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Official Pioneer SC-68/67 Thread - Page 32

post #931 of 1835
I am glancing over the online manual in anticipation of the SC-67's arrival. My source is an Oppo BDP-103 (which I also run the cable box through), and I want to be able to pass the video signal through untouched. If I am reading the manual correctly I would enter the Video Parameters menu, then turn V.CONV to off, correct? Will turning off this function still give me an OSD for volume and the like?
post #932 of 1835
Has anyone been using Netflix streaming and did you have any issues?

I have not tried to troubleshoot, but my son was streaming from Netflix and the picture would freeze. The sound would keep playing, but the picture would show a single frame.

I'm using the netflix USB wireless adapter and I know that my connection speed is good (they use Xbox for Netflix with no issues all the time).

As I said I have not tried to replicate the problem or troubleshoot but I thought any previous experience could help.
post #933 of 1835
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamtheatre View Post

...turn V.CONV to off, correct? Will turning off this function still give me an OSD for volume and the like?

yes & yes, you'll still have the OSD
post #934 of 1835
Flat Rocky!

Talk to me.

I'm in the market, and need as much help as possible.

I was all wrapped up about the Arcam AVR 600 and having quite a bit of consternation considering the high $$$.

Then I read reviews about this Pioneer SC-68. So, your USB issues aside, can you tell me about the sound? And... What did you have before? How is THAT in comparison?

I just need to know. I'm thinking the Pioneer could help solve MANY of my concerns and keep me from being destitute to boot!

Thanks.
post #935 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

yes & yes, you'll still have the OSD

Thanks, Steve.

Everything else looks pretty much like my VSX-33 as far as connections go. One other question: I see some kind of sound option called "Optimum", but there is very little information about it. Is this a gimmicky surround mode, or does it serve some value?

Nearly all of my listening is done either via DPLIIx Music/Movie or Pure Audio. Never found much use for anything else in my experience.
post #936 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by soniky View Post

I purchased an album in 24bit/192kHz FLAC format. There are 5 tracks and I downloaded them to a USB drive to play it on SC-68. It has no problem playing the first two tracks, but shows "File Format Error" (or something in that nature as I don't have it in front of me now) on all the other 3 tracks. However, the same USB drive plays totally fine on my PC with other software. I don't have other 24/192 FLAC to test with. This is very discouraging. I wonder if other people having this same issue or not.

Pioneer support pointed me to this clause on page 53 of the manual
d Uncompressed FLAC files are not supported. Pioneer does not quarantee playback

For people having this problem, I've found dBpoweramp a very good tool.
post #937 of 1835
Thread Starter 
^^
I didn't know there was uncompressed FLAC format redface.gif I knew of Apple lossless ALAC.
did you buy this from HDTracks? I'm asking because I'd like to try buying some hi-rez music from them. how do you know if it's compressed or uncompressed?
post #938 of 1835
Thread Starter 
Anyone installed the new gapless firmware yet?
I did last night; the update went A-OK.

For record, I used the same 8GB PNY USB memory as I did for the pandora update. I deleted the previous Pandora update files off it, formatted it again as FAT32 just to be sure and it was recognized & installed no problems.
post #939 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

^^
I didn't know there was uncompressed FLAC format redface.gif I knew of Apple lossless ALAC.
did you buy this from HDTracks? I'm asking because I'd like to try buying some hi-rez music from them. how do you know if it's compressed or uncompressed?

You can buy them from HDtracks and also a few other websites I can't remember the name of at the moment. HDtracks have a free sampler pack of lossless FLAC music.

I have dbpoweramp installed on my PC and if you right click, properties there is a dbpoweramp tab where you can see the characteristics of the audio file including whether it is lossless or not.

Some suggestion for HD downloads:

hdtracks.com
eclassical.com
naimlabel.com

Also see: http://hifiduino.wordpress.com/2011/01/25/free-hi-res-music-downloads/
Edited by bbear - 1/22/13 at 3:21pm
post #940 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by derrickdj1 View Post

I wonder if the problem is related to using two channel audion over coaxial? After running Full MCACC, then run auto MCACC and select keep speakers that you changed to small.

