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Official Panasonic VT50 owners thread - Page 207

post #6181 of 13463
Have the 3D settings been posted?
post #6182 of 13463
Hi Topper....Do you upscaling the vt50 resolution
to one of this in the onkyo nr818 ..??
thanks




■Resolution*4*6*8
􀁠Through:
Select this to pass video through the AV receiver at
the same resolution and with no conversion.
􀁠Auto:
Select this to have the AV receiver automatically
convert video at resolutions supported by your TV.
􀁠480p (480p/576p), 720p, 1080i, 1080p:
Select the desired output resolution.
􀁠1080p/24:
Select this for 1080p output at 24 frames per second.
􀁠4K Upscaling:
Select this for an output resolution four times that of
1080p. Depending on the resolution supported by
your TV, it will result in either 3840 × 2160 or 4096
× 2160 pixels.

You can specify the output resolution for the HDMI output
and have the AV receiver upconvert the picture resolution
as necessary to match the resolution supported by your TV.
This setting is available only when “Source” has been
selected in “Resolution” of the “Monitor Out” setting
post #6183 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by ledesma53 View Post

Hi Topper....Do you upscaling the vt50 resolution
to one of this in the onkyo nr818 ..??
thanks




■Resolution*4*6*8
􀁠Through:
Select this to pass video through the AV receiver at
the same resolution and with no conversion.
􀁠Auto:
Select this to have the AV receiver automatically
convert video at resolutions supported by your TV.
􀁠480p (480p/576p), 720p, 1080i, 1080p:
Select the desired output resolution.
􀁠1080p/24:
Select this for 1080p output at 24 frames per second.
􀁠4K Upscaling:
Select this for an output resolution four times that of
1080p. Depending on the resolution supported by
your TV, it will result in either 3840 × 2160 or 4096
× 2160 pixels.

You can specify the output resolution for the HDMI output
and have the AV receiver upconvert the picture resolution
as necessary to match the resolution supported by your TV.
This setting is available only when “Source” has been
selected in “Resolution” of the “Monitor Out” setting

I use custom picture mode on the 818 with the following settings.
Wide mode : Full
Edge Enhancement: Low
Noise reduction: Low or Mid
Resolution: 1080p/24 It will output 60hz unless the input is 24p

Everything else is default.

And I do output native from my HR34 Directv stb

And since I am using edge enhancement on the 818, I set the VT50 sharpness to 0 instead of 14-24.

Oh yeah, I also no longer up convert from my ps3. I let the 818 handle that now. I don't know that I see a difference, but the tech in the 818 is years newer and most likely superior.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any further questions. smile.gif
post #6184 of 13463
Hey guys,

My set is arriving tomorrow and I can't wait for it. My question is to do with calibration. I've requested Chad to come out and work on my set and he said he plans to make a trip soon and it will be before christmas. In the meantime, would you recommend I calibrate it using Topper's settings and the Disney WoW disc or should I just use it in THX mode and wait for it to get professionally calibrated?

Oh, and an off-topic question: what was the first blu-ray you tried on the VT50 that blew you away?
post #6185 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon! View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by TommmyJ

Is that due to changed viewing habits/being a new tv, or do you mean the new set seams better at not getting IR compared to previous one?
Don't EEEEEEEVEN go there.
mad.gif

Why not? I want to hear the answer to this.

Michael
post #6186 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walking Beast View Post

I apologise for my tone , I was just frustrated with the changes in image quality. I adjusted my viewing distance and it made a big difference. I still sit within 6 feet of the screen but not 4 feet or so as the first day, which was much worse.

If you are going to sit that close to a 65" TV, of course, things are going to look blurry. Anything that is not rendered with full resolution by the GPU, or games with blurry textures, will not look sharp.

