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Onkyo TX-NR818 "official" owner's thread discussion - Page 36

post #1051 of 7035
7/11/12 at 12:14pm
OK updated this list after talking to Denon thread wink.gif.. between 4311 and Onkyo 818..

Denon 4311 (released 2010)
get $1250 (from EE)
3 year warranty
Better build quality better
9 channels powered vs. onkyo 7 power (can do 11.2 wit external amp)
dual subEq for (Audyssey MultEQ XT32)
airplay working
interface worse (setup is pain)
both do XT32


Onkyo 818 (released April 2012)
get $950 (J&R amazon)
2 year warranty
Audyssey MultEQ XT32
worse build quality maybe? (going by history)
No Airplay (may work in future not holding my breath)
7 channels powered (Can do Bi-Amp with front speakers)
interface better

Features look pretty close between the two models.. $300 dollar difference is noticible but not a deal break if thought Denon offered more in the long run the Onkyo.
Edited by chrisfromalbany - 7/11/12 at 12:19pm
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post #1052 of 7035
7/11/12 at 12:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumbasbell View Post

I do use Audyssey and my reference level is at 0db. I stll get clearer sound from Direct TV than Blu-Ray movies. Also a question, does turning down the subwoofer after Audyssey Calibration send low frequency sounds to remaining speakers? I ask because when I do, the bass in all the speakers seem to increase. On another topic, I have heard that surround speakers should have higher decible than front speakers and front speakers should have higher decible than center speaker. So I have center at 5db, Fronts at 7db, and surround/surround back at 8db. Do I have it right?

The crossover settings determine what frequencies get sent to the sub, not the sub volume, although if you do adjust the sub volume do so on the AVR and not using the sub volume knob (otherwise, you'll need to rerun Audyssey again). Generally you want to leave the speaker trim levels set as Audyssey has set them for at least a few weeks to adjust to the way the mixer intended the audio to be heard. After that, feel free to adjust up/down to suit your preference.
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post #1053 of 7035
7/11/12 at 12:35pm
818 has much better video section than the denon 4311. ABT chipset is dated. The whole build quality amp quality stuff is very subjective
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post #1054 of 7035
7/11/12 at 12:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The crossover settings determine what frequencies get sent to the sub, not the sub volume, although if you do adjust the sub volume do so on the AVR and not using the sub volume knob (otherwise, you'll need to rerun Audyssey again). Generally you want to leave the speaker trim levels set as Audyssey has set them for at least a few weeks to adjust to the way the mixer intended the audio to be heard. After that, feel free to adjust up/down to suit your preference.
Only trouble is I live in the apartment and can't have too much of sub or I will get complaints.
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post #1055 of 7035
7/11/12 at 2:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rworne View Post

You seem to have deleted or edited an earlier response. It was a valid question though.
My app came out about 4 months before Onkyo released theirs, and a few weeks after another 3rd party developer released their own Onkyo remote solution.
My costs are:
Purchasing a new receiver every model year - I found out getting the cheapest possible one isn't all that effective. I need to buy at least a mid-range model like the 818. I have 3 of them stacked up on my desk and one in a HT setup.
Purchasing any new accessories/devices (this includes Apple items as well)
Developer's cert. & payment for 3rd party code to simplify some tasks
100's of hours of work, time from family & other activities (like sleep). I do work on it constantly and give quite an effort doing support via email (a weak point with lots of other app developers).
R&D other platforms: There's a Denon version pretty much finished last year (and scrapped due to poor protocol support). I also have an Oppo BD player and some Android devices for experimentation (but no time).
You should see the taxes I pay on this too. :-(
I also run with the constant threat that either Onkyo or Apple will do something to kill the app, or another developer more clever than me will come out with something I cannot compete against. I am already competing with Onkyo's free app which came out after mine was released and mine is still thriving.
Anyhow, there is a thread for iOS apps here where this may be more appropriate.

I edited a later quoted reply for spelling, my original reply said "I've been using the third party oRemote app, far better than the official Onkyo offering (unfortunately it's also a paid app)"

My key point was "far better than the official Onkyo offering" the "unfortunately it's also a paid app" was referring to the fact that the free Onkyo one is sh*t and the OP was going to have to get their wallet out :-) That wasn't a complaint that you were charging a small amount for your app.

No problems with the app (actually I'll go one up, it's maintained brilliantly and the app does everything I could hope for, and without issue) nor do I have the *slightest* problem with you charging for it, it's great value in my mind, sorry if my original response wasn't clear on that factor. (I'm also a software developer so no need to spell out the cost justifications ;-) £2.99 is cheap / great value in my mind!!)

Hope that clears up any confusion.

