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2 Dayton Titanic MK III 15s or 1 TC Sounds LMS-R 15 - Page 3

post #61 of 112
Thread Starter 
Ok so I have the patience of a 2 year old, the subs came in today and I went to the store and bought two sheets of 3/4 " MDF and one 24" x 48" sheet of 1/2 " to use for insetting the drivers. Made all the cuts (with a circular saw, wish I had a table saw) and am working on gluing together the sides minus the front bezel. Just need to get the connectors and make the driver holes. Question though....I think I read somewhere that people were using weather strip tape as a seal for the driver, but all I saw was like 1/8" think, that seems awfully thick for between the driver and the wood? What are people using?
post #62 of 112
You want the weather strip foam tape, it compresses down really well, and any parts of the driver that aren't sitting completely flush will have the foam expand into them.
post #63 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

You want the weather strip foam tape, it compresses down really well, and any parts of the driver that aren't sitting completely flush will have the foam expand into them.

perfect thank you,


I made a noob mistake and measured two of the sides wrong, but nothing the ol' saber saw can't fix up in a jiffy tomorrow after work!

What kind of silicon should I seal the inside the box? I have a couple different kinds, does it matter?
post #64 of 112

I don't see a reason to seal the inside if you're using adhesive like PL Premium to hold the panels together. Unless for some reason you didn't appply the glue or adhesive properly and left a gap then you would want to seal it some way. I've also heard that silicon can damage drivers because of the gasses it emits...??? or something like that, I don't remember.

 

You can see in my build PL Premium is squeezed out of the seams and forms a nice seal on the edges. Used a 1/4" bead of PL Premium on the ends of the panels.

1ef3cfdf_IMG_20120621_121446.jpeg

post #65 of 112
Thread Starter 
Thanks! I have 2 more questions,

How much polyphil should I use? line the walls with an inch? glue it on with craft glue?

I don't see radio shack selling terminal cups (atleast not online, I'll check in a store after work), where else would you buy them? My impatience won't let me wait on them to be shipped lol.
Edited by kcnitro07 - 6/22/12 at 7:09am
post #66 of 112
post #67 of 112
Thread Starter 
not sure how I didn't find all of those when I searched...I'm a noob....what about the polifill stuff?
post #68 of 112

1lb of polyfill per cubic foot.

http://www.glasswolf.net/papers/polyfill.html

 

If your enclosure is 3.5cu feet then you would need 3.5lbs of polyfill. This is just a guideline for sealed subs, you would have to do some measurements if you want the right amount.

post #69 of 112
Thread Starter 
another question:

to attach the speaker wire to the terminal cup, should I solder or use the little connectors?
post #70 of 112

I soldered my connections because I couldn't find the right size female disconnects in store.

post #71 of 112
I always solder now because I've had a connector shake off before.
post #72 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdchambe View Post

I have been following this thread closely and am interested in possibly building a similar setup. My goal, like the original poster, is to get deep bass extension.
Following the thread I have noticed that there have been a couple of different recommended sealed enclosure sizes for the 15 inch titanic drivers. Specifically, the 3.5 foot flat pack enclosure or 6 cu ft enclosures.
I would be building two subwoofers with a single titanic driver per enclosure and using a ep4000 amp. Could someone graph my potential setup with the two different sealed enclosure sizes?
Thanks alot!!

If I were you, maybe you should look at 4 Dayton RSS390HF 15s and a used EP4000 in (2) 9cuft boxes.Total cost should be around $1,000.

In room should have peaks of 118db with movies and about 110db at 10hz depending on room gain. These subs are great. The have very low distortion and need only about 400 watt per driver. The only bad thing about the HFs is they need large boxes, 8-12cuft.
post #73 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcnitro07 View Post

if thats the case, then would I be better putting them in the same enclosure? in order to get the 6 dB increase, they have to be collocated and what not, so is it better to do one box with 2 subs or 2 boxes?

