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The "Official" Yamaha AVENTAGE RX-A1020, RX-A2020 and RX-A3020 Thread - Page 21

post #601 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

Take a look at this answer I posted in another thread (link), and also see the post just above for the questions (they are very similar to yours).

It's for a different model (the Z11) but I think everything still applies to the 3020. Note that the Z11 setting called Bass Out = Front & SWFR is the same as enabling Extra Bass on the 3020.

Thanks, that does provide some insight, but the questions remain:

1) Unlike the Z11, when speakers are set to Large on the RX-A3020, there is no indicator of crossover frequency.. So if speakers are all set to Large (or even just the front speakers), what frequencies are being sent to the sub when the Extra Bass feature is enabled?

2) If the speakers are all set to Small and have different crossover values (Fronts: 40 Hz, Center: 60 Hz, Surrounds: 80 Hz), what value is the actual sub crossover set at?
Edited by se2k - 4/13/13 at 6:32pm
post #602 of 1654
Se2k,

Great questions

I'm curious myself
post #603 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by se2k View Post

Thanks, that does provide some insight, but the questions remain:

1) Unlike the Z11, when speakers are set to Large on the RX-A3020, there is no indicator of crossover frequency.. So if speakers are all set to Large (or even just the front speakers), what frequencies are being sent to the sub when the Extra Bass feature is enabled?

Not sure, but I assume there is still a crossover stored for each speaker, even though you don't get to see it or change it unless you set the speaker to small. I would assume that is the frequency used.

Quote:
2) If the speakers are all set to Small and have different crossover values (Fronts: 40 Hz, Center: 60 Hz, Surrounds: 80 Hz), what value is the actual sub crossover set at?

In principle the crossover frequency for each channel is used for both the high-pass filter on that channel and the low-pass for bass from that channel that's redirected to the sub. So it should be no problem to have difference crossovers for each channel. However, that Z11 review I linked in the other thread claimed that the front crossover frequency was being used as the sub crossover all channels.

I don't know if that was correct or still applies to the 3020, but since they allow you to set different crossovers they ought to work properly.
post #604 of 1654
Hey everybody,

I am just wondering if I purchased a US model of the Yamaha RX-A2020 can I change the firmware to say a European model?

I am guessing the US model has a voltage selector on the back?

I only thing that is different between regions is the radio frequencies and flashing a different firmware could fix this?
post #605 of 1654
The US model does not have a voltage selector on the back. Only the "General" model does and I don't know where in the world those are sold.

The same firmware is used in all regions. The firmware detects which region the hardware is for and operates accordlingly. There are a number of hardware differences that would prevent the receiver from working correclty if you somehow tricked the firmware into detecting a different region. For example, the US model has an HD Radio AM/FM tuner module, while the European models have a standard AM/FM module and a RDS decoder chip.
post #606 of 1654
Just got my 1020 today (upgraded from a HTR-6090.)

So far I am mostly pleased and have most things set up the way I want them. I do have a couple of lingering thoughts though.

-This remote is horrible. The buttons and print are teeny-tiny. I have to squint at the remote for like 10 seconds every time I want to hit a button. Has anyone figured out an alternative? I noticed that my old 6090 remote works somewhat with the 1020 (but not enough to use fully.) I wonder if other, newer Yamaha remotes will work with the 1020...I'd be willing to buy an extra remote for a different unit if it was better than this POS, or possibly a universal. Opinions?

-I have the 1.41 firmware, and I ran the YPAO. It was way off on the speaker levels (I adjusted them myself afterwards with an SPL meter and the Disney WOW blu-ray.) Is there a consensus on what is ideal as far as the YPAO front/natural/etc setting, or is it one of those "just use the one you like more" type of things?

-Am I best off leaving the tone control bass setting on 'bypass' and adjusting the sub level to manage the bass instead? Are people finding that boosting the treble a little makes for a nice crisp sound, or is that best left at bypass also?

Thanks in advance.
post #607 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicodimus22 View Post

-Am I best off leaving the tone control bass setting on 'bypass' and adjusting the sub level to manage the bass instead? Are people finding that boosting the treble a little makes for a nice crisp sound, or is that best left at bypass also?

YPAO usually gets the speaker levels right, except perhaps the sub, so if it's way off with levels maybe something went wrong. Did you do a muli-point setup?

If you don't like the YPAO result at all, I would probably turn off EQ (set it to Through) and see if you like that better (after fixing the speaker levels, especially the sub). If you do, I would start with that as a point for making tweaks, rather than the YPAO results.

For more bass I would turn up the sub (with all speakers set as Small) rather than use the bass tone control. By all means try the treble if you don't like the overall tone, but that's where the different YPAO modes come in (e.g. you might find Natural rolls off the highs more than Flat).

