Comparison, Unbiased Review & Ranking of 12 High-End Home Cinema Audio Systems - Page 2

OK, before I get onto individual replies to all your respective posts there's a few things I'd like to say to everyone in general.

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Firstly, thank you to the few individuals who have stepped in to bring some sanity to this thread by asking relevant parties to cease with the unwarranted venomous attacks; although, given the nature of internet forums this sort of aggressive behaviour is pretty typical and only to be expected. I would ask however that moving forward could everyone please try a little harder to keep things to adult intelligent debate and discussion, as opposed to aggressive attacks.

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Secondly, I most certainly do NOT have any direct connection with any individual brand of A/V equipment nor do I benefit directly or indirectly from any individual company’s product sales in any way whatsoever. Furthermore, I do not sell ANY items of A/V equipment individually direct to the general public (i.e. I am not an A/V equipment retailer).

To help appease the Doubting Thomases in this regards I think it is only fair that I tell you more about myself; so prepare yourself to be bored with my life history!

I am the Managing Director of a property development business in the UK, having recently taken over the running of the family business after my father passed away from terminal small cell liver cancer.

My qualifications are actually that of Nutritional & Food Science, and as such I am a scientist; and for 10 years I headed the Research and Development department and served on the Board of Directors of a nutritional supplements manufacturer, a company that I was instrumental in founding and wherein I personally developed the entire product range. I sold the business prior to taking over my father’s property development business recently.

My interest and knowledge regards all things A/V related stems from a childhood interest in music hi-fi and then evolved into an obsession with home cinema.

My years of obsessing with home cinema began with the birth of home cinema in the UK and continued right through until today. Hence, my journey began with VCR plus large size 4:3 TV; then progressed onto LASERDISC plus 16:9 Widescreem CRT TV (ridiculously deep and heavy!); then DVD and LCD Projector; and now Blu-Ray and HD TV / 4K Projector.

Here’s a photo of me with one of my early home cinema builds, which was designed with both high-end music hifi and movies in mind:



This system comprised no less than 5 x M&K MX5000 Subwoofers (one on each channel), Diapason Adamantes III speakers (LCR and Surrounds), Naim Audio Monoblock Power Amplifiers, and Lexicon MC-12 Processor. (So whoever said I’ve never listened to M&K / MK Sound please kindly go and eat your words, since I have been listening to M&K / MK Sound audio equipment for quite literally decades!)

This system’s audio performance was comparatively much better than that of numerous other systems which were many times more expensive.

And here’s a photo of my latest home cinema, which I am mid-way through building right now and is my latest take on ‘The Ultimate Home Cinema’:



This is a preview of what I will be intending to post as another new thread, providing comprehensive details of my conception, design and build of what I consider to be ‘The Ultimate Home Cinema’ currently available. So be warned in advance that I will be mentioning which home cinema PROJECTOR I consider to be the very best currently available; and incidentally I don’t work for that company either!

In fact, this latest ‘Ultimate Home Cinema’ project of mine is my sole reason for carrying out my due diligence in ascertaining what is, in my opinion, the home cinema audio system with the best audio performance currently available. It was only recently that I suddenly realised I was not aware of anyone to date who has carried out such a comprehensive auditioning and evaluation of all the top home cinema audio brands; so I decided to compose and publish my report online as a gift to anyone and everyone interested in home cinema. Which brings me onto my third point, which is:

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Thirdly, please kindly note that this report is my opinion; you do not have to agree with or accept any of it.

In my humble opinion, this sort of comprehensive comparison report is well overdue; and it is a crime that I am the first to do it. I will reiterate that you are perfectly entitled to your own opinion and inevitably not everyone will concur with my opinions. So I would urge others who are similarly placed as myself, namely wholly unbiased, to carry out similar comprehensive comparisons and post your views. There needs to be a lot more of this sort of impartial feedback, don’t you think?

Either way, you can do whatever you like with it; print it out and use it for toilet paper for all I care!

Or alternatively, why not take on board some of what I have said, and then go and audition whatever are the audio systems that are of interest to you and make up your own mind.

Personally, anyone who considers even for an instant purchasing a home cinema audio system costing upwards of £18,000 without auditioning it first, in my opinion, is an imbecile.

In fact, you should not just limit your audition to one brand of home cinema equipment; go and listen to at least three and then make up your mind which you like best before buying.

So I guess what I am trying to say that I do not in fact want anyone to buy any system that costs this sort of money without auditioning both it and at least a couple of others first; and choose which ones to audition according to what are your preferences. For example, if you are passionate about horn-type speakers then I strongly urge you to audition the PRO Audio Technology audio system; or if your maximum budget is £18,000 then you really should go and audition the MK Sound audio system.

