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Keager's Quad RE XXX 18 Underfloor IB Build - Page 11

post #301 of 341
12/7/12 at 4:38pm
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That was my suspicion also. I will try again tomorrow.
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post #302 of 341
12/8/12 at 1:30pm
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No construction today. I did use blue tape to mark where the new manifold will be. In the picture, lower left you can see the blue tape. In the distance by the plant is the location of the existing manifold. C360_2012-12-08-12-47-47.jpg
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post #303 of 341
12/8/12 at 11:33pm
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought an IB should not be behind the listening position?
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post #304 of 341
12/9/12 at 5:40am
Thread Starter 
Its definitely not ideal, but it is the only other spot that it can go due to how the floor joists line up with furniture water pipes, heater ducts etc. It also directly to the left, not behind. The picture kind of gives it that illusion though.
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post #305 of 341
12/9/12 at 6:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought an IB should not be behind the listening position?

If it's the only subwoofer source, yes. No different than box subs, big gains can be had from a sub rearward of the LP, in a multisub system.
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post #306 of 341
12/9/12 at 7:19am
Thread Starter 
FOH, I dont have a boxed sub to test the new location. Would it do any good to just place one of the drivers there free air?
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post #307 of 341
12/9/12 at 2:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by FOH View Post

If it's the only subwoofer source, yes. No different than box subs, big gains can be had from a sub rearward of the LP, in a multisub system.

I have a space that will hold another 3 x 18" subs that could be made into an IB on the back wall to the right of the LP. Could I put another IB sub there?
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post #308 of 341
12/9/12 at 2:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by keager View Post

Its definitely not ideal, but it is the only other spot that it can go due to how the floor joists line up with furniture water pipes, heater ducts etc. It also directly to the left, not behind. The picture kind of gives it that illusion though.
Ok, I see now.
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post #309 of 341
12/9/12 at 2:35pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

I have a space that will hold another 3 x 18" subs that could be made into an IB on the back wall to the right of the LP. Could I put another IB sub there?

Woah, woah, woah.. what am I thinking? Heck yes you could. What does your wife think of the four you have already?
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post #310 of 341
12/9/12 at 3:34pm
Am I missing something here? Where are the 4 LMS-U's planned to be implemented?

You still have those, right Dave?
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post #311 of 341
12/9/12 at 3:36pm
Thread Starter 
I believe he is using those as filler subs to smooth FR. Lol. Correct me if Im wrong Dave
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post #312 of 341
12/9/12 at 4:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by keager View Post

Woah, woah, woah.. what am I thinking? Heck yes you could. What does your wife think of the four you have already?
She does not venture into the theater, so she has no comment there. All she cares about is that there is no noise coming into the kids room when they are in bed at night. And I am golden in that department, so nothing is stopping me adding more if it is possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post

Am I missing something here? Where are the 4 LMS-U's planned to be implemented?
You still have those, right Dave?
I certainly do have them. Long story short, I was originally going to put the IB in the back of the room, b/c it would have been a true IB setup with the space behind the wall @ 1,700cf but I read on the cult that you should not put an IB sub behind the LP. I had that position measured and I get a great FR in the listening position with a sub were it was planed to be. So if I can do another IB in that postion, I would sell the LMS and get another 3 RE XXX 18's and do the IB as planned before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by keager View Post

I believe he is using those as filler subs to smooth FR. Lol. Correct me if Im wrong Dave
That was the plan, but after hearing how great an IB sounds it would be a shame to add boxed subs to the equation if another IB sub is possible. Sorry for hi-jacking your thread, maybe we should continue this in my thread?
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post #313 of 341
12/9/12 at 4:05pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

She does not venture into the theater, so she has no comment there. All she cares about is that there is no noise coming into the kids room when they are in bed at night. And I am golden in that department, so nothing is stopping me adding more if it is possible.
I certainly do have them. Long story short, I was originally going to put the IB in the back of the room, b/c it would have been a true IB setup with the space behind the wall @ 1,700cf but I read on the cult that you should not put an IB sub behind the LP. I had that position measured and I get a great FR in the listening position with a sub were it was planed to be. So if I can do another IB in that postion, I would sell the LMS and get another 3 RE XXX 18's and do the IB as planned before.
That was the plan, but after hearing how great an IB sounds it would be a shame to add boxed subs to the equation if another IB sub is possible. Sorry for hi-jacking your thread, maybe we should continue this in my thread?

No worries man, its fun to see the same drivers being used IB but in different applications. Will be cool to compare measurements!
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post #314 of 341
12/9/12 at 4:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by keager View Post

No worries man, its fun to see the same drivers being used IB but in different applications. Will be cool to compare measurements!
Absolutely!
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post #315 of 341
12/9/12 at 5:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

Long story short, I was originally going to put the IB in the back of the room, b/c it would have been a true IB setup with the space behind the wall @ 1,700cf but I read on the cult that you should not put an IB sub behind the LP. I had that position measured and I get a great FR in the listening position with a sub were it was planed to be. So if I can do another IB in that postion, I would sell the LMS and get another 3 RE XXX 18's and do the IB as planned before.
That was the plan, but after hearing how great an IB sounds it would be a shame to add boxed subs to the equation if another IB sub is possible. Sorry for hi-jacking your thread, maybe we should continue this in my thread?
Quote:
Originally Posted by FOH 
If it's the only subwoofer source, yes. No different than box subs, big gains can be had from a sub rearward of the LP, in a multisub system.

