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Prometheus *PLOT SPOILERS* discussion - Page 16

post #451 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCaboNow View Post

Oviously, it is not a financially good thing, for the movie, that you have to read Nitszsche, view the movie multiple times and watch the deleted and alternate scenes to make real sense of it...
Viewing multiple times and watching the deleted and alternate scenes would generate more revenue. Sounds like a financially good thing, no? wink.gif

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post #452 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCaboNow View Post

Most questions are answered in the deleted/alternate scenes and by multiple viewings. The movie is filled with dialogue that means something but is easily forgotten as you move on to the next scene. If this were a typical thriller movie it would be seen in a better light but since it is a scifi most folks have gotten used to just sitting back and letting the explosions tell the tale. Oviously, it is not a financially good thing, for the movie, that you have to read Nitszsche, view the movie multiple times and watch the deleted and alternate scenes to make real sense of it...

ACtually most of the questions asked of the Engineer can be answered even without viewing the deleted scene...IF one just pays attention to all the scenes that came before and extrapolates: "Why did you make us?" It was a failed experiment. "Why do you hate us?" Your history answers that. "Why do you do this?" Because we can. "Why?" To correct a mistake (and maybe make another one?).
post #453 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by cinema13 View Post

ACtually most of the questions asked of the Engineer can be answered even without viewing the deleted scene...IF one just pays attention to all the scenes that came before and extrapolates: "Why did you make us?" It was a failed experiment. "Why do you hate us?" Your history answers that. "Why do you do this?" Because we can. "Why destroy us?" To correct a mistake (and maybe make another one?).
post #454 of 472
Wow...I have to say, i really enjoyed this movie for what it was...a Sci-Fi movie.

I do have a question, in the beginning when the guy drinks the concoction in the special cup, he then deteriorates rapidly and dies off into the ocean where we morphs into something else....was this supposed to represent the newly genetically species that we now know as Humans? (this was on Earth, right)?
post #455 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by kezug View Post

Wow...I have to say, i really enjoyed this movie for what it was...a Sci-Fi movie.
I do have a question, in the beginning when the guy drinks the concoction in the special cup, he then deteriorates rapidly and dies off into the ocean where we morphs into something else....was this supposed to represent the newly genetically species that we now know as Humans? (this was on Earth, right)?

Not exactly. The earth was depicted as rocky and barren at that time (one presumes roughly 3 1/2 - 4 billion years ago). It represented the beginning of life, writ large. Humans were just the eventual evolutionary bi-product.
post #456 of 472
This was brought up earlier in this or the other Prometheus thread. It doesn't necessarily have to be earth, according to commentary by Ridley Scott. It could've been one of their (Engineers) seeded planets in recent time or ancient time.
post #457 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Not exactly. The earth was depicted as rocky and barren at that time (one presumes roughly 3 1/2 - 4 billion years ago). It represented the beginning of life, writ large. Humans were just the eventual evolutionary bi-product.
Maybe so, but it is interesting that humans and the Engineers are both bi-pedal creatures of advanced intelligence.wink.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcruiser View Post

This was brought up earlier in this or the other Prometheus thread. It doesn't necessarily have to be earth, according to commentary by Ridley Scott. It could've been one of their (Engineers) seeded planets in recent time or ancient time.
I choose to believe it was earth.
It makes the story more interesting IMO.
post #458 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

I choose to believe it was earth.
What about the time line, (relatively) recent time or ancient time? Because that can sway the other part of your post. v
Quote:
Maybe so, but it is interesting that humans and the Engineers are both bi-pedal creatures of advanced intelligence.wink.gif
They may have seeded all lifeforms on chosen planets or just humanoids.
post #459 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcruiser View Post

What about the time line, (relatively) recent time or ancient time? Because that can sway the other part of your post. v
They may have seeded all lifeforms on chosen planets or just humanoids.
On the screen, RS did leave it up to interpretation.

It's a hard one to call....
On one hand, for us humans very little of our DNA is unique to our species.
IIRC, our closest relative, the chimp, has > 95% our genes.

In addition, we primates are but a branch of the mammalian family, meaning we are connected to all mammals at some point.
When you take all of that into account, you could make the argument the "sacrificed" Engineer was the basis for all terrestrial life as we know it.
And life on earth has been around for ~ 3.5 billion years (Wikipedia).

OTOH, if the Engineer "seeding" gave rise to only humans, it creates a quandary of trying to explain the fossil and DNA evidence/record of human evolution.
My head hurts while contemplating that...I'll leave it others to speculate.
post #460 of 472
Actually, this discussion touches on one of the plot's weaknesses. Whether the opening scene took place on earth or another similar planet, the assumption is that the Engineers visited earth some 3.5 billion years ago more or less (I just needed my 7th grade science class for that factoid) and seeded the planet with self-replicating DNA that started the whole of earthly organic life percolating and evolving. And since they had advanced genetic engineering as well as space travel already, they sure didn't evolve or develop very far from that point in all that time. They still looked exactly the same and probably had the exact same type of space travel. In 3.5 billion years! One can thus conclude that the Engineers were really slow learners. wink.gif
post #461 of 472
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Actually, this discussion touches on one of the plot's weaknesses. Whether the opening scene took place on earth or another similar planet, the assumption is that the Engineers visited earth some 3.5 billion years ago more or less (I just needed my 7th grade science class for that factoid) and seeded the planet with self-replicating DNA that started the whole of earthly organic life percolating and evolving. And since they had advanced genetic engineering as well as space travel already, they sure didn't evolve or develop very far from that point in all that time. They still looked exactly the same and probably had the exact same type of space travel. In 3.5 billion years! One can thus conclude that the Engineers were really slow learners. wink.gif

Or highly evolved, more likely.