Before running the auto MCACC I wanted to mention that I have tried setting my fronts to SMALL and my sub to 'PLUS' but I still don't hear anything out of my sub.

Also, on the graphic on the front panel of the SC-68 it only shows front left and front right as being active.

Could this be a bug with the SC-68 where it doesn't split out the low frequency and send to the sub when you are using the COAX1 input?

Is there any point in trying to run MCACC if nothing is coming out of my sub at this point?
post #941 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon S View Post

I then ran MCACC through its paces. It reported that my center channel speaker is out of phase. I checked the connections and the speaker is definitely connected correctly. I am going to have to take down the speaker and check the wiring to see if there is anything amiss internally. After running MCACC the surround sounds more open and spacious than the Audyssey XT from the Onkyo, but bass was definitely light on the bottom end (it could be related to the phase issue on the center channel speaker).

I checked the wiring to my center channel and it is correct, I even checked each lead with a meter. I took apart my center channel speaker and all the connections internally were also correct as per the schematic I got from the manufacturer. As far as I can tell, the speaker is in phase. Someone told me that because my center channel is behind my Stewart screen, the screen could be confusing the MCACC, so I left it as it is... I might take the spekaer from behind the screen and place it in front and see what happens then just to confirm.
post #942 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

^^
I can give you what I know from info I have on the SC-68 and the service manual for the SC-57.

the SC-68 & SC-57 both use asahi-kasei AK4480 DACs for all channels that are used for the main inputs* (*notes below)

*notes:

- the SC-57 had 5 AK4480's. and 1 AK4388 (dedicated for internet radio & ipod/USB front port)
- I don't know if the number of AK4480's in the SC-68 is the same as what's in the SC-57. depends on what DAC they use for the USB-DAC & front port. the AK4388 in the SC-57 doesn't appear to do DSD from its spec sheet & since the front port on the SC-68 can play DSD files, it's possible they upgraded the front port to the 4480 or something else.
- I don't know if the SC-68's USB-DAC port uses a different DAC than the AK4480, since I don't have the SC-68 service manual. it is a separate DAC from the main DAC's based on the info I have but what chip mfg/model is not specified. since it takes the special driver, it's possible that it's different than the 4480 & what's used for front port.

ak4480 DAC (SC-68)_f03e.pdf 567k .pdf file

I think there's a pretty good chance the front & rear USB ports use an upgraded DAC from the SC-57 because of the new capabilities but that can't be proven until someone gets their hands on the service manual for the SC-68. I was hoping I could find an SC-68 service manual by now but no luck yet.

that's the extent of what I know.
Thank you so much for the replay. I'm gonna try and get my hands on one. I really want to know what they used. I will say I'm sure they upgraded it as It sounds better then the SC-57 . I had the SC-57 here and tested it against my SC-07 it was a very close shootout , they SC-68 is a step ahead in overall sound quality then both of them especially the SC-07 which is no slouch.
post #943 of 1835
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon S View Post

I checked the wiring to my center channel and it is correct, I even checked each lead with a meter. I took apart my center channel speaker and all the connections internally were also correct as per the schematic I got from the manufacturer. As far as I can tell, the speaker is in phase. Someone told me that because my center channel is behind my Stewart screen, the screen could be confusing the MCACC, so I left it as it is... I might take the spekaer from behind the screen and place it in front and see what happens then just to confirm.

wow! that's a lot of work you did smile.gif I wouldn't spend any more time worrying about the message. trust me.

all these room correction EQ systems can get tripped up on phase. I've never had it happen with my speakers which deliberately reflect sound being planar speakers but every situation & room setup is different.

the usual advice is if you're sure the external connection wiring is correct, + to +, - to -, then you're good and just ignore the message. I don't think Pioneer or any company expects an owner to go to the lengths you have even checking internal wiring smile.gif some speaker companies deliberately wire a driver out of phase for a specific sound signature. for example, I've read that Magnepan does this with the model I own to enhance the illusion of center depth. it could explain how in the end, the combined sound gets sensed as in phase...who knows.

you've certainly investigated it to great length...time to just ignore the message & complete the calibration smile.gif
post #944 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

^^
I didn't know there was uncompressed FLAC format redface.gif I knew of Apple lossless ALAC.
did you buy this from HDTracks? I'm asking because I'd like to try buying some hi-rez music from them. how do you know if it's compressed or uncompressed?

