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The Official Panasonic VT50 Settings Thread - Page 68

post #2011 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

Was there ever a D-Nice NIGHT TIME or dark room settings list posted? Seems like 94 might be kind of high for contrast for a dark room. I've decreased it to 82 but just wondering if I'm in the right ballpark.

Thanks

I think my night time mode contrast was 79
post #2012 of 2130
Is there a link to the VT50 recommended settings?
thanks
post #2013 of 2130
CHad was just out for a touchup and he went with the BT 1886 gamma target for my Night mode.

Happy with it so far. I'd run a higher gamma (2.35) vs a 2.2 on an older plasma but could never get it right. 1886 seems to be gaining traction and the theory and chart results make sense. Time will tell!

http://www.mediafire.com/view/7rfur0w4fpbobdq/Pan%2065VT50%20ISF%20Night%20bt1886.pdf
post #2014 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

CHad was just out for a touchup and he went with the BT 1886 gamma target for my Night mode.

Happy with it so far. I'd run a higher gamma (2.35) vs a 2.2 on an older plasma but could never get it right. 1886 seems to be gaining traction and the theory and chart results make sense. Time will tell!

http://www.mediafire.com/view/7rfur0w4fpbobdq/Pan%2065VT50%20ISF%20Night%20bt1886.pdf

Looks like he did a good job!
post #2015 of 2130
Any of you that calibrate, or hire someone, Id seriously recommend you try a BT 1886 cal for one of your modes, if anything to use as a night mode. I'll probably use it all the time, but the higher gamma from 40% on up to 90% really makes for a "rich" look IMO.
post #2016 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

Any of you that calibrate, or hire someone, Id seriously recommend you try a BT 1886 cal for one of your modes, if anything to use as a night mode. I'll probably use it all the time, but the higher gamma from 40% on up to 90% really makes for a "rich" look IMO.

Sounds interesting to try out. I may look into it on my next staycation.
post #2017 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by robnix View Post

Sounds interesting to try out. I may look into it on my next staycation.
And I will certainly discuss this with Chad during my next "touch up" or if I get that replacement VT60 I've been praying for smile.gif
post #2018 of 2130
I know I am not in the "club" anymore but just thought I would add my experience with my ST60, i have found both a flat powerlaw 2.3 and BT1886 to look very nice on my ST60. I had always subsribed to the traditioal 2.2 thinking, but as Gadget indicated the higher gamma does deliver more pop and richness to the picture imo. If you compare to 2.2 it appears a bit washed out imo So anyone that can try it out I think you will be pleased smile.gif
post #2019 of 2130
Exactly Chunon. The greatest thing about a 1886 vs the flat 2.35 is it slopes low end gamma to a lower number as needed by your displays actual black performance, as to help low end detail.

Very impressed with what I see so far.
post #2020 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

Exactly Chunon. The greatest thing about a 1886 vs the flat 2.35 is it slopes low end gamma to a lower number as needed by your displays actual black performance, as to help low end detail.

Very impressed with what I see so far.

Darnit - now I"m going to have to try it out. Maybe the Saturday before the Super Bowl.
post #2021 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by robnix View Post

Darnit - now I"m going to have to try it out. Maybe the Saturday before the Super Bowl.

It is great for sports imo I think you will like it smile.gif I'm still on the fence on Bt1886 but i tried a custom gamma curve 2.1 to 2.3 in Calman and like it alot.
post #2022 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by chunon View Post

It is great for sports imo I think you will like it smile.gif I'm still on the fence on Bt1886 but i tried a custom gamma curve 2.1 to 2.3 in Calman and like it alot.

