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DAC suggestion - Page 4

post #91 of 214
8/2/12 at 9:55am
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Originally Posted by Greg121986 View Post

Can't we all just get along? confused.gif

It would be nice. I think a simple modification from the moderators would fix this. If the thread wanders from the original topic, the comments should be removed. However, given most of our intelligence levels you would think we could handle this ourselves. There's just a few people on here that don't seem to understand the overall picture of what they are doing. They are not stepping back, they are just diving into the details of the argument and not realizing what they are doing to the content of this forum.
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post #92 of 214
8/2/12 at 10:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

I don't care if I came off insulting, you insult me. What you do is vomiting, your presentation is condescending crap. Your information may be useful, but you would be wise to let someone with couth and manners present your information in threads where it's useful.

Serf, you seem to really want me to hurt badly, don't you?
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How you can possibly think that taking every thread into your own direction and saying the same thing over and over is entertaining or useful for the rest of AVForum's readers?

Something about the steady trickle of appreciative PMs?
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How many countless posts do you have to read that mention people leave here to look elsewhere because of what you do?

The above statement does not make sense. If the posts are countless then they can't be counted and I can't possibly answer your question. If the question is unanswerable, why ask it?
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How is that honorable or gentlemanly?

Serf, if you can construe that what you post is honorable or gentlemanly then so can I! ;-)
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As clarification points, your opinion is not vomit... how you deliver your opinion is vomit. It's offensive, it's all over the place and it stinks.

Serf, you are playing with words.
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Demeaning language has nothing to do with the content I was delivering,

Serf, if you can't see what you are doing...
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instead of attacking how the debate is happening, look at the meaning and the point of the argument.

Serf, that would appear to be good advice for you to take!
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An adult would not take over everyone's thread with the same information over and over again even after several requests to stop,

Serf, that would appear to be more good advice for you to take!
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several people just flat out ignoring you and others looking elsewhere for data.

AFAIK there's no rule that says that everybody can only read one forum or that this would even be a good thing to do. I'm surprised that you think that people gettting data from a number of sources represents some kind of a problem. Expecting that people get their data from only one source that you control would appear to be something like thought control.
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What is it going to take for you to get a clue?

Serf, that's not an insult in your mind, I take it?
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I have no argument with your opinions or your science,

That would not be exactly obvious.
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I have an argument with why you feel the need to bring your theories into every single thread that has nothing to do with them.

I would like to see a reasoned explanation about how the information that I bring into threads is always irrelevant to them.
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I came into this thread looking for new DAC's and to see what's going on in the DAC world.

Serf, it appears to me that only certain news about what's happening in the DAC world is acceptable to you. Furthermore since your first post on this thread appears to be post 73 which is not a query about what's happening in the DAC world, but starts out: "This thread is a perfect example of why I rarely look here any more." That appears to be an attack. Your own words tell a different story!
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All I got was the same old Arny info of don't buy a DAC, buy speakers! Then accoustics! Then any response given is retorted and broken down with quotes, how did you scientifically come up with your opinions?

It all started out when I was in my early teens and got interested in building my own audio system (tubes, mono, as that was SOTA in those days).
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Was the earth spinning on the same degree of axis during the test? Was the weather the same? Humidity? Air density? Who gives a ****, I want to look at some DACs.


I believe that you can find DACs to look at here: https://www.google.com/search?num=10&hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1571&bih=843&q=dacs&oq=dacs&gs_l=img.12..0i10j0j0i10l8.2138.3546.0.6680.4.4.0.0.0.0.67.244.4.4.0...0.0...1ac.2fhbVCQpzKw
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post #93 of 214
8/2/12 at 10:22am
An open note to the forum weary:

There is the ignore button you know. Or, simply skip over the posts which are irritating to you as soon as it becomes clear that it will contain the same "tiresome" content you wish to avoid. It takes two to tango, as the saying goes. The mods shouldn't have to read and mold every thread to conform to some individuals desires for how a thread should proceed. Who has time for all that? And which individuals should get to make that determination? The solutions are simple; use the formal "ignore button" or employ a little self-discipline and engage your mental "ignore button".