Jamie

(sorry getting off topic for this thread, but just wanted to clarify)
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post #1056 of 7035
7/11/12 at 2:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumbasbell View Post

Also a question, does turning down the subwoofer after Audyssey Calibration send low frequency sounds to remaining speakers?

No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dumbasbell View Post

On another topic, I have heard that surround speakers should have higher decible than front speakers and front speakers should have higher decible than center speaker.

That's nonsense. Where did you read that?
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post #1057 of 7035
7/11/12 at 5:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barry Hartmann View Post

Thanks for the reply! That was the path I was on until my buddy diverted me with his recent purchase. My AVR update was something I planned on doing 18 to 24 months down the line but my sub was something that was in line to be replaced first. It was my sub from my old house before I had a dedicated HT but was good enough for me to get by with to keep the build costs down.

What SVS sub/s were you thinking about getting. If you are building your HT, maybe you would be willing to build your subs? I had (2) SVS PC39-16 Plus subs with the 12.3 drivers. They were very good subs but if you do some research and build your own subs, you can stomp the SVS subs into the ground.
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post #1058 of 7035
7/11/12 at 6:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamieu View Post

or an Ethernet cable or WiFi bridge, I'd assume you probably want to connect your AVR to your network anyway (firmware updates, DLNA, Internet radio, Spotify etc.)
I believe you can also use a cheaper TP-Link TL-WN722N USB adaptor with most Onkyo's in place of the Onkyo UWF-1 (as it uses the same Atheros chipset) but your milage may vary, if you go that route probably safest to get it from somewhere you can send it back in case it doesn't work on the 818.

I just wanted to confirm that that USB adapter does indeed work with the 818. I bought mine last week, and it was painless, it found my network np and was up and running within a matter of minutes. I got mine at amazon...


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002WBX9C6/ref=oh_details_o04_s00_i00
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post #1059 of 7035
7/11/12 at 7:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by yadfgp View Post

I just wanted to confirm that that USB adapter does indeed work with the 818. I bought mine last week, and it was painless, it found my network np and was up and running within a matter of minutes. I got mine at amazon...
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002WBX9C6/ref=oh_details_o04_s00_i00

I bought this too (£8.99) and it works perfectly with my 818.

This http://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-TL-WN722NC-150Mbps-Wireless-Adapter/dp/B003158RHE/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1342061309&sr=8-2 with the stand.
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post #1060 of 7035
7/11/12 at 9:58pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 6sj7gt View Post

Hi jmpage, I tried doing this and nothing happens. Is it as simple as you describe, or do you have to hold "return" for some length of time, or...?
I did update the firmware to whatever the latest version is.
I have not determined if it is dropping frames or not, but it is connected to a Panasonic PT-AE7000U projector which performs its own frame interpolation and could be masking the problem. I'd have to turn that feature off and experiment for a while.

Sorry, I'm a bit of an idiot lately (turned 40 and poof, there go the brain cells). It's the CBL/SAT button. Hold that down and press return (you should be able to press and let go) and you should be able to set video skip.

I might have spoken too soon when I said the problem was gone. My wife fired up the XBMC and started the movie "Sahara". This one has tons of slow pans for probably the first sold 5 minutes. I saw a bunch of what looked like frame drops, basically the picture noticeably jerked for a second during a pan. I saw this happen at least three times.

I have not tested it with the original disc in the blu-ray player but I will if I have time by this weekend.
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post #1061 of 7035
7/11/12 at 10:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

Sorry, I'm a bit of an idiot lately (turned 40 and poof, there go the brain cells). It's the CBL/SAT button. Hold that down and press return (you should be able to press and let go) and you should be able to set video skip.
I might have spoken too soon when I said the problem was gone. My wife fired up the XBMC and started the movie "Sahara". This one has tons of slow pans for probably the first sold 5 minutes. I saw a bunch of what looked like frame drops, basically the picture noticeably jerked for a second during a pan. I saw this happen at least three times.
I have not tested it with the original disc in the blu-ray player but I will if I have time by this weekend.
It's not CBL/SAT button it's the VCR/DVR button. Then while holding that simultaneously hold the Return button then while still holding the VCR button press the Return button again until it says Video Processor:skip on the receivers display. Also shut the A/Vsync off under HDMI control, set it manually. Also set everything to through and shut the OSD off. Onkyo sucks. Sorry. I have the 709 in the living room. Good sound. Useless features. Every setting needs to be off involving video. I always got frame skips especially with panning scenes with the 707 and the 709 I've posted numerous posts and others have also noticed it. Some do not but the issue is there. This for the most part corrected both. Youll also notice picture thats supposed to be unaltered looks better with it off, so clearly the Onkyo is doing something it should not. If you look at the firmware update explanations it says "improved playback of 24fps content" under some. Why would this need to be improved if that's supposed to be unaltered video. Because the onkyo does something funky with it. And i dont even want to talk about their crappy HDMI boards, which are probably related to the same issue some how. The new Denon 1913 I just got for the bed room seems to have better sound from what I hear than the Onkyo 707 I replaced( which had the infamous No sound issue) and not one problem. Looks like a Denon 3313 will replace that. I'm done with Onkyo. They really deserve to fold. Worst QC ever.
Edited by Semp1 - 7/11/12 at 11:21pm
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post #1062 of 7035
7/11/12 at 11:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rworne View Post