The most important frequencies to EQ are the ones coming from the sub, and the 1020 doesn't EQ the sub at all. So it wouldn't be surprising if you prefer to turn off YPAO EQ and just make a few manual tweaks instead.
post #608 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

YPAO usually gets the speaker levels right, except perhaps the sub, so if it's way off with levels maybe something went wrong. Did you do a muli-point setup?

If you don't like the YPAO result at all, I would probably turn off EQ (set it to Through) and see if you like that better (after fixing the speaker levels, especially the sub). If you do, I would start with that as a point for making tweaks, rather than the YPAO results.

For more bass I would turn up the sub (with all speakers set as Small) rather than use the bass tone control. By all means try the treble if you don't like the overall tone, but that's where the different YPAO modes come in (e.g. you might find Natural rolls off the highs more than Flat).

The most important frequencies to EQ are the ones coming from the sub, and the 1020 doesn't EQ the sub at all. So it wouldn't be surprising if you prefer to turn off YPAO EQ and just make a few manual tweaks instead.

I am surprised that you say the A1020 does not EQ the sub. If it's similar to the 3020 , then it does EQ the sub when you run YPAO. Am I missing something? Please explain.
post #609 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by SARHENTO View Post

I am surprised that you say the A1020 does not EQ the sub. If it's similar to the 3020 , then it does EQ the sub when you run YPAO. Am I missing something? Please explain.

The 2020 and 3020 are very similar internally, but the 1020 is closer in design to the lower models. For one thing it has a single DSP (so half the processing power of the 2020/3020), which is probably the reason they removed sub EQ (but it could be partly a marketing decision). If you set Parametric EQ to Manual mode, you'll find you can adjust EQ for the main speakers but not the sub.

But even on the 2020/3020 the available EQ is not that useful for fixing standing waves (not enough control over the filter frequencies), so in a difficult room a separate sub EQ system would be useful on any model.
post #610 of 1654
i need help restoring my yamaha a2000 reciever back to original firmware

i have nothing but issuses with my yds12 ipod adapter, yamaha tech support is usless !! and nothing but run around with apple support engineers.

the gui locks up after 3 seconds whene the ipod is docked, im using a iphone 5 with a lightning adapter everything locks up and cant control the ipod at all.

i never had any issues until the last firmware updat and iphone 6.1.3 update did them both around the same time,

i know you can restore the reciever to factory again but how do you restore to a older firmware version?


any help would be great !
post #611 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

YPAO usually gets the speaker levels right, except perhaps the sub, so if it's way off with levels maybe something went wrong. Did you do a muli-point setup?

If you don't like the YPAO result at all, I would probably turn off EQ (set it to Through) and see if you like that better (after fixing the speaker levels, especially the sub). If you do, I would start with that as a point for making tweaks, rather than the YPAO results.

For more bass I would turn up the sub (with all speakers set as Small) rather than use the bass tone control. By all means try the treble if you don't like the overall tone, but that's where the different YPAO modes come in (e.g. you might find Natural rolls off the highs more than Flat).

The most important frequencies to EQ are the ones coming from the sub, and the 1020 doesn't EQ the sub at all. So it wouldn't be surprising if you prefer to turn off YPAO EQ and just make a few manual tweaks instead.

I will try setting the EQ to 'through' and experiment a bit.

I am surprised to see that a lot of people are recommending setting all speakers to small. It just seems weird to do that, especially with these moderately beefy L/R/C speakers. I guess there's no harm in trying, and if I don't like it, I can switch back.

I'll have to do some more experimenting and see what sounds the best. Thanks for your input!
post #612 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

The 2020 and 3020 are very similar internally, but the 1020 is closer in design to the lower models. For one thing it has a single DSP (so half the processing power of the 2020/3020), which is probably the reason they removed sub EQ (but it could be partly a marketing decision). If you set Parametric EQ to Manual mode, you'll find you can adjust EQ for the main speakers but not the sub.

But even on the 2020/3020 the available EQ is not that useful for fixing standing waves (not enough control over the filter frequencies), so in a difficult room a separate sub EQ system would be useful on any model.

Thanks Kirk...
I am not familiar with A1020 buy I thought that any receiver with bass management would have sub equalization, perhaps not always tweakable manually but automatically at least.
post #613 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by solarg37 View Post

...i know you can restore the reciever to factory again but how do you restore to a older firmware version?

There's no magic restore, you have to have a copy of the older version and use the USB update method (described in the manual under Advanced Setup menu).

