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Sony HDR-GW77: waterproof, dustproof, shockproof small HD camcorder - Page 13

post #361 of 637
Thanks Mark. Always appreciate your help.
Mike (railfan)
post #362 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rouky View Post

I have bought a kit including 2 batteries and a charger for less than 15$ .
These battries even have a better duration than the Sony's one
At this company
http://www.amazon.ca/CyberShot-DSC-T100-DSC-W100-DSC-W130-DSC-W150/dp/B0032GWZXE/ref=sr_1_11?ie=UTF8&m=A9M8PF7TMJFVZ&qid=1352685684&s=generic&sr=1-11

i bought an oem brand batteries for my sony xr550. early this year i borrowed my friend's sony cx700 and bring my oem batteries as spare. problem is the
new model knows it's not original battery and every 30sec of video. the battery incompatible message flashes. and i learned my lesson not to buy
cheap batteries and memory card.

i bought my spare gw77 batteries from sony. and reputable seller like bh photo.
post #363 of 637
I am surely lucky, no problem so far for me.
I have bought cheap battery for these cameras without problem: Sony Dsc-M1, Nikon S10, Canon sx230, Panasonic HX-DC10 and finally the GW77.
post #364 of 637
Hi Mark... thanks for your thread.. and your review and post on this Camcorder on practically ALL the forums.. ;P

Well I have beena shutterbug (leisure) and recently thought of videoing my son's graduation concert... he's at his final year at Kindergarten and would be heading to primary 1 next year.

Its so precious to "record" such significant years of their growing years... hence, i decided to get a "budgeted" model.

I thought of the CX120? (cant recall now) and handled it.. PLASTIC... CHEAP.. urmmm is it durable?? Is it good enough? were the thoughts in my head....
I use an EOS 5D MKII with L Lenses... hence I do have some expectations...
WAIT!!! I SAID I WANTED A BUDGET CAMCORDER....

Well. i then start surfing, google etc to read up more because I am TOTALLY A NOOB with camcorder.. (I had a JVC which was FREE 9yrs ago and NEVER actually used it ;P)

Search on the web lead me to some of your reviews and i zoomed in on this model.

Thanks to you..

Well... my budget became pretty reasonable considering the CX cost me S$600+ while the GW77 cost me just alttle less than S$1K.. I justified the "extras" bcos i can.......
DO UNDERWATER VIDEOS OF MY KIDS!!! (3 KIDS!! 3 x the mileage ;P)

Well wife wasnt actually stupid...... she said... WELL... nice... but WHO IS GONNA HOLD THE KIDS and KEEP AN EYE ON THEM WHEN YOU ARE FILMING as they can't actually Swim that well yet.!!!!!!!!!
tsk tsk tsk.... that didn't derail me of my determination and my "justification"

So here i am learning from you experts... PLEASE guide me oh MASTERS!!! I can only try to handle it from a shutterbug's experience...

Do share with me tips etc... I'll be back to read your comments...... AFTER i finish reading this thread ;P

Have an awesome weekend ahead... WISH me luck.. i have exactly 8days to get familiar with my new toy!! smile.gif
post #365 of 637
Well.. before I actually come back from that 13page on this thread..... a quick question is....

I plan to mount the 77 on a tripod for my son's concert (indoors with prolly lots of stage lights)... and will the 77 gets good audio from the stage etc?? do i need to do ANYTHING in particular? or do i just need to get the right lighting settings and start filming??

Cheers guys
post #366 of 637
I shoot granddaughters at school events.

My best results come with:
  • Leaving the camera on all automatic settings
  • Accepting that school performances have bad acoustics
  • Accepting that lighting is a mix of weird bulbs
  • Holding still -- a tripod is good
  • Not zooming during the shot
  • Not panning during the shot.
  • Thinking of it as a stationary photo with motion in it.
  • Knowing nobody will watch more than 3 minutes of it except me
  • Remembering that almost every photography habit and skill can get in the way of thinking video

You spent plenty of money to get capabilities in a camcorder where the engineers have worked to make features that overcome the difficulties of typical family video, like school performances. Let them do their work!

Famous and successful photographers usually work alone. Famous and successful cinematographers work in teams. Your team is all the automatic stuff in the camera. As the director, you have to concentrate on where to point it and when to push the red button.

With your 5D you can take a bunch of photos and with a quick trip through Lightroom, get a few that are worth looking at. With video it is different. Although Lightroom now includes some video tools for DSLR owners, it is a far cry from what you need to make a watchable video. The work only begins with the camcorder.

Use your 8 days to retrain your brain to think about video. Practicing and learning about all the ways to get your camcorder out of the automatic mode will work for the 5% of shots that need that. The other 95% will be ruined.