With that said, open discussions are necessary, even if unpleasant for some. As stated before, there are plenty of forums which adhere to a different group mindset on these "controversial" audio topics. I for one am thankful that this one exists in its present state. So some people find it unpleasant, so be it. Some will leave because of it, so be it. Not every forum will make everyone happy. That's why there are many to choose from!
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post #94 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Serf, you seem to really want me to hurt badly, don't you?
Something about the steady trickle of appreciative PMs?
The above statement does not make sense. If the posts are countless then they can't be counted and I can't possibly answer your question. If the question is unanswerable, why ask it?
Serf, if you can construe that what you post is honorable or gentlemanly then so can I! ;-)
Serf, you are playing with words.
Serf, if you can't see what you are doing...
Serf, that would appear to be good advice for you to take!
Serf, that would appear to be more good advice for you to take!
AFAIK there's no rule that says that everybody can only read one forum or that this would even be a good thing to do. I'm surprised that you think that people gettting data from a number of sources represents some kind of a problem. Expecting that people get their data from only one source that you control would appear to be something like thought control.
Serf, that's not an insult in your mind, I take it?
That would not be exactly obvious.
I would like to see a reasoned explanation about how the information that I bring into threads is always irrelevant to them.
Serf, it appears to me that only certain news about what's happening in the DAC world is acceptable to you. Furthermore since your first post on this thread appears to be post 73 which is not a query about what's happening in the DAC world, but starts out: "This thread is a perfect example of why I rarely look here any more." That appears to be an attack. Your own words tell a different story!
It all started out when I was in my early teens and got interested in building my own audio system (tubes, mono, as that was SOTA in those days).
I believe that you can find DACs to look at here: https://www.google.com/search?num=10&hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1571&bih=843&q=dacs&oq=dacs&gs_l=img.12..0i10j0j0i10l8.2138.3546.0.6680.4.4.0.0.0.0.67.244.4.4.0...0.0...1ac.2fhbVCQpzKw

"The above statement does not make sense. If the posts are countless then they can't be counted and I can't possibly answer your question. If the question is unanswerable, why ask it?"

This is exactly what I am talking about, all you did was read my sentence, you didn't think about it at all or get the meaning. All you want to do is break down the sentence into a semantics argument. The point of the sentence was that people get sick of your relentless information covering the same information you post in several other threads. You really aren't as clever as you think you are, I think your parents just raised you thinking you were some kind of genius and you have no basis for comparison. Maybe you should use your scientific observation skills to run an experiment on who actually likes your posts in all these threads and get back with us.

[EDIT]

One other thing, your first sentence is laughable. I really want to hurt you? You really are a child. This is a public open forum on the internet. You (I'm guessing) should be an adult man of high intelligence, to think that you could be "hurt" by some words on a forum is pretty funny.

As an official public response my official intentions are simply "...to make you aware that all your posts about the same information we've read hundreds of times be contained to one thread and not pollute otherwise good subject threads...".
Edited by AudioSerf - 8/2/12 at 11:47am
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post #95 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

...I came into this thread looking for new DAC's and to see what's going on in the DAC world. All I got was the same old Arny info of don't buy a DAC, buy speakers!...

Ignore arnyk; his posting has become way too repetitive and way too over the top, even offensive; only safe things I can say that won't get me banned from this thread or from AVS.

With regard to a useful external DAC, I've now used a Benchmark DAC1/HDR unit (~$2k list) for this past 6 months and think well of it. For one thing it's OK as a PC desktop unit for driving hi-quality headphones; for another it has enough exterior metal covering that it runs not too terribly hot on hot Chicago days (fans only for me in Chicago), whereas my somewhat smaller NuForce Icon HDP unit becomes *too* hot when used on a hot day; another is that it (Benchmark) can be used as a top quality 2 channel stereo preamp and has a remote control for it's analog volume control.