Michael
post #6187 of 13463
On another forum an unofficial Panasonic rep stated that the -2 after the model number is for Panasonic factory internal coding and is not worth any attention. Someone else suggested it may be an indicator/ way of keeping track of when the firmware was installed/released for the fixed luminance controls. Models with the -2 may have the firmware already installed from factory. Who knows really but I am satisfied with what was posted unofficially by the rep. The only slight problem I have with mine is some vertical lines with panning on a white screen or what I think is described as dirty screen effect. I don't think I want to gamble and get a worse one as I don't have buzz or a big vertical line on the right side like others or dead/stuck pixels.
Edited by TommmyJ - 8/27/12 at 6:16am
post #6188 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by vilas View Post

Hey guys,
My set is arriving tomorrow and I can't wait for it. My question is to do with calibration. I've requested Chad to come out and work on my set and he said he plans to make a trip soon and it will be before christmas. In the meantime, would you recommend I calibrate it using Topper's settings and the Disney WoW disc or should I just use it in THX mode and wait for it to get professionally calibrated?
Oh, and an off-topic question: what was the first blu-ray you tried on the VT50 that blew you away?

I'd just start with Topper's settings for the first 200 or 300 hours and then get it calibrated. Looks fantastic with his settings. I watched the samples off the WoW Bluray (the tinkerbell ones especially) and they look amazing.
post #6189 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael2000 View Post

If you are going to sit that close to a 65" TV, of course, things are going to look blurry. Anything that is not rendered with full resolution by the GPU, or games with blurry textures, will not look sharp.
Michael

Thank you for the feedback. Why is it then that some games look amazing? Very sharp with great color and contrast? The other games like skyrim, witcher and deadspace 2 look horrible. These are 1080p games. I dont understand why so much inconsistancy among games. I did not have this issue on my 50 inch plasma, and never had inconsistancies on the CRT.

I was almost going to keep the tv since the content that worked right looked amazing. But it looked horrendous on way too many of the games I tested. Washed out, blurry, bad color, etc. It seems that everyone who reviews this tv doesnt want to talk about that part. There was not a problem with my viewing distance on the games that looked great. I would have been sold if it maintained the quality throughout most of my games. Its not like skyrim and deadspace 2 are low resolution games either. They are 1080p. It must be much more complex then just resolution of a game because these games looked great on my 50 inch. They didnt have the black levels of this new set but they were sharp atleast and not a blurred mess with horrible colors.

Im thinking of going down to the 55 inch VT. Do you think a ten inch size reduction will give me a better picture on these problem games? Or should I just go further down to the 50 GT or ST. If my G20 50 inch could handle these games I do not understand why such a massive problem on this top of the line 65. Any feedback on this issue would be appreciated
post #6190 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walking Beast View Post

Can anyone tell me if a smaller screen would give a better picture? Im thinking of getting an ST 50 inch over this 65 inch VT. There were a few games that looked great but way too many that looked horrible. I dont know why that is. Skyrim,witcher,twisted metal for example all looked super washed out , blurry and with weak colors. Compared to my 50 inch G20 plasma which displayed these games much much better, aside from the dithering. This tv definately has much less dithering and image noise. Most of the games just dont look good however. Would a 50 inch ST,GT or VT be best? Is there a big difference in image quality over the three. I dont plan to do pro calibration. I just want strong color, contrast and black levels, sharpness and clarity. My 50 inch was not blurry like this at all.
I tested alot of material and tried to tweak this set but now I need to make a choice on another option. I can go back to CRT but the size of a 50 inch is a nice plus. Even though the picture quality of my g20 was way off my sony crt.

Judging from your preference in image quality (super bright, vibrant, saturated colors and razor sharp), I think what you're looking for is a Sharp Elite.

Black levels are essentially the same. Overall, the VT50 is a better television, but the Elite will almost certainly provide the same "pop" you're missing from the old Sony CRT.

Personally, I don't think the astronomical price is worth it, but it might be a viable solution if you've got the coin.
post #6191 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walking Beast View Post

