Onkyo TX-NR818 "official" owner's thread discussion - Page 139

We need the 1010, 3010, and the 5010 tested. Has anyone heard back from Onkyo? Hometheater mag reviewed the 3010, I urge EVERYONE to contact them and ask if thay can start testing all future Onkyo/ Integra products for this VP bug.

I doubt they'll be that interested as their focus seems to be on the amps. The video tests are quite rudimentary. The 'Secrets of HT' pays a lot more attention on the video but if it's not on the test disc that means extra work.

Earlier I asked in the Spears and Muril thread about test patterns that can show 24bug in their forthcoming disc. I made the point that the 24p bug is more important than the various rare odd cadence torture tests in DVDs people seem to be addicted to doing.

Joe Rod posted in the 24p thread on the Onkyo forums this morning. Assuming his testing confirms what we've all seen (not sure how it won't), it will be interesting to see what Onkyo does next. The last post from a "forum moderator" there demands that we all send video proving the issue, instead of Onkyo just testing for it themselves, which of course they won't do. Bad customer support is bad.

Hi everyone. Got myself the 818 for a couple of days. I've tested all my BD with the 24p settings etc etc.. images and action scenes are just perfect. Is the 24p issue you guys are talking about, only related to the NTSC format?
Because of the fact I'm from the Netherlands and we are using PAL..
Thanks in advance..

btw: h ttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/24p

jmpage,

As you're also from Europe within the PAL region, is the 24p issue only related to the NTSC regions. Everything works fine over here (in the Netherlands)
Thanks in advance.

Unfortunately, the Harmony One is IR only.

Thanks for the heads up re: RS-232 and remotecentral.com. I downloaded the ISCP (Integra Serial Control Protocol) spreadsheet and took a quick look. Wow! This stuff is amazing! Bi-directional communication, direct access to Audyssey and listening modes, etc. It does everything. Even works over IP. If only it works over IR... I almost forgot about the 1dB volume control.

I think they are just going to cover their ears and start saying "LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA" over and over again.

Really dispapointing, and I dont even have an 818 (I do have an 809 and am seriously considering sending it back because of potentially needing their customer "service" at some point in the future)

Funny thing is Im cleaning up my HT now that I have a flat panel, and I have an Onkyo 6 disc CD changer from 2001 that still works fine. They really were quality back then.

Is there a recent firmware update?

- Rich

24p is the same in every region. It is a universal standard. Your local blu-rays are often the identical encodes as their US counterparts.
Like the vast majority, you simply don't see the problem.

So if the TV only displays content at 60hz will the 24hz bug be a noticeable problem?

Im debating switching out my old Pioneer VSX-1018 for the 818 but really am having a hard time deciding if its worth it or if I should wait till the newer models are out and reviewed.

Although its part of the spec its not commonly used. Especially not for feature films.

No problem. Yeah, discrete control is where it's at which is the primary reason I upgraded from my legacy receiver, an Onkyo TX-SR800. The first thing that I did after getting a current copy of the ISCP was to create a full set of RS-232 commands for my remote. The initial RS-232 codeset pages I worked up for my remote can be seen here. Each of the buttons on those pages stores the particular RS-232 command. The rest of my configuration file in turn links to the buttons on those pages as needed. Having access to the RS-232 codeset within the GUI is not required of course, but I find it useful for testing purposes or on occasion when I want to execute a command outside the activity based structure of the GUI. Bi-directional communication takes a little more work as it involves the use of ProntoScript (based off JavaScript) which for basic things is quite simple to implement even if you have little to no programming experience.

ATTN MiCasaVerde Vera users...

I think I have a solution/workaround to the issue. The fix is one or both of the following...


1) Block the uPnP ports only to/from the Vera

I'm using Tomato firmware but you should be able to this on many routers/firewalls.

Tomato allows you to use Access Restrictions (this might be under Firewall or Port Blocking or ??? in your firmware). I specified both of the Vera's MAC addresses (wired and wifi) to block uPnP ports 1900 & 5000.
... this should not affect your usage unless you use Vera to pull media lists and such from other uPnP enabled devices on your LAN.