One open question is if there's a $2k list AVR that is as good for stereo sound? I have no clue on an answer to this, but suspect it likely that there are some $2k list AVRs that have comparable stereo sound.

Of course, an AVR will be too big as a desktop unit for use with a PC for sound.
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post #96 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CruelInventions View Post

An open note to the forum weary:
There is the ignore button you know. Or, simply skip over the posts which are irritating to you as soon as it becomes clear that it will contain the same "tiresome" content you wish to avoid. It takes two to tango, as the saying goes. The mods shouldn't have to read and mold every thread to conform to some individuals desires for how a thread should proceed. Who has time for all that? And which individuals should get to make that determination? The solutions are simple; use the formal "ignore button" or employ a little self-discipline and engage your mental "ignore button".
With that said, open discussions are necessary, even if unpleasant for some. As stated before, there are plenty of forums which adhere to a different group mindset on these "controversial" audio topics. I for one am thankful that this one exists in its present state. So some people find it unpleasant, so be it. Some will leave because of it, so be it. Not every forum will make everyone happy. That's why there are many to choose from!

How about instead of being passive and just ignoring the situation, we actually make a change? There is a reason threads have a title and subject matter. Start a thread for Arny about his scientific philosophies, that way when people want to read them they can. I should have to have an ignore button or skip content when I'm trying to enjoy a forum I used to enjoy. If you want to ignore, go for it. I'm here to make a change. Most forum moderators at other much larger forums than this will instill some sort of a "stay on topic" moderation, it's not that hard.
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post #97 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

"The above statement does not make sense. If the posts are countless then they can't be counted and I can't possibly answer your question. If the question is unanswerable, why ask it?"
This is exactly what I am talking about, all you did was read my sentence, you didn't think about it at all or get the meaning.

The above is a figment of your imagination, and based on the illogical proposition that you can read my mind accurately.

The meaning was clear enough - you were very angry when you wrote it, and your anger made the post sound like it came from a blithering idiot with DACs to sell. ;-)
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All you want to do is break down the sentence into a semantics argument.

Its an exposure that you brought on yourself by not reading your post critically enough before you sent it out.
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The point of the sentence was that people get sick of your relentless information covering the same information you post in several other threads.

Have you ever wondered what a well-informed person thinks about the numerous posts that all seem to say the same thing - "I did the worst possible listening test that is known to man, and now based only on that, I'm going to make far-reaching pronoucements about some innocent audio product" Of course nobody actually is that honest. But if you have any insight into what actually happened, that is it, no?

It's the same relentless information covering the same information posted in several other threads that you are complaining about!
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You really aren't as clever as you think you are, I think your parents just raised you thinking you were some kind of genius and you have no basis for comparison.

I know a great many people who are far smarter than I am. Some of them inform me of this every chance they get! ;-)

Your post makes it sound like you are one of them. Is this true?
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Maybe you should use your scientific observation skills to run an experiment on who actually likes your posts in all these threads and get back with us.

I guess what you are saying is that I should post lies because then certain people (such as you) won't be unhappy.

I was taught not to lie. Sorry.
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Simply put, you are a child,

I would suggest that you review your recent posts with yourself, once your blood pressure gets back down into the triple digits...
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I'm not going to break down every one of your retorts and try to address them. I'm simply going to do something better. Every single time you post this type of information in a thread that has nothing to do with it, I'm simply going to re-address all of these issues. Every single one of your posts will be followed by mine. Then, like Cruel Inventions commented, I can simply be ignored with the ignore button or the mental ignore button. I am not taking the passive route, passiveness is weakness. I'm going to irritate you as much as you irritate me until you can figure out how not to post irrelevant information in threads that could otherwise be interesting. Let the games begin!

Works for me!

