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Prometheus - Page 2  

post #31 of 997
7/7/12 at 9:45am
I just finished seeing this. It was certainly worth $6 but I would not have wanted to pay $10 or $12 for it.

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post #32 of 997
7/7/12 at 2:52pm
So you watched a blu-ray that isn't out yet? Or you saw it streaming via VOD which is not going to be comparable to what is seen at the theater and will pale in comparison to the blu-ray release. And of course, you could not have seen it in 3D for $6 - maybe a bargain matinee in 2D and not on an optimal screen or audio system.
post #33 of 997
7/7/12 at 3:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fookoo_2010 View Post

So you watched a blu-ray that isn't out yet? Or you saw it streaming via VOD which is not going to be comparable to what is seen at the theater and will pale in comparison to the blu-ray release. And of course, you could not have seen it in 3D for $6 - maybe a bargain matinee in 2D and not on an optimal screen or audio system.
I saw it in 3D on day one for less than six dollars in a theater with fantastic projection and audio quality. But, of course, I don't live in the United States. rolleyes.gif

As for the film itself, I thought it was quite a mess (I blame that Lost writer guy!) but I liked it enough to own it on Blu-ray one day.
post #34 of 997
7/7/12 at 3:15pm
I am proud of never watching any stereovision and I will always be that way. I am also proud to say I prefer 'slow' films any day of the week and Prometheus' lack of slowness is one of it's biggest problems. Believe it or not scientists and researchers do not throw themselves head first cause doing things that way will get their heads smashed.
post #35 of 997
7/7/12 at 7:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

I think a lot of the those concerns are warrantless and just people expecting a simple, cookie cutter movie.

This is exactly the opposite of what I just said. I did not expect or want a simple, cookie cutter movie. I hoped for a movie with some modicum of intelligence in its writing and direction. What I got instead was a simple, cookie cutter movie filled with stupid characters doing stupid, illogical things just for the sake of being morons.

My problem with the movie isn't that it doesn't explain enough. My problem is that the movie explains too much, and every one of its explanations is uniformly dumb.
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This isn't Fountain, but it's deeper than Inception for sure. Comparing it to AvP is ridiculous on any count, and I'm wondering when the last time you saw 2001 was. Muppet Babies doesn't count.

That's nice. I complain that the movie isn't very smart, and you somehow use this to infer that I must be an idiot who only likes Muppet Babies, whatever that's supposed to mean. If you think that Prometheus is on the same level as 2001, then it's clearly you who didn't understand anything in 2001.
post #36 of 997
7/8/12 at 12:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by wuther View Post

Believe it or not scientists and researchers do not throw themselves head first cause doing things that way will get their heads smashed.
Like I said above....the weakest part of the movie.frown.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

This is exactly the opposite of what I just said. I did not expect or want a simple, cookie cutter movie. I hoped for a movie with some modicum of intelligence in its writing and direction. What I got instead was a simple, cookie cutter movie filled with stupid characters doing stupid, illogical things just for the sake of being morons.
My problem with the movie isn't that it doesn't explain enough. My problem is that the movie explains too much, and every one of its explanations is uniformly dumb.
That's nice. I complain that the movie isn't very smart, and you somehow use this to infer that I must be an idiot who only likes Muppet Babies, whatever that's supposed to mean. If you think that Prometheus is on the same level as 2001, then it's clearly you who didn't understand anything in 2001.
I am STILL celebrating the 4th...
I'll seperate you 2 guys tomorrow...when my brain is at a point where I can legally drive a car.wink.giftongue.gifsmile.gif
post #37 of 997
7/8/12 at 7:14am
Meh.

People complain about Milburn, yet Kane in ALIEN was just as reckless. "But, but, but they're space truckers" people invariably say.... And while true, they're space truckers in the care of a multi-billion, if not trillion dollar ore refinery ship. That both the commander and XO leave in orbit alone. And then they both proceed on an away mission to investigate possibly intelligent alien life, leaving a lowly Lieutenant in charge.