2) Turn off uPnP discovery inside the Vera

under "Setup" \ "Net & Wi-fi" tabs ... uncheck "Auto detect devices on my home network"
... this turns off uPnP discovery according to the forums.

I would say more. This should be part of automatic testing! What QA they have if they did not / cannot automate it yet...

When I go to update firmware menu, I can see only: "Version 1100-7101-0100-0000" on the top and "current firmware version" on the bottom. No options and such. I tried to reset/clear the unit, but nothing changes. Is it "bricked"?

Is it not working? What do you expect? You have the latest version of the firmware...

Great post on the Onkyo forum btw. I hope it gets them to the step where they can congratulate themselves as you put it so they can finally fix this. Thanks.

Would be nice if it could say "you have the latest version" or "no update at the time", something...

This is really minor issue. This would be much nicer if they fixed 24p issue, audyssey issues, gapless problems and made the OSD less laggy. I.e. - the every day functionality. They you would be newer ever look at this menu...

A lot of British/European and Hong Kong local studio Blu-rays are 24.00fps, I import many of them and use the Edge to identify which ones are just for interest.

We had a thread in the HDTV software media forum here where the question of whether everything should move to 24.00 and the short answer is no, because existing production workflow (presumably for the big studios) is all implemented in 23.976fps. Anyone interested should search 24.00 and posts by Mr D (digital film janitor in London) in that forum.

I have 2 subs and and extra set of fronts. I'd like to setup the extra fronts and 2nd sub in another room under Zone 2. I know the fronts can be hooked directly to the front wide terminal. Is there a way to have 1 sub work on zone 1 and the other on zone 2?

Thanks much.

The zone II sub would need to use speaker level inputs.

I believe Apple TV does not support DTS.
Apple TV supports Dolby Digital, but it will not stream DTS and there is no avaible option to enable it.

I've attached 2 .mkv files with moving bars that should make the 24fps bug visible. One file is 23.976fps the other 24fps.

MovingBars.zip 273k .zip file
(Source: http://www.avforums.com/forums/11305610-post1.html)

Rarding the1080/24p issue:

I've tried to educating myself about this issue, and according to wikipedia (which might not always be the best source) 35 mm movie cameras use a standard exposure rate of 24 FPS, though many cameras offer rates of 23.976 FPS for NTSC television and 25 FPS for PAL/SECAM.
It seems to me that 23.976 FPS appers when transfering a 24p movie (which is the standard) to NTSC television (60i, standard in USA and Canada).

In believe that in Europe (and Asia) where we use the PAL system, Blu-ray movies are sold with the original 24p move frame rate, thus avoiding the 23.976 issue.

Taken from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frame_rate:


24p is a progressive format and is now widely adopted by those planning on transferring a video signal to film. Film and video makers use 24p even if their productions are not going to be transferred to film, simply because of the on-screen "look" of the (low) frame rate which matches native film. When transferred to NTSC television, the rate is effectively slowed to 23.976 FPS (24×1000÷1001 to be exact), and when transferred to PAL or SECAM it is sped up to 25 FPS. 35 mm movie cameras use a standard exposure rate of 24 FPS, though many cameras offer rates of 23.976 FPS for NTSC television and 25 FPS for PAL/SECAM. The 24 FPS rate became the de facto standard for sound motion pictures in the mid-1920s.[4] Practically all hand-drawn animation is designed to be played at 24 FPS. Actually hand-drawing 24 unique frames per second ("1's") is costly. Even in big budget films usually hand-draw animation shooting on "2's" (one hand-drawn frame is shown twice, so only 12 unique frames per second)[6][7] and some animation is even drawn on "4's" (one hand-drawn frame is shown four times, so only six unique frames per second).

60i is an interlaced format and is the standard video field rate per second for NTSC television (e.g., in the US), whether from a broadcast signal, DVD, or home camcorder. This interlaced field rate was developed separately by Farnsworth and Zworykin in 1934,[12] and was part of the NTSC television standards mandated by the FCC in 1941. When NTSC color was introduced in 1953, the older rate of 60 fields per second was reduced by a factor of 1000/1001 to avoid interference between the chroma subcarrier and the broadcast sound carrier. (Hence the usual designation "29.97 fps" = 30 frames(60 fields)/1.001)