Yes, I bought them from hdtracks. FLAC, although lossless, can be compressed at various levels as well. As bbear mentioned, I am going to try dBpoweramp if it shows that information.
It's strange why Pioneer would have an issue with uncompressed flac files because it would be harder to decode compressed files.
post #945 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by inorick View Post

press + hold tune down and press + hold Zone 3 for ten second until restart

Thanks sir but it doesn't seem to work frown.gif
post #946 of 1835
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbear View Post

Before running the auto MCACC I wanted to mention that I have tried setting my fronts to SMALL and my sub to 'PLUS' but I still don't hear anything out of my sub.

Also, on the graphic on the front panel of the SC-68 it only shows front left and front right as being active.

Could this be a bug with the SC-68 where it doesn't split out the low frequency and send to the sub when you are using the COAX1 input?

Is there any point in trying to run MCACC if nothing is coming out of my sub at this point?

1st, thanks for the info on buying hi-rez files.

2nd, I confess to being confused.

to help, let's consider this: for 2 channel sources, for the sub to do anything, if you're fronts are set to Large, you'll need to add surround processing to convert 2.0 >> 5.1. if you are staying stereo sound, you'll need to 1) have fronts set to Small or Plus AND not be in Pure Direct audio mode. if you're in Pure Direct, the sub won't produce bass because all the digital processing & bass mgmt is bypassed.

for the sub to work with 2 ch sources, you should either be in Direct for 2 channel reproduction (2.1), Auto Surround & either a surround mode or downsampled Stereo mode. At least it used to be downsampled stereo, if Stereo is straight stereo in the new receivers, then the sub may work differently than in previous models, but the key is don't use Pure Direct mode if you want the sub smile.gif

also, check to see what crossover you set. if you set it to one of the low ones, like 50 hz, the music you're playing may not have bass as low as the crossover. for typical use, 80Hz is the suggested starting place that fits most speaker setups.

and running MCACC is independent of the input, doesn't matter.
using MCACC is a matter of taste. you can choose to use it or not, by selecting which preset to use, Symmetry, All Channels Adjust, Front Aligned, or Off.

when you select Pure Direct listening mode, most of the MCACC functions are turned off but not all. the ones we know are turned off are: the standing wave filter, phase control, EQ settings, speaker distances/delays. based on anecdotal evidence from a number of posters over the years, we believe the preamp output levels (channel levels & trim) are left on. we think this because the overall volume seems to change a bit in Pure Direct when you also select the MCACC preset (deactivates the channel output levels). in my case, the volume drops a bit, since nearly all my channels get a level boost in the calibration.

hope that makes sense.

your receiver should work in a logical way, consistent with how MCACC has worked for many years. a specific input (coax) should not effect at all how the bass management works. what will is the listening mode you're using, Auto Surround, Stereo, Direct & Pure Direct.

if you want 2.1 sound from a 2.0 source, meaning sub gets bass, then you're on the correct path. Set fronts to Small, set your initial crossover at 80, and don't use Pure Direct for stereo source. or you can add PLIIx, NeoX, THX and derive 5.1 from 2.0 because now, the bass from derived center & surrounds will also be sent to the sub.

did you hear test tones from the sub during your calibration? and...
do you hear the sub with 5.1 DVD/Blu-ray? you should since that is a dedicated LFE track + redirected bass.
Edited by ss9001 - 1/22/13 at 5:27pm
post #947 of 1835
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louie_18 View Post

Thanks sir but it doesn't seem to work frown.gif

the reset procedure is in the manual, top of pg 81. read the directions but in summary it is

turn the receiver off with the Standby/On button. then press & hold down the front panel Enter button while also pressing the Standby On/Off button again. you will see a display message of Reset? select No/Yes. that's it.

off the top of my head, I don't know what the other does.
post #948 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

if you want 2.1 sound from a 2.0 source, meaning sub gets bass, then you're on the correct path. Set fronts to Small, set your initial crossover at 80, and don't use Pure Direct for stereo source. or you can add PLIIx, NeoX, THX and derive 5.1 from 2.0 because now, the bass from derived center & surrounds will also be sent to the sub.

did you hear test tones from the sub during your calibration? and...
do you hear the sub with 5.1 DVD/Blu-ray? you should since that is a dedicated LFE track + redirected bass.