Then there's specimen B:


I really think a lot of hate comes down to two things:
Lost Butthurt, when people find out Linds co-wrote it.
Being more critical because something is new

I can think of a hundred other science fiction movies that were much worst, but I can still enjoy them. Maybe people just had unrealistic expectations?
Edited by TyrantII - 7/8/12 at 10:03am
post #38 of 997
7/8/12 at 7:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Funny then that he keeps making extended or Director's Cuts for so many of his other movies.
Alien
Legend
Gladiator
Black Hawk Down
Kingdom of Heaven
American Gangster
Robin Hood

I think with Alien, the studios said they were going to do a new cut with or without him. And he prefered making an alternative cut himself. I dont know the story with his other movies but I guess he isnt bothered with studios cashing in on extended cuts of his movies. Doesnt say he actually likes the extended cuts, just that they are part of the movie business.
post #39 of 997
7/8/12 at 7:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Maybe people just had unrealistic expectations?
I think that's exactly the issue. Everyone went in with the words "Alien prequel" and "Ridley Scott" floating around in their heads, and they wanted it to be another Alien, and it wasn't. So they come out of the theater disappointed, and they have to find an outlet, and so they pick apart the writing and story (in a way that I have never seen), and put all the blame on the guy who came in late and cleaned up the script.

Well, Jon Spaiths' script is on the disc, so I guess we'll finally see just how much of it was Lindelhof's "fault". As if Ridley Scott just blindly shoots any script that's laid in front of him without any kind of feedback.

As for the nitpicking, it's clearly a matter of holding this film to a different standard than every other film out there. The "mistakes" that people complain about happen in a dozen movies a year, and they've been there since the dawn of filmmaking. And yet, in this film, alone among all others, it becomes the single worst bit of writing in the history of cinema. Why don't people pick apart the Transformers films this way?

Ridley said it himself.. "This isn't a science class, it's a movie." It was never meant to be a life-changing experience, it's just a movie, designed to entertain and to make money. That's all. Anything beyond that is wishful thinking.
post #40 of 997
7/8/12 at 8:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi2016 View Post

Apologist rant
I love reading these. It's like a big game of 'I Don't Seem To Understand Why People Weren't Impressed With It, But I'll Try To Tell Them Anyway."

Hint: It has sod all to do with it's link,(or not), to Alien.

To be clear, I think that Prometheus was a gorgeous looking movie, that started off with a concept that I was eager to follow.
Then I found out, that it was the movie equivalent of Caprice, in that it looked fabulous, but it's head was full of ****.

I don't think people would be concerned as much about plot inconsistencies, etc, if the actual characters were up to scratch.
As it is, they were either starved of oxygen or lobotomised during cryo-sleep.
Edited by raoul_duke - 7/8/12 at 8:50am
post #41 of 997
7/8/12 at 10:03am
I acknowledge that the film has flaws. But I don't care. They do not lessen my enjoyment of the film, and they will not stop me from buying the Blu-ray.

My point above was the extreme level of utter hatred that people have for this film. The only conceivable reason for this could be that the people who hate the film so violently had some kind of personal interest in what they wanted the film to be, and were emotionally devastated when the film didn't meet that level of expectation. The only other time I've seen anything even approaching this level of negativity are the SW prequels, and that's a known quantity of "didn't meet my personal expectations", and people who are unable to enjoy films for what they are instead of what you want them to be.

I'm really sorry if Prometheus didn't meet your expectations, but I see no reason for you to come into the thread for no other reason than to tell us all how much you hated it. A simple "Didn't like it, not buying it" would have been fine, or better yet, just stay the hell out of the thread entirely. But if you insist on spelling out a big long list of arguments about how horrible the film is, then you should expect a response, and you should be prepared to accept that not everyone agrees with you. I won't change your mind about the film, and I'm not trying to. So don't you try to change my mind, either.
post #42 of 997
7/8/12 at 10:26am
If you can find a single post where I said I 'hated it', you can have a lovely big gold star.

Where I will agree with you, is the level of bile thrown at it, from every corner of the internet, by people that odds are, haven't even seen the damn thing.
But then, isn't this expected these days? The sheer nonsense I've seen levelled at The Amazing Spider-Man, again, by people that haven't even seen it, is astonishing.

As I say, I enjoyed the look of it and some of the questions posed, even if they weren't ultimately answered. I've seen it twice so far and plan on seeing it again,
when the BD comes out, so there must be something in there. smile.gif

Peace.
post #43 of 997
7/8/12 at 12:14pm
Frankly the scripts for Alien 3 and Alien 4 make Prometheus' look like Blade Runner.