(And I don't have an A-series myself, so I don't know for sure it will let you load an older version of firmware, but that was no problem on previous models.)
Edited by kriktsemaj99 - 4/15/13 at 11:24am
post #614 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

There's no magic restore, you have to have a copy of the older version and use the USB update method (described in the manual under Advanced Setup menu).

(And I don't have an A-series myself, so I don't know for sure it will let you load an older version of firmware, but that was no problem on previous models.)


thanks for the info,

this is really fusterating !!

i spent all that money for a ipod adapter that doesnt work and i can restore the firmware to a ealier version on either the iphone 5 or the reciever,

my buddies iphone 4 works with no issues and mine works in my infiniti just great !!

ive exhausted all options
post #615 of 1654
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicodimus22 View Post

I will try setting the EQ to 'through' and experiment a bit.

I am surprised to see that a lot of people are recommending setting all speakers to small. It just seems weird to do that, especially with these moderately beefy L/R/C speakers. I guess there's no harm in trying, and if I don't like it, I can switch back.

I'll have to do some more experimenting and see what sounds the best. Thanks for your input!

Two things...

1. Obviously you use less of the internal amplification to drive LF's... more headroom.

and

2. It's much more beneficial in smaller rooms to have the LF being sourced from one place.... letting the LCR be full range can trigger all kinds of interactions in the room as the LF waves develop.. the use of multiple subwoofer to decrease room interactions notwithstanding. (subs can be moved into their best position for that, whereas main speaker placement is fairly standardized/dictated by the display and room shape.)

Since frequencies under 80Hz and perceived as non directional, it's a fairly easy to see why most enthusiasts agree with the idea of letting the sub do the LF work. cool.gif
post #616 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer View Post

Two things...

1. Obviously you use less of the internal amplification to drive LF's... more headroom.

and

2. It's much more beneficial in smaller rooms to have the LF being sourced from one place.... letting the LCR be full range can trigger all kinds of interactions in the room as the LF waves develop.. the use of multiple subwoofer to decrease room interactions notwithstanding. (subs can be moved into their best position for that, whereas main speaker placement is fairly standardized/dictated by the display and room shape.)

Since frequencies under 80Hz and perceived as non directional, it's a fairly easy to see why most enthusiasts agree with the idea of letting the sub do the LF work. cool.gif

I'll definitely give it a try after work. Thanks for the explanation.

One more question...when I switch all the speakers to small and set the sub crossover to 80Hz, should the 'extra bass' setting be on or off?

Edit: Just found out that when all speakers are set to small, extra bass is grayed out from the menu (unavailable.) Answered my own question.
Edited by Nicodimus22 - 4/15/13 at 6:25pm
post #617 of 1654
Yamaha RX-A2020

A question about bi-amping. If I bi-amp my front speakers(widerange and midbass) does the amp run same signal to both of the speakers or use crossover between them? If yes to crossover can I change the settings by my self also if I`m not happy with the YPAO result?
post #618 of 1654
So, when I got home, I ran YPAO again just to be sure, changed all the speakers to small, adjusted the levels manually with an SPL meter, and now...

WOW. It sounded good yesterday, but now it sounds incredible! (I'm currently using the YPAO Flat setting because it sounds the best to me, and I don't know what I'm doing enough to do manual.) Everything I demo'd yesterday, I went back to tonight, and it sounds much better across the board. I still can't have the sub turned up as high as it's technically supposed to be because of my small apartment, but I fiddled with the level until I found a middle ground where there's a satisfying amount of bass, but it shouldn't drive my downstairs neighbor crazy. I feel giddy. I want to re-watch every movie I own to enjoy this new level of sound quality. smile.gif

I really have to thank this forum. I never would have thought of setting my speakers to small. (In my defense, it seems logical to set large speakers to large.)
Edited by Nicodimus22 - 4/15/13 at 8:02pm
post #619 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicodimus22 View Post

So, when I got home, I ran YPAO again just to be sure, changed all the speakers to small, adjusted the levels manually with an SPL meter, and now...

WOW. It sounded good yesterday, but now it sounds incredible! (I'm currently using the YPAO Flat setting because it sounds the best to me, and I don't know what I'm doing enough to do manual.) Everything I demo'd yesterday, I went back to tonight, and it sounds much better across the board. I still can't have the sub turned up as high as it's technically supposed to be because of my small apartment, but I fiddled with the level until I found a middle ground where there's a satisfying amount of bass, but it shouldn't drive my downstairs neighbor crazy. I feel giddy. I want to re-watch every movie I own to enjoy this new level of sound quality. smile.gif

I really have to thank this forum. I never would have thought of setting my speakers to small. (In my defense, it seems logical to set large speakers to large.)

Did you run YPAO for a single or multiple listening position?
post #620 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by SARHENTO View Post

Did you run YPAO for a single or multiple listening position?