post #462 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Actually, this discussion touches on one of the plot's weaknesses. Whether the opening scene took place on earth or another similar planet, the assumption is that the Engineers visited earth some 3.5 billion years ago more or less (I just needed my 7th grade science class for that factoid) and seeded the planet with self-replicating DNA that started the whole of earthly organic life percolating and evolving. And since they had advanced genetic engineering as well as space travel already, they sure didn't evolve or develop very far from that point in all that time. They still looked exactly the same and probably had the exact same type of space travel. In 3.5 billion years! One can thus conclude that the Engineers were really slow learners. wink.gif
As someone who is a slow learner and never made it to Junior High, I see your point and bow to your fancy-pants, East Coast learnin'tongue.gif
post #463 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

They still looked exactly the same and probably had the exact same type of space travel. In 3.5 billion years! One can thus conclude that the Engineers were really slow learners. wink.gif
Horribly inaccurate.

Engineer at beginning of film: Robe and loin cloth.
Engineer at end: Tactical space garb.
post #464 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

On one hand, for us humans very little of our DNA is unique to our species.
IIRC, our closest relative, the chimp, has > 95% our genes.
In addition, we primates are but a branch of the mammalian family, meaning we are connected to all mammals at some point.
The beginning scene shows how engineer's DNA combines with local condition. That could be interpreted as answer to such similarity.
Quote:
When you take all of that into account, you could make the argument the "sacrificed" Engineer was the basis for all terrestrial life as we know it.
And life on earth has been around for ~ 3.5 billion years (Wikipedia).
OTOH, if the Engineer "seeding" gave rise to only humans, it creates a quandary of trying to explain the fossil and DNA evidence/record of human evolution.
Seeing how fast the black goo reacts and transforms the biological being that comes in contact with, something tells me that it doesn't need 3.5 billion years to make or transform something. From there, we can speculate that the branching off events of species may have been triggered by external influence. confused.gif
Edited by bcruiser - 11/26/12 at 11:55am
post #465 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcruiser View Post

The beginning scene shows how engineer's DNA combines with local condition. That could be interpreted as answer to such similarity.
Seeing how fast the black goo reacts and transforms the biological being that comes in contact with, something tells me that it doesn't need 3.5 billion years to make or transform something. From there, we can speculate that the branching off events of species may have been triggered by external influence. confused.gif
True.
The movie doesn't really spell out the details of the process.
post #466 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Horribly inaccurate.
Engineer at beginning of film: Robe and loin cloth.
Engineer at end: Tactical space garb.

We don't say loin cloth near enough anymore...
post #467 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by sb1 View Post

Horribly inaccurate.
Engineer at beginning of film: Robe and loin cloth.
Engineer at end: Tactical space garb.

If he removed the space garb how do we know he wasn’t still in a fashionable loincloth? Of course he could’ve been dressed in a Yves Saint Laurent suit with Bruno Magli shoes but we’ll never know.
post #468 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCaboNow View Post

We don't say loin cloth near enough anymore...
Nor codpiece....
post #469 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Nor codpiece....

Touche. smile.gif
post #470 of 472
I invoke the Ancient Aliens explanation...the Engineers need not have to have been a sole contributor to human life. They simply jump-started it with the natural influence of their own likeness (more precisely, their essence, which in turn is a roadmap to all native life in their homeworld). How are we to know that the planet in the beginning was totally lifeless? Maybe there was very simple life (in the water, for instance). We (and all life) are a product of that native life as well as what the Engineers contributed. We are a hybrid ecosystem, rather than simply a hybrid species. It is possible that contribution allowed us to leapfrog various evolutionary steps or perhaps experience rapid evolutionary progress in spurts. The Engineer dna supplies those "answers" to breech bottlenecks that would normally have taken an extra million(s) of years for native life to finally come up with an answer.
post #471 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

The movie doesn't really spell out the details of the process.
Right. There are many more like that in this movie. We can speculate that the cells shown right after DNA reformation may not necessarily be cells of mammal. It can be interpreted as cells of DNA carrying bacteria or something like it that once it reaches the existing local life form (if going with added seeds theory instead of created seeds) via drinking water, it triggers a mutation. I'm basing this on variations the black goo caused based on which being it reaches, earthworm to snake that has Weyland logo head, Dr. Holloway - Dr. Shaw to "squid", Fifield to big headed killer, "squid" - engineer to Xenomorph like creature.
Edited by bcruiser - 11/26/12 at 8:44pm
post #472 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Hanky View Post

I invoke the Ancient Aliens explanation...the Engineers need not have to have been a sole contributor to human life. They simply jump-started it with the natural influence of their own likeness (more precisely, their essence, which in turn is a roadmap to all native life in their homeworld). How are we to know that the planet in the beginning was totally lifeless? Maybe there was very simple life (in the water, for instance). We (and all life) are a product of that native life as well as what the Engineers contributed. We are a hybrid ecosystem, rather than simply a hybrid species. It is possible that contribution allowed us to leapfrog various evolutionary steps or perhaps experience rapid evolutionary progress in spurts. The Engineer dna supplies those "answers" to breech bottlenecks that would normally have taken an extra million(s) of years for native life to finally come up with an answer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcruiser View Post

Right. There are many more like that in this movie. We can speculate that the cells shown right after DNA reformation may not necessarily be cells of mammal. It can be interpreted as cells of DNA carrying bacteria or something like it that once it reaches the existing local life form (if going with added seeds theory instead of created seeds) via drinking water, it triggers a mutation. I'm basing this on variations the black goo caused based on which being it reaches, earthworm to snake that has Weyland logo head, Dr. Holloway - Dr. Shaw to "squid", Fifield to big headed killer, "squid" - engineer to Xenomorph like creature.
Good points.smile.gif
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