It might not hit the heights of the first two but the series is definitely in an upward spiral.
post #44 of 997
7/8/12 at 2:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordAwesome View Post

Frankly the scripts for Alien 3 and Alien 4 make Prometheus' look like Blade Runner.
It might not hit the heights of the first two but the series is definitely in an upward spiral.

It's funny you mention that, as both Blade Runner and ALIEN were absurdly routed by the press when they were released as garbage, unimaginative tripe, and of not making much sense. Like them, I think Prometheus's legs will grow a little taller with time, and be appreciated a bit more. For sure, it's not those movies, nor up to their caliber. It does has some big flaws.

But I think you're on to something about the trash bin the internet can be, expected or not. Twitter and facebook (social media) gang up on it are an interesting study. I see a lot of know-nothings trashing it as the second coming of Battlefield Earth.

Meanwhile the consensus between my friends and myself was that we were happy to at least get an valid attempt at bug budget, adult, serious science fiction back on screen. It didn't quite get there, but it entertained none the less, and got us talking and contemplating at the least.
post #45 of 997
7/8/12 at 2:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

I'll separate you 2 guys tomorrow...when my brain is at a point where I can legally drive a car.wink.giftongue.gifsmile.gif
OOOK, where were we?
Oh yeah...AvP or 2001.

Actually, you guys (Josh & Tyrant) are BOTH right....and wrong.

Prometheus has elements obviously derived from AvP.
RS has said he admires the movie (or portions of it?).

Prometheus and AvP has:
Archaeologists discover artwork and/or hieroglyphs that inspire Weyland to hire a ragtag team of scientists to investigate a large unknown object in an inhospitable place....that turns out to be a pyramid....housing nasty killer extraterrestrials....which proceeds to wipe out stupid humans....with one marooned survivor left to tell the tale (hopefully).


Prometheus and 2001 has:
A mysterious object(s) beckoning humans to a faraway world to make contact with alien life-form(s).
The ultimate discovery in each film is an explanation of human origins and future human evolution.


It is not accurate to say neither AvP nor 2001 has a connection to Prometheus.
Both films are acknowledged in RS's movie....IMO.wink.gif

And FWIW, you can't compare AvP to 2001....the only thing they share is humans and spaceships.
post #46 of 997
7/8/12 at 4:16pm
How about no explanation to the journey you take with the main character?

Thats the other thing I think Ridley went for here. A lot happens, but nothing is explained. It happens to the viewer as well as to the main characters (Shaw and David), but we don't know why or how. As far as I can tell, that ambiguity is really, really pissing off some people. That things are not explained is really grating for them. 2001 was in much the same vein. It's a very ambiguous movie, and the story really is just following the characters along through their own wonderland. Nothing about 2001 is explained as well.
post #47 of 997
7/8/12 at 9:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

How about no explanation to the journey you take with the main character?
Thats the other thing I think Ridley went for here. A lot happens, but nothing is explained. It happens to the viewer as well as to the main characters (Shaw and David), but we don't know why or how.
That is where the sequel comes in (I hope).
As has been stated before, Prometheus was originally conceived as a 2-parter.

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As far as I can tell, that ambiguity is really, really pissing off some people. That things are not explained is really grating for them.
Oh well, can't please everyone.tongue.gif

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2001 was in much the same vein. It's a very ambiguous movie, and the story really is just following the characters along through their own wonderland. Nothing about 2001 is explained as well.
And VERY deliberately so by Kubrick.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interpretations_of_2001:_A_Space_Odyssey
post #48 of 997
7/8/12 at 10:11pm
As i tell my fiance every time we see it (seen it 4 times now).

This is a really good bad movie...or wait..its a really bad good movie...

But i can't wait for the home release. =)
post #49 of 997
7/9/12 at 6:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

It's funny you mention that, as both Blade Runner and ALIEN were absurdly routed by the press when they were released as garbage, unimaginative tripe, and of not making much sense. Like them, I think Prometheus's legs will grow a little taller with time, and be appreciated a bit more.

Alien and Blade Runner both had originality going for them (I don't recall either ever being described as "unimaginative")--Prometheus doesn't. I don't really see much too distinguish Prometheus from other recent sci-fi/horror flicks like Sunshine and Pandorum.