Thank you for the feedback. Why is it then that some games look amazing? Very sharp with great color and contrast? The other games like skyrim, witcher and deadspace 2 look horrible. These are 1080p games. I dont understand why so much inconsistancy among games. I did not have this issue on my 50 inch plasma, and never had inconsistancies on the CRT.
I was almost going to keep the tv since the content that worked right looked amazing. But it looked horrendous on way too many of the games I tested. Washed out, blurry, bad color, etc. It seems that everyone who reviews this tv doesnt want to talk about that part. There was not a problem with my viewing distance on the games that looked great. I would have been sold if it maintained the quality throughout most of my games. Its not like skyrim and deadspace 2 are low resolution games either. They are 1080p. It must be much more complex then just resolution of a game because these games looked great on my 50 inch. They didnt have the black levels of this new set but they were sharp atleast and not a blurred mess with horrible colors.
Im thinking of going down to the 55 inch VT. Do you think a ten inch size reduction will give me a better picture on these problem games? Or should I just go further down to the 50 GT or ST. If my G20 50 inch could handle these games I do not understand why such a massive problem on this top of the line 65. Any feedback on this issue would be appreciated

If your a console gamer, there are only a handful of native 1080p games, most are 720p and under, but if your using a high end pc gaming rig, gaming should look sweet on this tv!
post #6192 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael2000 View Post

Why not? I want to hear the answer to this.
Michael


1. A false distinction between two arbitrary model number variants is the last thing we need. It'd be too much for our IR blank slide inspectors to deal with.

2. IR is already not a problem.

3. & just wait- it won,t be too long before they're claiming to have "burn-in" on the -02 variants as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Walking Beast 
Im thinking of going down to the 55 inch VT. Do you think a ten inch size reduction will give me a better picture on these problem games? Or should I just go further down to the 50 GT or ST. If my G20 50 inch could handle these games I do not understand why such a massive problem on this top of the line 65. Any feedback on this issue would be appreciated


Don't go too far in the opposite direction. How about keep your vt AND your 34" crt around just for games.

you have the biggest of the best already, and can only downgrade from here unless you splurge on an elite.
post #6193 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by greekwolf View Post

Judging from your preference in image quality (super bright, vibrant, saturated colors and razor sharp), I think what you're looking for is a Sharp Elite.
Black levels are essentially the same. Overall, the VT50 is a better television, but the Elite will almost certainly provide the same "pop" you're missing from the old Sony CRT.
Personally, I don't think the astronomical price is worth it, but it might be a viable solution if you've got the coin.



Thank you. Yes that is way out of my price range. I never even gave the elite a thought because I have always despised the look of LCD tech. Looks very washed out to me. I did not try the elite however. I also remember major motion blurring with LCD and off angle viewing problems.


I wouldnt mind if some of the games didnt look so blurry and lack sharpness and detail. I notice this way more on the 65 then I did on the 50 and the CRT.
post #6194 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by cv1981 View Post

If your a console gamer, there are only a handful of native 1080p games, most are 720p and under, but if your using a high end pc gaming rig, gaming should look sweet on this tv!

Thank you. I only use pc for old games that I emulate on pc and run through the tv. Those look great on this tv.

Im a console gamer so Im not sure what tv would provide the best image for me in this case.
post #6195 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon! View Post

1. A false distinction between two arbitrary model number variants is the last thing we need. It'd be too much for our IR blank slide inspectors to deal with.
2. IR is already not a problem.
3. & just wait- it won,t be too long before they're claiming to have "burn-in" on the -02 variants as well.
Don't go too far in the opposite direction. How about keep your vt AND your 34" crt around just for games.
you have the biggest of the best already, and can only downgrade from here unless you splurge on an elite.


My old CRT died unfortunately. So I dont have it anymore. And I dont have the space for two gaming set ups. Just one tv to handle everything. You dont think smaller screen sizes would sharpen up the images more? My 50 inch g20 plasma was much sharper and I did not have issues with the games I am not having issues with on the 65.
post #6196 of 13463
Sitting as close as you do, yeah I thik it will make a difference. But I can still see pixels on 46" from 6', so ymmv. & if it was still a problem, you,d really regret sending the bigger set back for it.

I'd try to see if you can't make what you have work first. Like you said some games look good, that tells me it might be a game problem, not a VT problem!
post #6197 of 13463
I do not mean to get off topic, but I have a question. I can purchase an open-box 46-Inch XBR-HX929 for $1,200 plus tax. It was the display model, so it has been used roughly 3,500 hours. Or is the 50-Inch VT50 brand new a better choice, albeit more expensive? I have owned several LCD's and one LED HDTV, but I have never owned a Plasma. If you are knowledgeable enough to give me some good advice, please do smile.gif Thanks
post #6198 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon! View Post

Sitting as close as you do, yeah I thik it will make a difference. But I can still see pixels on 46" from 6', so ymmv. & if it was still a problem, you,d really regret sending the bigger set back for it.
I'd try to see if you can't make what you have work first. Like you said some games look good, that tells me it might be a game problem, not a VT problem!


