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The **OFFICIAL** Denon AVR-XX13 Model Owner's Thread & FAQ - Page 333

post #9961 of 10468

I've just bought a Denon 3313 AVR and am unable to get audio out of Zone 2 or 3 Pre-Out's to my other zone audio system aux in. Have tested the input to my other system with a basic mp3 player and its all good. The Amp Assignments are ambiguous and I am unable to get audio out of Zone 2 or 3 at all

Cheers, 

post #9962 of 10468
^^
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1465528/the-official-2013-denon-e-series-x-series-avr-model-owners-thread-faq/0_100#user_M
post #9963 of 10468
Hello Chario,

I just read that you have a 2113ci (like I do) paired with Canton speakers.

I've been listening to speakers all week and was about to buy Canton Chrono 509.2 tower speakers with a Chrono 505.2 center channel. But I noticed the impedance being stated between 4 and 8 ohms, as well as the sensitivity (88.3bd and 87.5db) being lower than other speakers I was considering. After reading a few posts on the net, I'm worried that my 2113ci won't be up to the task to drive those Canton speakers without clipping and possibly damaging the 2113ci and/or the speakers.

What Canton speakers do you have and do you have any issues with clipping? Is the 2113ci powerful enough?

Carl


EDIT:
P.S. I was replying to an earlier post (on page 103!!!) from Chario, but if anyone wants to give his/her opinion on the subject it will be greatly appreciated.
Edited by La_Maudite - 12/20/13 at 5:32am
post #9964 of 10468
Whether or not the receiver's amps will be good enough for those speakers depends on the acoustics of your room and your preferred sound level. However, in general, a 100W/channel amp normally cannot provide movie reference sound levels (105dB) when using speakers less than about 95dB sensitivity. Some help in determining the amount of power needed is available with the Harman/Crown power amp calculator at http://www.crownaudio.com/elect-pwr-req.htm
post #9965 of 10468
I have developed two independent minor issues with my 2113ci.

The first is when watching TV the audio will drop out and then fade back up to the listening volume volume. The entire event takes about 1 sec. It's quick enough that you don't miss anything, but super annoying. This issue is limited to my cable box. It has never happened while using my PS3 for games or movies. However, my cable box connected directly to a TV does not exhibit this behavior.

The second issue is that when watching TV the video will drop out, but the audio continues. The only course of action it to switch to another input and back, or to turn off the unit and turn it back on. This has bee happening quite a bit while watching TV, so I assumed it was a handshake issue with my X1 Comcast box until it happened last night while watching a bluray through my PS3.

My wife has a theory that this second issue seems to happen if there is a static electricity discharge. Our microfiber couch often causes us to shock ourselves, but the couch does not contact the receiver or HDMI cable, so I'm not sure the two are truly related. If they are I'm concerned about damaging the receiver. I am going to pick up static guard to treat my couch as a precaution, but it seems ridiculous to me. The receiver is about a foot from the couch, so not beyond the realm of possibility.

I have tried some minor troubleshooting including resetting the microprocessor, but with no luck.

Any thoughts?
post #9966 of 10468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Whether or not the receiver's amps will be good enough for those speakers depends on the acoustics of your room and your preferred sound level. However, in general, a 100W/channel amp normally cannot provide movie reference sound levels (105dB) when using speakers less than about 95dB sensitivity. Some help in determining the amount of power needed is available with the Harman/Crown power amp calculator at http://www.crownaudio.com/elect-pwr-req.htm

Thanks for the link. Going from (3m, 92db, 105dBSPL, 3db) for the MartinLogan Motion 40 to (3m, 88.3db, 105dBSPL, 3db) for the Canton Chrono 509.2, the difference in power required is enormous: 358w vs 840w. And that's per channel? If so, not one of the speakers I've looked at can be paired with my 2113ci.

Carl
post #9967 of 10468
Yes, that's per-channel.

Note that's also if you want to listen at full movie reference level without distortion. My impression is that most people in most home listening rooms prefer to listen about 20dB below reference. You need a well treated room with appropriate absorption and quality speakers to be able to listen comfortably at higher levels.
post #9968 of 10468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Yes, that's per-channel.

Note that's also if you want to listen at full movie reference level without distortion. My impression is that most people in most home listening rooms prefer to listen about 20dB below reference. You need a well treated room with appropriate absorption and quality speakers to be able to listen comfortably at higher levels.

Which is not my case. I don't listen to music or movies with extremely high volume, and my room isn't what I would call well treated wink.gif

At 20dB below reference, meaning 85dB, the power needed is much much much lower:

(3m, 92db, 85dBSPL, 3db) = 4w for the MartinLogan Motion 40
(3m, 88.3db, 85dBSPL, 3db) = 8w for the Canton Chrono 509.2

Of course, at this level the AVR isn't going to suffer at all. I guess now I have to figure out what is the maximum level I'll be using in my home.