Hell, I find Event Horizon to be a more interesting movie than Prometheus. EH even has superior production design, and if a director like RS who is so known for his visual style can't surpass a fifteen year old movie directed by Paul W.S. Anderson, that's kind of sad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

I see a lot of know-nothings trashing it as the second coming of Battlefield Earth.
Meanwhile the consensus between my friends and myself was that we were happy to at least get an valid attempt at bug budget, adult, serious science fiction back on screen. It didn't quite get there, but it entertained none the less, and got us talking and contemplating at the least.

The only thing Prometheus left me contemplating was how it could be so damn awful. It just had a terrible, terrible script.
post #50 of 997
7/9/12 at 8:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi2016 View Post

I think that's exactly the issue. Everyone went in with the words "Alien prequel" and "Ridley Scott" floating around in their heads, and they wanted it to be another Alien, and it wasn't.

What I wanted was a movie that wasn't dumb, regardless of what franchise it was attached to or who made it. Sadly, what I got was a movie that was very dumb.
Quote:
So they come out of the theater disappointed, and they have to find an outlet, and so they pick apart the writing and story (in a way that I have never seen), and put all the blame on the guy who came in late and cleaned up the script.

By "pick apart the writing and story (in a way that I have never seen)," I take it that you mean, "point out the countless and omnipresent inanitites in every aspect of the script."

How can you possibly watch this movie and not recognize how idiotic its characters behave? The teenagers in a Friday the 13th sequel are smarter than these clowns.
Quote:
As for the nitpicking, it's clearly a matter of holding this film to a different standard than every other film out there. The "mistakes" that people complain about happen in a dozen movies a year, and they've been there since the dawn of filmmaking. And yet, in this film, alone among all others, it becomes the single worst bit of writing in the history of cinema. Why don't people pick apart the Transformers films this way?

In what universe do you live where nobody called the Transformers movies stupid?

What you're really saying here is that Prometheus is of the same written quality as Transformers. On that, I can wholeheartedly agree.
Quote:
Ridley said it himself.. "This isn't a science class, it's a movie." It was never meant to be a life-changing experience, it's just a movie, designed to entertain and to make money. That's all. Anything beyond that is wishful thinking.

The weakest possible defense there can possibly be. "It's just a movie. It's supposed to be stupid!" Well, congratulations. Mission accomplished on that. Ridley Scott & co went above and beyond in that respect.
post #51 of 997
7/9/12 at 8:38am
Red Letter Media mentions many of the issues and glaring flaws found in character motivations, mythos, and plot; which completely deflates any semblance of suspension of disbelief.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x1YuvUQFJ0

2001 is a cinematic poem of ambiguity, open to interpretation that does not insult the intellect of the audience whereas Prometheus arbitrarily dangles the setup with no punchline.

Perhaps an extended version will flesh things about but the flaws of the script will remain. I enjoyed the visuals and found the premise interesting but ill conceived.

Best Regards
KvE
post #52 of 997
7/9/12 at 8:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMFDMvsEnya View Post

Red Letter Media mentions many of the issues and glaring flaws found in character motivations, mythos, and plot; which completely deflates any semblance of suspension of disbelief.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x1YuvUQFJ0
2001 is a cinematic poem of ambiguity, open to interpretation that does not insult the intellect of the audience whereas Prometheus arbitrarily dangles the setup with no punchline.
Perhaps an extended version will flesh things about but the flaws of the script will remain. I enjoyed the visuals and found the premise interesting but ill conceived.
Best Regards
KvE

That RLM skit was actually satire. They did it to draw in trolls, then spun it around laughing at how predictable those folks were. It worked brilliantly.

Their real review, which is just as ambiguous as the movie, can be seen here: http://redlettermedia.com/half-in-the-bag-prometheus/

Their conclusion was it was flawed, but entertaining and interesting. And that if you can't enjoy a movie like Prometheus, you "must hate everything and probably should stop going to the cinema".

smile.gif
post #53 of 997
7/9/12 at 9:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by raoul_duke View Post

I love reading these. It's like a big game of 'I Don't Seem To Understand Why People Weren't Impressed With It, But I'll Try To Tell Them Anyway."
.

Lol I agree. Blade runner is my favorite film and always has been with Alien/Aliens close behind. I just saw Prometheus and was blown away. What a fabulous film. It will share an honored place amongst Alien/Aliens in my collection. Very much looking forward to the blu-ray.
post #54 of 997
7/9/12 at 9:09am
After listening to your linked video for a bit it sounds like a fair, as well cheeky, discussion. Looking forward to listening to it in full later.

