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MIT speaker cable - Page 2

post #31 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by kzhtoo View Post

.... I'm very curious though because if it is in fact not sonically beneficial, how these cable companies have been around for many years. ... smile.gif

Since when did people make sound decisions, not be biased nor gullible in the marketplace? Why is homeopathic stuff still around and people make money from it? How about those so called holographic bracelets that do all sorts of magic?
Why did Airborn cold pill made a killing until they could no longer make such claims? A company over $100 million.

The list is almost endless.
post #32 of 410
^^^

because they agree with his (indefensible) position, maybe? wink.gif

good to see it didn't take long for the "your system isn't good enough" excuse to surface... rolleyes.gif
post #33 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinjuku View Post

Rutgar,
What if I were to have my Attorney draw up a contract that would cover:
1. Air fare
2. Accommodations
3. Food
4. Rental car
5. $5000 in cash
You can have 5 days of 8 hours where I will flip a coin 4 times a days and either make a change or not. Your choice of either Kimber or AQ (either line or speaker level your choice) and some Belden 5000ue for speaker or Mogami Gold for line level. The sessions will be video taped. The tapping is to make sure you don't look. Since you are a believer in the higher priced stuff sounding better then what other pros and enthusiasts consider adequate you have to stone cold say which is which. You will get zero sighted time. You're allowed as many breaks as you want and time enough for me to switch cables and replace storage in the camera.
1. I'll initially purchase either the Kimber or AQ (not constant bias systems or doohickies on the cable, because they aren't cables).
2. You put up $2500
If you can't hit a 90 percent rate then you lose. You pay the air fare, hotel, car, food plus the $2500. All monies will be held in escrow. I'm offering you 2:1 on your money.

I see you live in Ky.Do they even have electricity their for your test.
post #34 of 410
Do you have anything to offer other than class warfare? Facts or data perhaps?

Why don't you see if he'll offer you the same challenge - it's easy money for you, right? rolleyes.gif
post #35 of 410
Yep We have electricity. Luckily that works out for Eminence, Thiel, and a few other prominent names. But by all means keep up your rep of stupidity. I understand that you lack two things: faith in your conviction and $$.
post #36 of 410
Quote:
but you guys are simply wrong in your assertions concerning MIT products in general.

No, you are ! LOL

Is that really the best you can do?
post #37 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahead View Post

I see you live in Ky.Do they even have electricity their for your test.

Form this, might we conclude that the Buddahead expects the mountain to come to him? ;-)

Oh that was Mohammed that was supposed to go the mountain.

Obviously, Budda is neither well-traveled nor well-read. IME Ky is a very civilized place.
post #38 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by kzhtoo View Post

Not sure if this is the right place to post this, but did not see any sub-forum dedicated to cable.
So I was looking around on Audiogon and found that a lot of discontinued MIT speaker cables are selling for half price. I'm currently using some "just cable" ($3-4 a foot) and wondering if it is worth jumping on the deals. I'm interested in MIT CVT2, S3 etc selling for $250 - $600.
I'm not very familiar with the cables and any advice would be greatly appreciated.

No one can tell you what they (wire X, cable Y) will "sound" like to you. Especially if you are remotely cognizant of how the hearing process works. There is certainly a chance that cabling could effectively change the soundfield to audibility thresholds in a system. Other than extreme cases like highly inductive wire, magic boxes with series resistance, etc, etc. the probability becomes much lower if the wire is connected into a system designed by competent engineers. The probability becomes much greater if the cabling is inserted into an "Audiophile Injurneered" type system, where indeed, it is possible for changes to rise to audibility thresholds.
Then of course, there is the fact that no soundwave change at all has to occur, for someone to "hear" something. This is a fact beyond audiophile IQ level, but that is irrelevant to it being a fact. It's simply a function of human perception.
So cabling does matter and does in fact, have the capability to change the sound, if not the soundfield. It's entirely up to you to decide whether your system, or mind, are capable of being affected by them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahead View Post

Asking wire questions here is like asking Homeless people the difference in good wine
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rutgar View Post

You and I are in total agreement that this is the wrong forum to ask about speaker wire and/or interconnect questions.
I agree with both of you. For a much more objective, rational, logical, high IQ, common sense, sane type answers for your ilk, the so called AA "Cable Asylum" is by far more appropriate.smile.gif

cheers,

AJ
Edited by AJinFLA - 6/25/12 at 4:12pm
post #39 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJinFLA View Post