Ok, I think you hit the nail on the head - I am using Pure Direct. Picky as I am (and bit of a perfectionist) I decided early on there was no point in using anything other than Pure Direct. Now I get your point totally, I have to turn that off and set up for a 2.1 system (from my 2.0 source).

I will give it a try but I suspect that the sound degradation I hear when going from Pure to Non-pure is not going to be worth it. My Vienna's although bookshelf type can really pump out solid bass, it was only my retailer who suggested trying to use my sub as it would be able to handle my awkward room.

Anyway I will give it a try

BTW, test tones work fine when running MCACC, including the sub. Blu Ray sounds great.
post #949 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louie_18 View Post

Thanks sir but it doesn't seem to work frown.gif

Ok try this, at front panel press Tune V first and hold then press multizone on/off for 5 second or till the power on
post #950 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

to help, let's consider this: for 2 channel sources, for the sub to do anything, if you're fronts are set to Large, you'll need to add surround processing to convert 2.0 >> 5.1. if you are staying stereo sound, you'll need to 1) have fronts set to Small or Plus AND not be in Pure Direct audio mode. if you're in Pure Direct, the sub won't produce bass because all the digital processing & bass mgmt is bypassed.

Wait, do you mean we don't get anything from sub if we play 2 channel source in Pure Direct mode? Wow, just checked and you are right. Guess I didn't know what I had been missing.

So if we just want 2.1 and no more we should use Direct?
Edited by soniky - 1/22/13 at 9:07pm
post #951 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by soniky View Post

Wait, do you mean we don't get anything from sub if we play 2 channel source in Pure Direct mode?

Yes, that is exactly the case - I tested it just now.

Source: 2-channel audio over COAX1
Fronts setting: SMALL
SW setting: YES or PLUS
Direct/Pure setting: PURE
..
RESULT: NO output: from sub-woofer

Source: 2-channel audio over COAX1
Fronts setting: SMALL
SW setting: YES or PLUS
Direct/Pure setting: DIRECT
..
RESULT: sub-woofer output is heard

Note, I haven't spent a lot of time listening when in DIRECT mode, but whether I set the SW to YES or PLUS, I cant tell the difference. (bass sounds about the same)

Comments:
With my speakers (Vienna Acoustics Hadyn Grand) the quality of the sound is quite noticeably better when using PURE DIRECT mode (compared to DIRECT). It would sure would be nice to have the option of outputting lower bass frequencies which still being in PURE DIRECT mode, however I find it too much of a sacrifice to the overall quality to use the DIRECT mode.

If Pioneer could come up with a way of sending the low frequencies to the sub, whilst still being in PURE mode, and it being facilitated by means of a firmware update, then I would be very happy. However, I suspect that filtering out certain frequencies in that way would be a complete violation of the 'PURE DIRECT' architecture as designed into these Elite AVRs
post #952 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by soniky View Post

Yes, I bought them from hdtracks. FLAC, although lossless, can be compressed at various levels as well. As bbear mentioned, I am going to try dBpoweramp if it shows that information.
It's strange why Pioneer would have an issue with uncompressed flac files because it would be harder to decode compressed files.

Well, dbpoweramp shows all my flac files are 33% compressed except for one that's 32%. Some play fine and some don't and doesn't seem to correlate to the compression level. Mind you that these are all 24/192 files. All my 24/96 files played fine so far.

FLAC can vary in compression level from -0 (fastest compression) to -8 (highest compression) plus no compression. As a test, I picked a file that sc-68 refused to play and converted it with different compression levels as follow:

-8 Played fine
-5 Played fine
-0 Played fine
no compression - Guess what, sc-68 choked trying to play the file. I hear pieces here and there get dropped (like cell phones 15 years ago). And it won't stop no matter what I try. When I tried to switch to pandora, it shows pandora on the screen but still playing the same flac from the usb. Eventually I decided to press the power button but it took 20 seconds to shutdown and another 20 seconds to come back on after I press power button again. Evidently, I think I have experienced a sc-68 processing limitation (as documented).

