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Are You Looking For A Less Expensive Norco 4220 / 4224 Alternative? - Page 35

post #1021 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by captain_video View Post

If you start replacing motherboards and controllers you might as well just buy a brand new Norco 4224 and build a system from scratch. The best part of this deal was that you got a fully functional server that can support 24 drives. Aside from the recommended modifications to the chassis, all you needed to do was populate it with hard drives and install your OS to be up and running. Replacing major componenrts defeats the entire purpose and nullifies any savings.

if you jumped in in the beginning, you can not beat the price with norco 4U server case, even replacing the guts of 4U supermicro server.
1) the SM is sturdy than norco
2) solid SM server case than norco smile.gif

if you buy SM server with missing trays and need to buy trays... I totally agree with you.
post #1022 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by bima View Post

if you jumped in in the beginning, you can not beat the price with norco 4U server case, even replacing the guts of 4U supermicro server.
1) the SM is sturdy than norco
2) solid SM server case than norco smile.gif
if you buy SM server with missing trays and need to buy trays... I totally agree with you.
The SM is definitely a better case. The point being that you can buy a Norco 4224 for $299 with trays and nothing else. If you start gutting the SM and swapping out the motherboard and controller cards with new hardware plus the cost of acquiring drive trays then it's cheaper to go with the Norco. OTOH, the used SM case is still cheaper than buying new, even if you have to buy the trays separately. The original SM server deal was a great buy and I'm hoping it comes back. I've had my name on the waiting list for a while.
post #1023 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by captain_video View Post

The SM is definitely a better case. The point being that you can buy a Norco 4224 for $299 with trays and nothing else. If you start gutting the SM and swapping out the motherboard and controller cards with new hardware plus the cost of acquiring drive trays then it's cheaper to go with the Norco. OTOH, the used SM case is still cheaper than buying new, even if you have to buy the trays separately. The original SM server deal was a great buy and I'm hoping it comes back. I've had my name on the waiting list for a while.


bwa? Where?!?!?!?
post #1024 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by captain_video View Post

The SM is definitely a better case. The point being that you can buy a Norco 4224 for $299 with trays and nothing else. If you start gutting the SM and swapping out the motherboard and controller cards with new hardware plus the cost of acquiring drive trays then it's cheaper to go with the Norco. OTOH, the used SM case is still cheaper than buying new, even if you have to buy the trays separately. The original SM server deal was a great buy and I'm hoping it comes back. I've had my name on the waiting list for a while.

never see 4224 for $299... as today. do you have a link for that?

total cost for me was $300( -$30, since bought AIC 4U server from them)+$80 Shipping= $350-ish. the lowest norco4224 was 399-ish(inculding Shipping) after 10%-15% off from newegg.
event without -$30... I would say the deal is good for complete 4U SM!!.
the motherboard+SATA cards+CPU+memory are jus a small bonus to play, and decent from a file server to start for.
post #1025 of 2256
Sorry, you're right. The 4224 goes for $399, not $299. Must have been thinking of something else when I posted that.rolleyes.gif
post #1026 of 2256
haha
post #1027 of 2256
Well, I'm having a bit of trouble. Maybe someone can help me out. Perhaps it's something simple I'm missing. I haven't messed with a PC in a while. Been at least 15 years since I was messing with building a PC myself (was into water cooled rigs at the time, some peltier stuff).

I hooked up a Corsair AX850 PSU and do not have the four pin J32 power port on the motherboard connected. I thought that this was redundant and maybe useful for a second processor which I do not have connected yet. Also, the new PSU doesn't have a connector for the PWRI2C port that the original PSU did. I tried to power on with a new boot drive connected to the motherboard SATA0 and no drives connected to the backplane. I could not get any display on a monitor plugged in to the VGA port.

I tried to troubleshoot the battery (which I replaced) and by connecting the chassis intrusion detector up to the motherboard (it was not connected), but these measures still do not let me boot, not even a bios display.

Any advice?

I have a four pin molex to four pin J32 connector on order, but thought that I should at least be able to post without this.
post #1028 of 2256
Also, I get one bios beep, indicating normal operation?

The USB keyboard I have plugged in does not have power, though, so perhaps that four pin power connector has a purpose after all. Anyone able to boot this without power connected to J32? If so, perhaps I have a bad board. That would suck.
post #1029 of 2256
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaG View Post

Also, I get one bios beep, indicating normal operation?
The USB keyboard I have plugged in does not have power, though, so perhaps that four pin power connector has a purpose after all. Anyone able to boot this without power connected to J32? If so, perhaps I have a bad board. That would suck.

The same thing happened to me... Try reseating the SATA cards... they sometimes get dislodged in shipping...
post #1030 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 View Post

The same thing happened to me... Try reseating the SATA cards... they sometimes get dislodged in shipping...

Grrr .... you were right, kinda. I did go through as my next step pushing on the bios chip, pushing down on the SATA controllers, and removing and reseating the RAM. Now it is working!