You might consider setting up your new camcorder at the concert and get it recording video with an audio track. Then, start shooting the 5D for tight close ups, intense expressions and other drama. In editing you can use the audio track as your base and lay stills on top of the video with fades. It will break up the boredom and add interest. Watch how it is done on TV.

Good luck!
post #367 of 637
Thanks Mark. I appreciate your effort in putting together a quick guide for a beginner like me. It's awesome.

I note yr emphasis on what are the difference looking thru the lens vs a LCD panel. That would be really usefully in training my handling, what to look for and re-program my perception.

I hv to agree with you on the investment. Sounds like a good tip. Wahahhaha. As u prolly also know, in SLRs or DSLR, no one uses much of the P mode. But it's opposite in camcorder according to you. Roger that. smile.gif

By the way. REEEAALLY NO ZOOOMING?? frown.gif

Well considering how smooth the zoom works. I thought I could prolly get some close up videos when he takes the stage.

Would it be better that I stop the video and then do close up when he takes the stage?
Or is it better to keep videoing the performance, when it's his turn, pan it to his direction and slowly zoom in?
OR just leave It totally alone.

I don't Wana ruin my ONLY chance to video his last performance in Pre-school and I doubt I would hv any "practice" of such a set up.

Mark. I am sorry but I lost you at the last para. Can u kindly elaborate??
Thanks bro. It's no wonder you hv earned te respect in this thread. smile.gif

Really truly appreciate your inputs and tips
post #368 of 637
P/s I've never done any video editing. Even on picture smile.gif. So I am a double noob!!!
post #369 of 637
I am picking up some odd noise in my audio. It sounds like vibration created by an internal fan. I actually sounds a bit like rolling film. Anyone else getting this?
post #370 of 637
It's not Mark. It's Bill. Mark may be busy elsewhere, like maybe the 3D forum, working or even flying to some far off place for more video. But he taught me everything I know, except for which camera to buy last summer. I a different one than the GW77, so I probably don't belong here! (grin)

" the difference looking thru the lens vs a LCD panel. That would be really usefully in training my handling, what to look for and re-program my perception."
It is not about view finders and LCDs. It is about what you are looking for. With photos you are trying to catch split seconds or freeze frames. With video you are looking for interesting motion and good sound. The minds eye has to work differently.

"As u prolly also know, in SLRs or DSLR, no one uses much of the P mode. But it's opposite in camcorder according to you."
I watched a Lightroom 4 seminar somewhere on the internet. It was conducted by an Adobe executive. When you install Lightroom you are given the option of sharing usage data with Adobe so they can tune future releases. For all the converstion about the need to use manual controls for good results, the real data at Adobe says that automatic modes are by far the dominant mode, both in shooting and post processing -- even for working pros.

" REEEAALLY NO ZOOOMING??"
It hurts view eyes and makes people seasick. Watch TV or YouTubes. When it is used right, it is so slow and subtle it enhances the video. It has to be slow and subtle enough that the viewer does not notice. Same for panning. It's like Tabasco. A little goes a long ways. If you watch Marks travel or baseball videos you can see how little he zooms and pans.

"Would it be better that I stop the video and then do close up when he takes the stage? "
Don't think like a photographer. Think like a videographer. I would probably do the zoom, but edit around it in the computer later. A pro would use two camcorders and mix the clips in editing. (I'm trying to learn how to do that in a project documenting a family elder talking about family history. I'm mixing clips taken by my two granddaughters.)

"Or is it better to keep videoing the performance, when it's his turn, pan it to his direction and slowly zoom in? "
You are thinking video! Good. With a photo camera you would see a wide shot and a zoom shot. With video you have to figure out what to do with the in-between. I googled "kindergarten concert". There are plenty to look at where you can see what others did both right and wrong. FWIW this one seems to be something I would watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM6ouKDHS60

Here is another with less than the best pans, zooms and camcorder stability: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8ol7ED9Qcs&feature=related

"Mark. I am sorry but I lost you at the last para. Can u kindly elaborate??"
Again, it's Bill. I was referring to video editing in a computer. It is part of what makes video compelling and has only been easy for a few years. Video editing software allows you to mix many layers of audio, video and photo. Using the kid concert as an example, you could set up a primary camera or a sound recorder to get the music. Then, if all the other parents shared their video and photos you could layer them on top of each other, selecting the best shots and clips while keeping the music intact. Watch the news on TV. They do it every night. The anchor will start off as a talking head in the studio. He/she will continue with the story while another clip from another camera at "the scene" enhances the story.
Edited by bsprague - 11/15/12 at 11:41am
post #371 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boe Barker View Post