Smaller rooms tend to be more problematic with bass reproduction. You should build 2 boxes for better room response. Place one in the front center of the wall and one on the back center of the wall. If that is not possible, place one on the left center of the wall and the other on the right center of the wall.

You will lose headroom but you should gain solid bass performance at all seats. If response is not a problem, you can always co-locate the sub for more headroom.
post #74 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNICRON-WMD View Post

Smaller rooms tend to be more problematic with bass reproduction. You should build 2 boxes for better room response. Place one in the front center of the wall and one on the back center of the wall. If that is not possible, place one on the left center of the wall and the other on the right center of the wall.
You will lose headroom but you should gain solid bass performance at all seats. If response is not a problem, you can always co-locate the sub for more headroom.

Well I finished the cabs on saturday and powered em up on Sunday with Archaea's inuke 3000DSP. I moved them around and got the "flattest" graph out of the front corner positions. Being I have a TV sitting on a TV stand, I can't really do front and rear middle wall, maybe if I had a projector or an LCD hanging on the wall, but not with my current TV.

I'll post pictures and graphs and what not at some point the next couple of days. I do have to admit that Archaea was correct, they don't look as good as the flatpack would have, but it was way more fun to do the actual work of creating the box oppose to just gluing one together.

Edit, by finished I mean completed, not finished, they are bare wood at the moment as I haven't decided what to "finish" them with, and might not until my home theater room is done.
Edited by kcnitro07 - 6/25/12 at 1:48pm
post #75 of 112
Sweet! Well any impressions you care to share? Also when you post graphs I would be interested in the eq settings on the amp. Thanks
post #76 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke Kamp View Post

Sweet! Well any impressions you care to share? Also when you post graphs I would be interested in the eq settings on the amp. Thanks

Seems to go a bit lower than the BICs, but it doesn't seem as loud..I don't like music as much. I did watch underworld awaking and my whole couch was going crazy with the gun fire in the elevator scene, but the "clip" light on the amp kept coming on every shot, so I turned it down and now its not as impressive, but it did sound pretty good despite the clipping light on the front of inuke scarying me. . Hmmmmmm

Most of the graphs I have are no EQ. Just moving the subs around trying to find the best placement.

Jonathan end up talking me into trying some "restore" wood deck finish stuff as the finish, the first coat is drying right now, so it'll be a couple days before I actually hook them back up and do some more playing.
post #77 of 112
Thread Starter 
One thing I did notice was during the sweep in REW, the screen on my DLP TV would shake like crazy at the low end...
post #78 of 112
Luke advised bridging my inuke into a single 4ohm channel to test a sub with a bit more wattage.

You'll have to be careful and listen for distortion on the sub, because the Inuke DSP 3000 amp can output more power than your driver can take, but if you increase the gain slowly you can see how they sound with more power.
post #79 of 112
I am at a loss at how two 15" on much more power would do anything less than three low end bics? Maybe it appears to not get as loud because they have less distortion than the bics? I wonder how much more power the ep4000 has over the inuke? I take no responsibility for damaged drivers if you take it past its limits, maybe some of the others with more experience with these amps and drivers can chime in.
post #80 of 112

The only way to be sure is to use an spl meter to see how loud it really is. It could also be that you are used to the sound of the BIC subwoofers.

post #81 of 112
Thread Starter 
the BICs were ported, I like that sound apparently. We also registered them at peaking at 121 dB in my room though I don't remember ever hearing distortion coming from them. Unfortunately, I don't have an SPL meter so I can't calibrate the SPL on REW, I just use it to see the graph. I have plenty of time to test and play on Friday, boxes won't be completely dry until Thursday. I have yet to hook them up side by side and compare sounds, I'm happy with them, just seems quieter, I have a graph at home I took of the BICs right before I switched. I can look and see what they peaked at, REW should be graphing them similarly with no SPL cal. So I can see which is "louder" and where I think