A big +1. As FOH said, if the rear-mounted spot was to be your primary subwoofer, then issues with localization might arise. Since you have already measured the spot and it had a good FR from the listening position, I bet it would supplement your front-mounted monsters very well and allow you to continue the theme of hidden speakers/subwoofers without having the LMS in boxes visible in the room. My room will have 2 IB locations rear of the listening positions. Influenced by the Harman White Paper, the 4 (or even 2) wall mid-point locations seem to be the best options, but as it is a bonus room above the garage with side attic space only, a 4-corner install is much more easily accomodated and should give up very little in performance (each corner will get a manifold with 2 Stereo Integrity 18's).
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post #316 of 341
12/9/12 at 5:55pm
This quote from the cult of infinitely baffled was what got me worried in the first place.

"Generally speaking we do not recommend placing the IB behind or immediately beside the listening position (too many potential phase related issues with the mains/smearing the stereo image)."

I don't know enough to understand why this would happen. I guess this is not an issue with 2 different locations and one being up front?
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post #317 of 341
12/13/12 at 2:16pm
Thread Starter 
Got the hole cut, and joists framed up.
C360_2012-12-13-13-15-12.jpg
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post #318 of 341
12/13/12 at 2:35pm
Not long now!
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post #319 of 341
12/13/12 at 2:44pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

Not long now!

Yeah, it should be playin by the end of tomorrow
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post #320 of 341
12/14/12 at 5:25pm
Thread Starter 
Second manifold is functional. Still need to seal up some gaps between manifold and floor,so I'm not sure how it is going to sound. The little bit I did listen to it, there is so much ULF, but not so much low to mid bass. I desperately need to eq seperately, and find out how to adjust the time delay(actually how to determine how it should be set). Sealing up the gaps will help too I'm sure. Also have a nasty humm from the subs. Ugh. I'm going to try hooking a wire between the case of the mini dsp and the amp case.
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post #321 of 341
12/15/12 at 2:02am
What do you mean you have a hum? Ground loop problem?

Are you running both manifolds? I found once I sealed everything up I really got a boost in mid base.
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post #322 of 341
12/15/12 at 6:09am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave View Post

What do you mean you have a hum? Ground loop problem?
Are you running both manifolds? I found once I sealed everything up I really got a boost in mid base.

Yes, ground loop. I'm going to ground the case of the mini dsp and see if that helps. It was there before, and I just dealt with it, but now, with two manifolds, it's pretty bad. I smothered the gaps with PL premium last night. I will take another listen today too see the difference. I will proabably have to wait until Monday to do some EQ'ing when the kids aren't around making noise and stuff.
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post #323 of 341
12/15/12 at 7:27am
Thread Starter 
I tried to use a 3 prong to 2 prong adapter to plug in the outlet strip the Mini Dsp uses and the hum is still there? Is that doing the same thing as grounding the case to the outlet? Or, should I still try that?
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post #324 of 341
12/15/12 at 11:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by keager View Post

I tried to use a 3 prong to 2 prong adapter to plug in the outlet strip the Mini Dsp uses and the hum is still there? Is that doing the same thing as grounding the case to the outlet? Or, should I still try that?

I had a nasty hum caused by the amp itself. While it may not be advisable, using the 3 to 2 prong adapter rectified the issue. Guess that isn't an option for you though given you are rocking the 220V Clone... Also found humm coming from by Cable box...
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post #325 of 341
12/15/12 at 11:25am
Jensen, others, make superb products to help in this regard. These are industry standard, and the best there is in my opinion. Everyone should have some if needed. There's others, but Jensen is the leader. Bill Whitlock and Deane Jensen are genius'. This whitepaper should be required reading for any A/V enthusiast.

I've lifted safety grounds, yes it's leathally dangerous. It can solve issues, but create others.
That said, you may take a wire and assure your AVR/PrePro is grounded from the ground terminal, to center screw on outlet (if the center screw is grounded, ping me if you need to know how to know if it's grounded).

Good luck
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post #326 of 341
12/15/12 at 11:39am
Thread Starter 
The minidsp external power supply has a two prong plug that plugs into a outlet strip with other components. So a wire from the case to screw of the outlet?
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post #327 of 341
12/15/12 at 3:22pm
No, sorry
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post #328 of 341
12/15/12 at 3:29pm
What are you using to connect the amp to the receiver?
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post #329 of 341
12/15/12 at 3:59pm
Thread Starter 
Out of the denon receiver is an rca to the mini dsp. From there to the amp is two xlr cables. When I remove the rca between the receiver and mini dsp, hum is gone.
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post #330 of 341
12/15/12 at 4:38pm
What if you take the MiniDSP out of the loop and plug the receiver directly into the amp?
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