No one can tell you what they (wire X, cable Y) will "sound" like to you. Especially if you are remotely cognizant of how the hearing process works. There is certainly a chance that cabling could effectively change the soundfield to audibility thresholds in a system. Other than extreme cases like highly inductive wire, magic boxes with series resistance, etc, etc. the probability becomes much lower if the wire is connected into a system designed by competent engineers. The probability becomes much greater if the cabling is inserted into an "Audiophile Injurneered" type system, where indeed, it is possible for changes to rise to audibility thresholds.
Then of course, there is the fact that no soundwave change at all has to occur, for someone to "hear" something. This is a fact beyond audiophile IQ level, but that is irrelevant to it being a fact. It's simply a function of human perception.
So cabling does matter and does in fact, have the capability to change the sound, if not the soundfield. It's entirely up to you to decide whether you system, or mind, are capable of being effected by them.
I agree with both of you. For a much more objective, rational, logical, high IQ, common sense, sane type answers for your ilk, the so called AA "Cable Asylum" is by far more appropriate.smile.gif
cheers,
AJ
Nice job working the word "soundfield" into your post a few times AJ smile.gif
post #40 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Form this, might we conclude that the Buddahead expects the mountain to come to him? ;-)

Probably. Putting money on the table is the quickest way to cleave the expensive cable adherent from their 'faith'. The ironic thing is that they'll spend thousands of $'s on cables, talk about how great they are and when I give them a slam dunk opportunity to both recoup some or all of their investment, publicly prove their point, and a shot at shutting me up all I ever hear are crickets. Same here and same at Polk Forums. No faster way to see a group of people run backwards than to pony up some cash. I've seen it clear a room quicker than a fart.
post #41 of 410
post #42 of 410
post #43 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinjuku View Post

Probably. Putting money on the table is the quickest way to cleave the expensive cable adherent from their 'faith'. The ironic thing is that they'll spend thousands of $'s on cables, talk about how great they are and when I give them a slam dunk opportunity to both recoup some or all of their investment, publicly prove their point, and a shot at shutting me up all I ever hear are crickets. Same here and same at Polk Forums. No faster way to see a groH

up of people run backwards than to pony up some cash. I've seen it clear a room quicker than a fart.



Hey i will take you up.I grew up in louisville.I now live over by Corydon.But I travel mostly to the east end where I grew up
Out by Indians Hills US42.Just pm me with your phone no and we can talk.Thanks Bob
post #44 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahead View Post

Hey i will take you up.I grew up in louisville.I now live over by Corydon.But I travel mostly to the east end where I grew up
Out by Indians Hills US42.Just pm me with your phone no and we can talk.Thanks Bob

PM sent....
post #45 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinjuku View Post

Probably. Putting money on the table is the quickest way to cleave the expensive cable adherent from their 'faith'.

Maybe yes, maybe no.

The cleaving I see is separation between the expensive cable adherent and their credibility among reasonable person.

I can't recall ever seeing a expensive cable adherent change their ways. Certainly not in this thread.

Do I expect Mr. B. or Mr. R. to change their position on expensive cables or other unnecessarily high-priced audio gear? No.
Quote:
The ironic thing is that they'll spend thousands of $'s on cables, talk about how great they are and when I give them a slam dunk opportunity to both recoup some or all of their investment, publicly prove their point, and a shot at shutting me up all I ever hear are crickets.

You are not alone in that. My friend Tom Nousaine reports similar outcomes, even with high end cable manufacturers.
Quote:
Same here and same at Polk Forums. No faster way to see a group of people run backwards than to pony up some cash. I've seen it clear a room quicker than a fart.

I strongly suspect that these folks are in denial about their cowardice. I strongly suspect that shortly, they will see an article or review of some new magic cable or audio component, and whip out their plastic so fast that their fingertips will be frostbitten.
post #46 of 410
buddahead,

Just FYI my current output connection is 1/4" TRS if you decide on line level.
post #47 of 410
I don't know why these threads keep popping up. Everybody knows that tinned Marine wire is the best speaker cable made. It's even corrosion proof.smile.gif
post #48 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post


You are not alone in that. My friend Tom Nousaine reports similar outcomes
He scared them all off years ago with the Zipser test.

PS: What's in many of the MIT magic boxes are zobels. Shows them pretty clearly in the patent app for them.
post #49 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Middleton View Post

I don't know why these threads keep popping up. Everybody knows that tinned Marine wire is the best speaker cable made. It's even corrosion proof.smile.gif

I had to look the term "Marine Wire" up to see what it means. It means that the wire is pretty nicely made. If the guage and the conductor configuration is right, then I must totally agree with you.
post #50 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by A9X-308 View Post

He scared them all off years ago with the Zipser test.

Tom is a cool guy. He's made enough money so that within reason he can do what he wants, including travelling all over the US figuratively pulling down the britches of any golden ear who is naive enough to play.
Quote:
PS: What's in many of the MIT magic boxes are zobels. Shows them pretty clearly in the patent app for them.

They are thus hoping that enough of the purchasers have equipment that is poorly-designed trash, to make a reputation for them. Obviously, not many people buying mid-fi Pioneer receivers are their market, so it is safe to presume that they know something about high end equipment that isn't really complementary...
post #51 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

I'm not a fan of DBT critics who make a religion out of preferences developed in bogus and questionable listening tests.
In fact we can and have met the logical requirements that we first imposed on ourselves before we recommended them to anybody else. Some people have what it takes to organize and perform a good logical experiment, but many others can't. In my opinon and experience, the requirements for a good listening test are easy enough to meet.
Example being the false offensive claims you made just above.
"Blind trials" usually being code for a test that would have been a good DBT except for its intentional defects... Is it fish, is it fowl?