Looks like as long as I convert again with some level of compression then it would play fine. It seems that the original flac I got from hdtracks is close to a level -0 compression but I really can't tell by compressing already compressed file again.
post #953 of 1835
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by inorick View Post

Ok try this, at front panel press Tune V first and hold then press multizone on/off for 5 second or till the power on

sorry that's not the full factory reset to default settings. read my post. it's in the manual & it's not what you're posting.

I don't know what your suggested steps will do but they certainly are not the steps to do a factory reset.
post #954 of 1835
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbear View Post

If Pioneer could come up with a way of sending the low frequencies to the sub, whilst still being in PURE mode, and it being facilitated by means of a firmware update, then I would be very happy. However, I suspect that filtering out certain frequencies in that way would be a complete violation of the 'PURE DIRECT' architecture as designed into these Elite AVRs

Pure Direct on a 2 channel source = no bass to the sub

Pure Direct on a 5.1 encoded disc = bass to the sub

if the disc is 5.1, you will get sub activity in Pure Direct because there's a dedicated .1 LFE track. BUT you'll still lose the redirected bass from center & surrounds because the DSP is not used.

when I play 5.1 SACD/DVD-A music, I typically use Direct because I don't want the music matrixed to 7.1. but I still get the full use of my subs because of the dedicated .1 "sub" track.

here's why:

Pure Direct
-small/large/plus, crossover, EQ, speaker distances/phase control/standing wave filter - not used. DSP bypassed
-preamp channel levels - used unless you also turn MCACC preset to Off

Direct
-small/large/plus, crossover, EQ, speaker distances/phase control/standing wave filter, channel levels - all used
-matrix surround processing - not used, you will get straight surround decoding of the disc

Auto Surround & all surround processing modes (Prologic, Neo, THX, Optimum, ALC, reverb surround)
-every form of DSP in use depending on user selections
Edited by ss9001 - 1/23/13 at 4:22am
post #955 of 1835
Thread Starter 
more info on Pure Direct use

Analog Direct

Pure Direct has always been for all practical purposes a form of pure analog bypass. on all my Pio AVR's, I use the multichannel analog inputs for an old quadraphonic receiver with preamp outs. and when I use Pure Direct, the receiver display actually says Analog Direct. the manuals have always said that Pure Direct turns off nearly all digital processing. bass management being done by DSP's, it is bypassed. the only processing done in Pure Direct is the channel level adjustment and that's not stated anywhere but has been inferred by many who've noticed a volume change also turning the MCACC preset to off, which means MCACC is OFF OFF wink.gif

sidebar -- Analog to Digital Converters in the receiver

a) multichannel ADC's
up until about 2 model years ago, multichannel analogs had ADCs on all channels, so in Direct & Auto Surround modes, you could apply bass mgmt & surround processing. but starting with the SC-37/35 generation, ADC's have been removed from the multichannel analogs so by default all they ever can be is straight analog, and that's why you can't add surround modes or the receiver's bass mgmt to a hi-end player, like the Oppo 95/105, when using its 5.1/7.1 analog connections; you have to use the player's bass mgmt & speaker distance settings instead.

b) 2 channel ADC's
there are still ADC's on 2 ch digital coax/opt/2 ch analog so user can use DSP / bass mgmt / digital processing. all modern receivers still have these.

SACD Direct

if you want your SACD player to send DSD stream, not converted to PCM first, not only set the player menu to do that, but you'll NEED to set the receiver to Pure Direct, too. because adding any form of bass mgmt, processing to DSD means it has to be converted to PCM first. this has no audible effect either way, but some purists want SACD to be a straight converstion DSD >> Analog instead of DSD >> PCM >> Analog. but when you do that you lose all the benefits of having bass management & room correction for playing SACD's.