Gravity is hitting bluray in a month as well smile.gif
post #2023 of 2130
Good point !
post #2024 of 2130
Is it possible to do a hybrid where you get the benefit of the just the lower slope?
post #2025 of 2130
Mo anything is possible with a custom gamma curve smile.gif
post #2026 of 2130
Well I'm certainly intrigued. I've heard the benefits of 1886 on the low end and being a strategy employed by some of the LCD amateur calibrators to deal with crappy native black levels.
post #2027 of 2130
Low end gamma is where it has been basically for my set, and its fine IMO, but having that higher number curving towards 2.4 from 40-90 really adds a lot to the image.

So far every panny owner I have talked to likes it, and Chad and Tom Huffman speak well of it.
post #2028 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

Low end gamma is where it has been basically for my set, and its fine IMO, but having that higher number curving towards 2.4 from 40-90 really adds a lot to the image.

So far every panny owner I have talked to likes it, and Chad and Tom Huffman speak well of it.

Well, I guess it's time to do some more calibration... Just when I thought I was done... But then again, we're never really "done", are we? LOL
I'm intrigued by this and looking forward to trying this gamma approach...
post #2029 of 2130
If you own your own gear (I do), you never are done LOL
post #2030 of 2130
You speak the truth biggrin.gif it's never ending but fun imo
post #2031 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

If you own your own gear (I do), you never are done LOL

Yep, I have my own equipment too of course, hence never being done, lol
post #2032 of 2130
I don't understand what 1886 does. What does it increases "richness" mean? Is there a difference in MLL or detail in the blacks? Does it look more realistic? Please explain. Thanks.
post #2033 of 2130
Its hard to explain, but as you lower gamma the image washes out. As you increase it, it adds a more rich image (pop, color, depth). Hard to explain.

2.4 gamma is where they are headed for a standard, but depending on black performance it doesnt work out so well setting gamma to 2.4 in the darker areas. So this is a curve based off a sets MLL, where you end up with the higher gamma in the 40-90% range and it improves the image IMO.
post #2034 of 2130
Gadget on my set it definitely results in better saturation Of colors and a more contrasty look

There is a correlation between gamma and color saturation from what I have read
Edited by chunon - 1/24/14 at 4:39am
post #2035 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by TWD View Post

I don't understand what 1886 does. What does it increases "richness" mean? Is there a difference in MLL or detail in the blacks? Does it look more realistic? Please explain. Thanks.

In very simple terms, as you increase the gamma curve, whites tend to "look" peaked more where as darker shades tend to further darken. This gives a more contrasty, striking image. The issue can be with very dark or low APL detail that can get crushed (depending on how that material was mastered). BT1886 attempts to resolve that issue by starting with a lower gamma based on the display's MLL so that dark detail is more likely to be seen - but then that gamma curve rises as the APL increases so you get the "punch" with more mid and higher level APLs. It attempts to take in account the display's capabilities so that when viewing content on different displays, the gamma can look a bit more similar. It's an attempt to standardize gamma. I really like it on my VT60 especially with newer releases. However, sometimes I do find content that I prefer with just a straight 2.3 as I speculate that content was mastered at something closer 2.2.
post #2036 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

In very simple terms, as you increase the gamma curve, whites tend to "look" peaked more where as darker shades tend to further darken. This gives a more contrasty, striking image. The issue can be with very dark or low APL detail that can get crushed (depending on how that material was mastered). BT1886 attempts to resolve that issue by starting with a lower gamma based on the display's MLL so that dark detail is more likely to be seen - but then that gamma curve rises as the APL increases so you get the "punch" with more mid and higher level APLs. It attempts to take in account the display's capabilities so that when viewing content on different displays, the gamma can look a bit more similar. It's an attempt to standardize gamma. I really like it on my VT60 especially with newer releases. However, sometimes I do find content that I prefer with just a straight 2.3 as I speculate that content was mastered at something closer 2.2.

And therein lies the problem with setting the gamma curve. We don't have any idea what the folks that produced the content did with respect to gamma. Do we?

Larry
post #2037 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

And therein lies the problem with setting the gamma curve. We don't have any idea what the folks that produced the content did with respect to gamma. Do we?