You seem to have deleted or edited an earlier response. It was a valid question though.
My app came out about 4 months before Onkyo released theirs, and a few weeks after another 3rd party developer released their own Onkyo remote solution.
My costs are:
Purchasing a new receiver every model year - I found out getting the cheapest possible one isn't all that effective. I need to buy at least a mid-range model like the 818. I have 3 of them stacked up on my desk and one in a HT setup.
Purchasing any new accessories/devices (this includes Apple items as well)
Developer's cert. & payment for 3rd party code to simplify some tasks
100's of hours of work, time from family & other activities (like sleep). I do work on it constantly and give quite an effort doing support via email (a weak point with lots of other app developers).
R&D other platforms: There's a Denon version pretty much finished last year (and scrapped due to poor protocol support). I also have an Oppo BD player and some Android devices for experimentation (but no time).
You should see the taxes I pay on this too. :-(
I also run with the constant threat that either Onkyo or Apple will do something to kill the app, or another developer more clever than me will come out with something I cannot compete against. I am already competing with Onkyo's free app which came out after mine was released and mine is still thriving.
Anyhow, there is a thread for iOS apps here where this may be more appropriate.

The official Onlyo app is crap. Your Oremote app is great. Best app ever for an electronic device even controls the PS3 slim (BTW I think that it might be the only iOS app that does this) and TV through HDMI control. Great app. Its the only thing good about an Onkyo and they didnt even make it. Also love the way it's iPad compatible. When it comes to Denon you definitely shouldn't waste your time with one. Their app is very good. Almost as good as your Oremote for the onkyo.
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post #1063 of 7035
7/12/12 at 9:27am
I can attest to the TL-WN722N-my router is in the basement and I have a 92% signal. Good enough for me.

On an aside, my 818 just notified me that there is a firmware update. Has anyone else been notified? When I plugged it in for the first time, I updated the firmware so I am pretty sure it is not reminding me of that update.

Loving my first Onkyo so far.....While I think Harmon Kardon is a good product, these make my old HK sound like an .mp3 player.
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post #1064 of 7035
7/12/12 at 9:28am
I don't really need the on board amps seeing how I have a XPA-5, but for the price is there really any pro out there (mainly Onkyo wise) around the same price as this one? Aside from not having subeq the 818 seems like a good bang for your buck. I need to ditch the UMC fast and get back into an Onkyo.

What I'm mainly looking for, which this has it:

XT32
3D capable in case I do want to purchase a 3D PJ in a year or two
1080p + upscaling
NEO X
Dual HDMI out's

Thanks,
Judd
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post #1065 of 7035
7/12/12 at 9:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by boidsonly View Post

I can attest to the TL-WN722N-my router is in the basement and I have a 92% signal. Good enough for me.
On an aside, my 818 just notified me that there is a firmware update. Has anyone else been notified? When I plugged it in for the first time, I updated the firmware so I am pretty sure it is not reminding me of that update.
Loving my first Onkyo so far.....While I think Harmon Kardon is a good product, these make my old HK sound like an .mp3 player.

What the version number of the F/W update?
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post #1066 of 7035
7/12/12 at 9:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Limp Fox View Post

I don't really need the on board amps seeing how I have a XPA-5, but for the price is there really any pro out there (mainly Onkyo wise) around the same price as this one?

No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Limp Fox View Post

Aside from not having subeq the 818 seems like a good bang for your buck. I need to ditch the UMC fast and get back into an Onkyo.
What I'm mainly looking for, which this has it:
XT32
3D capable in case I do want to purchase a 3D PJ in a year or two
1080p + upscaling
NEO X
Dual HDMI out's
Thanks,
Judd

Looks like the 818 has everything you're looking for and more.

By the way, the 818 has a sub equalizer. Actually a pretty good one.
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post #1067 of 7035
7/12/12 at 10:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post

No.
Looks like the 818 has everything you're looking for and more.
By the way, the 818 has a sub equalizer. Actually a pretty good one.