I am picking up some odd noise in my audio. It sounds like vibration created by an internal fan. I actually sounds a bit like rolling film. Anyone else getting this?
Post a clip on YouTube so it can be heard here.
post #372 of 637
BILL BILL so sorry I got yr name wrong! smile.gif. Appreciate the advise and tips buddy. It's Sat for me tomorrow and I would start my "play" on the 77 with your tips. Thanks bro
post #373 of 637
Thread Starter 
GW77 video: Taipa Island, Macau and a White Balance tip

Casino glitz, making cookies, tourists, manual workers, European architecture, Asian religion.

https://vimeo.com/53735793

One tip: at various times you will see golden statuettes. Auto white balance sees the reflections from these as yellow and so tries to correct by adding blue. The result is a dull unrealistic yellowish color rather than the bright gold. So the gold parts were done in manual white balance using a left-behind white shopping bag as the white sheet in push-to-set. The same problem occures in shooting fire, which is mostly bright yellow - auto wb tries to make it whiter by adding blue. Luckily the GW77 has a manual wb mode, which is easy to set. Auto wb does a pretty good job in normal situations (better than the Panasonic models).
Edited by markr041 - 11/17/12 at 5:34pm
post #374 of 637
The sound is faint, but present. If you listen closely, you will here a sound similar to a fan spinning. Not the wind that would be produced, but the sound of a vibration. I did not have the ceiling fan on, nor is this a single occurrence. I've tried both normal and low audio choices.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W9trIx1ZAY

http://youtu.be/y5FI_gZv01w


Side note: Using the auto white balance and exposure, I tend to get this desaturated look. I have had some improvement with switching to manual white balance settings, but the color remains desaturated. Easy fix in fcp, but none the less an extra step.
post #375 of 637
Is there a way to record the videos without opening the LCD screen? And what about recording with the LCD like this? http://cdn.pocket-lint.com/images/GnP6/sony-hdr-gw77v-handycam-waterproof-to-16-feet-announced-5.jpg?20120606-195502
post #376 of 637
Thread Starter 
"Desaturated look": there is a discussion of this already in this thread. This "look" is the result of overexposure, which often happens in auto *exposure* mode. Has nothing at all to do with white balance.

I have posted many videos taken with the GW77 in this thread; do you see a "desaturated" look? The Sony's score well on color saturation, but you have to get the exposure right. The lcd is very accurate - the "desaturated" look appears on the lcd screen while you are shooting if you are overexposing. This happens if there is a large dark area in the frame, for example. I cannot view Youtube videos here in China (Vimeo is not ok either for viewing), so I am going on experience.

You can shoot with the LCD flat on the camera and facing out.
Edited by markr041 - 11/19/12 at 5:23am
post #377 of 637
Any input on the sound Mark?

As for the exposure, I'll experiment more (I actually saw the exposure comments after I wrote the post) I tried adjusting the exposure manually, but still had a similar result.

Thanks for your help.
post #378 of 637
Just visited a couple of websites for businesses that sell the Gw77, and I noticed that after dropping the price a few weeks ago, those prices are right back up near where they were in the first place. Anyone have a clue as to what's up with the price fluctuations?
post #379 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boe Barker View Post

Any input on the sound?
.


Most likely it is the cam auto focusing that is causing the sound you are hearing. Try manual focus and see if it stops.
post #380 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by Railfan View Post

Just visited a couple of websites for businesses that sell the Gw77, and I noticed that after dropping the price a few weeks ago, those prices are right back up near where they were in the first place. Anyone have a clue as to what's up with the price fluctuations?

Prices fluctuate all the time with these cams. You most likely won't see a big price drop until the new year..unless a black friday deal comes up. Sony rewards has the GW77 for $629.99 right now. You can possibly get it for $529.99 if you sign up for a Sony Rewards CC with the $100 off promo they are currently running.

Edit: Amazon has the blue and white versions of the GW-77 for $599.99 right now. It's not big price drop, but is the lowest price I have seen it offered for yet.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00863R2M2/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_10?ie=UTF8&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
Edited by tingham - 11/20/12 at 6:24pm
post #381 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by tingham View Post

Prices fluctuate all the time with these cams. You most likely won't see a big price drop until the new year..unless a black friday deal comes up. Sony rewards has the GW77 for $629.99 right now. You can possibly get it for $529.99 if you sign up for a Sony Rewards CC with the $100 off promo they are currently running.
Edit: Amazon has the blue and white versions of the GW-77 for $599.99 right now. It's not big price drop, but is the lowest price I have seen it offered for yet.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00863R2M2/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_10?ie=UTF8&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

I have been recommending Amazon Warehouse Deals lately. I buy there all the time and have gotten some great deals on barely used products. As of today, a black GW77 is $448.47 (free shipping with Amazon Prime). Blue and white are still over $500, though.

Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution
post #382 of 637
I turned many of the settings to manual. The sound continued. Putting my ear next to the camera allows me to hear the same sound that occurs on my video. I believe my camera has an internal fan producing some noise. Hopefully, this is abnormal and the camera can be repaired/replaced. I'll speak to Sony this week and see what they say.

Thanks for your suggestion Tingham
post #383 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boe Barker View Post

I turned many of the settings to manual. The sound continued. Putting my ear next to the camera allows me to hear the same sound that occurs on my video. I believe my camera has an internal fan producing some noise. Hopefully, this is abnormal and the camera can be repaired/replaced. I'll speak to Sony this week and see what they say.
Thanks for your suggestion Tingham

try to video underwater. if there is still same fan sound then there is something wrong with your gw77.
post #384 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by brunerww View Post

I have been recommending Amazon Warehouse Deals lately. I buy there all the time and have gotten some great deals on barely used products. As of today, a black GW77 is $448.47 (free shipping with Amazon Prime). Blue and white are still over $500, though.
Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution

The warehouse deals are pretty good Bill. I have purchased there myself in the past. Amazon states there is no warranty with warehouse deals. Whether the manufacturer knows that is another matter. Something a buyer should be aware of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boe Barker View Post

I turned many of the settings to manual. The sound continued. Putting my ear next to the camera allows me to hear the same sound that occurs on my video. I believe my camera has an internal fan producing some noise. Hopefully, this is abnormal and the camera can be repaired/replaced. I'll speak to Sony this week and see what they say.

I highly doubt there is an internal fan in the unit. You said you tried a bunch of manual adjustments. Did you use manual focus? It must be done on the touchscreen.

You want to stop the cam from focusing to see if the cam's auto focusing mechanism is making the sound you are hearing.

I don't know if locking the focus is possible with the GW77. Maybe Mark can chime in here when he gets a chance. He is familiar with what I am referring to.

Are you hearing this noise in quiet footage only? Can you hear it in outdoor footage?
post #385 of 637
Thread Starter 
You can lock focus, exposure, and white balance.
post #386 of 637
I can hear the noise with my naked ear while using the unit. The noise is only audible when the room is very quiet.

Auto focus was the culprit. By switching the focus to manual, the sound stopped. Turning the auto-focus on brought the humming/clicking sound back. (verified with my ear)

I've actually watched more videos since I asked this question. I've heard this sound in some other users videos. So, I think this is normal, not an isolated case.

Thanks everyone.
Edited by Boe Barker - 11/22/12 at 9:44am
post #387 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boe Barker View Post

Auto focus was the culprit. By switching the focus to manual, the sound stopped. Turning the auto-focus on brought the humming/clicking sound back. (verified with my ear)
Boe,

I can think of at least two other camera/camcorders that will have noise picked up in quiet places. It starts out with the camera making a little bit of noise and, with no other sound present, the camera feels an obligation to make whatever weak noise there is into something that can be heard on the audio track. The three solutions are to shoot where it is noisy, turn off the Automatic Gain Control (AGC) or fix it in editing. In editing you can reduce the volume, remove the audio track, try to filter it, replace it with narration or replace it with music.

Another solution is to hang around loud noises (like airplanes or rock music) for enough years that your ears filter out the offending frequencies!

Bill
post #388 of 637
Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

You can lock focus, exposure, and white balance.

Thanks Mark, nice to know that you have these options with the GW77. I'm definitely going to pick a GW77 up at some point when there is a significant price drop. Your raw videos from this little powerhouse look really good on my big screen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boe Barker View Post

I can hear the noise with my naked ear while using the unit. The noise is only audible when the room is very quiet.
Auto focus was the culprit. By switching the focus to manual, the sound stopped. Turning the auto-focus on brought the humming/clicking sound back. (verified with my ear)
I've actually watched more videos since I asked this question. I've heard this sound in some other users videos. So, I think this is normal, not an isolated case.
Thanks everyone.

Your welcome, glad you know how to prevent the cam from making the sound now.
post #389 of 637
Thread Starter 
Railfan and rail fans: A GW77 train video.

Toy trains in Grand Central Terminal NYC and a ride on a high-speed (305km/hr) Chinese express train at night from Nanjing Station (the largest train station in Asia), to Hangzhou. Both venues were very dimly lit.

https://vimeo.com/54215549
post #390 of 637
Sweet. A couple of questions, Mark.

1) Did you do anything special about keeping the model trains in focus?
2) Same question regarding the real train moving towards you.
3) I noticed flickering light on the pavement in the station, and on the sides of the passenger cars (real train). Do you know the source of this?

Good low light performance. Thanks for the video.

Mike(Railfan)
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