how Pure Direct is used is not unique to Pioneer. Denon goes so far as turn display lights, video signals completely off in their pure direct mode. what I don't know is if Denon completely bypasses bass mgmt but if they are purist enough to turn all non-audio related functions off, I suspect they turn off all digital processing too.
Edited by ss9001 - 1/23/13 at 5:11am
post #956 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post

some call it "pride of ownership" wink.gif

your dealer sounds like a practical sort. it's certainly up to you...if you value the extras, get 'em & not regret anything smile.gif

even though dissimilar metal corrosion/oxidation will be a long time coming (many years), I personally still prefer the gold plating, that's just me smile.gif I still have gear decades old w/o gold plating & every few yrs I remove the cables, take a pencil eraser to the jacks to rub off the film & brighten them up. but I've bought used vintage gear off ebay sellers that had so much oxidation that the silver-aluminum finish was completely dull gray & even showed white spots indicating mild pitting, probably due to long term storage in attics, basements, garages with moisture present. this is not conducive to good signal transfer but can be dealt with by using contact cleaner and a bit of friction smile.gif gold will stay oxidation-free but you'll probably trade this off before any serious oxidation starts.

in the end, if you think you'll get some use out of features like the USB-DAC & like the gold, copper screws & ceramic speaker jacks, and have harder-to-drive, 4 ohm speakers, the SC-68 may be for you smile.gif (peace of mind w/ Ultra 2 cert)

if you really don't think you need the extras in the SC-68, the 67 will do a great job - as several have pointed out, the power difference is minimal & features are about the same.

and like you, I also have preferred the top models. in the end, it's your money & receiver & not the dealer's so get what you think you'd be happiest with.

Thanks for the heads up, yeah I know what you mean by pride of ownership😉 anyways to cut to the chase my dealer has ordered the 68 should get it tomorrow!
post #957 of 1835
So, how does the 68 compare to the Denon 5805 in terms of punch and raw power? I'm still stunned when I go to my folks house and feel the power from the 5805.

bob
post #958 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post


Pure Direct has always been for all practical purposes a form of pure analog bypass. on all my Pio AVR's...

Thanks, that makes perfect sense.

To be honest, as much as I would like it to have the option to output to the subwoofer in Pure Direct mode, I would rather Pure Direct keep with the concept of it being an 'analogue bypass' than mess around with the two channels of audio which I am feeding into it. My Viennas might benefit from splitting off some of the bass and feeding to the sub, but although the sound is more 'punchy' with the sub on, the sound coming out my fronts is noticeably less clear (pure?). For the sort of music which I listen to, I am sticking with Pure Direct for the majority of my listening.

What I find annoying is that for the times when I do want to use Direct, that I can't switch between Direct and Pure Direct and have different speaker settings for each. For example, this ideally is what I would like to happen:

When in Pure Direct mode:
SW = OFF (setting irrelevant as it will be off anyway)
Front = LARGE

When in Direct mode:
SW = YES
Front = SMALL

What seems to happen is when I select Direct, then set my speakers as above (i.e. fronts = small), when I then switch to Pure Direct the Fronts are still set to SMALL.

Yes, I can correct this via the remote (if I can see the buttons!), but it is a pain.

Thanks for the tip on SACD, I have always had my player set to stream DSD, and the SC-68 is probably still in Pure Direct mode from when I have been listening to music through my Mapleshade adapter, however I will make a point to check next time I play a SACD
post #959 of 1835
Anybody using the arc feature on their SC-68? I have a Samsung PN60E8000 tv and have enabled the arc function on the SC-68. If I look at the tv input on the SC-68 menu it shows the audio as arc. However when I switch the tv to OTA channel and the SC-68 to tv I hear no sound. Originally I had the tv hooked to the 68 via digital optical and I got sound. My digital cable really isn't long enough so was hoping to use the arc function. Any ideas?
post #960 of 1835
Quote:
Originally Posted by zachman View Post

Anybody using the arc feature on their SC-68? I have a Samsung PN60E8000 tv and have enabled the arc function on the SC-68. If I look at the tv input on the SC-68 menu it shows the audio as arc. However when I switch the tv to OTA channel and the SC-68 to tv I hear no sound. Originally I had the tv hooked to the 68 via digital optical and I got sound. My digital cable really isn't long enough so was hoping to use the arc function. Any ideas?

Unless something changed overnight the OTA output on every TV as been optical or RCA besides the internal speakers ARC has always been for the source connected via HDMI since the tuner is built in the TV and is not tied to the source not happening.
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