I just tried God of war 3 which is a 720p/1080i game and that was one of the best looking games. And looks quite sharp with incredible contrast, as this tv definately has. Another poster mentioned that the game has to be rendered a certain way, and objects within the game or they will be blurry. So it seems to have alot to do with the way a game is made. Hopefully the next gen will just render everything in real high quality so this doesnt become a continuing issue, if thats the case, or if i understood correctly. This tv is also a purchase that I am looking to hold me over into the next gen until OLEDs or the next technology that would satisfy me becomes affordable. So thats probably atleast 4 years from now.

I got Skyrim looking better today. In the outside areas, not so much in the dungeons. So hard to find a setting that handles dark and light areas in games equally as well. With some games its not a big issue.


Its not so much seeing some pixels that bothers me but just very blurry faded images in some games. Like dark souls and even twisted metal. Witcher 2 I got looking better but it still doesnt look real sharp to me. And looks like detail is missing in some areas, like enemies faces. There will be darkness in certain areas where I remember details. I do have the refference levels set to standard as not to crush blacks. I cannot sit any further back unfortunately with this current set up. And I think I am too close as well. As gaming is giving me a headache at 4-5 foot viewing distance.

So i dont think Ill regret a 55 inch tv, as my 50 was great size for me, just wanted more visual fidelity out of my G20 50 inch. I was not happy with the black levels of my G20 from 2010. Also the dithering , or dancing green pixels, especially in black areas was very bothersome to me. The good news is, my VT does not have much dithering at all on the settings I like. If image is too bright then yes it will. And the VT has incredible contrast. Makes me think of my CRT in that regard. First tv to impress me visually since the CRT (on the content it excels in, certain games only) (Blu rays look incredible, Im not denying that. This tv is mainly for gaming however)

So I am thinking 55 is a more reasonable size for my viewing distance (if not I can go down to GT 50 or ST 50, as I know 50 inches is nice for me)m and Im hoping the smaller size will sharpen up some of the games that looked very bad. I never had this issue on my G20 so I dont see why I should on a 50 or 55 inch plasma that is supposed to be much improved. Ive never owned a 65 inch so maybe for my viewing distance and prefferances its not right for me.
post #6199 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by HypostaticUnion View Post

I do not mean to get off topic, but I have a question. I can purchase an open-box 46-Inch XBR-HX929 for $1,200 plus tax. It was the display model, so it has been used roughly 3,500 hours. Or is the 50-Inch VT50 brand new a better choice, albeit more expensive? I have owned several LCD's and one LED HDTV, but I have never owned a Plasma. If you are knowledgeable enough to give me some good advice, please do smile.gif Thanks

Depends on what your preferences are. I suggest weeding through this tangled thread. But the big thing is that the LCD will have uniformity issues/blooming and off axis performance is quite poor. And motion will be less natural on the LCD.

On the flip side of the coin. The LCD can squeeze more brightness for bright room situations and full screen white content "commercials" can look a bit whiter and brighter. These things would not be enough for me to choose an LCD. If ever in doubt, by both and judege side by side and then return the one that loses out.

Plus the extra 4 inches is worth consideration. Thats what she said anyway. Sorry couldn't help it. tongue.gif

Good luck
post #6200 of 13463
WalkingBeast, I would try the 55VT50 if I were you. At your viewing distance that should be plenty big. Also, the VT has a better filter than the ST/GT to give it better picture with lights on/daytime.
post #6201 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by mnc View Post

WalkingBeast, I would try the 55VT50 if I were you. At your viewing distance that should be plenty big. Also, the VT has a better filter than the ST/GT to give it better picture with lights on/daytime.