Got to get Windoze installed now, but it's giving me a hard time with 64 bit drivers even if I try to use the 32 bit Vista drivers from the SM website ...
post #1031 of 2256
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaG View Post

Grrr .... you were right, kinda. I did go through as my next step pushing on the bios chip, pushing down on the SATA controllers, and removing and reseating the RAM. Now it is working!
Got to get Windoze installed now, but it's giving me a hard time with 64 bit drivers even if I try to use the 32 bit Vista drivers from the SM website ...

Which 84bit drivers... These should be the only ones you need.
post #1032 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 View Post

Which 84bit drivers... These should be the only ones you need.

I will use those drivers for the RAID disks, but the main boot drive is connected to the motherboard SATA0 port.

I cannot even get past the windows setup. Windows prompts for a storage device driver (did not automatically recognize the SATA SSD hooked up to the motherboard). So when I try to point it out to the windows installer (downloaded the chipset driver from SM website), it gives me a notice that unsigned 64-bit drivers are not supported. That is even if I turn off 64-bit driver signing enforcement before the installer boots via the F8 key. It even rejects the 32-bit chipset dirvers from the SM website. I bought Windows 8 Pro and may try to install that instead when the disc gets here.
Edited by AlphaG - 11/5/12 at 7:29am
post #1033 of 2256
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaG View Post

I will use those drivers for the RAID disks, but the main boot drive is connected to the motherboard SATA0 port.
I cannot even get past the windows setup. Windows prompts for a storage device driver (did not automatically recognize the SATA SSD hooked up to the motherboard). So when I try to point it out to the windows installer (downloaded the chipset driver from SM website), it gives me a notice that unsigned 64-bit drivers are not supported. That is even if I turn off 64-bit driver signing enforcement before the installer boots via the F8 key. It even rejects the 32-bit chipset dirvers from the SM website. I bought Windows 8 Pro and may try to install that instead when the disc gets here.

Doesn't make any sense... I wasn't asked for any drivers during the install of windows 7 64 or 32 or WHS.
post #1034 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 View Post

Doesn't make any sense... I wasn't asked for any drivers during the install of windows 7 64 or 32 or WHS.
It makes perfect sense. Windows doesn't ask for any drivers during the initial installation. It will scan your hardware and install only the device drivers it can find either on the installation disc or on the internet. If it can't locate drivers it skips it and flags the device in Device Manager. You'll only be prompted for drivers if you install hardware on an existing Windows PC. You'll get the New Hardware Found message and Windows will attempt to locate drivers automatically. If it can't find the drivers you'll have to install them manually.

For a fresh install of Windows, open the Device Manager following the Windows installation and look for any devices with a yellow exclamation point. Open them up and you should see a tab for the drivers in the displayed window. Select the drivers tab and pick the option to reinstall or update the drivers. You can then browse to where the drivers are located and Windows will install them. You can open the progress window as the drivers are being installed and get the status of the device. If the installation is successful the yellow exclamation point in Device Manager will go away and the correct name for the device will now appear under the appropriate device heading.
post #1035 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 View Post

Doesn't make any sense... I wasn't asked for any drivers during the install of windows 7 64 or 32 or WHS.

Possibly I messed something up moving the windows installation over to USB flash drive from original disc. I will figure it out.

On another note, if anyone is interested in adding DVD drive to this, ebay does have the addon kit with SATA drive, mounting bracket and sata adapter backboard available here (I got one for ~$15 shipped):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Supermicro-MCP-220-84605-0N-Slim-SATA-DVD-Kit-w-Bracket-For-SC846-/170936025855?pt=US_Computer_Case_Accessories_Tool_Kits&hash=item27cc94c2ff



Or you can search for part number MCP-220-84605-ON for the SATA version of the drive if this seller sells out ...

I have not yet received mine, but will update as to whether it works or not.
post #1036 of 2256
Well, for anyone interested in adding a DVD drive, that $15 buys you the mounting bracket, an adapter plate to use floppy drive power adapter and SATA cable, a SATA cable, and some screws. No drive included. I also got a dvd burner from Newegg, and with some slight modding, it fits just fine without the stock PSU to which this DVD holder is clearly designed to mount to.
post #1037 of 2256
That appears to be a standard laptop drive. I bought a bunch of used ones on ebay a while back for about $10 apiece. You can buy external cases with USB cables for about $7 if you can't mount it internally.
post #1038 of 2256
<---in for bookmarking.
post #1039 of 2256
Has anyone gotten S3 sleep to work with WHS 2011 with the Supermicro motherboard included with the 2U server case? I seem to only get S1 working. Even tried without the SATA card installed. "Powercfg -a" reports the system firmware does not support S3 state. frown.gif
post #1040 of 2256
Why try and get sleep working on a server? The whole point is to have it available at all times instantly . That is how I see it anyways. It is a older server motherboard, so they might no have put the extra time in to making sleep work well.
post #1041 of 2256
There's something to be said for using power reduction and sleep modes when using a machine for WHS. But you're asking for trouble trying to constantly power cycle that many drives. It may just fall into the "old wive's tales" category these days, but in the past hardware did not generally benefit from being turned off and on a lot. It was quite often a lot better for the lifespan and reliability of the drives to keep them running. Any saving that might have been gained in reducing power consumption goes right out the window when you start calculating the costs incurred by drive failures. Whether or not remains true with modern drives is an interesting question, I've not heard much supporting the idea of it for *server* applications.