Thanks for the response. I must have missed it, but I didn't think the 818 had that or the ability to set distances correctly. Maybe I am thinking of something else.
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post #1068 of 7035
7/12/12 at 10:09am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Limp Fox View Post

Thanks for the response. I must have missed it, but I didn't think the 818 had that or the ability to set distances correctly. Maybe I am thinking of something else.

What the 818 does not have that other XT32 capable AVRs have is multi SUB-EQ.

The 818 can EQ for one sub on the subwoofer split output. Other XT32 AVRs can EQ 2 subs separately.
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post #1069 of 7035
7/12/12 at 10:29am
How do you go about fixing that? Run one sub, then try to tune the other to 75db's with a sbl meter? Hmm maybe not since that wouldn't allow the other sub to be tweaked without using SMS -1 or another way.
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post #1070 of 7035
7/12/12 at 10:31am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Limp Fox View Post

How do you go about fixing that? Run one sub, then try to tune the other to 75db's with a sbl meter? Hmm maybe not since that wouldn't allow the other sub to be tweaked without using SMS -1 or another way.

Well, there's only one AVR out there with XT32 that does not support EQ of 2 subs and that AVR is the 818. Since the AVR 818 just came out I don't think there's a lot of great advice on how to handle this.... which is probably compounded by the fact that the large majority of owners of the 818 probably only have a single sub.

I believe that in the Audyssey thread, one of the Audyssey guys indicated that the difference with sub-EQ vs. no sub-EQ would probably not be that big of a deal (audible) in most situations.

However, since AVS is made up of a very obsessive bunch this keeps coming up. I think that the true test is for someone with two subs to do a test comparison between the 818 and another AVR like the 4311 that does do sub-EQ with XT32.

Test comparison would mean measurements, not "A or B sounds better".
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post #1071 of 7035
7/12/12 at 10:34am
eh that means I will be stuck with this UMC crap for awhile haha
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post #1072 of 7035
7/12/12 at 10:37am
...or just get a SMS-1 which then puts me more in the $1500 range
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post #1073 of 7035
7/12/12 at 11:05am
@ jamieu:

The current version on my 818: 1070-4100-0100-0000
This is the update I applied when I powered up the 818 for the first time on.
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post #1074 of 7035
7/12/12 at 11:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Limp Fox View Post

eh that means I will be stuck with this UMC crap for awhile haha

I'm interested to see how the XMC-1 is. Of course I wouldn't buy one for a few months after it's been released to see if there are any major problems...That TACT room correction sounds like it should be great.
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post #1075 of 7035
7/12/12 at 12:12pm
@boidsonly

Yes, there's a newer one that Onkyo released on the 15th of June 1080-6100-0100-0000 (my units already been updated to this one)
http://www.intl.onkyo.com/support/firmware/tx-nr818.html
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post #1076 of 7035
7/12/12 at 12:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

What the 818 does not have that other XT32 capable AVRs have is multi SUB-EQ.
The 818 can EQ for one sub on the subwoofer split output. Other XT32 AVRs can EQ 2 subs separately.

No, "Other XT32 AVRs" don't "EQ 2 subs separately". MultEQ always equalizes all connected subs as one.
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post #1077 of 7035
7/12/12 at 12:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by FantaXP7 View Post

I'm interested to see how the XMC-1 is. Of course I wouldn't buy one for a few months after it's been released to see if there are any major problems...That TACT room correction sounds like it should be great.

MultEQ XT 32 "sounds like it should be great" too and the best thing is that it's available right now.

The XMC is nothing more than a list of specs. It was announced years (!) ago and Emotiva misses one deadline after the other yet they keep making even more boastful announcements. Very untrustworthy company.
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post #1078 of 7035
7/12/12 at 2:05pm
Jmpage2

I hooked my HTPC (AMD 6450 and XBMC) directly to my TV. The judder I was getting when going through the onkyo did not disappear. It's exactly the same when hooked directly to the TV. Movies are smooth as silk. TV shows that juddered through the Onkyo judder directly through the TV. Still doing other tests. In my case it must be source material.
Edited by AndrewS99 - 7/12/12 at 2:55pm
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post #1079 of 7035
7/12/12 at 2:16pm
Does anyone know how to get the front panel to auto-dim? I remember this working at one point and now it stopped. is there a setting somewhere?
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post #1080 of 7035
7/12/12 at 4:15pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewS99 View Post

Jmpage2
I hooked my HTPC (AMD 6450 and XBMC) directly to my TV. The judder I was getting when going through the onkyo did not disappear. It's exactly the same when hooked directly to the TV. Movies are smooth as silk. TV shows that juddered through the Onkyo judder directly through the TV. Still doing other tests. In my case it must be source material.

If you have the original source disks the next step is to test with those on a DVD/BD player. This would prove if the problem was with encoding, XBMC playback, etc.
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