If my primary use for a television was to game on at 5 feet away, I would buy a 50-55" LCD period. I f I cared about content besides gaming, it would be 55" VT at that distance. You will never get an answer that makes sense as to your g20 looking better, because it simply isn't. You either have a defective panel, too big a panel, or warped recollection of the g20 pq or a combination of all three. That's about all I can add to help answer your questions. GL
post #6202 of 13463
Thank you for the feedback. We will see. I just ordered the VT55 so that is my next adventure for the moment. Ill be sure to update on my perspective of the unit, plus Im sure ill have some questions at some point. If that doesnt workout then I think ill be looking at 50 inch GT (or ST if that might be better). Other then that I dont have any other ideas except going back to CRT but im trying to give this newer tech a chance!! I am just very obsessive over contrast and sharpness, color that pops. The VT has incredible black and contrast to be clear. The issue was the blurry and washed out look on certain games. Also 65 was too big for my viewing distance. Definate headaches.
post #6203 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by TopperMcFly View Post

If my primary use for a television was to game on at 5 feet away, I would buy a 50-55" LCD period. I f I cared about content besides gaming, it would be 55" VT at that distance. You will never get an answer that makes sense as to your g20 looking better, because it simply isn't. You either have a defective panel, too big a panel, or warped recollection of the g20 pq or a combination of all three. That's about all I can add to help answer your questions. GL




Thanks again. I absolutely despise the look of LCD. Very bright and washed out to me, motion artifacts (trails) and the viewing angle issues. I admit the last lcd i tried was a sony xbr 40 inch from maybe 2005 or 2006 but since then ive always hated the look of LCD. I have a hard time believing its remotely close to handling motion like a plasma and having the contrast of a plasma. Maybe things have changed but I just have strong doubts in that department. Last time I gamed on an LCD got really bad eye strain and just hated the look of the image. Feel free to correct me if Im way off. Its been a long time. When I finally got a 34 inch widescreen sony xbr CRT I loved the image and would have rode that out as long as possible. Despite the limited screen size it was completely immersive for gaming.

Id definately take the new VT over that for the movies though. The size and amazing contrast is great. I liked gaming on a 50 inch plasma, the G20. So Im fine with the tech. I just wanted crazy contrast and black levels and not to see all the dithering. Which the 65 VT basically delivered on. It was almost perfect for me. Just too mixed in the content. One game would look incredible the next would be all washed out. Id hate to get a sequel to an anticipated game and have it be all washed out.

The VT is a huge step above the G20. MASSIVE. I agree with you there. The contrast and less dithering really blows away the G20. I loved that. In some ways its almost like my CRT. It was almost perfect for me. The G20 was just more consistant for the content I used. Thats what I was getting at. I didnt have any games that looked extremely bad while others looked great. It was much more consistant. Of course nothing looked as good as the games the VT excelled in. The black level is great.

Hopefully the 10 inch size reduction will even out some of the content. Ill be getting it tommorrow so I can get an idea then atleast. My recollection of the G20 is very fresh. It was my last tv which I was using up until a few days ago for many long marathon sessions.

I used your setting that you posted and tried it on skyrim. It was great during the day scenes. Very good. The night scenes though had alot of dithering and it became very dark. Most likely wasnt intended as a gaming system but was worth a try.

Thanks again
post #6204 of 13463
Heard back from Panasonic Canada today regarding my flickering green pixel, after they sent the service guy to have a look at it. They said that it is unrepairable and Panasonic will be replacing my tv for me. Surprised that they decided to as I expected them to say that this happens and with only one pixel they weren't going to do anything about it.
post #6205 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by TommmyJ View Post

Is that due to changed viewing habits/being a new tv, or do you mean the new set seams better at not getting IR compared to previous one?