Thanks
post #9969 of 10468
Quote:
Originally Posted by jvh4 View Post




The first is when watching TV the audio will drop out and then fade back up to the listening volume volume. The entire event takes about 1 sec. It's quick enough that you don't miss anything, but super annoying. This issue is limited to my cable box. It has never happened while using my PS3 for games or movies. However, my cable box connected directly to a TV does not exhibit this behavior.



Any thoughts?

 



I have this issue also only on my cable box. I've completely given up on it and will be rid of the issue totally when I get my antennae up.
post #9970 of 10468
Hi,
when I select 'Setup'/Audio on my Denon 2113 remote, most of the times the 'Surround Parameter' and 'Tone' options are greyed out. Only seldom those options are available to check them so I can change the parameters. I didn't notice any correlation when they are available and when not.
Why is that so?
Thanks.
post #9971 of 10468
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexandru27 View Post

Hi,
when I select 'Setup'/Audio on my Denon 2113 remote, most of the times the 'Surround Parameter' and 'Tone' options are greyed out. Only seldom those options are available to check them so I can change the parameters. I didn't notice any correlation when they are available and when not.
Why is that so?
Thanks.

Hi alexandru27, Surround Parameter options are available depending on what surround mode you are in. Tone is available when Dynamic EQ is turned off.
post #9972 of 10468
Hi and thanks! I've switched to a channel with dolby digital and the surround option appeared smile.gif
post #9973 of 10468
Quote:
Originally Posted by jvh4 View Post

I have developed two independent minor issues with my 2113ci.

The first is when watching TV the audio will drop out and then fade back up to the listening volume volume. The entire event takes about 1 sec. It's quick enough that you don't miss anything, but super annoying. This issue is limited to my cable box. It has never happened while using my PS3 for games or movies. However, my cable box connected directly to a TV does not exhibit this behavior.

The second issue is that when watching TV the video will drop out, but the audio continues. The only course of action it to switch to another input and back, or to turn off the unit and turn it back on. This has bee happening quite a bit while watching TV, so I assumed it was a handshake issue with my X1 Comcast box until it happened last night while watching a bluray through my PS3.

My wife has a theory that this second issue seems to happen if there is a static electricity discharge. Our microfiber couch often causes us to shock ourselves, but the couch does not contact the receiver or HDMI cable, so I'm not sure the two are truly related. If they are I'm concerned about damaging the receiver. I am going to pick up static guard to treat my couch as a precaution, but it seems ridiculous to me. The receiver is about a foot from the couch, so not beyond the realm of possibility.

I have tried some minor troubleshooting including resetting the microprocessor, but with no luck.

Any thoughts?

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1465528/the-official-2013-denon-e-series-x-series-avr-model-owners-thread-faq/0_100#user_L11

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1465528/the-official-2013-denon-e-series-x-series-avr-model-owners-thread-faq/0_100#user_L17
post #9974 of 10468
Has anyone had a tracking issue (sound and picture not matching) playing blu rays thru the new xbox one with a denon avr? I have the 2113 and just noticed this problem. I've never had the problem using my ps3. Any ideas for a quick idea fix? Thanks for the help.

Edit: Apparently it's an Xbox One issue. The lag happens when the system is set to refresh at 24 Hz. Turned that off and it works fine...
Edited by af7miller - 12/22/13 at 8:04am
post #9975 of 10468
Hi again.
Still on 5.0, as haven't added as yet a sub. Planning on adding one soon.
Also, ever since I've bought it (10 months ago), didn't bother to download/install any of the firmware upgrades for Denon 2113 - mainly because I was worried not to get some of the issues being discussed here back this spring. Haven't followed the discussions on this forum for the past few months - did Denon announce some new firmware upgrades during this time? And most importantly: is it worth the bother? Will some of the upgrades improve the sound quality?
Thanks.
post #9976 of 10468
^^
Post #6 of this thread lists the firmware change log.
post #9977 of 10468
.
Right, forgot about that post, thanks.

Still, the firmware log from 11/17/2013 shows exactly the same content as the one in 9/5/2013. Is it an error?
post #9978 of 10468
^^
Yes, double post. Thanks for catching that. smile.gif
post #9979 of 10468
Another issue popping up with my 1913. I'm getting some Dolby Digital encoded streams from VUDU coming across with the dialogue anchored to the left side of my 5.1 (most streams are ok, as are ALL DD+ streams) and today I've noticed a couple of cable stations that when in DD, the dialogue is being anchored from the left side only. Getting almost no sound out of the right rear channel when this happens. Test tones and other encodes play sound properly. Does this sound like an issue w/ my AVR or the source?
post #9980 of 10468
post #9981 of 10468

Received my denon 1713 from accessories for less yesterday.  And it is 100 times better than my onkyo htib avr.  I can actually hear my surrounds!! I love it so far.  Audyysey is also amazing. 

post #9982 of 10468
Quote:
Originally Posted by jvh4 View Post

Yeah. I've tried that as well. Thanks anyway.