Larry

Nope.
post #2038 of 2130
My opinions on BT1886 after 7 days:

  • My previous "night" mode that I used all the time was about a 2.27 avg gamma 36fl
  • I initially found myself swapping to 2.23 gamma power curve mode quite a bit because I felt 1886 was a bit dim. The blacks are excellent, the brighter scenes pop, but its the dim scenes that seemed off.
  • After awhile I found I wasnt happy with either, 1886 seemed dim, 2.23 seemed off
  • Now its finally settling in where 1886 looks good most of the time. I tend to prefer a one size fits all mode, and 1886 is close. Im sure some folks may not like it for a brighter room, so Id recommend keeping something on the back burner to use.
  • One of the big problems, and Ive seen this before, is swapping between modes. You allow yourself to get used to a day mode, then the night mode can seem dim, but once you allow yourself to get used to the night mode, no big deal.
  • What I do seem to see is the overall image in most scenes look "better" with 1886 vs the 2.23 mode. I use 1080p/24 in and 96hz mode, quite often actually, and I find that the 1886 mode contours less on pans vs the 2.23 mode. Not sure why that it is.
  • Finally, some of the scenes in tv shows, where I feel its too dark, cause me to start looking at the actual scene and room. Usually its a bar, restaurant, or just dark meeting room. So I have to question "should it not look dim?".
  • I watch all my blu-ray flicks in a dark room in 96hz mode and that looks outstanding.

I really want something in 70" this year, but it'll be hard for me to replace this VT50 with any LED LCD. I may just have to come to the realization that I now have to wait for OLED.
Edited by gadgtfreek - 1/28/14 at 1:17pm
post #2039 of 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgtfreek View Post

My opinions on BT1886 after 7 days:

  • My previous "night" mode that I used all the time was about a 2.27 avg gamma 36fl
  • I initially found myself swapping to 2.23 gamma power curve mode quite a bit because I felt 1886 was a bit dim. The blacks are excellent, the brighter scenes pop, but its the dim scenes that seemed off.
  • After awhile I found I wasnt happy with either, 1886 seemed dim, 2.23 seemed off
  • Now its finally settling in where 1886 looks good most of the time. I tend to prefer a one size fits all mode, and 1886 is close. Im sure some folks may not like it for a brighter room, so Id recommend keeping something on the back burner to use.
  • One of the big problems, and Ive seen this before, is swapping between modes. You allow yourself to get used to a day mode, then the night mode can seem dim, but once you allow yourself to get used to the night mode, no big deal.
  • What I do seem to see is the overall image in most scenes look "better" with 1886 vs the 2.23 mode. I use 1080p/24 in and 96hz mode, quite often actually, and I find that the 1886 mode contours less on pans vs the 2.23 mode. Not sure why that it is.
  • Finally, some of the scenes in tv shows, where I feel its too dark, cause me to start looking at the actual scene and room. Usually its a bar, restaurant, or just dark meeting room. So I have to question "should it not look dim?".
  • I watch all my blu-ray flicks in a dark room in 96hz mode and that looks outstanding.

I really want something in 70" this year, but it'll be hard for me to replace this VT50 with any LED LCD. I may just have to come to the realization that I now have to wait for OLED.

I did the BT 1886 just a couple of days ago and am watching it now and evaluating too. It does seem to reveal a few more details in the lower range compared to my 2.3 power gamma calibration. Interestingly, I also seem to perceive some scenes as dim, or as if the image doesn't pop enough. But then when I switch between 2.3 and 1886 it actually isn't much different... Anyway, I'll have to watch if for a bit longer...

Btw, what did you set your brightness to with 1886?

Cheers...
post #2040 of 2130
Btw, Panasonic is allegedly coming out with an LED LCD in 2014 that is supposed to match and in some areas outperform ZT60!!! Not sure which sizes it will come in, but chances are you may have a solution in an LED LCD this year without losing PQ of the VT50...
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