Short answer is probably viewing habits. I noticed even on the old set IR was reduced and virtually eliminated by using size 1 and making sure pixel orbiter is on. I almost was going to not have BB swap the set, but decided to take a new set. I am running the break-in slides this week when not around and will make sure I use size 2 for only DVD/BD/streaming. I have to believe that to get these deeper blacks Panasonic made some trade offs and being more prone to IR is one of the things the better panels come with. My 5 year old Panasonic I ran in size 2 mode all the time and never had IR, but the blacks were awful compared to the VT50.
post #6206 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walking Beast View Post

Thanks again. I absolutely despise the look of LCD. Very bright and washed out to me, motion artifacts (trails) and the viewing angle issues. I admit the last lcd i tried was a sony xbr 40 inch from maybe 2005 or 2006 but since then ive always hated the look of LCD. I have a hard time believing its remotely close to handling motion like a plasma and having the contrast of a plasma. Maybe things have changed but I just have strong doubts in that department. Last time I gamed on an LCD got really bad eye strain and just hated the look of the image. Feel free to correct me if Im way off. Its been a long time. When I finally got a 34 inch widescreen sony xbr CRT I loved the image and would have rode that out as long as possible. Despite the limited screen size it was completely immersive for gaming.
Id definately take the new VT over that for the movies though. The size and amazing contrast is great. I liked gaming on a 50 inch plasma, the G20. So Im fine with the tech. I just wanted crazy contrast and black levels and not to see all the dithering. Which the 65 VT basically delivered on. It was almost perfect for me. Just too mixed in the content. One game would look incredible the next would be all washed out. Id hate to get a sequel to an anticipated game and have it be all washed out.
The VT is a huge step above the G20. MASSIVE. I agree with you there. The contrast and less dithering really blows away the G20. I loved that. In some ways its almost like my CRT. It was almost perfect for me. The G20 was just more consistant for the content I used. Thats what I was getting at. I didnt have any games that looked extremely bad while others looked great. It was much more consistant. Of course nothing looked as good as the games the VT excelled in. The black level is great.
Hopefully the 10 inch size reduction will even out some of the content. Ill be getting it tommorrow so I can get an idea then atleast. My recollection of the G20 is very fresh. It was my last tv which I was using up until a few days ago for many long marathon sessions.
I used your setting that you posted and tried it on skyrim. It was great during the day scenes. Very good. The night scenes though had alot of dithering and it became very dark. Most likely wasnt intended as a gaming system but was worth a try.
Thanks again

I definitely like Plasma better but LCD tech has changed a lot since 2005. Sony has much better motion on there LCD's nowadays and has one of the best motion interpolation systems. Motion Flow on low does not have a lot of artifacts and the SOE effect is very subtle. I just got a 55"vt50 so I think plasma is the best but I wouldn't judge a LCD from what you remember in 2005 because that was almost 8 years ago and LCD tech has made some huge strides. It still not for me though.
post #6207 of 13463
I'm so excited, best buy just dropped off the 55"vt50. I can't wait to set it up. There delivery service is pretty good and they were here right on time.
post #6208 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by TommmyJ View Post

On another forum an unofficial Panasonic rep stated that the -2 after the model number is for Panasonic factory internal coding and is not worth any attention. Someone else suggested it may be an indicator/ way of keeping track of when the firmware was installed/released for the fixed luminance controls. Models with the -2 may have the firmware already installed from factory. Who knows really but I am satisfied with what was posted unofficially by the rep. The only slight problem I have with mine is some vertical lines with panning on a white screen or what I think is described as dirty screen effect. I don't think I want to gamble and get a worse one as I don't have buzz or a big vertical line on the right side like others or dead/stuck pixels.

FWIW - My set has a "Model No." of TC-P65VT50 and "Manufacturing ID No." of TC-P65VT50-2. Manufactured July 2012. I did not have the luminance firmware fix out of the box.

Maybe they all have a -2.
post #6209 of 13463
as stated before that im in the market for a new receiver to take full advantage of the vt50's 3d function. narrow them down to the pio sc61 or onk 818, which one should i go for and why? or mayb there are better receivers around that price range i dont know about. thanks guys
post #6210 of 13463
Quote:
Originally Posted by HypostaticUnion View Post

I do not mean to get off topic, but I have a question. I can purchase an open-box 46-Inch XBR-HX929 for $1,200 plus tax. It was the display model, so it has been used roughly 3,500 hours. Or is the 50-Inch VT50 brand new a better choice, albeit more expensive? I have owned several LCD's and one LED HDTV, but I have never owned a Plasma. If you are knowledgeable enough to give me some good advice, please do smile.gif Thanks

I wouldn't take a chance on a display model of any display whether it's Sony, Panasonic or anyone else's. Just too much chance of something going wrong.
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