I wish you happiness and productivity with your new occupation.
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post #98 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:54am
"Steady trickle of PM's"

I'm assuming you mean thank you's and appreciative PM's? I don't doubt that you do, I've appreciated your information on several occasions as well. I'm not exactly sure how I can make it more clear that I think you have good information, I just know that several people don't appreciate having their threads steered into your direction and content. As a case in point, the OP of the thread we are talking in now said he left and looked elsewhere for answers because of what you did. It's that simple. I'm all for starting a thread and even a sticky, giving you credit for having great information on how you think a system should be built. I'm just tired of seeing it in several other threads.
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post #99 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:55am
So, about digital to analog converters under $1,000 and their accompanying recommendations... smile.gif
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post #100 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

How about instead of being passive and just ignoring the situation, we actually make a change? There is a reason threads have a title and subject matter. Start a thread for Arny about his scientific philosophies, that way when people want to read them they can.

I actually know a little science (of sorts) about passive agressive and codependent behavior. You do know that the above post is a very clear cut example of one and an invitation to the other?

In short, have you somehow been restricted from creating threads on AVS?

If not, why aren't you doing what you have recommended to others?
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post #101 of 214
8/2/12 at 11:58am
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I guess what you are saying is that I should post lies because then certain people (such as you) won't be unhappy.

I was taught not to lie. Sorry.

Wow, you are one thick headed dude. I'm not asking you to lie, I'm asking you to keep your content in an appropriate thread.

As far as the blood-pressure comments, you have no idea who I am or my occupation. Dealing with you is barely above taking a nap, I'm not angry nor could you ever get my BP up. I'm simply tired of seeing an exciting topic only to find out your posting your same old information in it.

Also, commenting that I should critique what I say more really? Your first response to me was full of hurt, anger and miss-spellings. Notice I didn't break that down into quotes and simply argue each sentence as a grammar mid-term. smile.gif You would really be cool if you would just learn to post your information where it belongs.
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post #102 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

"Steady trickle of PM's"
I'm not exactly sure how I can make it more clear that I think you have good information, I just know that several people don't appreciate having their threads steered into your direction and content.

Serf, I think you may be a little fact challenged. I have before me post #2 to this thread. I suggest that you read it as carefully as you need to in order to be convinced that your above accusation is completely and totally unfounded.
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post #103 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

I actually know a little science (of sorts) about passive agressive and codependent behavior. You do know that the above post is a very clear cut example of one and an invitation to the other?
In short, have you somehow been restricted from creating threads on AVS?
If not, why aren't you doing what you have recommended to others?

I know that what you just said is worthless, you are not a doctor or psychologist and your opinion on who I am by what little you know of me is exactly what you laugh at about other people. You have no basis, facts, or any other useful information to make any type of medical point about my personality.

I'll start you a thread!
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post #104 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:04pm
Guys, for serious now. Can we please start talking about DACs and which ones we may recommend for the OP under $1,000? I can't even remember if I posted a legitimate reply to this thread now. I have to go back and find my posts. redface.gif
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post #105 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Serf, I think you may be a little fact challenged. I have before me post #2 to this thread. I suggest that you read it as carefully as you need to in order to be convinced that your above accusation is completely and totally unfounded.

Post #2 says "upgrade your speakers"

A perfect example of what I'm talking about. He asked about a specific setup and what DAC to upgrade to under $1000. I didn't see him ask what speakers he needs. It's all about delivery too, this comment assumes he's an idiot and doesn't know anything and has bad speakers. It would of been wiser to ask more questions or say "would you mind if I suggested somewhere else to put your money or are you set on a DAC" that opens up the OP to ask for more guidance if needed.
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post #106 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:07pm
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Originally Posted by Greg121986 View Post

Guys, for serious now. Can we please start talking about DACs and which ones we may recommend for the OP under $1,000? I can't even remember if I posted a legitimate reply to this thread now. I have to go back and find my posts. redface.gif