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Fourthly, it is abundantly clear that a great many of you who are so quick to criticise and hurl insults have not in fact read my report properly, and that you have simply flipped through it and perhaps glanced at the back page before drawing all sorts of incorrect conclusions. I would therefore request that everyone please kindly ensure that you have actually read my report properly before posting your comments and questions.

One glaringly obvious example of this is with regards to the implications that my report exclusively entails pimping Steinway Lyngdorf. This is in fact not the case. Those actually bothering to read my report properly will note that I clearly indicate my opinion is that:

- MK Sound is without a doubt the very best home cinema audio system that you can buy for £18,000.

- Widsom Audio has the best audio performance of all ‘conventional-type’ operating home cinema audio systems (with ‘conventional-type’ being defined as carrying out digital to analogue conversion within the A/V Processor / Receiver stage, and then amplifying in the analogue domain)

- PRO Audio Technology is by far the best Horn-Type speaker home cinema audio system.

- James Loudspeaker has the best overall score of all ‘conventional-type’ home cinema audio systems.

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And finally, there is a fundamental reason WHY Steinway Lyngdorf has superior audio performance, which anyone who understands how home cinema audio equipment operates should be able to understand. I have explained all of this in detail in my report; so I suggest those who have not already done so see page 34 and read the section wherein I have explained how the audio system works and why it is superior.

It is crystal clear that those who have been so quick to criticise me simply cannot have read this; hence, I would ask that if you wish to discuss matters further that you do so first, because it is impossible to discuss something properly when your information level is incomplete.

N.B. I will get onto replying to your individual posts, but since there is a lot to get through, I would ask again for you to be a little patient with me!

Thank you for your comments regarding appreciating my taking to the time to complete my write up...And YES, it is most certainly is legit.


In my opinion, without a doubt the very best home cinema audio system that you can buy for £18,000 is the one in my report by MK Sound; and that one includes TWO subwoofers, which if your room size isn't that big you could get away with only one, which would make the system even cheaper. Furthermore, you could opt for 5.1 as opposed to 7.1 speaker setup which would be cheaper still and still sound excellent for the price.



Yes, I wholeheartedly agree; which is why I always recommend auditioning any audio system you are considering before buying it; and preferably a few others too

However, this would not affect the respective systems' strengths and weaknesses; for example, if an audio system sounds harsh and induces ear fatigue when played at cinema reference levels, it is still going to do so whatever are your particular speaker preferences.


Well, yours might be...

Furthermore, that's where taking copious notes during the audition proves somewhat helpful


Yes, which is an excellent point; and I would add that those rooms had differing levels of acoustic room treatment too, which would most certainly to an extent affect audio performance.

Obviously, the ideal would have been to audition all these systems in the same room, however that is quite simply not feasible, so I did the best that I could in the circumstances to keep influencing factors to a minimum.


Thank you for the positive feedback. Yes, I was hoping that some people might find that information useful.


It is really all or nothing. This is because Steinway Lyngdorf's audio systems operate differently to all other audio systems. In all other audio systems the digital signal is converted to analogue at the AV Processor / Receiver stage, degrading the signal quality, and then amplified in the digital domain, which contaminates the audio signal with noise and further degrades the signal quality; whereas with Steinway Lyngdorf the audio signal is maintained as a full resolution digital signal throughout the electronics, meaning it eliminates all the audio quality degradation caused by the way conventional-type audio systems operate. As such, you cannot take a subcomponent of a Steinway Lyngdorf audio system and combine it with a subcomponent of a conventional-type audio system. To attempt to do so would be akin to attempting to put a square peg through a round hole.


Sorry, but I live in the UK and pounds is our currency... However, I'm having tea with the Queen tomorrow, so I'll make a note to ask her to change it to dollars for you

And the JBL system is ridiculous not just because of its outragious price... (ooh I bet I just annoyed a few more people by saying that! I had better don the body armour again and brace myself for the next wave of attacks!)
Edited by madboynutter - 7/6/12 at 5:37pm

**Sigh**

No, people do not pay me for this... This is a system that I designed and built FOR ME; in my living room. It was an experimental 'outside the box' designed home cinema audio system, which was about two decades ahead of its time with regards to audio performance.

It incorporated an additional pair of speakers utlizing an invention of my brother's (that he'd named Panoramic Audio) which was practically identical to the recent Audyssey DSX beyond 5.1 technology, although this was over 20 YEARS prior to Audyssey launched their product; and the unusual positioning of the front speakers was integral to the system's performance... As it happens that system was without a doubt one of the better sounding audio systems available. In fact, it sounded better than audio systems ten times its price. The audio dynamics and ambience were incredible.