Thus support of sleep modes (which themselves have been a series of technological moving targets) isn't usually a priority for server-oriented equipment and manufacturers.

There comes a point where quests for power management like this also run afoul of user expectations. When you expect the server to be running and it isn't then things get screwy. Like the wife complains that it didn't catch a show she had set it up to record. Perhaps because it didn't come out of sleep mode with all drives properly spun up. The WAF is an area where 'penny wise but pound foolish' comes to mind...

I suppose if you only used drives all known for their sleep and power management reliability (like using 2.5" laptop drives) you might have a better chance of lower power consumption. And then look at CPU throttling and states as the next step. Avoiding cold power states until you're certain the higher modes are reliably adjusting themselves. As in, the parent OS is reliably going in and out of these less-consumptive modes without interruption of necessary services.

Me, I've simply accepted some wattage is going to be consumed wastefully. The money spent there is worth more than my time to fight with all the half-baked power management nonsense. I'd use it if it worked but don't want the headaches of untangling things when it doesn't.
post #1042 of 2256
I keep my unRAID server running 24/7. I have the ability to spin down individual drives when not in use, but I found that the lag time due to spinup isn't worth it. I prefer to have instant access to everything on my server at all times. The whole idea of having a server is the ability to access your data instantly at any given time. You don't build a server to scrimp on energy costs. That's what green drives are for.
post #1043 of 2256
I was curiously reading the entire thread starting from page 1, and each page kept giving me more and more insecurities with the kind of modification being done to make this case a norco 4224 look alike case. I do agree the SM case might be a tad better in terms of quality/build compared to a Norco, but once the chassis is mounted to a rack/cabinet it does not matter what kind of metal or better build grade is used for the built, i am sure the Norco case will also last a life time just as the SM chassis.
With the SM, you need addtl brackets to mount it to the rack.. with norco everything is available with the package. With all the component swap i dont really think its worth all the hassle.
post #1044 of 2256
It's classic battle if time and effort vs cost. It's different for everyone.
post #1045 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by holyindian View Post

I was curiously reading the entire thread starting from page 1, and each page kept giving me more and more insecurities with the kind of modification being done to make this case a norco 4224 look alike case. I do agree the SM case might be a tad better in terms of quality/build compared to a Norco, but once the chassis is mounted to a rack/cabinet it does not matter what kind of metal or better build grade is used for the built, i am sure the Norco case will also last a life time just as the SM chassis.
With the SM, you need addtl brackets to mount it to the rack.. with norco everything is available with the package. With all the component swap i dont really think its worth all the hassle.

Some people ( me) almost live more for the modding than the actual end result. It's almost a "let down" when a project like the above comes to an end and all is working well cause the real fun is over . Well , for the time being that is wink.gif
post #1046 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

It's classic battle if time and effort vs cost. It's different for everyone.

VERY , very true . Some folks just like tinkering and the self satisfaction
post #1047 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by flocko View Post

VERY , very true . Some folks just like tinkering and the self satisfaction

+1
Not making fun of other people who went with the mod, but guys.. whats the point of making a look alike of another chassis thats already in the market which in turn does the same job that it is intented to do? Neither does it improve the display or color on Theater screen, neither does your sound improve.. all it does is house various components with the same kind of configuration and capacity inside your rack cabinet.
While going through the entire thread i see members making recommendations after recommendations trying various tweaks and modifications page after page and months after purchase.. finally what you got? A Norco look alike which is more or less expensive!

Time is so precious here, but still if given.. I could spend hours on a DIY Sub/Horn/Speaker even a custom home theater room to tweak and make it better.. but no point in ripping apart an industrial server chassis and making it compatible for an AV server chassis when you already have options readily available.
post #1048 of 2256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Litlgi74 
These should be the only ones you need.

Thanks! These saved my ass!
post #1049 of 2256
That Norco is also $400.00 . Would love and I mean LOVE to have one but even though that is reasonable as far as server cases go ... still a lot of "clams" for an empty case .
post #1050 of 2256
Trust me, with all that effort that went in, with the mod, the write up on these threads, research.. finding the right panels, bolts, screws, fans.. wiring, firwares.. hacks.. ripping and cutting of flesh, hours gone in researching, reading, modding.. i dont think the savings must be more than a 100 dollars here or there against the norco.
Even though the SM chassis comes with parts, but arent they mediocre? Most swapped the PSU, motherboards.. fans.. etc. Piling up the chassis with mediocre PCB units and blow drier fans makes no sense.
Edited by holyindian - 11/19/12 at 4:53pm
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