This is what is irritating. This thread will never be about DAC's unless a mod removes all of our conversations. This is what happens when Arny and others get into a thread, and my exact point. LOL smile.gif
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post #107 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:08pm
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Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

Who gives a ****, I want to look at some DACs.
It appears that you came to a wrong forum for such thing. Not to worry though, not all forums are the same. From what I've heard, Audio Asylum and Polk Audio forums will offer what you are seeking. wink.gif
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post #108 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:09pm
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Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

Wow, you are one thick headed dude. I'm not asking you to lie, I'm asking you to keep your content in an appropriate thread.
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Please point out exact statements and posts in this thread that you feed are not consistent with the posts that went before them.
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As far as the blood-pressure comments, you have no idea who I am or my occupation.

Don't need to. The syntactic patterns are there.
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Dealing with you is barely above taking a nap, I'm not angry nor could you ever get my BP up.

Asymptomatic blood pressure, eh?
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I'm simply tired of seeing an exciting topic only to find out your posting your same old information in it.

Please show examples of information that you feel that I post repetitively with exact quotes.

You have been proven to be in error with other claims that you have made, so I'm not going take what you say at face value.
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Also, commenting that I should critique what I say more really?

A heartfelt apology would seem to be appropriate.
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Your first response to me was full of hurt, anger and miss-spellings.

True, I don't spell so gud when I'm ROTFLMAO. ;-)
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Notice I didn't break that down into quotes and simply argue each sentence as a grammar mid-term. smile.gif You would really be cool if you would just learn to post your information where it belongs.

I think that once we get you to simmer down and actually try to document your claims, you will see things a little differently, or at least make my arguments for me.
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post #109 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

Post #2 says "upgrade your speakers"
A perfect example of what I'm talking about.

Serf, you seem to be forgetting your own assertions. The author of that post is not me. I promise you that Mr. M is not a sock puppet of mine. I didn't steer this thead off topic as you have claimed.

Serf, if you have even a modicum of character, you will immediately publicly apologize to me here for telling such a reprehensible untruth about me.
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post #110 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:14pm
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Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

This is what is irritating. This thread will never be about DAC's unless a mod removes all of our conversations. This is what happens when Arny and others get into a thread, and my exact point. LOL smile.gif

Serf, I think that you need to realize that you are the originator of one of the larger off-topic deviations in this thread.
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post #111 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:18pm
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Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Serf, you seem to be forgetting your own assertions. The author of that post is not me. I promise you that Mr. M is not a sock puppet of mine. I didn't steer this thead off topic as you have claimed.
Serf, if you have even a modicum of character, you will immediately publicly apologize to me here for telling such a reprehensible untruth about me.

Arny, you seem to be forgetting that my initial post did not call you out. You were just the first to write back. smile.gif If Mr. M wants to chat, he's more than free to.

I'll apologize for nothing. I don't say or do things that I feel I need to apologize for. You did not originate the deviation here, but you have in the past and you kept it going in this one. If you want to prove to me that everything you said was on topic, I'm listening.
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post #112 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:19pm
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Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Serf, I think that you need to realize that you are the originator of one of the larger off-topic deviations in this thread.

Yes, 1 time after years of reading here and recently posting 30+ useful posts once I decided to join I will admit that I am purposely deviating this thread. It will be the only one I do it to, and I won't apologize for that either.
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post #113 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:20pm
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Post #2 says "upgrade your speakers"
Which was a constructive suggestion, just a shorthand way of suggesting that he think about putting his money somewhere else. You need to relax a bit.
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post #114 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:28pm
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Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

Which was a constructive suggestion, just a shorthand way of suggesting that he think about putting his money somewhere else. You need to relax a bit.

Maybe if you would of said, "I know this is off-topic, but if you are looking to spend $1000 on your system maybe you should consider speakers, depending on what speakers you have know. If you want to know why, I'd be happy to explain."

That's constructive.