However, I have no interest in having an argument with you; as you have so far only demonstrated capacity and desire to criticise and insult a complete stranger... how incredibly manly of you... If you decide you are interested in having an intelligent conversation as opposed to simply attacking and insulting me then let me know.


Since you have read it, please tell me what the fundamental reason why Steinway Lyngdorf is superior in audio quality then please.

In short, no and no.

Sceptre Audio Visual Ltd is a Trade Only company who's sole function is to service the A/V needs of Sceptre Property Development Ltd.

Hence, sorry to rain on your parade, but no, we are not "asked for equipment recommendations from [our] clients" because Sceptre Audio Visual's only 'Client' is Sceptre Property Development

Furthermore, Sceptre Property Development Ltd. operates exclusively internal aquisitions, development and then resale. It does not have any Clients either.

Also, any and all decisions with regards to which A/V equipment is purchased and used in our property developments is made by me, and only me.

So, I reiterate for the umpteenth time that I do NOT have any affiliation whatsoever with any manufacturer.

I trust that clarifies matters for you.
Edited by madboynutter - 7/6/12 at 3:40pm

**sigh (again)**

Firstly, I note with amusement that you haven't answered my question, which only proves my point.

Secondly, you are perfectly entitled to your opinion; I have already repeatedly stated that this report is simply my opinion. You don't agree with it, then I respect your opinion. You are quite correct that the first picture that I have posted includes a highly unusual arrangement of speakers; but that wasn't the only aspect of the system that was highly unsual. You have dismissed the system as somehow incorrect or wrong, when you quite frankly don't know what you are tlaking about. Yes, it breaks the 'rules' of speaker placement, and intentionally so.

It might interest you to learn that I invented a formula for Ice Cream that contains no sugar, and only a healthy type of fat that actually makes you lose weight. It does not contain the usual ingredients that ice cream contains, so does that make it incorrect, or that I am any less able to make ice cream than the next person who will only make it using the standard ingredients? No it does not; it simply means that I think outside the box and you don't.

Thirdly, as stated I have no interest in arguing with you, because it is so transparently obvious that you are the sort to argue that apples are in fact oranges just for the sake of being deliberately argumentative.

Quite frankly, I have no interest in defending myself someone who does nothing but attack and insult. Like I have said, if you want to have an adult intelligent conversation then let me know.

I thought I was in process of answering all the questions posed to me... I also thought I'd made it clear (more than once) that due to there being a lot of replying to do it will take me some time to complete my replies to everyone's posts. As such, I have asked (again more than once) that everyone be a little patient with me in this regard.

I happen to work ridiculously long hours at the moment so am doing the best that I can to answer everyone as fast as I can.

So stop being obnoxious by accusing me of not doing so, OK?

Hey Chris,

Firstly, you are making a gross error in your incredibly naive overgeneralization that someone can only be an expert in one field. Hence, the fundamental flaw in your logic that because my professional background includes that of Nutritional & Food Science, excludes me form also having expertise in Audio Visual too.

As it happens, it might interest you to learn that further to Nutritional Science and A/V, I also run a highly successful property development company; and with respect to our largest property development at the moment, namely a 5,000 square foot conversion of a commerical factory to high-end residential house, I was personally responsible for completing all the design work, specification for works brief, as well as 128 architectural construction drawings, including all scale floor plans, side elevations and 3D Visuals etc...

And I happen to be a mean cook too

So, with the utmost respect, I suggest that you reserve your insults like "your horribly flawed techniques" until after I have posted my upcoming new thread outlining in detail my latest Ultimate Home Cinema build... because when you see what I have designed and built you will need to eat those insults for breakfast
Edited by madboynutter - 7/6/12 at 6:00pm

Quite the conspiracy theorist aren't we? And very much a troll who likes stirring the pot too...

And you need to look up the definition of SPAM, since I am afraid that posting a wholly relevant report on solely the three most popular A/V Forums does not qualify as SPAMMING.

Thank you for proving my point, namely that you haven't bothered to actually read my report.


Again, you fail to comprehend. You have not been doing anything wrong; and neither have I.

And since I have no interest in repeating myself, then if you choose to be deliberately obtuse then good luck with that.

Incidentally, it is most interesting to note how you insist on persisting with the baseless insults.


The only thing to be sorry about is your failure to comprehend my wholly relevant analogy.