Whether the first video is wholly satire it does make valid points of what I was referring to. Such as blatant disregard by a team of scientists to follow any quarantine protocols or practice any caution of common sense.

Best Regards
KvE
post #55 of 997
7/9/12 at 10:35am
I do agree. But lab work makes for such a boring movie.

Plus, I just chocked it up to the fact these group of "scientists" wittingly signed up for a 4 year deep space mission without any briefing on what their purpose was or where they were going, payable upon return. Grad students might go along with that, but no respectable scientist is signing up for that. Plus we find out later that the scientific mission is anything but. But that's me, I allow that stuff to go if a movie can pull itself together otherwise. Personally I feel like this one did.
post #56 of 997
7/9/12 at 1:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wuther View Post

I am proud of never watching any stereovision and I will always be that way.

I really can't understand this attitude. It just makes me imagine the same sorts of folks back in time: "I am proud of never watching any talkies and I will always be that way."

I'm not a huge fan of 3D in general, but Prometheus was composed, shot, dailied, and edited with stereoscopic equipment every step of the way, and there was not a single 3D gimmick effect in the entire film. After watching it in a digital 3D presentation at 4K resolution, I can say that there was definitely another level of immersion in story. I'd classify it as subtle, but it was there for sure, and it's a film that other stereoscopic movies can aspire to. Now, I admit that the studios are really hurting themselves with post-converted 3D drek like Clash of the Titans. I stay away from post-converted 3D like the plague, but when it's shot in 3D or animated in 3D, I seek it out in 3D, just like I'll be looking to view The Hobbit in 4K 48fps 3D if I can find a theater showing it that way, and do my best to keep an open mind about the frame rate. My philosophy is that the best way to watch any movie is to get as close as possible to the way the director reviewed the final cut.

Then again, for any haters of movie making innovation, don't let me try to change your mind. By all means continue to watch all of your movies in B&W at the Academy aspect ratio, the way they were meant to be, dad gummit!
post #57 of 997
7/9/12 at 3:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robonaut View Post

I don't really see much too distinguish Prometheus from other recent sci-fi/horror flicks like Sunshine and Pandorum.
You must be kidding.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

What I wanted was a movie that wasn't dumb, regardless of what franchise it was attached to or who made it.
I can't argue with you regarding too many dumb characters in the movie.
By far the weakest aspect of the movie....very disappointing.
But I am hoping an Extended Cut and/or a Sequel will help dim the memory.
At any rate, I felt the plusses easily outnumbered the minuses in Prometheus.wink.gif

BTW, I read your review of the Darbee....interesting.
Although I haven't tried it, your take on it is surprising (you are probably the last person I can think of who would like such a device wink.gif).
post #58 of 997
7/9/12 at 3:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie E View Post

I really can't understand this attitude. It just makes me imagine the same sorts of folks back in time: "I am proud of never watching any talkies and I will always be that way."
I'm not a huge fan of 3D in general, but Prometheus was composed, shot, dailied, and edited with stereoscopic equipment every step of the way, and there was not a single 3D gimmick effect in the entire film. After watching it in a digital 3D presentation at 4K resolution, I can say that there was definitely another level of immersion in story. I'd classify it as subtle, but it was there for sure, and it's a film that other stereoscopic movies can aspire to. Now, I admit that the studios are really hurting themselves with post-converted 3D drek like Clash of the Titans. I stay away from post-converted 3D like the plague, but when it's shot in 3D or animated in 3D, I seek it out in 3D, just like I'll be looking to view The Hobbit in 4K 48fps 3D if I can find a theater showing it that way, and do my best to keep an open mind about the frame rate. My philosophy is that the best way to watch any movie is to get as close as possible to the way the director reviewed the final cut.
Then again, for any haters of movie making innovation, don't let me try to change your mind. By all means continue to watch all of your movies in B&W at the Academy aspect ratio, the way they were meant to be, dad gummit!

+100
post #59 of 997
7/9/12 at 4:33pm
People do dumb things in life. People do dumb things in movies.

Alien 10
Aliens 9
Alien3 7
Alien Resurrection 6
Prometheus 8
post #60 of 997
7/9/12 at 5:18pm
Great input from every angle, enjoying the discussion....however, you're all making this one a tough decision to blind buy for those of us on the fence, lol!!!!
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