In my opinion your statement assumed he had poor speakers and was wasting money on a DAC, essentially saying he's not very well informed. Nobody is going to appreciate that. smile.gif

In all honesty, that's not a super big deal for most people to give a shorthand suggestion. Maybe he would go research, but when it turns into 2-3 people multi-line quoting everyone's response and attacking everything BUT the subject matter, it gets old really fast.
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post #115 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:34pm
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Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

Arny, you seem to be forgetting that my initial post did not call you out. You were just the first to write back. smile.gif

I never said that your first post called me out, nor was that the focus of your biggest errors of fact.

I see that you are trying to distract attention from the topic in order to avoid taking responsibility for your more recent posts.
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I'll apologize for nothing.

Gosh, that was predictable!
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I don't say or do things that I feel I need to apologize for.

Is that because of your standards for your personal behavior?
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You did not originate the deviation here, but you have in the past and you kept it going in this one.

So in fact some mysterious force is compelling to reply to my posts?

Oh, I forgot that you promised:

" Every single one of your posts will be followed by mine."

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If you want to prove to me that everything you said was on topic, I'm listening.

I might take that as an admission on your part that you generally don't take any responsibility for your actions...
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post #116 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSerf View Post

Maybe if you would of said, "I know this is off-topic, but if you are looking to spend $1000 on your system maybe you should consider speakers, depending on what speakers you have know. If you want to know why, I'd be happy to explain."
That's constructive.

Serf, we now know how to please you: Let you write all of our posts for us.
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In my opinion your statement assumed he had poor speakers and was wasting money on a DAC, essentially saying he's not very well informed. Nobody is going to appreciate that. smile.gif

Serf, a clear case of you making up an inflammatory issue and then responding to it.
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In all honesty, that's not a super big deal for most people to give a shorthand suggestion. Maybe he would go research,

Have you ever done any proper listening tests invoving DACs?

Do you have any reliable personal experience with the audible nature and degree of differences between DACs and the differences between speakers?
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but when it turns into 2-3 people multi-line quoting everyone's response and attacking everything BUT the subject matter, it gets old really fast.

I don't see where that happened. Got any direct quotes or is this another claim that you are going to immediately vacate?
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post #117 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:44pm
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In my opinion your statement assumed he had poor speakers
OK, so we can state definitively in this case that your opinion was wrong. You still need to calm down.
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post #118 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:45pm
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Serf, we now know how to please you: Let you write all of our posts for us.

If you allowed that, your online persona would instantly take a turn for the better.
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Serf, a clear case of you making up an inflammatory issue and then responding to it.

I've already received plenty of PM's in this short time agreeing that you are rather, well, irritating and rude and that it would be a lost cause for me to argue with you. I may or may not take the time to find all of these examples, regardless I will respond.
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Have you ever done any proper listening tests invoving DACs?

No, I am not an audio scientist and even if I was I wouldn't know how do any tests "invoving" anything. (You must of been laughing)
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Do you have any reliable personal experience with the audible nature and degree of differences between DACs and the differences between speakers?

Absolutely not. Which is why if you look through all of my posts I have never given any advice on any scientific matter here. Now let's stop deviating from the fact that you have little personal experience with how to talk to people or keep your information in relevant threads.
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post #119 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

OK, so we can state definitively in this case that your opinion was wrong. You still need to calm down.

Why do you think I'm upset? I'm completely calm, I'm sitting in a telepresence room right now if you have some video equipment. I can smile and wave while I type if you wish? You are correct that I can not read your mind, you may not of thought he had bad speakers, although I don't know why you would suggest he get speakers if you thought they were already good? It appeared that you came to the conclusion he needed speakers, which is why you probably suggested to get speakers? No?

smile.gif

I added the smiley so that you don't think I'm not calm.
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post #120 of 214
8/2/12 at 12:51pm
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Why do you think I'm upset? I'm completely calm
Well, if you behave like this when you're calm, I do not want to see you when you're agitated. frown.gif
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