Well, excuse me, Reverend, but I wasn't really referring to you, though I see you couldn't help but get in the pulpit anyway. You have in fact done credible work, but it gets obscured by your quasi ex cathedra tone when you think someone's failed your fidelity test. (Now there's a double entendre.) I considered you as being more level-headed about this.

Even though our conclusions on this thread's topic appear to be identical, you have a way of either obtusely misunderstanding language or a habit of making small yet pathological changes to other's posts so you can get into lectura gravis mode like a know-it-all who must have the last word. You like to focus on differences to the exclusion of commonalities, and you like to do it in a harsh and mean-spirited way.

Let me help you with one simple example of how you misread. It would take too much time and space to do a line-by-line reconstruction of your misrepresentations.
Quote:
I'm not a big fan of DBT advocates who make a religion out of their "scientific dogma."

"I'm not a big fan of..." is an idiomatic expression in English. I might use it like this: I'm not a big fan of taxes, or I'm not a big fan of country music. I still pay all my taxes willingly, and there are some country artists I enjoy listening to, but I don get excited or "fan"atical about either. Not being a big fan does not make one a critic.

"...of DBT advocates who..." shows respect for DBT proponents through the use of "advocates," a perfectly honorable term. I did not write wackos, Nazis, Zombies, dilettantes, dictators, or fanatics, etc. At the same time the inclusion of "who" indicates there's a subclass of advocates that's about to be described. It introduces a restrictive or essential adjective clause.

"...who make a religion out of their 'scientific dogma.' "is the restrictive clause. It does not brand all DBT advocates with this characterization; rather, it includes another idiomatic phrase, "make a religion" which indicates that some advocates give it god-like status which only they and other special people can discern and execute properly. "Scientific dogma" is in quotes because it is in itself an oxymoron; science and dogma should not be together logically, yet there are cases of dogmatic scientism to be found in many places on AV Science, especially among people who have never done any of the things they demand of others.

You claim to have done these things, and I always accepted that you had. Since I see an evolving tendency on your part to misread or mischaracterize other people's posts, I am no longer interested in what you have to write. I don't trust your objectivity, and I tire of your constant, harping negativity. I'm going to put you on ignore, and I suggest you save yourself from your self-imposed drama and do the same to me.
post #52 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by filecat13 View Post

Since I see an evolving tendency on your part to misread or mischaracterize other people's posts, I am no longer interested in what you have to write. I don't trust your objectivity, and I tire of your constant, harping negativity. I'm going to put you on ignore, and I suggest you save yourself from your self-imposed drama and do the same to me.

Thanks for literally asking me highlight any more serious errors or false claims that you make. ;-)

Remember, I'm not playing to the true believers such as your self. You seem to have forgotten that.
post #53 of 410
Ok here it goes, what's inside the box ????? i don't know and i don't care, what's important to me is do i like the sound of my system with these cables ????? if the answer is yes well that's the ONLY important thing for me, i upgraded from MIT Shotgun speaker cables to Tara Labs Temporal Continuum and i still don't know what's in the box and i still don't care because my system sounds better with these cables and i'm very happy.


337
post #54 of 410
Looks like the controller to my electric Blanket'Do your speakers get warmer when you turn it up.
post #55 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAcoustat View Post

Ok here it goes, what's inside the box ????? i don't know and i don't care, what's important to me is do i like the sound of my system with these cables ????? if the answer is yes well that's the ONLY important thing for me, i upgraded from MIT Shotgun speaker cables to Tara Labs Temporal Continuum and i still don't know what's in the box and i still don't care because my system sounds better with these cables and i'm very happy.
337

The logical approach you seem to be advocating in the above post appears to be much like Solipsism. The problem is that it creates a logic-proof box that cuts you off from interaction with others.

Is that your goal?
post #56 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAcoustat View Post

Ok here it goes, what's inside the box ????? i don't know and i don't care, what's important to me is do i like the sound of my system with these cables ????? if the answer is yes well that's the ONLY important thing for me, i upgraded from MIT Shotgun speaker cables to Tara Labs Temporal Continuum and i still don't know what's in the box and i still don't care because my system sounds better with these cables and i'm very happy.
337

They aren't cables

If you want to play around with EQ then get an EQ and have at it.
post #57 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinjuku View Post

They aren't cables
If you want to play around with EQ then get an EQ and have at it.

Right they are passive equalizers.
post #58 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinjuku View Post

They aren't cables
If you want to play around with EQ then get an EQ and have at it.

Well, certainly they are cables... They just aren't ONLY cables.
post #59 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rutgar View Post

Well, certainly they are cables... They just aren't ONLY cables.
There are cables inside of equalizers. Should they be called cables instead of equalizers?
post #60 of 410
Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahead View Post

Looks like the controller to my electric Blanket'
Do your speakers get warmer when you turn it up.

I think you're onto something. It also looks like the
head of an aquarium heater.
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