Also, I'm don't think I'm daring enough to put bridge it to 1500 Watts into my 800W speakers, doesn't sound very fun to me.
post #82 of 112
I am not that handy with rew but you can test distortion. Harmonic distortion doesn't sound bad to many and they actually turn their subs up until distortion and that sounds correct to them. 121db without distortion measurements and without knowing at what frequency doesn't tell you a whole lot. 121db may have been at over 100% distortion. This figure 1 shows how a distorted waveform can have higher output than the fundamental.

http://www.pge.com/includes/docs/pdfs/mybusiness/customerservice/energystatus/powerquality/harmonics.pdf
post #83 of 112
Thread Starter 
So what you're saying is most people like the sound of harmonic distortion...whats wrong with having it then? :P

I don't own an oscilliscope or whatnot so I can't really test for distortion. I do know that music sounded better on the BICs IMO. However, movies are better on the Daytons. I haven't played too much with it though as they were only operational for a few hours and then I took them back apart to start the finishing. I'll do more playing. This weekend. And hopefully post some pictures.

You're welcome to come over and help me dial em in Luke :P
post #84 of 112
You don't need an oscilliscope. This is the first thing that popped up with "how to test distortion with rew" search. I can see distortion with Omni but I like the look of the rew distortion tests better.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/rew-forum/43270-rew-rta-distortion-tests.html

My wife's working this weekend and I am on baby duty but I could swing by at some point soon I am sure.
post #85 of 112
Distortion numbers can be effected by room noise and house vibrations....

That could be difficult to accurately measure and compare fairly in room at max SPL of each sub system - - - depending on your room's cooperation.

Those are probably best to take outdoors --- on the plus side Nelson has more bass booming cars driving by his house than anyone I know - so he could probably just throw his subs out there in the back yard for a half hour of testing and none of the neighbors would even care enough to come to the window to see what's happening. wink.gifbiggrin.gif
post #86 of 112
Thread Starter 
Well, I haven't noticed the THD section of REW, but I'm pretty well a noob at it and don't really know how to use it beyond clicking "measure" lol. I'll pull some measurements up this weekend and see what I have. I wonder if that is saved in graphs when you click save. Or if it even does that on a normal sweep? I don't know, but i'll figure it out.

I'll pull up my saved graphs and compare tonight, last night I was distracted by finishing the cabs and then playing diablo III with archaea and listening to him whine about his character being too pansy to kill anything....biggrin.gif
post #87 of 112
This it true and I have first hand experience with my darned drop ceiling.mad.gif

I need to get back to diablo, my characters are definitely pansies. Finally got the 2.1 going on the computer and it is a lot more fun with decent sound.
post #88 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke Kamp View Post

This it true and I have first hand experience with my darned drop ceiling.mad.gif
I need to get back to diablo, my characters are definitely pansies. Finally got the 2.1 going on the computer and it is a lot more fun with decent sound.

well it doesn't help when you're playing hardcore and you die and everyone else is in act 2 and you bring in a lvl 1 character lol that was no fun I'm sure...same thing happened to me a couple weeks ago. You should come play with us sometime!
post #89 of 112
My wizard IS terrible! I'm just going to throw that out there. Any level 37 character should be doing more than 450dps. Heck your level 39 was doing what 1200dps? I'd be wacking on a guy and you'd walk up and one shot him with your DH.


Now I feel better again, after my daily Diablo 3 gripe.
post #90 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

My wizard IS terrible! I'm just going to throw that out there. Any level 37 character should be doing more than 450dps. Heck your level 39 was doing what 1200dps? I'd be wacking on a guy and you'd walk up and one shot him with your DH.
Now I feel better again, after my daily Diablo 3 gripe.

I'll give you all he gear my lvl 53 wizards is wearing!

anyway, back on topic...I was really happy with my tv shaking like crazy during the sweeps...thats the kind of stuff I was missing with the BICs. I think overall I'm happy with the Daytons, I might try all 5 subs together and see how that sounds biggrin.gif, Archaea came up with the Idea of using the Daytons for sub 30Hz and the BICs for above 30Hz....hmmmm
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