Let me explain it for you... Thinking outside the box = doing the out of the ordinary.

Or let me put it this way, Audyssey DSX speaker set up involves "unconventional speaker placement", so I must assume you have also sent a message to Chris Kyriakakis at Audyssey telling him his "unconventional speaker placement" is 'wrong' and insulting him by saying something along the lines "Are you serious? People pay you for this? I wonder what the speaker manufacturer would think of you positioning speakers right up near the ceiling and ridiculously wide"


That is without a doubt the most intelligent thing you have said yet. Yes, some very good questions have indeed been posed and I will endeavour to answer them as soo as I can.

And by the way, I am really looking forward to what you have to say about my current Ultimate Home Cinema build (when I get a free minute to start the thread!)
Edited by madboynutter - 7/6/12 at 4:27pm

1) RE: "your lack of identity is a real problem" - My identity is not a problem as this thread now contains a lot of information about myself that demonstrates that I do indeed not have any affiliation with any brand of A/V equipment.

2) RE :You do not say what expertise you have in audio - I have stated what expertise I have in audio, namely circa 20 years experience stemming from a childhood interest in high-end music hi-fi to present day obsession with home cinema, including designing and building home cinemas.

3) RE: "You don't say how you came to listen to all of these systems" - Isn't it obvious? In most cases I visited the demonstration centre of the UK Distributor for the respective brand of A/V equipment; e.g. I auditioned the Wisdom Audio and PRO Audio Technology audio systems at the UK distributor’s (Genesis Technologies; Neil Davidson) demonstration centre in Bracknell, Berkshire; I auditioned the Steinway Lyngdorf, MK Sound and James Loudspeaker audio systems at the UK distributor’s (Gecko, Rob Sinden) demonstration centre in Newbury, Berkshire; I auditioned the Artcoustic audio system at the UK distributor’s (Artcoustic UK; Paul Cummin) demonstration centre in Chelmsford, Essex; and so on…Otherwise I audtioned systems whilst visiting the USA or set up and tested at my home.

4) RE: "You say nothing about the how limited your aural memory might be, or how it might be affecting your ratings (obviously you want us to believe your memory is some absolute standard of judgement). You present us with the golden ears fallacy when you say you can tell the difference between lossless HD and CD, and then you go on to say CD audio is compressed" - What??? Are you seriously telling me that you can't tell the difference between a CD and a SACD or DVD-A?! Just because I can doesn't mean I have 'golden ears' it just means I'm not tone deaf!

5) RE "I like how you mention your favored brand again and again in all-caps; this is a common technique in marketing, so one doesn't forget the brand name" - Oh blimey, here we go! It's a conspiracy! Seriously, you are imagining things. I mean come on! What are you implying? That I am a Steinway marketing agent working deep undercover by infiltrating A/V forums to boost company sales by spelling Steinway Lyngdorf in my posts using CAPITALS as opposed to lower case letters?! Sheez! I won't use CAPITALS any more, happy?

6) RE: "I like how you mention your favored brand" - Since I clearly state in my report that the best home cinema audio system that you can buy for £18,000 is MK Sound then I guess that makes my favored brand MK, right? Or is it PRO Audio Technology, which is the best horn-type speaker audio system? Or perhaps Wisdom Audio, the best sounding conventional-type audio system?

7) RE: "Any of these would raise red flags for a guerrilla marketer, but taken altogether it looks pretty bad for you" - Hey, watch out, THEY are coming for you! Quick, put on your tin foil hat so THEY can't steal your brainwaves!

But you didn't answer it correctly, which proves you haven't read my report properly.

In short, the reason why Steinway Lyngdorf is superior in audio quality is because Steinway Lyngdorf audio systems operate differently to all other audio systems. In all other audio systems the digital signal is converted to analogue at the AV Processor / Receiver stage, degrading the signal quality, and then amplified in the analogue domain, which contaminates the audio signal with noise and further degrades the signal quality; whereas with Steinway Lyngdorf the audio signal is maintained as a full resolution digital signal throughout the electronics, meaning it eliminates all the audio quality degradation caused by the way conventional-type audio systems operate.

Elimination of audio quality degradation + elmination of noise introduction = Superior audio quality. QED.

You can quite literally turn the volume knob up to maximum and put your ear to any of the speakers and you will hear absolutely no background noise whatsoever... no hiss, no hum, nothing. How many other audio systems can you say that about, eh?

And how many other audio systems have 100% eliminated the audio quality degradation caused by converting the digital signal to analogue at the pre-amp stage and then amplifying in the analogue domain? That's right... NONE.

NOW do you understand?