Single. I live alone, and almost never have anyone in my apartment. From what I have read, there is some compromise doing the multiple position YPAO (in that it will sound better in a wider area, but the sweet spot won't be quite as good.) I always want the best sound right in the middle, where I will be sitting virtually 100% of the time.
post #621 of 1654
I just noticed something odd. It doesn't affect performance, but it seems weird.

When I power off my blu-ray player, and the 1020 isn't being fed a signal, the red HDMI logo on the front display is steadily flashing on and off. Is that a normal thing?
post #622 of 1654
Yah. it's normal. I believe its doing this to tell you that there's an "HDCP error". It'll do this even though there's no HDCP protected content currently being input.
post #623 of 1654
Hi all,

i just need a quick (actually two) help from you all:

I'm the proud ownerof a rx-a1020 and I 'd like to know if it is normal the the OSD does not give any info about bitdepth of files being played over
the network (mostly FLAC for me) and taken from the NAS: it only shows sampling freq.

2nd question: where can I find the serial number of the machine? is there any other place than the backplate, like a submenu on OSD or whatever?
my rig is now deeply entrenched into my dedicated piece of forniture, along with satellite, ps3, xbox360, cables, router, cat fur & food (yes, my cats love to steal food and go eating
it behind xbox...)!

thank you in advance!
post #624 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostDot View Post

where can I find the serial number of the machine? is there any other place than the backplate, like a submenu on OSD or whatever?

It's on the outside of the box on a white sticker, if you still have it. Not sure about where it is on the unit, though.
post #625 of 1654
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicodimus22 View Post

Single. I live alone, and almost never have anyone in my apartment. From what I have read, there is some compromise doing the multiple position YPAO (in that it will sound better in a wider area, but the sweet spot won't be quite as good.) I always want the best sound right in the middle, where I will be sitting virtually 100% of the time.

The reason I asked was because if you did a multiple position correction, YPAO would have optimized the correction for those locations and not just your MLP, and manually tweaking using the SPL might not be a good idea.
post #626 of 1654
^^ what about manual SPL after 8 pts YPAO positions?
post #627 of 1654
Multi-point YPAO only uses the first position to set speaker levels, so it's OK to check them with an SPL meter afterwards (just make sure you used the main listening position for the first YPAO measurement, and also for the manual check).

And if you never listen close to reference level, I would raise the surround levels (and perhaps the sub) a bit anyway (subjectively this sounds better at lower volumes).
Edited by kriktsemaj99 - 4/16/13 at 2:57pm
post #628 of 1654
we want to raise it at 75db? what volume do we set it too for SPL check?
post #629 of 1654
Got a couple of lingering questions about the 1020. Please bear with me, as I don't know all the terminology involved.

-If I have a basic 5.1 speaker configuration (running at 6 ohms with all the speakers set to small) is it recommended/worthwhile to bi-amp the L/R speakers? Or would that cause problems (either making the receiver work too hard since it's running at a lower impedence, or screwing up YPAO, or any other reason I haven't thought of?) Or is that feature meant for a stereo setup rather than 5.1? Or would it act normally during 5.1, and then kick on when I switch to a stereo mode? I was looking at it going "hmm...if there is a way to make this sound better for just the cost of some speaker wire, I should ask about it." I looked, and my L/R speakers have 4 terminals (2 red, 2 black) each with a metal jumper connecting them right now. If this is something that is a worthwhile effort, I would assume that you remove the jumper between the terminals prior to hooking up both sets of wires?

-When adjusting the subwoofer level, is it good practice to send a 0db level to the sub and then adjust the volume knob on the sub itself? Or, is it preferable to set the sub's volume knob at 50% and then adjust the level coming out of the receiver? I suspect one method might be superior, but I don't really know.

-I don't really understand the subwoofer trim feature. The manual hardly says anything about it. The advertising for the 1020 shows it as 2 pictures, sort of a "with and without" it, but it might just be an advertising thing. Anyone have a good grasp on subwoofer trim and if/when it should be adjusted?

Thanks for any help on these.
post #630 of 1654
FYI: If you have the 1020 and dislike the layout/shape of the buttons on the remote, you can order the remote for the 1010 rather cheaply here and it is guaranteed to be compatible:

http://www.everytvremote.com/remote-control/yamaha/ww512000.aspx

http://www.newtvremotes.com/Catalog/Item.php?BLI=YAMAHA&CG=1&model=RX-A1010&qlref=000215WW

I can't stand the 1020 remote (especially the volume being so freaking high up) so I was quick to order the 1010 remote, which looks like it will be a lot more comfortable for me to use overall.
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