that issue but their new panels are more sensitive to IR. it seems they fix and issue but introduce a new one. Same goes with LCD/led. Tv are slimmer and the blacks are a lot better but they stopped worried about screen uniformity and now it's plaguing the majority of led/LCD.

Hopefully, IR and buzzing will be better with the 2013 plasma models.
post #1488 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by tima94930 View Post

It's not whole-screen dimming. The 46HX850 appears to have 16 rectangular zones covering the whole screen, 8 on each side, and they independently brighten and dim depending on the moment-to-moment content. I gave a couple of specific examples in earlier posts, but I began noticing it in more and more content the longer I had the TV. It ranges from unnoticeable, to subtle, to unsubtle and distracting, with the latter becoming more and more common for me.
I really don't want to try another LED TV; prior to the HX850, I tried an EX645, and it had bad clouding, flashlighting, and banding. Overall, I like my 3 CCFL TVs I bought in 2007-2010 better than these LED sets, and I've resumed searching for a working TCON board to repair my 40W4100.
Hopefully, IR and buzzing will be better with the 2013 plasma models.

I know you gave specific example but I never watched any of theses show and don't have acces to them right now some cannot test this with my current unit. One off the few times I notice it was during the movie timecop own space tv station, on the scene where van dam and the black girl goes in the past for the first time together. The screen or specific portion of the screen started to dimm in no out. Changing dynamic led from standard to low fixed the issue.

Beside that one episode, I have not notice it. Maybe it does occur, but not to the same level for me to notice it enough or be bothered with it.

I have notice some scene where the entire screen seems to go darker and than lighter again like the local dimming was trying to determine if it had too dim the led or not. Again, it didn't happen very often. I am sorry to hear about your issue its the set. I am not entirely satisfied myself. Have to decide if I can live with the flashlighting I have on my set or not. Good luck.
post #1489 of 1970
Hey everyone!

Soo I don't know if I got lucky but Sony has agreed to replace my current TV KDL-55HX729 and give me a KDL-55hx850. I was very pleased with my previous TV but it was just giving me headaches with the random restarts. Sony had replaced the Logic Board, and after tons of troubleshooting and talking to customer service I got them to send a replacement TV.

My question to the current owners of the HX850 is if I am going to notice a huge difference between my previous model and the newer one. Sony originally wanted to give me the HX750 but after reviewing the specs I noticed that it did not have X Reality Engine Pro, which my HX729. This is the reason why Sony agreed to provided the HX850. smile.gif

Second question is if there are any specific settings that I should apply for an optimum viewing experience and if it is worth buying the aluminum base that comes with that model of TV in Europe.

Thanks in advance for any advice that can be given!
post #1490 of 1970


Here is a picture of my current hx850 in game mode, no dynamic led. I had to boost the backlit a bit to get my iPad camera to capture what I see a bit more since my other picture didn't show it as I was seeing it.
post #1491 of 1970


Here is another one with nothing on screen (black transition screen). Again no dynamic led, backlit raised to help show the issue on a bit more since I can't modify the exposure on my iPad's camera.

I game mode, even with dynamic led set to low or standard, the bottom corners are pretty visible on black screen and dark scenes. Sorry for the double post, can't seem to post more than a single picture at a time from the mobile version of this website.
post #1492 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guibs View Post



Here is another one with nothing on screen (black transition screen). Again no dynamic led, backlit raised to help show the issue on a bit more since I can't modify the exposure on my iPad's camera.

I game mode, even with dynamic led set to low or standard, the bottom corners are pretty visible on black screen and dark scenes. Sorry for the double post, can't seem to post more than a single picture at a time from the mobile version of this website.

In game mode, the effect of LED dimming is not as much as Cinema mode. I suspect this is to reduce lag. So your best bet is to reduce the backlight. Increasing backlight is going to reveal these issues but that's not the point. Avoid playing in complete darkness and reduce backlight to minimum.

Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk HD
post #1493 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by rajivr View Post

In game mode, the effect of LED dimming is not as much as Cinema mode. I suspect this is to reduce lag. So your best bet is to reduce the backlight. Increasing backlight is going to reveal these issues but that's not the point. Avoid playing in complete darkness and reduce backlight to minimum.

Sent from my cm_tenderloin using Tapatalk HD

Obviously here, this is the "worst" case scenario that I was showing. Backlit was set to max and no dynamic led was on. Reducing the backlit to minimum will reduce a lot of the ghosting bot the 2 bottom corners and top left corner still show up on black screen. Engaging dynamic led will eliminate all clouding and will get rid of the upper left corner but the bottom 2 corners remains and I get a bit more input lag.

I need to get a better camera to be able to show the result with the backlit down and dynamic edge engaged. My ipod or ipad camera won't show much while in person, it's more visible.
post #1494 of 1970
When do you suspect the 2013 tvs to have pricing announced
post #1495 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danediz View Post

When do you suspect the 2013 tvs to have pricing announced

Last year they were announced in March

On a side note have been hearing rumblings the new sets might start arriving next month. The bigger question is will it be display sets or one's that can actually be purchased?
Edited by m2845 - 1/30/13 at 12:22pm
post #1496 of 1970
Why does amazon say the hx850 was available last january?
post #1497 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danediz View Post

Why does amazon say the hx850 was available last january?

Good question!!!

To my knowledge this model was not made avaible to sell until late April/early May. I could have swore this tv was made available to sell the same week as the NFL draft last year?
post #1498 of 1970
Am I correct that finding a new KDL55HX850 is now next to impossible?

Thanks for any info
post #1499 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by idreaminhd View Post

Am I correct that finding a new KDL55HX850 is now next to impossible?

Thanks for any info

You can still find them on line and maybe in your local area BUT just not as easy like it was the last 2 month. Also, the price has gone up on them as well.
post #1500 of 1970
Quote:
Originally Posted by idreaminhd View Post

Am I correct that finding a new KDL55HX850 is now next to impossible?

Thanks for any info

I'm from Central America, you can still find them if you lived anywhere across Latin America (from mexico to argentina), and brand new not floor models. The U.S. amazon page show brand new HX850's from third party sellers from $2,400.00 for the 55" version and $2,150.00 for the 46" version. I guess you can still find them in the US because they are ensamble in Mexico, here are the links:
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-BRAVIA-KDL55HX850-55-Inch-Internet/dp/B006U1VGNS/ref=sr_1_6?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1359594145&sr=1-6
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-BRAVIA-KDL46HX850-46-Inch-Internet/dp/B006U1VGAQ/ref=sr_1_8?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1359594145&sr=1-8
I don´t know about Europe and Australia. Hope it helps you, I don´t know where you from.
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