Due to the HDMI handshake issues common with some cable/sat boxes, connecting the HDMI directly to the TV with optical from the box to the AVR would resolve your issue.
post #9983 of 10468

Hi, hoping someone can point me in the right direction.

I have a Denon 3313, with B&W 604 S2 Fronts, B&W 601 S3 Rears and a Kenwood Centre. No Subwoofer.

 

My wife was playing the Ipad through the system (Stereo) when it dropped sound to the Left Front speaker.

When I cam home and retried it, I initially got full Stereo and then it dropped to the Right only and no Left.

Swapped the speakers over and got the reverse, Sound from Left Speaker but no Right.

Rebooted the Amp, but no difference.

Reset the Microprocessor, but no difference.

Ran the Audyssey setup and as the Left Speaker is the first in the Setup, It fails with no Speaker or Microphone.

When performing a manual Tone Test, all are good except whatever is connected to the Left Output speaker terminal.

If I bump the DB level (not sure of correct term) all the way up to 12DB is gradually get louder, but never to the levels of the other speakers set at 2 DB. Is there anything else I can try before I drop it back to the store to get looked at?

Also can I hook the Fronts up to the Front Wide terminals until I take it in, will this work ok?

This may have been happening for a while as it wasn't until we play stereo that it it obvious something is amiss. No sound from speaker in any sound configuration, Game, Cinema, Direct etc.

thanks

post #9984 of 10468
^^
If after swapping the speakers, and the issue followed the speaker, there's a problem with the FL speaker not the amp. Otherwise if it was an amp problem, you could try connecting the FL/FR speakers to the SBL/SBR speaker posts and then set Amp Assign to "Front B" (p. 93 OM) and set the Front Speakers setting to "B" (p. 93 OM).
post #9985 of 10468

Sorry, tried to be clear, but obviously wasn't. Issue definitely with Amp not speaker. When I swapped the speakers over it was at the Amp end not the speaker end, so issue moves to whatever speaker is plugged into the Left Front speaker out terminal.

 

I haven't seen any other forums or threads with my particular issue. Aside from what you described, couldn't I (for now) just move them to the Front Left and Right Wide speaker terminals?

post #9986 of 10468
^^
What would be the purpose of connecting to the FWL/FWR speaker posts? You only have a 5.0 setup and are having issues with the FL speaker post. confused.gif
post #9987 of 10468

Its not clear in the manual and I haven't played around enough with anything that isn't "out of the box" configuration wise.

 

I thought the FWL/FWR posts just added more depth i.e. 2 FL's (FL&FWL) and 2 FR's (FR&FWR), so if my FL post is dud in some manner I could just move them to the FWR & FWL posts instead of the FR & FL posts they are currently in. Or to use the FWR & FWL post I need to be already using the FR & FL posts?

 

The FL post is not entirely dead, the Audyssey setup does send a tone Test to the FL connected speaker but it is so faint the microphone doesn't pick it up and the manual Tone test needs to be bumped up past 4 dB to start to hear any tone. Up to 12dB which is Max is still way below the other speakers set ay 2dB.

post #9988 of 10468
Replacing the receiver would be the best fix.

However, you might try pressing down in various places on the top-back of the box. If it's a poor wiring connection, that might flex things enough so that it makes a better contact. At least one person reported that helping his intermittent speaker connection.
post #9989 of 10468
Top rear above the HDMI outputs works on my 3312; haven't had to do so lately.
post #9990 of 10468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gegamuss View Post

Its not clear in the manual and I haven't played around enough with anything that isn't "out of the box" configuration wise.

I thought the FWL/FWR posts just added more depth i.e. 2 FL's (FL&FWL) and 2 FR's (FR&FWR), so if my FL post is dud in some manner I could just move them to the FWR & FWL posts instead of the FR & FL posts they are currently in. Or to use the FWR & FWL post I need to be already using the FR & FL posts?

The FL post is not entirely dead, the Audyssey setup does send a tone Test to the FL connected speaker but it is so faint the microphone doesn't pick it up and the manual Tone test needs to be bumped up past 4 dB to start to hear any tone. Up to 12dB which is Max is still way below the other speakers set ay 2dB.

At a minimum, an AVR must have the FL/FR speakers connected. Use of the FWL/FWR posts are when expanding from a 5.1 setup to a 7.1 setup. Your only option would be either FL/FR as Front A, or SBL/SBR as Front B.
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